Hello all,
My first post here :)
I'll shortly introduce myself before getting to the "meat" of the post:
Just a regular dude playing RPGS since the early 80's, my attention was brought to the RPGSite after stumbling on the RPGPundit's Blog.
Like many of us I developed my own personal game system: "Under the moons of Zoon".
UTMOZ is a rules-light gamesystem complete with setting ( heavily influenced by ERB's Carter stories).
It's an 80 odd pages pdf complete with Illustrations and color cover that weights about 11 Megabyte.
You can find the game at my website, http://artikid.altervista.org
I'm more than willing to receive comments and criticism
Best regards to all
Artikid
Hey, that's certainly a nice-looking game and looks very complete, even with some useful examples. I've seen some commercial games that do worse. I'll have to go through the rules a bit more, but at first glance they seem to strike a nice balance between simplicity and comprehensiveness. Do you intend to flesh out the world a bit further or is it intentionall left vague, more as a planetary romance toolkit?
One pet peeve of mine: Word really does the worst justification ever...
I love the title. It calls out to be shouted as a battle-cry.
"ZOOON!"
Wow! very cool. Thanks for sharing.:)
Hello all,
UTMOZ was thought of more as a toolbox than as a comprehensive and complete setting, I intentuionally left things vague.
Personally I hate it when campaign settings go down to giving you each and every important NPC's address, favored color and lucky number.
The game was written in a sort of "hurried rage" after re-reading for the nth time ERB's Carter novels.
Actually the game system is a overhauling of an old game system I had started writing at the beginning of time ;P.
At the moment I have not planned any sourcebooks or even adventure modules (I suck at writing them !).... yet I don't write anything off.
Please keep the comments coming and thanks for spending some time to reply
Best Regards
Artikid
PS: Yes, Word sucks... but I didn't want to use X-Press, I hate it!
Hello,
After a little playtesting I can say that Psionics seems to be the sore point when it comes down to game-balance.
At this moment I'm considering the reduction of Psi-Points from Psi-Index times 3 to Psi-Index times2.
The game as it stands allows for the creation of quite powerfull psionicists -something I like- yet the Psi energy reserve of characters might be excessive...
The revised version is on-line at http://artikid.altervista.org.
At the moment the Mind Control Manifestation has been de-powered and a few things in the Psionics chapter have been clarified.
Best regards
Artikid
That looks very impressive. Sosthenes is right, though--I think there'd be no harm in fleshing out the setting. This feels like a setting-driven game, a la Tekumel / Jorune, and you probably have it all thought out already anyway.
Well, I actually never suggested doing that. Not that it's a bad idea. The current game book is a bit more on the side of a specific setting than a generic Swords & Planet book, so a few more cool tidbits would be fine. A gazzeteer approach would probably be best. But one has to keep priorities in mind, a cool adventure should be done first ;)
Since the first post here, I've been reading the game material a bit more thoroughly and really have to say that this is a nice product. Well done!
I kinda like the gonzo madness of Encounter Critical, but this is a more streamlined product, where the rules fade into the background and the possibilities for decent adventuring are definitely there.
"return from darkness..."
Just found this, and bumping this thread because I think Zoon is awesome.
Wonder if a PM to the author would spark him up to talk more about his game.
His website has an e-mail so I've contacted him that way to say discussion is underway here - I'm hoping that isn't too intrusive...
Cheers,
BSJ.
As you can see I received that e-mail :)
What can I add? UTMOZ is a very little game so there's not very much I can add:
Playtesting has not been intensive, and that's one of the reasons I'm not offering it as POD.
I've actually played UTMOZ a couple of times plus the few times I tested the game it stems from.
Nonetheless I've recently made a couple of changes to action checks introducing open-ended rolls.
I'm still not sure about psionics, and I probably should clarify mass combat.
Still I'm a lazy SOB and hate writing, so it may take me some time/years to actually do that.
Granted -of course- I get some testing done meanwhile.
Over the course of time some people have contacted me to make sporadic (and mostly favorable) comments.
I know those people played at least one-shots, but when I asked for some feedback -or even write ups of the adventures they played to publish along with the rules- I've only had vague responses or no response at all.
Anything else I can do for you guys?
Well, I thought it was a great setting, really good artwork and system - one of the best free RPGs I've seen, and I've certainly paid money for worse.
I suppose my only specific system question would be why skills are valued at 1/2/4 for basic/expert/master, rather than 1/2/3, I suppose. And maybe consider renaming the "purple moon of Zartru"...;)
Mass combat/psionics looked pretty good really to me. It does seem like a PC can positively influence how their side fares in battle without it being too much. Perhaps the way a PC can be taken out by a unit casualty result might seem unfair to a player on the receiving end. Psionics - I'll have to look over more before I can try and helpfully nitpick :) Maybe 'astral projection' and 'possession' should be separate powers.
I chose a 1/2/4 progression because I wanted a Master level skill to have a bigger impact.
I think that high levels of skill should have a heavy influence, in this way a character with Body 2 and master level skill can hold his own against an unskilled guy with Body 6.
Actually it's a sort of compromise, I would have liked for skill levels to have a higher impact.
The problem was that I wanted UTMOZ to use small numbers and a simple system, so that a newbie could play it with little or no effort.
Mass combat: well, it is not that I don't like what I wrote, it's just that the whole chapter has a messy presentation. Regarding player casualty: war is hell, guys! Remember that PCs have Epic points though.
Psionics: in the playtest sessions I run we had a min/maxed psionicist. He did not have a huge impact, but my impression is that he could have.
I'm toying around with the idea of lowering the psi-points reserve.
My intention was for Psionics to be powerfull at high levels but that it should not dominate the game.
This is intended to be a Barsoom pastiche, not a D&D one.
Best regards
artikid
OK...well, even +3 on 2d6 is a fairly big jump (average 7, and chance of higher or lower rolls falls off quite quickly). Other options could be to have four levels of skill +1 to +4, or have an untrained penalty (say -2 penalty if you don't have the skill, for some skills). Or you could reduce the range of attributes to 1-5 or even 1-4 so that attribute doesn't have such a dramatic effect.
On increasing effects of skills: I suppose they could have other effects beyond the bonus, anything from choose to specialty giving another +1, to letting characters reroll on 11-12 as well as 12, to unlocking special uses for Epic Points (or something).
OK fair enough on the mass combat! I hadn't factored in epic points either.
I could see a chart or something to see if characters get captured, or lost and believed dead, but I suppose that could be a matter of GM intervention.
And..Psionics: I'm not sure if I'm reading the psicrystal rules right but if a character somehow has Cannibalize, Regeneration, and a Psicrystal they can activate the psicrystal to regenerate 2x [1 power level + attunement level of crystal] hit points for 1 Psi point, then cannibalize those for half that many psi points - giving them infinite psi points - and HP? Or is a psicrystal limited use? (Hmm...also Psychosurgery could also do this in place of Regenerate - actually that seems to be just better than Regenerate since you can use it on others).
Pg 49.."Any character touching an attuned crystal..receives a number of d6 of damage...". Is the psion who owns the crystal exempted from this?
Warp: time travel is potentially a game buster. 'If its 1 century in the past or future..." can this be used to time travel anything up to that distance e.g. before the princess was kidnapped to destroy the GM's adventure? Possibly specify how accurate/inaccurate this is meant to be.
Boost: doesn't look very useful as it adds to an attribute but also causes a -2 on all rolls while its Maintained. At best you can get a +2 to one stat and a -2 on all other rolls for 4 points.
Sacrifice: should probably specify that the creature killed should be sentient (or at least noteworthy), to limit it to Bad Guys rather than PCs with backpacks full of fluffy bunnies...
Precognition: why Epic Points here rather than the usual psi points?
Psi Index can be very expensive at up to 6 attribute points, but doesn't seem to do anything unless a character also buys the Psionicist skill. A possible trap in character generation since its just a waste of points initially - indeed, even the example character suffers from this.
Potentially you could at least use Psi Index for psionic defense (I think currently e.g. with Mind Reading the defender uses Presence?).
Interesting stuff to consider BSJ.
I've not much a chance to try this, I've been looking at it though, I admit to wanting a bit more setting, but that's not a big thing.
This thread made me curious so I checked out Zoon. After skimming it I must say it looks pretty cool and I think it really ought to be expanded a bit setting-wise and made into a full print product. Very nice.
I don't see a need to change the skill system or the attribute scoring system.
One thing I sure do not want is more of a "special effects due to skill" system.
It's not my bag and it's not part of the setting/source material.
The cannibalize/psi-crystal/HP connection: I think you got something there.
Let's see:
You can't regenerate and then cannibalize, you'd have to first cannibalize and then regenerate.
Regeneration heals existing damage, it does not grant extra hit points. So you actually have to damage yourself first.
A character with Psi-index (N), can get up to (N) Psi points by losing (N*2) Life points,he then could regenerate that much damage by spending (N) Psi points.
But what's the point? You are not getting infinite Life or Psi energy, you are just switching points around.
A psi crystal changes the situation, the same character with a level (X) psi-crystal could get (N+X) psi points for (N*2) life points and then regenerate the damage for (N) psi points, thus gaining (X) psi point for free.
In due time you are going to accumulate extra psi point.
You may not believe it, but I think it's more a nuissance than a problem.
Why?
Utmoz has an implicit 1 action per round limit. So you just stand there accumulating psi points and doing... nothing.
No multi actions here, so beware when you cannibalize yourself in combat.
Also: no psi-crystal, no extra Psi points.
In combat with a psionicist the first thing to do is to disarm him or her.
Remember that psi-crystals should be rather rare and valuable.
Anway it is a problem, and thanks for pointing it out:
I probably should change cannibalize so that it can only make you recover spent psi-points and change the exchange rate to 3 or 4 LP to 1 PP.
Psychosurgery: you shouldn't be able to use it on yourself, I'll have to change the wording.
Psi-Crystal attuning: No. As the paragraph says, the owner gets zapped too.
Warp: I know this is a potential gamebuster. Remember that you need a physical link and that you risk meeting a horror each time you use it.
Hounds of Tindalos anyone?
I guess this could be changed to a 1 year/LY at Psi level one and doubled for each level thereafter, with a chance of people coming out of the gate on a 2,3,11 or12 on 2d6.
Anyway I trust the GMs to have balls enough to handle it as is.
Boost: you actually can get up to.... +4 with a Psi-index of 6, including the penalty for maintainace. +5 with a maxed out psionicist, and up to +8 with a level 3 Psi-crystal.
You keep forgetting Epic Points: just with Epic points you could push this up to a stunning +16. And what if a ring of psionicists Boosted you?
Sacrifice: killing bunnies would give you how much.... 2 points? And going around sacrificing living beings -even bunnies- is a sure way to get lynched by a mob on Zoon.
Also: Lingering horror rule. Are you sure you want to sacrifice that bunny?
Precog: EPs are spent in addition, not in place.
Psi-index: no trap here, just an attempt at munchkin prevention.
You are buying the potential to be a psionicist, I think this is reason enough.
Remember that you can raise an attribute by 1 point only through experience.
In previous versions of the game you could not buy a Psi index at all if you did not have one from the start and I'm tempted to go back to this.
A few more thoughts on cannibalize/regenerate/ crystal.
Re-reading UTMOZ I realized I had taken some measures against such a loophole, I just did not make it clear in the rules.
If you look under Sacrifice you'll see that Psi points in excess of your reserve fade away at the rate of 1 point per turn.
So you need a level 3 psi crystal to actually gain 1 point, but you can hardly use it.
Look here:
first round: Cannibalize (lose N*2 LP, gain N+X PP)
second round: Regenerate (Heal N*2 LP, lose N PP, lose 1PP if above maximum PP)
third round: do something (lose 1PP if above maximum PP)
While a Ring is not so easy to put up and Epic points are gone once spent they can still make it useful for very short periods.
I'll probably leave this as is, I'll just make the wording clearer.
OK. Fair enough.
I feel kind of bad about bringing you here just to insult you by picking holes in your game, given that I really like Zoon. I initially bumped the thread just to make people aware of its existence, really.
Even with games I actually love, perhaps especially those, I'm likely to go on at length about minor design features.... However, I've only read through UTMOZ very quickly so I haven't really figured out how everything interacts. So sorry if this hasn't been helpful.
Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;437315OK. Fair enough.
I feel kind of bad about bringing you here just to insult you by picking holes in your game, given that I really like Zoon. I initially bumped the thread just to make people aware of its existence, really.
Even with games I actually love, perhaps especially those, I'm likely to go on at length about minor design features.... However, I've only read through UTMOZ very quickly so I haven't really figured out how everything interacts. So sorry if this hasn't been helpful.
No problem man, you actually have been very helpfull!
I wish more people had given me the same kind of feedback.
When looking at a game, especially one I love, I try to tear it apart myself. Just to see how much "wear and tear" it can stand, how much the designer tried to fine tune it.
UTMOZ is a simple game, when I first finished it I thought it was done.
However, no matter how simple a system is, there's lots of possiblities a designer alone can't test or prepare for.
Especially an amateur like me.
I think I'll be putting a new version up with the clarifications for psionics in a couple of days.
I'll put you in the credits.
Quote from: artikid;437322No problem man, you actually have been very helpfull!
I wish more people had given me the same kind of feedback..
He's a good type of tester, the kind that thinks it through.
I wish I had more time to read it and try it out. Sigh. So much to do and so many good games to try.
Thanks guys :)
Cheers.
I'll check periodically and be sure to download the new version!
It's up!
Nothing mindboggling in the revision:
- downpowered Warp
- clarified Precognition and Psychosurgery
- Moved the paragraph on excess Psi points at the beginning of the Psionics' chapter
- added BSJ to the credits
Enjoy!
Cool thanks!
My 11 year old daughter requested something "not like Europe or Asia, and not like LotR" for gaming. She is very excited about Zoon, it is just the sort of unique adventure she is looking for.
I am now busy writing a few adventure ideas. I think I have finally wrapped my mind around the Psionics rules, a good thing since she is playing a psionicist.
The orbital mechanics of Zoon give me mental contortions, although if I remember that it is a Sword&Planet game, the gas giant is always overhead at the Light Pole, and the seasons are each eight-earth days long, for a 32 earth-day cycle, and that winter is basicly the Zoonian "night", cold and dark everywhere, but especially so at the Dark Pole, summer is daylight and hot, autumn is sunset and spring is sunrise, and fungi forests sprout up grow to maturity and die often in as little as one cycle, unless I want them to last longer (or shorter) my head doesn't hurt as much.
After all it's Sword&Planet not hard SF.
I like the inclusion of the Horrors and the post-apocalyptic elements, Lovecraft and long lost ancient civilizations have always been favourite tropes of mine.
I wonder what colour is a basilisk and therefor the Firstborn? For some reason I picture the Firstborn as albino, but we have a number of local snakes which are dark grey or black on the back, and red, yellow, or white beneeth. Any of these could make for a frightening Firstborn too. I just don't see them as either green or brown.
As for the open-ness of the setting, Thank You! I grew up with the first generation RPGs where published setting was almost non-existant. We made it all up to suit ourselves. I note the old Pulp writers never hesitated to indroduce a new element when needed, as if it had been there all along even though it was never mentioned before.
Hi DaveTheLost!
Yes, you got all Zoon's cycles right!
Hope you and your daughter enjoy the game and please let me know how it played out!
Best regards
Artikid
Just DLed this game and it looks very cool. I like the art as well. I certainly remember the Carter books fondly, and with the movie immanent, this game might be fun to try. Thanks very much.
I am seriously considering running Zoon as on online game. Any takers?