I'd be willing to help out a bit as a minion - fair's fair, since you're helping me on my thing.

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;569502I'd be willing to help out a bit as a minion - fair's fair, since you're helping me on my thing.

Well thank you. It'll be about a week before I finalize a team. It may be a bunch more people it may be just a duo thing but I'll decide that by the 16th.

For now you've posted in this thread so you have an idea of what I'm going for already. Are there any major questions?

Cheers. I think I have a reasonable idea of what you're attempting, but OK some minor questions:
 
Any thoughts as to what sort of races would be included? Also how that interacts with classes - I find it a problem in some games that there's optimum matches (Minotaur/Fighter or Elf/Ranger or whatnot).
 
I'm gathering its quite different to 3E at this point already, but is compatibility with d20 to any extent a goal? Or is the aim to construct the best system possible, regardless of how extensive changes are?

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;569694Cheers. I think I have a reasonable idea of what you're attempting, but OK some minor questions:
 
Any thoughts as to what sort of races would be included? Also how that interacts with classes - I find it a problem in some games that there's optimum matches (Minotaur/Fighter or Elf/Ranger or whatnot).
 
I'm gathering its quite different to 3E at this point already, but is compatibility with d20 to any extent a goal? Or is the aim to construct the best system possible, regardless of how extensive changes are?

Thanks for the interest. I'm gonna be getting a new laptop soon but in the mean time I've resorted to using dead tree format for my work.

A bunch of classic races will be included. I tried to make some twists on them to keep things fresh. Right now races get a single ability, an attribute modifier (only a single bonus), and a bonus to one of the defenses and 2 skills. After that I'm still deciding but I'm thinking I'm going to allow races to pick up "sub" abilities as you level. Right now I'm planning on 5 that you get on levels 2, 6, 10, 14, and 18. Nothing game changing but they'll just add to the player's repertoire.

Right now I have plans for about 8 Primary Races including Beastkin (like shifters from eberron), Dwarves, Elves, Humans, Kinfolk (reskinned Halflings), Kobolds (for dragon people), Orcs, Shifters (like changelings from eberron) that fit neatly into the setting with a number of other races on the drawing board and with goblins serving primarily as antagonists.

Beastkin are a bunch of forest dwelling animal people who worship and revere the forest. They act as the forest warping elves for the setting. They are the "Closest" to nature. They are also only mammals.

Dwarves come in 3 flavors: Forge, Sea, and Storm. They are also now "elementals". Each has a dual element and resides in different areas mostly away from most other societies. Forge dwarves are earth and fire and live under the mountains. Bonus points if they can find a volcano. Sea Dwarves are Water and Ice and live in the seas/oceans. Bonus points if its in the arctic. Storm Dwarves live on mountains and seek the stormiest mountains to live on. They come in different shapes, sizes, and colors depending on their sub group but are all hairy (with women having more hair on their head and eyebrows). Forge Dwarves are your familiar stocky, surly dwarves. THey would remind people more of Duergar than regular dwarves, 'cept without the evil or psychic powers. Sea dwarves are more medium sized and stoic. Storm dwarves are tall and tend to be proud.

There are 3 kinds of elves (Light, Dark, Twilight). They are considered "Fey" and are keepers of the Future, Past, and present respectively in their mythos.  The "light" elves are ruthless tyrants who believe that only they are "good" enough to control the future. The Twilight elves are the regular joes in comparison. The Dark Elves are rampant traditionalists and keepers of ancient lore often playing at odds with the Light Elves in secret shadow games. Elves also have been moved from the forests to being a more civic minded race.

Humans are still your every day man race. It is important to note that they are the dominant race and share about as much of the spotlight as other races. I'm thinking of making just a few uniform human subcultures (no real world analogues) but for right now they are just seen as a mysterious and godless race of seafarers.

Kinfolk will act as your halfling sized amazons (or garuda if you are familiar with Legend of Zelda). They are quite numerous and aggressive. They act a lot like you would expect orcs or particularly well organized and community oriented goblins to work in most lazily written settings.

Kobolds are still dragon people of various elements and flavors (adjusted for my setting's dragons of course. They are also technicians and are pretty much spearheading the technical revolution in the steampunk setting.

Orcs happen to be the big brutish people you'd expect. They are giant blooded and proud of it. They are also traditionalists but are very accepting of anything that gets the race as a whole ahead. There are about 2 kinds of orc, Winter and Summer.

Shifters are like the shapeshifters presented in eberron. In this setting shifters are aberrations that have lost their purpose. In older times they were meant to do "some thing" but as a race they've forgotten and now live in hidden enclaves either keeping to themselves or living hidden among other races.

To answer your other question compatibility is not a goal nor is it desired. I am indeed making a system (as best as I can) almost from the ground up using 3rd as a spring board.

Heard of Zelda but never played it (I was a Sega guy in my misspent youth), so the only 'garuda' I've heard of is the large...Indian? Indonesian?...mythological bird the airline is named after.

All the race stuff looks pretty cool though. Perhaps beastmen could have multiple animal varieties that give slight variations in power, and making them more flexible so that the GM could have cat people or wolf people or whatnot in their campaign?

Ability modifiers for races perhaps brings up the question of how exactly you're generating attributes. I think 3.x/4E has a problem with the way it does it,  where you spend varying numbers of points (equal to ability modifier) to raise a stat by 1, then apply fixed bonuses for race, level or items later - I'd rather a consistent point system be used throughout.

Another question might be whether/to what extent you include racial disadvantages (e.g. in older D&Ds there are halfling size penalties, dwarf speed, elves being unable to be Raised, and so on).

On the dead tree thing, you could always set yourself up a yahoo group or similar to upload your files to for safekeeping. Or email them to yourself periodically.

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;569894Heard of Zelda but never played it (I was a Sega guy in my misspent youth), so the only 'garuda' I've heard of is the large...Indian? Indonesian?...mythological bird the airline is named after.

All the race stuff looks pretty cool though. Perhaps beastmen could have multiple animal varieties that give slight variations in power, and making them more flexible so that the GM could have cat people or wolf people or whatnot in their campaign?

Ability modifiers for races perhaps brings up the question of how exactly you're generating attributes. I think 3.x/4E has a problem with the way it does it,  where you spend varying numbers of points (equal to ability modifier) to raise a stat by 1, then apply fixed bonuses for race, level or items later - I'd rather a consistent point system be used throughout.

Another question might be whether/to what extent you include racial disadvantages (e.g. in older D&Ds there are halfling size penalties, dwarf speed, elves being unable to be Raised, and so on).

On the dead tree thing, you could always set yourself up a yahoo group or similar to upload your files to for safekeeping. Or email them to yourself periodically.

I'm not that much of a zelda fan but I remember them from Ocarina of time (I also may have spelled it wrong).

As for Beastkin that's exactly how they are. Again they are similar to shifters from eberron except that they always have their special animal trait (nothing game changing) and they all only get a +2 to awareness no matter what kind of animal trait they have. Of course it follows that they "look" like the animal in question so you have your cat people and wolf people but there aren't major differences between the two. IE dog person can be just as strong or stronger as wolf person and they both can have bites that do the same amount of damage.

Right now there are no "disadvantages". You just pick up your racial traits and go from there. Racial "disadvantages" are on the back burner but wouldn't come until I'm doing some kind of in depth look at the race as a whole.

For generating Ability scores I have that much typed up again. I only am planning to have point buy (randomness is unnecessary in my opinion for character generation). Some of the rules are: no attribute gets above 16, none below 7 during generation, racial comes in after generation. Otherwise attributes work largely like they do in 3rd. Here they are:

Power
Power gives a measure of a Character's physical prowess. It represents how much physical force a Character can exert on the world.
Characters with a lot of Power tend to be more muscled and dense. They are able to perform well at tasks that demand direct physical might such as breaking and lifting. Characters that lack power tend to be weaker and more frail.
A Character's Power Score determines their Encumbrance Rates. A Character who's Power Score reaches 0 become unable to move in any way and may start to Suffocate from the weight of their own body. Characters without a Power Score cannot physically effect the world.
A Character's Power Score Bonus modifies: Fortitude, Climb, Fly, Jump, and Swim Checks. It modifies Melee and Thrown Weapon Damage Rolls. It may also be used on random rolls where brute force is necessary (such as breaking an object).
Special Note – Objects do not have a Power Score unless they are able to move. Even then if the Object is unable to move under its own power it merely adjusts the Power Score of the operator and only when being used for its specific function (like a pulley). If an Object can move under its own power then the Power Score is still only applied to its function.

(Details of Encumbrance in Document but think of it just like the PHB for simplicity's sake)

* A Character can Lift up to twice max load but is Staggered while doing so.

* A Character can Push/Drag up to 5 times their max. Certain conditions can adjust this.
These rates are based on Medium Sized Characters. Being of a different size can change the Encumbrance Rates of a Character (details in document).

*Having more legs can also increase Encumbrance Rates. Being a Quadruped of a Size Category lower than Medium double their Encumbrance Rates. Those Medium and above multiply their Encumbrance Modifiers by 1 and a half.


Resilience
Resilience gives a measure of a Character's physical health and toughness. It represents how much physical punishment a Character can endure.
Characters with a lot of Resilience tend to have very strong and healthy genetic features and structure. They are also able to recover faster from injury and prove more durable and resistant to disease and poisoning. Characters lacking tend to have less defining or memorable bodily features and are generally more sickly and out of shape.
A Character's Resilience Score determines their Endurance Rate and how many Wounds they can take before Death. A Character who's Resilience is reduced to 0 dies as their body ceases to function. A Character who does not have a Resilience Score does not have a physical body.
A Character's Resilience Bonus modifies their: HP, SHP, Physical Damage Resistance, and Fortitude. It also is used for any Endurance Checks that the Character makes.
Special Note – Objects do not have Resilience Scores. They instead have a Structure Score that determines their Encumbrance Rates.

Agility
Agility gives a measure of the Character's grace and coordination. It represents how well balanced a Character is and how dexterous their actions are.
Characters with a lot of Agility tend to have an abundance of hand eye coordination. They tend to be quick to react and leaner in form.
A Character who's Agility Score is reduced to 0 cannot coordinate their movements and is rendered Immobile and Prone as they are reduced to random flailing. Characters without an Agility Score don't move.
A Character's Agility Bonus modifies their: Accuracy, Dodge, Acrobatics, Balance, Escape Artist, Legerdemain, and Stealth. It also is used when performing actions that require sharp reflexes or coordination.

Awareness
Awareness gives a measure of a Character's perception and instincts. It represents how well tuned a Character's senses are.
Characters with a lot of Awareness tend to have sharp senses and remarkable intuitive skills. They generally are quick to pick up on a situation.
A Character who's Awareness Score is reduced to 0 cannot perceive the world around them in any way and cannot function, rendering them Helpless. Characters without an Awareness Score do not perceive.
A Character's Awareness Bonus modifies their: Accuracy, Dodge, Insight, Investigate, Perception, and Survival.  

Intellect
Intellect gives a measure of a Character's knowledge and memory. It represents a Character's aptitude for processing and retaining information.
Character blessed with a lot of Intellect tends to remember and take in information easily. They are generally well read or knowledgeable about any number of subjects.
A Character who's Intellect Score is reduced to 0 cannot retain memories or process thoughts which renders them either comatose or unresponsive. Characters that do not have an Intellect Score do not have conscious thoughts.
A Character's Intellect Bonus modifies their: Will, Magic Damage Reduction, Crafts, Knowledges, Linguistics, and Treatment. It also modifies the number of Active Wards a Character can use.

Personality
Personality gives a measure of a Character's  charm and presence. It represents a Character's ability to impose their will on others and to attract the loyalty and admiration of their peers.
Characters born with a strong Personality tend to be expressive and attract the admiration of others. They are generally well spoken and willful.
A Character who's Personality Score is reduced to 0 loses their sense of self and is rendered catatonic. A Character that does not have a Personality Score cannot distinguish between itself and anything else.
A Character's Personality Bonus modifies their: Will, Magic Damage, Animal Handling, Deception, Intimidate, and Manipulate. It also modifies the number of Active Cohorts a Character can use.

There are a bunch of key terms scattered throughout here and here are some of the explanations:
HP – Also known as Hit Points, these represent a Character’s ability to avoid serious injury. As long as a Character has HP they avoid losing Attribute Points when taking Damage. Whenever HP is recovered it generally depletes the Character’s SHP pool. A Character may channel SHP turning it into HP at a rate of 1 point per minute of Rest. A character may also Naturally Heal HP equal to 8 + Resilience Modifier during Full Rests.

SHP – Also known as Stock Hit Points, these represent a Character’s reserve Hit Points. Each time a character recovers Hit Points an equal amount is subtracted from the character’s Hit Points. Characters only recover SHP during Full Rests at a rate of 8 + Resilience Modifier.

Defense – All Characters have three Defenses: Fortitude (used to defend against Combat Maneuvers, Poisons, Diseases, and other bodily ailments), Dodge (used to dodge incoming hazards and Attacks), and Will (used to resist mental/metaphysical attacks and affects). Defenses are generally Passive but may be rolled as part of an Active Defense.

Combat Maneuver – Combat Maneuvers are special Attack Actions a Character can take in order to produce a special result. Every Combat Maneuver starts with an attack and then the effect is determined afterward. Basic Combat Maneuvers include Grab, Push/Pull (Bull Rush, Trample, Overrun), Called Shot (Disarm, Sunder)

Physical Damage Reduction – This value reduces all Physical Damage taken.

Meta Damage Reduction – This value reduces all incoming Metaphysical Damage taken.

Attack – Attacking is the most basic Combat Maneuver you can utilize. To make an attack you must have a Line of Effect to a target in your reach and then you make an Attack Roll using the appropriate Attack Bonus. Your attack roll is then compared to the target’s Dodge Defense.

Basic Attack Formula: Accuracy Bonus +Agility/Sense Bonus + Bonuses + Weapon Penalty + Etc

Defense – Every character has three defenses that are used to resist attempts at damage. When defending against something a character generally uses their Passive Defense Bonus though they may perform the Basic Defensive Maneuver called an Active Defense Action that allows them increase their Defense. Some actions or abilities may only be applied when using an Active Defense.

Fortitude – This defense is used against bodily attacks, Combat Maneuvers, poisons, diseases, internal damage, and similar affects. Abilities and affects that target Fortitude are felt internally by the victim whether or not the save is made the victim will know that something felt wrong with their body and may feel a bit queasy or shaky afterward.

Defense Formula: Fortitude Bonus + Power/Resilience Bonus + Size Bonus + Etc

Dodge – This defense is used to evade attacks and affects. This defense represents a mixture of luck, quick thinking, instinct, fast reflexes, and good timing. A character might not know that they were even assaulted when this Defense holds if the assault was unseen or imperceivable though they might feel that something is amiss or discover the problem by using a Awareness Based Skill or Ability.

Defense Formula: Fortitude Bonus + Agility/Awareness Bonus + Size Bonus + Etc

Will – This defense is used to resist and overcome mental attacks and affects. This defense represents force of will. When this Defense holds a character might know that they are being tested but will not know how or by whom. If this Defense is tested in conversation using Skills then the character will without a doubt know they are being tested but are subject to all the affects of the ability and may not react negatively unless given sufficient reason to do so.

Defense Formula: Fortitude Bonus + Intellect/Personality Bonus + Size Bonus + Etc

Update
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Races – There are any number of Races and creatures within Mana Sphere's Setting that Players can expect to have ready access to. For now though only the Primary Races will be presented here-in for the purposes of Character Generation.  Selecting a race determines a Character's general look and provides a number of features and abilities specific to that Race.

Beastkin – Beastkin are largely forest dwelling animal blooded people who are said to descend from the God of Beasts himself. Beastkin are fierce protectors of nature, They are a mysterious people who have learned to live with nature instead of needing to take from it.
Physical Description – Beastkin  may look wildly variant from Beastkin to Beastkin. Beastkin stand about the size of a Human but can vary within that depending on what kind of animal blood they draw from. Smaller animals tend to have smaller builds and vice versa. Otherwise Beastkin share many of the traits of their bloodline where feline Beastkin tend to have whiskers and owl Beastin tend to be feathered. It is possible for Beastkin to interbreed and mix traits though most Beastkin avoid mixing blood.
Creature Type – Beast
Base Move Speed – 30ft / 6 Squares
Attribute Bonus – Awareness +2
Defense – Dodge +1
Racial Ability: Bestial Trait – Beastkin develop abilities based on the animal they share blood with. When generated Beastkin may choose one of the following traits and gain the associated Skill Point:
Ambler – Increases Move Speed by 20ft when moving on all fours. +1 Acrobatics
Clawed – Gain Natural Weapon: Strike and Proficiency with Natural Weapons. +1 Climb
Hide – Gain Natural Armor of your choice. +1 Hit Points
Horned – Gain Natural Weapon: Gore and Proficiency with Natural Weapons. +1 Intimidate
Large Lunged – Gain the ability to hold your breath for four times the length of time before necessitating an Endurance Check for Suffocation. +1 Swim
Tailed (Prehensile) – Gain a Prehensile Tail capable of fine manipulation. +1 Acrobatics
Tailed (Semi-prehensile) – Gain a Semi-prehensile Tail, Natural Weapon: Slam, and Proficiency with Natural Weapons. +1 Balance
Toothed – Gain Natural Weapon: Bite and Proficiency with Natural Weapons. +1 Intimidate
Wild – Gain an Enhanced Sense (Dark Vision, Echolocation, Precision Sight, Scent, Tremor Sense). +1 Perception
Winged – Gain Wings capable of Flight. +1 Fly
Racial Skills: Choose any 1 of the below Skills.
Animal Handling
Knowledge: Nature
Survival

Dwarves – Dwarves come in three primary varieties. Forge Dwarves  are stocky earth born grim surly people that primarily live beneath mountains, preferably volcanoes, an hammer out their existence there. Storm Dwarves are taller wind blessed Dwarves that live high within the mountains looking down upon all others. Sea Dwarves live low beneath the depths in arctic regions largely keeping to themselves.
Physical Description – All Dwarves  tend to have thick, plentiful hair. The men having it all over while women have long heads of hair, thick eyebrows and distinctly curvy figures.
Creature Type – Elemental
Base Move Speed – 30ft / 6 Squares
Attribute Bonus – Resilience +2
Defense Bonus – Fortitude +1
Racial Ability – Elemental Blessing:
Forge Dwarf – Earthbound – You may use your Resilience Score in place of your Power Score to determine Encumbrance Totals. Additionally while on the ground you suffer no Penalties from Medium Encumbrance and Armor never slows your Move Speeds.
Storm Dwarf – Airborne – You may bend the air around you to enable Flight. You may also take Fly as one of your Racial Skills. Whenever you fall you may use an Opportunity Action to slow your fall for a number of feet up to your Move Speed.
Sea Dwarf – Waterlogged – You may breathe underwater as if you were breathing on land. Additionally Cold Conditions never slow you and you are never in danger of slipping on icy or wet surfaces (treat the Balance DC as unchanged  by these conditions).
Racial Skills: Choose any of the 2 below Skills. Cannot choose the same one multiple times.
Balance
Climb
Jump
Linguistics
Knowledge: Sage

Elves – There are three primary Elven Sub Types discussed here: the Light, Twilight, and Dark Elves. They are also known as Thanes, Sidhe, and Drow respectively. Within their lore they are considered keepers of the future, present, and past respectively.
Physical Description – Light Elves are the tallest and tend to have pale to golden shades of skin with long hair, often kept in exotic and complex styles. They tend to have long faces and sharp features. Twilight Elves are shorter than High Elves and have skin tones going from various shades of grey and hair of various lengths depending on their style, profession, or culture. Dark Elves tend to be as tall as High Elves but have jet black skin tones varying slightly between slightly red to midnight blue hues with similarly colored hair.
Creature Type – Fey
Base Move Speed – 30ft / 6 Squares
Attribute Bonus – Intellect +2
Defense Bonus – Will +1
Racial Ability – Fate's Blessings:
Light Elves – Dowsing – Once per day a Light Elf may designate a specific creature or thing that is of some importance to them or their current goals. Whenever they are within Close Range of something directly or closely related to the "thing" in question they are alerted to it and are given a single Perception Roll to identify it. This alert only occurs once per triggering stimulus between Full Rests.  This ability does not trigger for the same stimulus after you've found it. Lastly Light Elves can see in Blinding Light  as ell as normal light and can't be blinded by bright flashes of light.
Twilight Elves – Balance – Twilight Elves may choose a single Racial Skill  and reduce the Error Range of that skill by an amount equal to half their Level rounded up. Additionally once between Full Rests they may Take 10 on a roll after knowing the Result even if conditions wouldn't normally allow for it.
Dark Elves – Secrets – Dark Elves have photographic memories and can completely memorize anything they see or hear. They may then reproduce it whenever they choose to. Once between Full Rests a Drow may designate a roll they've made and reuse the Die Result on a later roll instead of rolling regularly.
Racial Skills: Choose any 2 of the below Skills. May not choose the same one twice.
Craft: Any 1
Knowledge: Any 1
Linguistics
Perception
Treatment

Humans – Humans are wildly varied and mysterious people. They are mostly known as seafarers who's origins are largely unknown. They've only recently gained a foothold on the shores of the main continent because of the tumultuous times. Humans thus far have proven themselves to be no fools and a legitimate threat to the powers that be. There are two primary empires that have settled on the primary continent but there are no significant differences between the people.
Physical Description – Humans share a lot of generic traits but are highly varied amongst themselves and thus do not stick to many conventions unless entire cultures are considered.
Creature Type – Humanoid
Base Move Speed – 30ft / 6 Squares
Attribute – Any 1 +2
Defense – Any 1 +1
Racial Trait – Skilled – Choose one of your Racial Skills and gain a Bonus Skill Feat for it. Also gain a +1 Bonus to one Attribute Score that isn't your highest.
Racial Skills: Choose any 2 neither of which can be the same.

Kinfolk – Kinfolk are a mostly female race of short athletic people. They are known for their numbers, ferocity, and territorial natures. Most people see them as wild, primitive, savages who have a worse reputation  than the Beastkin. This is mostly because of their violent tendencies toward would be invaders. Many individual or smaller groups of Kinfolk have can be found abroad and have been seen to be about as civilized as any other sentient race. Within their own social structure Kinfolk most outsiders are seen as the savage ones. They are deeply connected with plants and enjoy spending time among foliage and in the sunlight. Lack of either over a long period of time tends to leave them depressed and moody.
Physical Description – Kinfolk are mostly female and have athletic bodies and browned skin. They have long, green hair that often rises up and slips down their backs. Males, much more uncommon than females, look a bit more muscular than females but both look similar for the most part. They stand on average at about 3 and a half to 4 feet tall. They tend to have large eyes and slender bodies.
Creature Type – Small Plant
Base Move Speed: 20ft / 4 Squares
Attribute – Agility: +4, Awareness: +2, Power: -2, Resilience: -2
Defense – Dodge +1
Racial Trait – Woodland Stride – Kinfolk are very adept at moving through the forests and cannot be tracked in verdant settings by any means save for other Kinfolk or those with heightened Tracking abilities. They are also no impeded by Difficult Terrain.
Racial Skills: Chose any 2 of the Skills below. You may not pick the same one twice.
Acrobatics
Balance
Climb
Escape Artist
Insight
Jump
Perception
Stealth
Survival


Orcs – Orcs have certainly earned their reputation for being the toughest and unrelenting foes one could face. They are proud of their long history of conflict and can attest to never being completely conquered despite the efforts of some. Orcs lead an embattled history and this has shaped their culture. Their people are also fractured with some having been taken in by other races and used for labor while others have retreated to harder to invade territories and carved out a place for themselves there. Still, collectively, Orcs are a strong, imposing, and proud people. There are 2 primary types of Orc: Summer and Winter Orcs.
Physical Description – Orcs are uniformly tall and well muscled people, evidence of their Giant heritage. Women tend to be more slender and curvy than males. They are only about as hairy as Humans and have varying hair lengths based on culture and style. Summer Orcs tend to have darker skin tones, mostly varying shades of grey with coarse black hair. Winter Orcs tend to have lighter tones keeping a more light green tone with lighter hair tones.
Creature Type – Giant
Base Move Speed – 30ft / 6 Squares
Attribute – Power +2
Defense – Fortitude +1
Racial Trait – Orcish Toughness – Orc Natural Healing Rates are doubled. Additionally when calculating SHP orcs multiply their HP total by 1.5.
Racial Skills: Choose any 2 of the below Skills. You may not select the same one twice:
Hit Points
Martial Proficiency
Climb
Intimidate
Jump
Survival
Swim

Shifters – Shifters are a seemingly cursed race. Other races tend to meet them, once exposed, with almost equal parts hate and mistrust. To this end Shifters live in the shadows, in secret or hiding within the light. More than anything a Shifter values secrecy. It is whispered among the few existing Shifter circles that they have a mysterious purpose that has been long forgotten but most Shifters simply keep to themselves, applying their skills to survival and even conquest.
Physical Description – When not in disguise shifters are pale, almost featureless, aberrant looking humanoids. They are pale have flat noses and no mouths. They have long black eyes and uniform, slender forms. When in disguise, which most Shifters stay there are no defining features that bind one Shifter to another. Typically they stand between 5 and 7ft tall and tend to take forms similar to those around them.
Creature Type – Aberration
Base Move Speed – 30ft / 6 Squares
Attribute – Personality +2
Defense – Will +1
Racial Trait – Alter Self – Shifters can shift their physical form to that of another creature. This ability allows the Shifter to use the Disguise Skill Task at will with no other equipment. This ability does not provide or alter clothing however. A Shifter cannot make major physical changes to their anatomy other than the act of switching genders. Otherwise they cannot add new appendages (IE extra arms, wings, etc), create new internal organs, or any other major changes like that. They may, however, change their skin tone, slightly change their height, hair length/color, nail length, eye shape/color, etc. These changes are skin deep and differences in internal anatomy will remain.
A Shifter when generated has an alter ego starting off. This is different to their base form and must be fleshed out. This alter ego is what they transform to whenever their "real self" is to be revealed. Even when knocked unconscious or if a piece of their body is separated from them it is the form their body takes. To turn into their base form against their will is always considered to be something worse than death to ask for and any attempts to force them to do it are treated as such. Only in death or by choice does a Shifter shift to their base form. All Shifters gain a Skill Point in Deception.
Racial Skills – Choose any 1 of the below Skills.
Insight
Intimidate
Knowledge: Any 1
Linguistics
Manipulate

Looking pretty good, I think.
Reading over it, specific comments:
*quite liked the "double max. load = staggered" - fairly tight bit of integration/good reuse of conditions.
*I'd think keeping the abilities with the same names as D&D (at least mostly) avoids confusion so long as their function is largely unchanged.
 
Races - the descriptions all look fine to me. On specific racial abilities, the elf 'reduced error range' function has me slightly worried re. how complex the skill system may end up being, and I didn't like the dark elf "store dice roll" power since its somewhat meta and perhaps abusable or annoying (encouraging PCs to roll for mundane events until they can store up a "20").
The Earthbound dwarf trait is odd since it makes a characters Str irrelevant for calculating encumberance, and may do nothing for many characters (if their Str is higher).
Creature type "giant" (orc) - this word is starting to get a bit misleading if its also used for medium-size creatures.

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;570164Looking pretty good, I think.
Reading over it, specific comments:
*quite liked the "double max. load = staggered" - fairly tight bit of integration/good reuse of conditions.
*I'd think keeping the abilities with the same names as D&D (at least mostly) avoids confusion so long as their function is largely unchanged.
 
Races - the descriptions all look fine to me. On specific racial abilities, the elf 'reduced error range' function has me slightly worried re. how complex the skill system may end up being, and I didn't like the dark elf "store dice roll" power since its somewhat meta and perhaps abusable or annoying (encouraging PCs to roll for mundane events until they can store up a "20").
The Earthbound dwarf trait is odd since it makes a characters Str irrelevant for calculating encumberance, and may do nothing for many characters (if their Str is higher).
Creature type "giant" (orc) - this word is starting to get a bit misleading if its also used for medium-size creatures.

It's coming along bit by bit. I can only work on this at certain times when I can clear my schedule to do so since I let my girlfriend use my computer often and I work. Anyways:

Error Range - I change the "fumble" system away from simply rolling a one which by default is the system's error range. "Errors" only occur on skill checks that actually list them and the effects of an error are concretely spelled out so there are no confusion issues nor does it necessitate the GM to make something up. Errors and Criticals both follow this and certain (minor) abilities, conditions, etc increase and/or decrease Error and Critical ranges. They can both be reduced to 0  or increased to take up half the RNG.

Dark Elf Store a Roll - This is actually intentional and something integrated into the setting where Dark Elves are often seen doing something repetitively until they gain a critical success so essentially you can count on a Dark Elf at least getting one critical starting off a random fight. Compared to some of the more "interesting" racial abilities I feel like the Dark Elfs is pretty tame. However none of this is written in stone so if you have a better idea that fits the fluff I'm all ears (thus the point of making a team).

Forge Dwarves' Encumbrance - It does nothing for characters with higher Strength which is why I added the extra ability of not being held back by armor or a medium load. The Con to encumbrance thing is again all part of the minor racial abilities thing.

"Giant" Blooded Orcs - "Giant" is going to be a creature type but giants aren't going to be the only large sized creatures so I felt that I needed orcs to have a certain spin and since they are by and large very tall people I wouldn't think its too much of a stretch to think of them as giant blooded. I'm thinking of giving them a racial ability they can pick up where they get "large build" like the Half-Giants and Goliaths of 3rd Edition.

Update
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Professions – Before a Character can gain a Class Level they generally have a Profession. A Character's Profession reflects what they were doing before the game begins. Sentient Characters of all Tiers have access to a Profession as long as they have reached the age of maturity. Characters that are too young to have one simply don't have a Profession and are very unlikely to have a Class.

Acolyte – Knowledge: Divine, Knowledge: Sage, Linguistics, Mystic Proficiency, Will

Aristocrat – Deception, Insight, Linguistics, Manipulate, Will

Artisan – Craft: Any 1, Investigate, Knowledge: Any 1, Perception, Fortitude

Brawler – Hit Points, Accuracy, Intimidate, Fortitude, Dodge

Criminal – Deception, Escape Artist, Legerdemain, Stealth, Dodge

Courier – Escape Artist, Linguistics, Pilot, Survival, Dodge

Entertainer – Acrobatics, Balance, Deception, Manipulate, Dodge

Explorer – Climb, Jump, Survival, Swim, Fortitude

Healer – Animal Handling, Insight, Knowledge: Any 1, Treatment, Will

Hunter – Animal Handling, Perception, Stealth, Survival, Fortitude

Laborer – Hit Points, Climb, Jump, Pilot, Fortitude

Merchant – Deception, Knowledge: Any 1, Investigate, Manipulation, Will

Mystic – Mystic Proficiency, Insight, Knowledge: Any 1, Manipulate, Will

Navigator – Perception, Pilot, Stealth, Survival, Dodge

Nomad – Animal Handling, Pilot, Survival, Treatment, Will

Scholar – Mystic Proficiency, Knowledge: Any 3 (no two of which can be the same), Will

Slave – Hit Points, Escape Artist, Fortitude, Dodge, Will

Squire – Martial Proficiency, Manipulate, Pilot, Fortitude, Will

Warrior – Hit Points, Martial Proficiency, Accuracy, Fortitude, Dodge

Zealot – Hit Points, Mystic Proficiency, Insight, Knowledge: Divine, Will

NP
 
OK, with the dark elves it shoulds like its implied that the Dark Elf has to be using the ability in question to store the roll? (i.e. no climbing 20 times in order to store a 20 to use on an attack roll...?)
 
Professions - if this is simply a list of additional skills and there are no other major effects, the same effect might be handled more simply by saying "pick five skills to reflect your character's pre-adventuring profession". As number of professions defined in the system increase the state of it approaches that.
 
I'm unsure if class skills exist, but if so that would prevent complications due to overlaps in class and profession skill lists as well (i.e. I could imagine a problem like Hunter/Ranger being suboptimal due to the same skills being gotten for free twice).

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;570363NP
 
OK, with the dark elves it shoulds like its implied that the Dark Elf has to be using the ability in question to store the roll? (i.e. no climbing 20 times in order to store a 20 to use on an attack roll...?)
 
Professions - if this is simply a list of additional skills and there are no other major effects, the same effect might be handled more simply by saying "pick five skills to reflect your character's pre-adventuring profession". As number of professions defined in the system increase the state of it approaches that.
 
I'm unsure if class skills exist, but if so that would prevent complications due to overlaps in class and profession skill lists as well (i.e. I could imagine a problem like Hunter/Ranger being suboptimal due to the same skills being gotten for free twice).

It is implied that Dark Elves are OCD perfectionists and can be found doing some mundane thing until they get it "just right". In character people (other than people who know about dark elves) shouldn't know why they do those kind of things. It's supposed to be seen as a wierd quirk by most people. Dark Elves themselves only have an inkling of why they do it but it becomes a ritual for them. They pick some mundane activity and do it every morning or whenever they can after a good night's sleep (or whenever they can get a good sleep). Such a thing, in setting wise, is just something they do. It pretty much gives them a sharp edge in competitions (if they compete in any) or one off encounters.
Mehanics wise it is implied that a Dark Elf "will" surprise you at least once during combat or competition so when people who know about their ability at all hear that they are facing a dark elf then they will legitimately be put on edge (just as planned).

On professions: I should explain skills a bit further before going on. "Skill Points" buy "Skill Ranks" but not in the traditional 3rd edition sense. I think I mentioned it earlier but Skill Bounuses act like Base Attack Bonuses in that there are multiple bonus tracks. All skills except Hit Points, Martial, and Mystical Proficiency follow the bonuses given on the tracks.

There are 4 ranks to all skills: Untrained, Trained, Expert, Master. By default you're considered "Untrained" in anything you don't have a skill point in. You can basically spend up to 3 skill points raising your rank in something. You get 3 Skills from race, 5 Skills from Profession, 10 Skills from Class and 2 Skill Points just for being 1st Level. From there you get a single Skill Point every even level.

Now the reason I have 5 skills locked in a profesion is to reduce power gaming and force people to spread points around a bit even to stuff they possibly don't need. If a player really wants to invest in something they can just choose to have a certain profession and race and use the 2 free points on anything they want. There "may" be something else to profession, and I'm certainly open to doing something with it, but I haven't really thought of anything to give them "yet". Perhaps in te future but for now they are bundles of skill points that serve as a call to the past profession skill, flesh out the character's background a bit, and force feeds the player a skill spread.

Sorry yes, you did explain the skill tracks earlier.
 
Well the professions move min/maxing up from "pick the best skills" to "pick the best profession". I think working harder to balance the skill list would probably be a better option.
You could for instance give skills a variable cost depending on how good they are (e.g. 5 points for a rank of Craft, 20 points to buy a rank of Dodge), roll the more powerful skills into class features, roll together some of the less powerful skills or subdivide the more powerful ones, limit some of the game effects of them to instead require 'skill tricks' or feats, or give out a point of the more powerful skills for free (Dodge, Fortitude?) so that an additional skill point spent provides less direct return in terms of bonuses (depending on how the ranks are set up).

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;570588Sorry yes, you did explain the skill tracks earlier.
 
Well the professions move min/maxing up from "pick the best skills" to "pick the best profession". I think working harder to balance the skill list would probably be a better option.
You could for instance give skills a variable cost depending on how good they are (e.g. 5 points for a rank of Craft, 20 points to buy a rank of Dodge), roll the more powerful skills into class features, roll together some of the less powerful skills or subdivide the more powerful ones, limit some of the game effects of them to instead require 'skill tricks' or feats, or give out a point of the more powerful skills for free (Dodge, Fortitude?) so that an additional skill point spent provides less direct return in terms of bonuses (depending on how the ranks are set up).

I'm fine with people picking "the best profession" if they wanna min max. This is a system where you're 3 skill points away from the max in "stuff" and at least it "forces" the min maxxers inherent in gaming into having a background while people who are interested in story have mechanical stuff that has a long lasting effect on their characters. Plus with the ease that I tried to put into skill selection, going back to fiddling around with points would be a step back from this much more streamlined process.

Balancing the skills like wise is a big priority for me. Like really fucking big thus the enforced dependency on usin skills to power spells, use various class skills, etc. Here's the list of skills:

Hit Points (yes this is a skill and the only one modified by Resilience/Constitution

Martial Proficiency - Determines weapon, armor, shield, proficiencies. Controls access to combat, armor, shield, weapon style, and similar feats/talents. Also controls proficiency with combat maneuvers and ability to access magic weapons, armor, and shields.

Mystic Proficiency - Controls access to spells, metamaic feats/talents, rites, and rituals.

Accuracy - Your base to hit bonus.

Fortitude - Defense

Dode - Defense

Will - Defense

Acrobatics - Your flippin' around

Animal Handling - Your ability to control and socialize with animals. Can be expanded ino vermin, oozes, etc.

Balance - Ability to stay on your toes

Climb - scaling, swinging, jumping on thing's backs.

Craft (5) Reduced number of total craft skills to 5. Made them more general to cover large areas with an option inside to focus on one thing. Allows you to be more effective aainst constructs, vehicles, etc

Deception - Where bluff used to be. Has an option for disguise with a skill focus feat. Automatically given to shifters. Otherwise covers most kinds of trickery.

Escape Artist - For when you need to escape in a hurry. Also covers squeezing into stuff and teleportation abilities.

Fly - Like swim and climb its a movement based skill. You mess it up you fall. You can get it and not be able to fly but that's pretty useless. Its iven away most of the time to things that are guaranteed wings.

Insight - Your sense motive, your intuition, various forms of inductive reasoning.

Intimidate - All fear affects are controlled by intimidate from mystical to mundane.

Investiate - Your ability to gather information, clues, and various forms of deductive reasoning.

Jump - your ability to hop. It ets better and more similar to flight the more times you concentrate on it. No jump ceiling so it scales with time.

Knowledge (5) - Also reduced to cover wider swathes of info. Most of the time its stuff you know, allows you to predict enemy movements, know tactics, usual rituals, know weaknesses. Its also required for a number of spells and magic item crafting/recognition. Bein smart in this case maks you more inclined to know magic/technology of course.

Legerdemain - Your theivery, your stealing, slieght of hand, etc etc. This skill is about the only thing that may allow you to create/use interdimensional spaces at the high end.

Linguistics - Know your lanuages, decipher scripts, analyzes ancient texts, use your rune, siil, and other lanuage dependent abilities.

Manipulate - This is the Diplomacy skilll. Its the thing that allows you to turn the hearts of kings and swoon the ladies.Most mind control thins depend on this skill.

Perception - All your senses boiled into one. 'nuff said. most detection and scrying abilities depend on this skill.

Pilot - Would be ride but I'm aiming for a techie (steampunk) setting plus it allows people to specialize where they want. Navigating will be split between this and Survival.

Stealth - You know the drill. You got your hide and move silently inside alon with your ability to try to hide from enhanced senses.

Survival - This is your survival, trapping, forain skill. It also allows you to hide in the wilderness and is THE skill you use to counter superior senses like Scent and Echolocation if you get the right talents.

Swim - Like fly you sink or you swim. Thins that are predisposed to swimmin et a leg up. those who are really ood at swimming can resist colder or hotter temperatures and hold their breath really well. They also tend to have more endurance.

Treatment - This is your healing skill in a nutshell. Does your limb replacement and reviving at the higher end.

A number of skills of course didn't make it.

Professions are now actual proffessions.

Appraise, gather info, knowledge local, search, and reconizing foreries are all in Investiate. Concentration is just makin a skill check.

Decipher script, speak languages, and using certain magic devices, are folded into Linguistics.

Disguise got consumed alon with bludd in Deception.

Forgery is in craft and legerdemain.

Open lock is also within craft (the one you would use for locks) and legerdemain.

Perform ot split into pieces and depending on the performance type is in acrobatics (dance), Craft (visual art), Deception (acting, Comedy), Legerdemain (cause I didn't know where else to put instrument playing), and Manipulate (oratory).

Use Magic Device is split into Linguistics and Knowledges.

Use Rope is in Survival.

So here's some small notes on Classes. As it is there are no Prestige Classes and no rules for cross classing, Instead classes just have various class abilities that they choose throughout their career to sharpen their focus or not. Class abilities are all thematic and focus on a certain theme. Typically the themes are the only thing that is protected between classes as a number of mechanically similar abilities can and do appear on multiple ability lists.

Each class has 3 archetypes that characters may choose to follow in order to streamline the character generation process. Classes give Primary Abilities that are given at every odd level. I may also write up a bunch of sub abilities that come online every even level but whether I stick to it or not is up in the air for now. There are no plans to make class feats currently. More notes later.