Lets say you have a percentage chance to do something special - something outside the normal range of things you can accomplish. So, instead of making a single attack in a round, you make two. Instead of suffering from a wound, you manage to overcome it and fight on. Instead of being stuck by arrows, you deflect them. Instead of drowning, you hold your breath for 10 minutes.

Call them exploits, if you like.

What kind of percentage chance keeps them as special, but doesn't make trying them so hard, folk will hardly ever try?

At the moment, i'm going from about 10% for a novice, up to about 70% at epic levels.

Quote from: One Horse Town;581058Lets say you have a percentage chance to do something special - something outside the normal range of things you can accomplish. So, instead of making a single attack in a round, you make two. Instead of suffering from a wound, you manage to overcome it and fight on. Instead of being stuck by arrows, you deflect them. Instead of drowning, you hold your breath for 10 minutes.

Call them exploits, if you like.

What kind of percentage chance keeps them as special, but doesn't make trying them so hard, folk will hardly ever try?

At the moment, i'm going from about 10% for a novice, up to about 70% at epic levels.

It depends... if I fail my roll, have I wasted my turn, will I get a bonus to a successive Special Thing roll (Because I've spent time setting it up, do I get to do my normal thing?

Quote from: Ladybird;581067It depends... if I fail my roll, have I wasted my turn, will I get a bonus to a successive Special Thing roll (Because I've spent time setting it up, do I get to do my normal thing?

There might be drawbacks for failing, yeah.

Although i kind of like the idea of building up to an exploit. I have an Advantage system in place already that takes care of mundane things - like you gain +1 to hit next time, do +1 damage on your next blow etc.

Maybe i can add a "You gain +5% (or 10%) to your next Exploit attempt" to Advantages.

Quote from: One Horse Town;581070There might be drawbacks for failing, yeah.

I'd rather suffer a drawback, like some penalty in the future, than just have nothing happen as a result of my turn. If I roll the dice, I want something to happen, good or bad.

(I am aware that "nothing happens" is the same as the result "you spent your action's opportunity cost on this, and failed", but it's a perception issue.)

QuoteAlthough i kind of like the idea of building up to an exploit. I have an Advantage system in place already that takes care of mundane things - like you gain +1 to hit next time, do +1 damage on your next blow etc.

Maybe i can add a "You gain +5% (or 10%) to your next Exploit attempt" to Advantages.

Perhaps you could combine the two mechanics into one? Say, someone tries an exploit, and fails - give them a Risk Token, which gives them +10% to any future exploits they attempt, but also +10% to exploits against them, because they're put themselves out of position, have shifted their guard, etc., and will be easier targets for the opposition. Risk Tokens clear when the character either lands an exploit, is the target of a successful exploit, or tries something else (However, in this case, they would clear at the start of the player's next turn, so they can't easily cancel if the situation looks too risky).

I kind of do this with something called Fate points, of which a player will normally have between one and three, they don't regenerate but need to be purchased if used, and they ain't cheap. Spend your fate point and your action may succeed, but if you roll a 1 on your fate roll its a disastrous failure instead. A 2 is a plain old failure, with varying degrees of success thereafter.

This has a complex and imho desireable effect on player usage.

I'd rather be able to buy it than hope for it, so it happens when I need it -- when it will be most awesome.

Quote from: Ladybird;581076Perhaps you could combine the two mechanics into one? Say, someone tries an exploit, and fails - give them a Risk Token, which gives them +10% to any future exploits they attempt, but also +10% to exploits against them, because they're put themselves out of position, have shifted their guard, etc., and will be easier targets for the opposition. Risk Tokens clear when the character either lands an exploit, is the target of a successful exploit, or tries something else (However, in this case, they would clear at the start of the player's next turn, so they can't easily cancel if the situation looks too risky).

Advantages are tied into combat and skill resolution at the moment. I plan on having Exploits for each Stat.

It's a roll under target number system - if you roll your TN exactly, you get to choose an advantage for your next action. You can also 'call an advantage' that is declare you are trying for an advantage before you roll the dice and if you roll under your TN, you gain that advantage.

So, say your attack TN is 7. You roll a d10 and gain an 8 - fail. Your next roll is a 5 - that's 2 under your TN and you deal 2 points of damage. Next you roll a 7 - you deal no damage but get to choose an Advantage for your next round. A few rounds later you decide to 'call' an Advantage, let's say, trip. As long as you roll 7 or below, your foe has to resist a trip attempt.

Here's the TN success chart for combat.

Beat TN By

0   Choose Advantage      
1   1 Vitality Damage   
2   2 Vitality Damage   
3   3 Vitality Damage   
4   4 Vitality Damage   
5   5 Vitality Damage   
6   Wound   
7   Wound +1 Accuracy
8   Wound +2 Accuracy   
9   Wound +3 Accuracy
10+   Wound +4 Accuracy

Quote from: Ladybird;581076I'd rather suffer a drawback, like some penalty in the future, than just have nothing happen as a result of my turn. If I roll the dice, I want something to happen, good or bad.

(I am aware that "nothing happens" is the same as the result "you spent your action's opportunity cost on this, and failed", but it's a perception issue.)

I think this is a good point, and oft overlooked.  There is all kinds of noise about succeeding and doing something epic and being in the spotlight during a turn, but I think it really boils down to "something needs to happen".  Even if a missed opportunity means my character is now flat on their ass, at least that is something I can work with next turn.

Nothing upsets people more than indifference; hence, having your turn end up as 'indifferent' understandably gets people upset.

Quote from: StormBringer;581085Nothing upsets people more than indifference; hence, having your turn end up as 'indifferent' understandably gets people upset.

Typically I find that the attempted deed needing a fate point is so spectacular that even failure is usually rewarding in that sense. Of course this is a very different idea from storygame fate points.

Well, as an example of a drawback, Milly fails with the Crippling Blow Exploit. She puts everything she has into hacking the face off that Ogre - ouch! She pulls a muscle - she is Rocked for 2 rounds (Rocked gives -2 to Initiative).

Quote from: The Traveller;581093Typically I find that the attempted deed needing a fate point is so spectacular that even failure is usually rewarding in that sense. Of course this is a very different idea from storygame fate points.

Exactly.  Your character may fail magnificently and end up on the edge of dying, but at least something happened.  Nothing is worse than "You swing at the Ogre and...  you missed.  Next?"  The briefest bit of description is better, even if there is no mechanical consequence.

Quote from: One Horse Town;581094Well, as an example of a drawback, Milly fails with the Crippling Blow Exploit. She puts everything she has into hacking the face off that Ogre - ouch! She pulls a muscle - she is Rocked for 2 rounds (Rocked gives -2 to Initiative).

Awesome.  I would totally play that kind of game.  It could be somewhat frustrating if these things keep piling up, so perhaps some oddball chance that their failure sets them up for a awesome hit the next time?  Milly stumbles through the Crippling Blow exploit, gets the -2 initiative, (GM rolls less than 10% on the Exception Roll or something) but is perfectly set up for the Stab Them In the Liver exploit for double damage next turn, with possibly a good bonus to make sure they hit.  Something that would only come up maybe once or twice a session, with the odds increasing by the number of failures in the previous string.  Flubbed it the last five times?  +5 bonus to the Exception Roll.

I don't want to get too complex, as the game is getting pretty complex as is!

It's Embodiments btw.

I'll post an example character below and a bit of explanation blurb.

I should also move this to Design, i think.

[B]Priestess of Far Coral Shoals[/B]

Rank: 1
Origin: Great Lakes
Origin Occupations: Woodsman, Fisherman, Scout, Deckhand, Smuggler and Courier
Path: Cultist
Titles: Earned – None
Bought – None
Invested – None

[U]Statistics [/U]
Value Exploits
Might 4 2% Vitality: 17
Agility 4 4%
Training 4 -
Fortitude 3 10%
 
Spirit 5 10% Discipline: 17
Knowledge 4 -
Influence 3 4%
Poise 3 8%

Wounds: 10
Morale: 10

Occupational Levels

Wrecker (Cult of The Drowned One) 2 (Ex – Fort +3%/lvl, Spirit +5%/lvl)
Fisherman 2 (Ex – Fort +2%/lvl)
Deckhand 2 (Ex – Might +1%/lvl, Ag +2%/lvl)
Smuggler 1 (Ex – Poise +2%/lvl)
Hypnotist 2 (Ex – Inf +2%/lvl, Poise +2%/lvl)

Occupational Embodiments

None

Occupational Skills

Foraging 2
Lesser Invocation 2
Knife 2
Climb 2
Swim 2
Sailing 2
Belaying Pin 2
Hide 1
Perception 1
Streetwise 1
Society 2
Perform – Hypnotise 2

Implement Levels

Mirror 1

Implement Embodiments

None

I don't want to get too complex, as the game is getting pretty complex as is!

It's Embodiments btw.

I'll post an example character below and a bit of explanation blurb.

I should also move this to Design, i think.

[B]Priestess of Far Coral Shoals[/B]

Rank: 1
Origin: Great Lakes
Origin Occupations: Woodsman, Fisherman, Scout, Deckhand, Smuggler and Courier
Path: Cultist
Titles: Earned – None
Bought – None
Invested – None

[U]Statistics [/U]
Value Exploits
Might 4 2% Vitality: 17
Agility            4 4%
Training 4 -
Fortitude 3 10%
 
Spirit 5 10% Discipline: 17
Knowledge 4 -
Influence 3 4%
Poise 3 8%

Wounds: 10
Morale: 10

Occupational Levels

Wrecker (Cult of The Drowned One) 2 (Ex – Fort +3%/lvl, Spirit +5%/lvl)
Fisherman 2 (Ex – Fort +2%/lvl)
Deckhand 2 (Ex – Might +1%/lvl, Ag +2%/lvl)
Smuggler 1 (Ex – Poise +2%/lvl)
Hypnotist 2 (Ex – Inf +2%/lvl, Poise +2%/lvl)

Occupational Embodiments

None

Occupational Skills

Foraging 2
Lesser Invocation 2
Knife 2
Climb 2
Swim 2
Sailing 2
Belaying Pin 2
Hide 1
Perception 1
Streetwise 1
Society 2
Perform – Hypnotise 2

Implement Levels

Mirror 1

Implement Embodiments

None

I don't want to get too complex, as the game is getting pretty complex as is!

It's Embodiments btw.

I'll post an example character below and a bit of explanation blurb.

I should also move this to Design, i think.

[B]Priestess of Far Coral Shoals[/B]

Rank: 1
Origin: Great Lakes
Origin Occupations: Woodsman, Fisherman, Scout, Deckhand, Smuggler and Courier
Path: Cultist
Titles: Earned – None
Bought – None
Invested – None

[U]Statistics [/U]
Value Exploits
Might 4 2% Vitality: 17
Agility             4 4%
Training             4 -
Fortitude            3 10%
 
Spirit 5 10% Discipline: 17
Knowledge 4 -
Influence            3 4%
Poise 3 8%

Wounds: 10
Morale: 10

[U]Occupational Levels[/U]

Wrecker (Cult of The Drowned One) 2 (Ex – Fort +3%/lvl, Spirit +5%/lvl)
Fisherman 2 (Ex – Fort +2%/lvl)
Deckhand 2 (Ex – Might +1%/lvl, Ag +2%/lvl)
Smuggler 1 (Ex – Poise +2%/lvl)
Hypnotist 2 (Ex – Inf +2%/lvl, Poise +2%/lvl)

[U]Occupational Embodiments[/U]

None

[U]Occupational Skills[/U]

Foraging 2
Lesser Invocation 2
Knife 2
Climb 2
Swim 2
Sailing 2
Belaying Pin 2
Hide 1
Perception 1
Streetwise 1
Society 2
Perform – Hypnotise 2

[U]Implement Levels[/U]

Mirror 1

[U]Implement Embodiments[/U]

None