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Author Topic: What's to be done about homelessness?  (Read 22269 times)

Shasarak

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #120 on: February 23, 2021, 06:35:27 PM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

Who da Drow?  U da drow! - hedgehobbit

There will be poor always,
pathetically struggling,
look at the good things you've got! -  Jesus

jhkim

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #121 on: February 23, 2021, 08:28:09 PM »
Point out any mistakes I made besides getting the total city budget confused with the budget for the homeless programs. I was asking honest questions, and you got butthurt and lashed out like a child. We already knew you were a troll and an asshole, no better than the people you complain about. This is just more evidence towards that.
I don't even care about your opinions anymore. I just like to watch you dig your hole deeper.

HappyDaze's first reply to you pointed out a lot of things that were included in that xB$ total that didn't belong, in another post specifically told you where to look for the real number, and then in a later post provided the actual numbers. HD does troll, but not in this case. It wasn't particularly polite, but neither is your post.

I agree with Pat here. The conversation here has devolved into trading insults rather than discussing the issues. Regarding the issue of cost of homeless... Currently in Seattle, the number I heard was,

$100M/11751 homeless persons = $8510/homeless person

I'm curious about how much that is compared to other programs. For example, in Houston, there was a $58 million program that aimed to end chronic homelessness - but Houston has a homeless population only one-third the size.

https://communityimpact.com/houston/cy-fair/government/2020/06/30/updated-harris-county-houston-commit-58-million-to-program-that-could-functionally-end-chronic-homelessness-in-the-county/

$58M / 3938 homeless persons = $14,728 per homeless person

Maybe the Houston program is much better -- but the cost is also greater per homeless person. Now, Houston has a lower homeless population per capita than Seattle. On the other hand, homeless population interacts with prison population. If a city effectively makes being homeless illegal, then there is a lower homeless population but a higher prison population.

Texas has nearly double the prison population per capita as Washington, and the cost of a prisoner averages $33,000 per capita in the U.S. So that's not a great tradeoff economically.

Ratman_tf

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #122 on: February 24, 2021, 12:24:22 PM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

And as for not giving "two shits about accuracy," I'm the one that pointed you toward the accurate information and then even went so far as to give you direct links to it since your ability to do even basic research seemed so limited.

So, again, what "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

You still obsessing over moi? I'd be flattered if you weren't a psycho.

https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/what-s-to-be-done-about-homelessness/msg1163902/#msg1163902

I did not, "Stick with alternative facts", like you claimed. I do not tolerate having words put in my mouth, or ideas assigned to me that I do not hold.
Back at you. Find me one instance where I "Stuck with the alternative facts".
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
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HappyDaze

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #123 on: February 24, 2021, 02:18:53 PM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

And as for not giving "two shits about accuracy," I'm the one that pointed you toward the accurate information and then even went so far as to give you direct links to it since your ability to do even basic research seemed so limited.

So, again, what "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

You still obsessing over moi? I'd be flattered if you weren't a psycho.

https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/what-s-to-be-done-about-homelessness/msg1163902/#msg1163902

I did not, "Stick with alternative facts", like you claimed. I do not tolerate having words put in my mouth, or ideas assigned to me that I do not hold.
Back at you. Find me one instance where I "Stuck with the alternative facts".
Reply #90. The one where I suggested you look at the real budget and you instead insisted that you had found a solution with your bullshit numbers (hint: those were your alternative facts that you were clinging to).

Ratman_tf

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #124 on: February 27, 2021, 04:15:08 PM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

And as for not giving "two shits about accuracy," I'm the one that pointed you toward the accurate information and then even went so far as to give you direct links to it since your ability to do even basic research seemed so limited.

So, again, what "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

You still obsessing over moi? I'd be flattered if you weren't a psycho.

https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/what-s-to-be-done-about-homelessness/msg1163902/#msg1163902

I did not, "Stick with alternative facts", like you claimed. I do not tolerate having words put in my mouth, or ideas assigned to me that I do not hold.
Back at you. Find me one instance where I "Stuck with the alternative facts".
Reply #90. The one where I suggested you look at the real budget and you instead insisted that you had found a solution with your bullshit numbers (hint: those were your alternative facts that you were clinging to).

Reply #93. dkabq corrects me on the actual number. I aknowledge this in post #96.
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

HappyDaze

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #125 on: February 27, 2021, 04:44:01 PM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

And as for not giving "two shits about accuracy," I'm the one that pointed you toward the accurate information and then even went so far as to give you direct links to it since your ability to do even basic research seemed so limited.

So, again, what "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

You still obsessing over moi? I'd be flattered if you weren't a psycho.

https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/what-s-to-be-done-about-homelessness/msg1163902/#msg1163902

I did not, "Stick with alternative facts", like you claimed. I do not tolerate having words put in my mouth, or ideas assigned to me that I do not hold.
Back at you. Find me one instance where I "Stuck with the alternative facts".
Reply #90. The one where I suggested you look at the real budget and you instead insisted that you had found a solution with your bullshit numbers (hint: those were your alternative facts that you were clinging to).

Reply #93. dkabq corrects me on the actual number. I aknowledge this in post #96.
You missed my more detailed links in Reply #91. You're really bad at this.

Ratman_tf

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #126 on: February 28, 2021, 06:21:17 PM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

And as for not giving "two shits about accuracy," I'm the one that pointed you toward the accurate information and then even went so far as to give you direct links to it since your ability to do even basic research seemed so limited.

So, again, what "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

You still obsessing over moi? I'd be flattered if you weren't a psycho.

https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/what-s-to-be-done-about-homelessness/msg1163902/#msg1163902

I did not, "Stick with alternative facts", like you claimed. I do not tolerate having words put in my mouth, or ideas assigned to me that I do not hold.
Back at you. Find me one instance where I "Stuck with the alternative facts".
Reply #90. The one where I suggested you look at the real budget and you instead insisted that you had found a solution with your bullshit numbers (hint: those were your alternative facts that you were clinging to).

Reply #93. dkabq corrects me on the actual number. I aknowledge this in post #96.
You missed my more detailed links in Reply #91. You're really bad at this.

I didn't miss them. I didn't want to engage with a self-declared troll. I only seriously engaged when you started assigning thoughts to me that I didn't say. And this whole drawn out troll is evidence that I should have ignored you then.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2021, 06:22:56 PM by Ratman_tf »
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

HappyDaze

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #127 on: March 01, 2021, 02:37:32 AM »
What "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

And as for not giving "two shits about accuracy," I'm the one that pointed you toward the accurate information and then even went so far as to give you direct links to it since your ability to do even basic research seemed so limited.

So, again, what "shit" did I make up? Please, be specific.

You still obsessing over moi? I'd be flattered if you weren't a psycho.

https://www.therpgsite.com/the-rpgpundit-s-own-forum/what-s-to-be-done-about-homelessness/msg1163902/#msg1163902

I did not, "Stick with alternative facts", like you claimed. I do not tolerate having words put in my mouth, or ideas assigned to me that I do not hold.
Back at you. Find me one instance where I "Stuck with the alternative facts".
Reply #90. The one where I suggested you look at the real budget and you instead insisted that you had found a solution with your bullshit numbers (hint: those were your alternative facts that you were clinging to).

Reply #93. dkabq corrects me on the actual number. I aknowledge this in post #96.
You missed my more detailed links in Reply #91. You're really bad at this.

I didn't miss them. I didn't want to engage with a self-declared troll. I only seriously engaged when you started assigning thoughts to me that I didn't say. And this whole drawn out troll is evidence that I should have ignored you then.
OK, so you didn't miss the facts I presented, you just decided to ignore them and stick with your alternative facts. Now you've confirmed that the words I assigned to you then perfectly fit your behavior. You really should have quit when some people might have believed you didn't intentionally ignore fact for fiction.

oggsmash

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #128 on: March 01, 2021, 07:34:41 AM »
Greetings!

Well, fuck the "studies". My lived experience dealing with many homeless people first hand has demonstrated to me that a distinct majority of homeless people are very much drug and alcohol addicts. Not all of them, certainly, but a majority. Mentally ill people make up a large component of the homeless population as well.

Capable, mature, functioning, and responsible people typically don't become homeless, and when they do, they don't remain homeless for long.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
As usual, SHARK is playing his role as a bombastic dumbass to the fullest.

If we want to go with lived experiences,  I can say that I've seen many homeless individuals spend time in mental health centers when the temperature drops. Yes, they are "crazy" enough to play the system for a warm, dry place to sleep and hot meals for a few days because the system holds them for 72h if they claim suicidal ideation.

  So you are saying a bunch of the ones claiming mental disorders are lying grifters who just do not want to work and know that society loves to take care of a victim?  That I can believe.

Ratman_tf

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #129 on: March 01, 2021, 11:54:55 AM »


I think I've helped you troll the thread for long enough.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2021, 12:09:11 PM by Ratman_tf »
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung

HappyDaze

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #130 on: March 01, 2021, 03:05:48 PM »


I think I've helped you troll the thread for long enough.
I think everyone has seen how you flounder and thrash when you're called on for sticking with alternative facts (in this case, also known as bullshit numbers and nonsense), but it's hilarious to see you keep twisting on the hook. You really should have walked away after I pointed out you were wading in the shit of alternative facts, but you had to show us all that you could touch bottom in the deep end of it. All because you just can't let it go when the one that was right was me. For you, it's obviously personal.

Visitor Q

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #131 on: March 06, 2021, 05:53:04 PM »
Coming from a UK perspective here.

I spent about 6 years working in different legal advice and housing law jobs. Many of the clients were homeless.  That was about 7 years ago.  Also until COVID I volunteerd at a local soup kitchen run by a Catholic Church and have gotten to know a few of the homeless people in the local area.

In the UK you have two types of homeless.  Legally homeless and Street Homeless.  Legally homeless means you meet the legal definition of homeless because you don't have a legal place to stay.  For example if you had been kicked out of your house and were crashing at a friends for two weeks you would be legally homeless.  Street homeless isn't strictly an official term but is often used to describe those sleeping rough on the streets.

Legally homeless is such a wide spectrum of people and circumstances it's difficult to comment but improving access to jobs and affordable housing would have a massive impact.

With street homeless I would say a majority have mental health issues including substance abuse and/or very limited education possibly caused by learning difficulties.  About 90% are men (this is an official figure not my estimate).  Probably about 25% are refugees or asylum seekers.

Over the past few years the number of Street homeless has fallen.  The initiatives that seemed to have worked appear to be:

Directing money towards very focused charities which coordinate with local politicans.  In the UK the main one is Shelter.  This provides both the legal and political impetus but also democratic oversight to ensure funds are being spent correctly.  Most of the various Christian Churches provide quite a lot of funding as well.  The charities themselves provide hostels and set standards (hygene and safety) for hostels to encourage rough sleepers to go there.  The hostels then act as community outreach for drug support, employment, accessing benefits etc.

Local Authorities legally being required to identify vulnerable children particularly in their late teens who are with parents or other adults (foster care etc) but are shortly going to be homeless.

Public awareness.  This includes awareness of mental health issues so people get help earlier. 

Just recongising that homelessness is an issue that could potentially effect anyone.  This might seem like a soft solution and by itself it is, but there is a massive assumption that the government will provide a house to anyone and so homeless people are somehow there by choice.  By increasing awareness that this isn't the case it does make people a little more aware that actually someone they know might need some help because things can spiral out of control very quickly.

Also I get the impression that public awareness of the number of empty houses compared to rough sleepers has shamed the government a little bit.

I think more up to date and regular stats on the numbers of rough sleepers and registered legally homeless would also provide a political impetus.

It is a really difficult problem and I don't think there's an easy solution.  Certainly the UK hasn't completly solved it.  There's quite a lot of homeless people in my area even though it is a pretty good area of London.  Throwing money at the solution would definitely help but I would suggest that without focused coordination and leadership you probably won't be spending your £ (or $) as efficiently as you'd like.

Hopefully not opening a can of worms here but I get the impression that the UK political system is a little bit more direct in terms of being able to directly address a social problem like this.  For example the Prime Minister is also a Member of Parliment for a particular constituency, meaning homelessness in that area is his individual problem.




 






 

 
« Last Edit: March 07, 2021, 11:07:01 AM by Visitor Q »

KingCheops

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #132 on: March 07, 2021, 12:15:41 PM »
Thanks for the interesting experience/perspective.

FelixGamingX1

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #133 on: April 16, 2021, 07:50:28 PM »
I think that's just one of the many serious problems COVID-19 generated in a ton of fields like mental health, depression, anxiety, uncertainty, stress. I am very concerned about the end results of this pandemic and the negative effects it will have in the current and next generations, economic impact, etc. It's very saddening to see all this mess and being able to do so little. I mean, for starters we can't even coordinate whether or not to wear masks, there's no communication, it's awful. Even trying to eat in a restaurant is a whole process that makes you want to just stay home. But even staying home can feel super lame at times. The few gatherings felt good, you miss your friends and all but always concerned if they might have the virus or not. Just seems like everyone is clueless and running around in circles hoping the vaccine works. But unfortunately it's the world we live in at this moment. Better times will come so everyone hang in there, I'm optimistic by the end of 2021 we will have made some progress towards some normalcy. And hopefully the people that got hit the hardest are able to recover from this.
American writer and programmer, since 2016.
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Koltar

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Re: What's to be done about homelessness?
« Reply #134 on: April 17, 2021, 03:44:07 PM »
For years I have had a solution to the Homelessness problem.

This idea would work in most cities in America - Almost every major city has too many abandoned and empty buildings. It is an information management problem - we just need to match up homeless folks with empty homes and buildings that can be used as residences.
That includes all the shyscrapers or tall building that are near 40 to 5-% 'empty' - people could live on those floors.
- Ed C.
The return of 'You can't take the Sky From me!'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUn-eN8mkDw&feature=rec-fresh+div

This is what a really cool FANTASY RPG should be like :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-WnjVUBDbs

Still here, still alive, at least Seven years now...