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Author Topic: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.  (Read 100804 times)

Shrieking Banshee

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #60 on: February 26, 2022, 11:12:37 AM »
The president of the Ukraine denies that. And he's Jewish.

I don't know enough about the topic to have any idea which is true.

It is not. And Im Jewish as well.

Mistwell

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #61 on: February 26, 2022, 11:14:27 AM »
THEN, also as you noted, I have long been disturbed and concerned about actual, real, NAZI influence in Ukraine. I've seen videos and such where this isn't a few guys with political opinions just to the right of Mao, or who oppose the Alphabet Mafia, and are labeled as NAZI's by the deranged fucktard Left--there are entire *REGIMENTS* of heavily-armed NAZI's in the Ukrainian military, featuring swastika armbands, Nazi tattoos, waving Nazi banners and the whole bit. RIGHT SECTOR is fucking right, my friend! I've seen videos and interviews with these guys. Geesus. And the Ukrainian government embraces them and supports them.

And Lefty Liberal fucktards always screeching about how everyone that opposes them are Nazi's, and that Putin is a monster--how convenient they are oblivious to actual Nazis in positions of influence in Ukraine.

Shark, you'll notice I've been pretty quiet on Ukraine here. But this part, I gotta jump in. This part is Russian propaganda. You're repeating stuff directly planted by RT. That Nazi influence stuff is bullshit from FSB. They're taking two strategies on this one: 1) Paint the Ukraine military and Government as drug addicts, and 2) Paint the Ukraine military and Government as Nazis.

It's not that there isn't a neo-nazi nationalist segment of Ukraine. There is. There's one in most nations. But they're tiny, and have no power in Ukraine. In the 2019 election, the Ukrainian far right nationalists (which are not all neo-nazis themselves, but that's the group they allied with) were humiliated, receiving only 2% of the vote. That's less than they got in most EU nations, like France and Germany.

And as Pat mentioned, the President is Jewish, and he comes from a family like mine where most of his family was wiped out by the holocaust.

The actual Nazis do not have meaningful influence in Ukraine. But, Putin wants you to think they do. And he wants you to think drug addicts run Ukraine. Those are the two strategies their propaganda is taking, and people shouldn't fall for Russian propaganda. There is plenty of real stuff to talk about.

Shrieking Banshee

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #62 on: February 26, 2022, 11:22:56 AM »
Shark, you'll notice I've been pretty quiet on Ukraine here. But this part, I gotta jump in. This part is Russian propaganda.

Ukraine isn't run by a cabal of secret nazis so that makes shelling civilians 'OK' with rockets aimed at civilian sections.

But after the Crimea anexation there was a sizable movement of neo-nazis that became popular in the country out of spite for russia (because the germans ruled Ukraine for a bit, and so at that moment anything anti-russia was in). I mean they had parades down main street. And its been a while since the last confirmed one, but TONS of Drug addicts have run Ukraine at one point or another. When I lived there we made plenty of jokes about the mayor being a major coke fiend. We where without a mayor for a while and it didn't make any difference. I don't know what the status was in terms of influence the last 2 years or so.

But as I said, killing the civilians and bombing cities isn't really gonna fix the underlying social issues so moreso then being mugged by a schitzophreniac is likely to fix a phobia of spiders. If neo nazi coke-fiends where shouting 'Go Putin', they would be the first to be put in power by him.

Tubesock Army
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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #63 on: February 26, 2022, 12:44:26 PM »
Hard to know what's propaganda and what's real, but if this is genuine, it goes a long way toward explaining why Russia isn't doing as well as projected.

Lots of videos today, purporting to show captured Russian soldiers. Most of these are claiming that they didn't know they were fighting, or were told they would be "training". Others claiming they were told that Ukraine would offer little resistance. Some seem scared, confused. Multiple reports of Russians getting lost, or attempting to hide themselves in Ukraine.

I don't yet know what to believe wrt these videos. Ukraine has set up a hotline for Russian parents to check on their kids.

jhkim

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #64 on: February 26, 2022, 01:31:14 PM »
And people *wonder* why Vladimir Putin is being hard-nosed, and aggressive? Gee, I wonder why!? Russia can't possibly have its own legitimate security concerns--like the US--and insist that Russia's perspective and concerns IN THEIR FRONT YARD--be respected, huh? Just like we don't mince words when it comes to our strategic and real security concerns. But Russia needs to shut up and sit down like a little bitch, is that right?

Regardless of internal politics, Ukraine is not a legitimate security concern for Russia that justifies invasion. Ukraine is not building up its military and/or threatening to attack Russia. Russia is attacking purely to conquer, not out of self-defense.

The people of Ukraine have done nothing to justify this assault.

Invading another country just because they don't like you isn't a "legitimate security concern" - it is unprovoked aggression.

oggsmash

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #65 on: February 26, 2022, 04:16:00 PM »
  You know what I do not hear about?   The White house and congress clamoring to allow in hundreds of thousands of refugees from Ukraine.  That seems odd, normally with such a clearly painted bad guy like Putin, they would be all over themselves to bring in refugees.

Tubesock Army
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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #66 on: February 26, 2022, 04:22:51 PM »
Maybe because neighboring countries seem willing to do it? Hard to say.

oggsmash

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #67 on: February 26, 2022, 04:30:17 PM »
  Strange though, since neighbors were willing in many other crisis in the past.  Maybe too close to midterms to push taking in refugees?

oggsmash

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #68 on: February 26, 2022, 04:36:47 PM »
And people *wonder* why Vladimir Putin is being hard-nosed, and aggressive? Gee, I wonder why!? Russia can't possibly have its own legitimate security concerns--like the US--and insist that Russia's perspective and concerns IN THEIR FRONT YARD--be respected, huh? Just like we don't mince words when it comes to our strategic and real security concerns. But Russia needs to shut up and sit down like a little bitch, is that right?

Regardless of internal politics, Ukraine is not a legitimate security concern for Russia that justifies invasion. Ukraine is not building up its military and/or threatening to attack Russia. Russia is attacking purely to conquer, not out of self-defense.

The people of Ukraine have done nothing to justify this assault.

Invading another country just because they don't like you isn't a "legitimate security concern" - it is unprovoked aggression.

  Well....since you are saying this from the USA, the rest of the world takes it with a grain of salt.  Given the USA's past, especially the past 50ish years, this is a case of a giant pot calling a kettle black. 

Tubesock Army
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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #69 on: February 26, 2022, 04:44:54 PM »
Imagine simping for authoritarianism so hard that you can't help but "AKCHYUALLY..." at a free country fighting back against invasion by a criminal dictator lmao

Shasarak

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #70 on: February 26, 2022, 05:15:03 PM »
5 pages and no one has addressed the concern that Hunter Biden will not get his stack of cash this year?

For shame!
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yancy

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #71 on: February 26, 2022, 05:21:13 PM »
5 pages and no one has addressed the concern that Hunter Biden will not get his stack of cash this year?

He can fuck right off, the Ukrainians got gypped.

I'm more worried about how this will affect the prices of crappy steel-jacketed 'liberal-plinking' ammo.
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Ghostmaker

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #72 on: February 26, 2022, 05:32:20 PM »
5 pages and no one has addressed the concern that Hunter Biden will not get his stack of cash this year?

For shame!
Big guy's gotta get his ten percent, y'know.

Pat
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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #73 on: February 26, 2022, 05:47:22 PM »
5 pages and no one has addressed the concern that Hunter Biden will not get his stack of cash this year?

For shame!
Don't worry, I'm sure his daddy is setting him up with a defense contractor right now.

jhkim

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #74 on: February 26, 2022, 05:59:35 PM »
And people *wonder* why Vladimir Putin is being hard-nosed, and aggressive? Gee, I wonder why!? Russia can't possibly have its own legitimate security concerns--like the US--and insist that Russia's perspective and concerns IN THEIR FRONT YARD--be respected, huh? Just like we don't mince words when it comes to our strategic and real security concerns. But Russia needs to shut up and sit down like a little bitch, is that right?

Regardless of internal politics, Ukraine is not a legitimate security concern for Russia that justifies invasion. Ukraine is not building up its military and/or threatening to attack Russia. Russia is attacking purely to conquer, not out of self-defense.

  Well....since you are saying this from the USA, the rest of the world takes it with a grain of salt.  Given the USA's past, especially the past 50ish years, this is a case of a giant pot calling a kettle black.

OK, but in this analogy, the pot and the kettle are in fact both black - i.e. both the USA and Russia have engaged in unjustified wars.

Still, that means that Putin's invasion is wrong - which I would think is your position based on your earlier stance. There are not legitimate security concerns that mean the Ukrainians deserve to be invaded. That's the fundamental question here.