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Author Topic: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.  (Read 41027 times)

Battlemaster

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #840 on: June 21, 2022, 11:59:27 PM »
Talking about Russia's military spending is not easy. The ''Russian federation'' inherited a huge military from the soviet union. A lot of it is still useful despite poor maintenance .

Also the Russian ecomony is still under Putin's control, he sets wages, prices, etc. Plus let's not forget slave labor, and the fact the russian army is basically a slave labor force.

Best estimates place the total Russian GDP at just below New York state's. That was before the war abd sanctions. Exact estimates are imposible due to the fact the Russian economy is a blatant kleptocracy and no one knows how much is simply stolen by oligarchs and exists in the russissn economy only as 'cooked book' entries.
Fuck the fascist right and the fascist left.

Battlemaster

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #841 on: June 22, 2022, 12:00:16 AM »
fap fap fap

OK, groomer.

You calling me a pedo you motherfucking pjece of shit? Even pundit doesn't pull that level of shitlording. I hope you fuck up and call someone that IRL and they stomp your mouth to a pulp you pussy.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2022, 12:16:01 AM by Battlemaster »
Fuck the fascist right and the fascist left.

Battlemaster

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #842 on: June 22, 2022, 12:04:23 AM »
Is calling people pedos just the new shitlord default response?

« Last Edit: June 22, 2022, 12:19:30 AM by Battlemaster »
Fuck the fascist right and the fascist left.

Battlemaster

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #843 on: June 22, 2022, 12:08:59 AM »
I can't wait till one does it in real life and gets his mouth smashed.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2022, 12:19:03 AM by Battlemaster »
Fuck the fascist right and the fascist left.

Battlemaster

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #844 on: June 22, 2022, 12:23:58 AM »

Speak for yourself Jeff. Or are you trying to pull that leftie tactic of claiming to represent some mob of people who think and believe exactly like you so you feel free to speak on their behalf? Sorry buddy, we're all individuals here. Even you.

I call them like I see them.

You are just butthurt that your liar ways have been exposed for all to see.

You are free to call things as you see them, but not free to speak for how others see them. Stop naming yourself a leader when you lead only yourself.

You view me as a messianic threat to your online image which is as much a lie as you are. The readers know what you are.

No Jeff. Believe it or not I've seen your social media. I view you as an ordinary dude, just like me. I have no "online image" or at least none I particularly care about. And what's this "the readers" crap? We're all just guys posting to an internet message board about games and game related stuff. This isn't the fucking wall street journal. You and I have no "readers" in the sense you keep using that word.

Hey mistwell, where js jeffs 'online prescence'?  Motherfucker just called me a pedo, I might want to see what kind of shit he pulls on his so called 'social media ''.
Fuck the fascist right and the fascist left.

Mistwell

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #845 on: June 22, 2022, 12:48:26 AM »

No Jeff. Believe it or not I've seen your social media. I view you as an ordinary dude, just like me. I have no "online image" or at least none I particularly care about. And what's this "the readers" crap? We're all just guys posting to an internet message board about games and game related stuff. This isn't the fucking wall street journal. You and I have no "readers" in the sense you keep using that word.

Bolding mine because stalkerish behavior is creepy as fuck.

What's next, you gonna dox me?

See, you try to come off as rational but you are willing to search out and look into my social media? That's only rational to a crackhead.

EDIT: You'd think you would have been smart enough to not threaten my SO, but like a true social justice wanker you have no bounds.

Of course I'm not going to dox you. But we both know why it's not stalkerish (unless you forgot, which is possible). Which is kind of funny I guess. And what's this about your SO?

Mistwell

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #846 on: June 22, 2022, 12:51:06 AM »

Speak for yourself Jeff. Or are you trying to pull that leftie tactic of claiming to represent some mob of people who think and believe exactly like you so you feel free to speak on their behalf? Sorry buddy, we're all individuals here. Even you.

I call them like I see them.

You are just butthurt that your liar ways have been exposed for all to see.

You are free to call things as you see them, but not free to speak for how others see them. Stop naming yourself a leader when you lead only yourself.

You view me as a messianic threat to your online image which is as much a lie as you are. The readers know what you are.

No Jeff. Believe it or not I've seen your social media. I view you as an ordinary dude, just like me. I have no "online image" or at least none I particularly care about. And what's this "the readers" crap? We're all just guys posting to an internet message board about games and game related stuff. This isn't the fucking wall street journal. You and I have no "readers" in the sense you keep using that word.

Hey mistwell, where js jeffs 'online prescence'?  Motherfucker just called me a pedo, I might want to see what kind of shit he pulls on his so called 'social media ''.

That's not going to happen man. Leave me out of it.

jeff37923

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #847 on: June 22, 2022, 01:02:15 AM »

No Jeff. Believe it or not I've seen your social media. I view you as an ordinary dude, just like me. I have no "online image" or at least none I particularly care about. And what's this "the readers" crap? We're all just guys posting to an internet message board about games and game related stuff. This isn't the fucking wall street journal. You and I have no "readers" in the sense you keep using that word.

Bolding mine because stalkerish behavior is creepy as fuck.

What's next, you gonna dox me?

See, you try to come off as rational but you are willing to search out and look into my social media? That's only rational to a crackhead.

EDIT: You'd think you would have been smart enough to not threaten my SO, but like a true social justice wanker you have no bounds.

Of course I'm not going to dox you. But we both know why it's not stalkerish (unless you forgot, which is possible). Which is kind of funny I guess. And what's this about your SO?

Nope. You are stalking me.

You need to stop doing that, creeper.

And you remember threatening my SO. You even apologized about it, claiming that it wasn't your intent.

Amazingly creepy.
"I do not want to create a story, I want to create a stage. The player characters will perform on that stage and interact with the setting. When the players talk to their friends about what their characters did, then there will be a story."

jeff37923

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #848 on: June 22, 2022, 01:02:49 AM »

Speak for yourself Jeff. Or are you trying to pull that leftie tactic of claiming to represent some mob of people who think and believe exactly like you so you feel free to speak on their behalf? Sorry buddy, we're all individuals here. Even you.

I call them like I see them.

You are just butthurt that your liar ways have been exposed for all to see.

You are free to call things as you see them, but not free to speak for how others see them. Stop naming yourself a leader when you lead only yourself.

You view me as a messianic threat to your online image which is as much a lie as you are. The readers know what you are.

No Jeff. Believe it or not I've seen your social media. I view you as an ordinary dude, just like me. I have no "online image" or at least none I particularly care about. And what's this "the readers" crap? We're all just guys posting to an internet message board about games and game related stuff. This isn't the fucking wall street journal. You and I have no "readers" in the sense you keep using that word.

Hey mistwell, where js jeffs 'online prescence'?  Motherfucker just called me a pedo, I might want to see what kind of shit he pulls on his so called 'social media ''.

I'll give you a hint: golf.

Happy hunting, groomer!
"I do not want to create a story, I want to create a stage. The player characters will perform on that stage and interact with the setting. When the players talk to their friends about what their characters did, then there will be a story."

HappyDaze

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #849 on: June 22, 2022, 06:27:18 AM »
Is calling people pedos just the new shitlord default response?
I don't think it's all that new.

3catcircus

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #850 on: June 22, 2022, 12:11:59 PM »
Is calling people pedos just the new shitlord default response?
I don't think it's all that new.

The fact that he refers to Jeff as a "shitlord" tells me what kind of leftist he is. I could be wrong, but I'm guessing that when he isn't wallowing in his mom's basement or actively grooming, he's in an antifa drum circle in front of a SCOTUS house or vandalizing a pro-life medical clinic...

HappyDaze

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #851 on: June 22, 2022, 12:55:01 PM »
Is calling people pedos just the new shitlord default response?
I don't think it's all that new.

The fact that he refers to Jeff as a "shitlord" tells me what kind of leftist he is. I could be wrong, but I'm guessing that when he isn't wallowing in his mom's basement or actively grooming, he's in an antifa drum circle in front of a SCOTUS house or vandalizing a pro-life medical clinic...
Don't be an idiot. He's likely not all that different from anyone else no matter how you want to exaggerate the most minor of differences.

3catcircus

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #852 on: June 22, 2022, 01:03:01 PM »
Is calling people pedos just the new shitlord default response?
I don't think it's all that new.

The fact that he refers to Jeff as a "shitlord" tells me what kind of leftist he is. I could be wrong, but I'm guessing that when he isn't wallowing in his mom's basement or actively grooming, he's in an antifa drum circle in front of a SCOTUS house or vandalizing a pro-life medical clinic...
Don't be an idiot. He's likely not all that different from anyone else no matter how you want to exaggerate the most minor of differences.

I just find it entertaining seeing the level of projection from leftists - and his level of projection is right up there with Alden Bunag.

KindaMeh

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #853 on: June 24, 2022, 11:12:15 PM »
  I am not certain, but isnt the bill on "helping" Ukraine around 54 billion since start of the year for the USA now?  Isnt that more than Russia's annual military budget?  Where is that money and gear going I wonder?

Roughly yes, though that's mostly a commitment to future aid, not aid that has been sent. Congress passed a $40 billion dollar aid package in May which is the bulk of it, with majority support from both parties. About half of the May package is non-military aid, such as food assistance and health care, with the other half being military aid.

Russia's annual military budget was $66 billion in 2021, but they have increased spending by a lot since the start of the Ukraine war in 2022. I don't think there are reliable spending estimates at this point of their war spending. Active war spending is likely to be much more.

  So in other word mighty close to what their annual military budget has been.   No accounting from the USA or Ukraine side as to where the money and gear is going...and an uptick on arms being sold on the black market.  This is a shit show. The USA has put up 54 billion in half a year.

Comparing pre-war spending to war spending is really apples and oranges. As I said, I don't think estimates of Russian war spending are reliable - but to give an idea, the Moscow Times estimated Russian spending at $300M per day in the war, while Newsweek cited an outside estimate of $900M per day.

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/05/18/russian-defense-spending-surges-to-300m-per-day-amid-ukraine-war-a77712

https://www.newsweek.com/russia-spending-estimated-900-million-day-ukraine-war-1704383

While I don't doubt that there is plenty of cruft in the Ukraine aid package, at least it's going towards a known problem of the Russian war on Ukraine. What I find far more ridiculous is the U.S. spending $770 billion every year in *peacetime* on its military. The Ukraine military aid is a drop in the bucket compared to that.


Firstly, those are interesting numbers to know. Thanks for the info. That said, I actually now kind of have to question whether when half of the money is being spent on aid and the like (not saying such things are not needed) and Russia may be burning through that other half in a month if the higher estimate is true, if this will genuinely be enough to solve the problem or even make a noticeable impact long term. It seems to me that (since I do agree with you on the fact that the funds are going towards a known problem on the global stage) maybe we should be diverting more of our current military spending to being available for similar operations, and since we didn't plan for that ahead of time, sending more now if we really wish to succeed, (my preference) or nothing. But not a false gesture of sympathy made only for political purposes when we don't actually intend to follow through.

As for military spending, we also spend a lot on healthcare and entitlement systems that could and perhaps should be reformed. That said, while I agree we need to downsize national spending, and probably reform our military spending as well, I also acknowledge that one of the government's first and foremost obligations is to the security of our nation and its citizens. As well as, if I am to add in some political realism here, the US's place within the world and positioning in international affairs. Add in a small dose of cosmopolitanism, because I doubt most would want to assume the value of non-citizens to be quite so literally zero, and it becomes clear we need a force adequate to fend off the hostile geopolitical actions of authoritarianism and other things that are not to our interests and overtly screw over the world we are positioned within. Looking at military spending, including veteran benefits and the like which I think help us maintain such a solid force, we are head and shoulders above many  other nations immediately behind us combined. Perhaps we shouldn't spend quite that much, I would agree. But look to things like our refusal to help out Ukraine due in part to military concerns and the fact that analysts are unsure an undistracted USA could protect Taiwan and prevent vicious Chinese expansion if it came down to it... and I don't things are quite so clear cut as you and I would like. IF we are to reduce spending significantly, we will need to both temper that reduction, and acquire alliances that more than pull their own weight, moreso than they do now, and as I think most of our diplomats would say, that's not as easy as it sounds.

Pat

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Re: Ukraine is under attack. It's a full on war.
« Reply #854 on: June 24, 2022, 11:25:45 PM »
The sane reason not to help the Ukraine except for hopes and prayers is because 1) there is no compelling US interest, 2) US interventionism has a really bad history, and 3) Russia has a legitimate strategic interest.

Withdraw from NATO, and let Europe play with Russia, if they care. They're rich enough. It's about time they spent some of that money on defense.