TheRPGSite

Quote from: DocJones on June 12, 2021, 02:40:00 PM
Not a fan of rap, hip hop or whatever the kids are calling it these days.
However I couldn't help noticing that this guy's mocking the woke songs are hitting #1 on iTunes.
Tom MacDonald's "Snowflakes" Reaches #1 On All-Genre US iTunes Sales Chart (https://headlineplanet.com/home/2021/06/04/tom-macdonalds-snowflakes-reaches-1-on-all-genre-us-itunes-sales-chart/)

Quote from: oggsmash on June 15, 2021, 04:04:29 PM
  If you have kids in public school, I can assure you woke is definitely NOT turning a corner.   There is some outrage shown on TV with parents ranting at board meetings, but I can tell you from where I am how that goes.  The uproar starts, some "conservative" runs their mouth about how we should not have CRT, MLK had a dream, yadda yadda yadda.  No one with a smidge of authority has the stones to call the shit what it is, anti white programming.  Add in the people who are for what they thing it is, are easily coerced into thinking it is something it is not and are led by Shitbirds who feel "Define CRT so we can address the concern" when it is nebulous as hell, authored by commies, and any critique of it is used to subtly (or in many places not so subtly) start tossing the R word for opposing it. 

    A corner might get turned, but I can honestly say the internet weirdos radicals have suddenly started to influence policy in local schools all over the country.  So time will tell.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on June 15, 2021, 07:25:42 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 15, 2021, 04:04:29 PM
  If you have kids in public school, I can assure you woke is definitely NOT turning a corner.   There is some outrage shown on TV with parents ranting at board meetings, but I can tell you from where I am how that goes.  The uproar starts, some "conservative" runs their mouth about how we should not have CRT, MLK had a dream, yadda yadda yadda.  No one with a smidge of authority has the stones to call the shit what it is, anti white programming.  Add in the people who are for what they thing it is, are easily coerced into thinking it is something it is not and are led by Shitbirds who feel "Define CRT so we can address the concern" when it is nebulous as hell, authored by commies, and any critique of it is used to subtly (or in many places not so subtly) start tossing the R word for opposing it. 

    A corner might get turned, but I can honestly say the internet weirdos radicals have suddenly started to influence policy in local schools all over the country.  So time will tell.

I take it as a good sign that parents are getting pissed enough to show up and complain.

I found out about Tom Macdonald a few months ago. Really like his stuff. It's boilerplate anti-woke, but he puts a lot of energy into his songs and videos.

Quote from: oggsmash on June 17, 2021, 03:37:58 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on June 15, 2021, 07:25:42 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 15, 2021, 04:04:29 PM
  If you have kids in public school, I can assure you woke is definitely NOT turning a corner.   There is some outrage shown on TV with parents ranting at board meetings, but I can tell you from where I am how that goes.  The uproar starts, some "conservative" runs their mouth about how we should not have CRT, MLK had a dream, yadda yadda yadda.  No one with a smidge of authority has the stones to call the shit what it is, anti white programming.  Add in the people who are for what they thing it is, are easily coerced into thinking it is something it is not and are led by Shitbirds who feel "Define CRT so we can address the concern" when it is nebulous as hell, authored by commies, and any critique of it is used to subtly (or in many places not so subtly) start tossing the R word for opposing it. 

    A corner might get turned, but I can honestly say the internet weirdos radicals have suddenly started to influence policy in local schools all over the country.  So time will tell.

I take it as a good sign that parents are getting pissed enough to show up and complain.

I found out about Tom Macdonald a few months ago. Really like his stuff. It's boilerplate anti-woke, but he puts a lot of energy into his songs and videos.

  Well, I have a friend who is a teacher.  He has had two mandatory "training sessions" that were all out CRT.  The people pushing the shit screech you must define it for them and say it is not in the classroom (yet every teacher is being beaten over the head with it).  So parents being pissed still means jack shit IMO.  This is just the school district where I live (which is a pretty red county) so I have no idea if real action is taking place beyond people complaining, and them summarily being labeled racists.  So we will see.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on June 17, 2021, 08:18:28 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 17, 2021, 03:37:58 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on June 15, 2021, 07:25:42 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 15, 2021, 04:04:29 PM
  If you have kids in public school, I can assure you woke is definitely NOT turning a corner.   There is some outrage shown on TV with parents ranting at board meetings, but I can tell you from where I am how that goes.  The uproar starts, some "conservative" runs their mouth about how we should not have CRT, MLK had a dream, yadda yadda yadda.  No one with a smidge of authority has the stones to call the shit what it is, anti white programming.  Add in the people who are for what they thing it is, are easily coerced into thinking it is something it is not and are led by Shitbirds who feel "Define CRT so we can address the concern" when it is nebulous as hell, authored by commies, and any critique of it is used to subtly (or in many places not so subtly) start tossing the R word for opposing it. 

    A corner might get turned, but I can honestly say the internet weirdos radicals have suddenly started to influence policy in local schools all over the country.  So time will tell.

I take it as a good sign that parents are getting pissed enough to show up and complain.

I found out about Tom Macdonald a few months ago. Really like his stuff. It's boilerplate anti-woke, but he puts a lot of energy into his songs and videos.

  Well, I have a friend who is a teacher.  He has had two mandatory "training sessions" that were all out CRT.  The people pushing the shit screech you must define it for them and say it is not in the classroom (yet every teacher is being beaten over the head with it).  So parents being pissed still means jack shit IMO.  This is just the school district where I live (which is a pretty red county) so I have no idea if real action is taking place beyond people complaining, and them summarily being labeled racists.  So we will see.

Not necessarily. There have been multiple events of parents showing up for school board meetings and ripping into them, to the point of at least one board fleeing the damn meeting.

https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2021/06/progressives_betray_their_panic_over_grass_roots_campaign_to_elect_school_boards_to_stop_crt.html

They are NOT having it all their way. And they only have themselves to blame.

Quote from: Trond on June 18, 2021, 10:24:30 AM
Complaining out loud is what it takes if you ask me. People are generally terrified of being "the only one" who thinks something for themselves.

Quote from: oggsmash on June 18, 2021, 10:25:47 AM

Quote from: Trond on June 18, 2021, 10:24:30 AM
Complaining out loud is what it takes if you ask me. People are generally terrified of being "the only one" who thinks something for themselves.

   I agree with that.  But without follow up action, it means nothing beyond noise.

Quote from: Pat on June 18, 2021, 11:32:55 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on June 18, 2021, 10:25:47 AM

Quote from: Trond on June 18, 2021, 10:24:30 AM
Complaining out loud is what it takes if you ask me. People are generally terrified of being "the only one" who thinks something for themselves.

   I agree with that.  But without follow up action, it means nothing beyond noise.

What action would you suggest?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 02, 2021, 01:01:12 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

Your information is 50 years outdated. Critical Race Theory hasn't spent the past five decades frozen in time.

In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you only have to look into how they re-define terms and their basic assumptions about Theory.

https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/critical-theory/

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

On the other hand, "woke" is and has always been stupid when taken out of the context of Black culture. It's a phrase coined by black folks in the South to talk about other folks (usually white but occasionally black or other race) and how well they understand what black folks go through on a daily basis. If anyone who passes the paper bag test is talking about wokeness in any form, I feel completely free to ignore them as uninformed, whether they are on the left or the right side of the spectrum.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds. Anti-racism training is an insane mish-mash of several things, including a warped view of CRT, usually pushed by people who don't know why anti-racism can be useful or important, and the actual trainings (including 90% of the ones I've been subjected to) are almost always poorly executed or so basic to be useless. Yes, everyone knows that racism is bad, and looking at ways in which the deck is stacked against people who aren't white (or white *enough* in some times and places) can be useful. But hearing for the eighth or ninth time in a 40-hour "training" that "white privilege" and "white fragility" need to be accepted (without going in-depth into what exactly those two phrases are shorthand for) before "racial healing" (again, left undefined) can begin is really difficult to swallow....

Unless you've had the 15 semester-hours that I've had on Critical Race Theory, Cultural Encounters and Reflection, Clinical Pastoral Education, and Imago Dei (M.Div. branch of understanding these things) that build a picture of just how fucked up the United States is on race relations. I had one class that was led by a Tejano whose family had lived in the San Antonio area since the 1500's, had an ancestor who got out of the Alamo before the Mexicans closed in, and was told by a guy whose parents were refugees from WWII Poland that he should "Leave the US to us Americans." in my presence. These things are really, really tricky and need some time to work through and nuanced discussion. They don't work so well in soundbites or "trainings" that are designed (even by well-meaning people) to make a buck and cover HR-required Continuing Education hours.

Quote from: Zelen on July 02, 2021, 01:54:47 AM
Sundown towns? Isn't it weird how we have all these scary names for things white people allegedly did a century ago (I'm sure there's some truth to it, but also a lot of motivated exaggeration), but our lexicon of ominous phrases doesn't have a word for the same phenomenon happening to whites?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:26:59 AM
Just on this one: I'm curious if you know of any US townships or counties where, by law, if you were white, you couldn't stay overnight (even in a payed lodging) without being arrested and thrown in jail for vagrancy. There were several of those for nonwhites in the early-to-mid twentieth century US. In fact, Washington Territory (now Washington State) actually declared a handful of Black families "officially white" when they passed their restrictive "anti-Negro" laws preventing any black person from owning real property.

Quote from: deathknight4044 on July 02, 2021, 02:16:06 AM

"Unless youve been indoctrinated as I have, you arent allowed to have an opinion about our systemic vilification of White western people". Yeah man its so esoteric it's not like we can read the works of proponents of critical race theory like Robin DeAngelo, or the training material that teachers are being given, or the training corporation's like Disney and coca cola are pushing on to their employees.

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:40:40 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Nope, never listened to Fox News. My only exposure to any of their shows is watching the (not complimentary) Outfoxed documentary.

And you're the one who's claiming that Critical Race Theory is behind the Civil Rights Movement, when in fact it was created by Harvard scholars in the 60s and 70s, after, and in response to the successes of, the Civil Right Movement. And you can't weasel your way of the out the timing by claiming you were referring to something broader, because another poster referred back to the older Critical Theory, and you rejected that and said you're referring to Critical Race Theory in specific.

So your entire first post, which tries to credit all kinds of earlier historical events to Critical Race Theory, is completely and objectively wrong. Which you can't defend, so you're just making unsubstantiated claims that everybody else knows nothing.

QuoteBut, no, it isn't supposed to be a vilification. It's part of a conversation about race that noticed, like you've shown, as soon as racial issues come up, a lot of white folk get really defensive. Why is that? I've seen it happen again and again in conversations I've had -- in fact, until I got my nose rubbed in it when I was 20, I was much the same way -- and "white fragility" is one way to shorthand what's going on.
[/quote

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:52:37 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:40:40 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Nope, never listened to Fox News. My only exposure to any of their shows is watching the (not complimentary) Outfoxed documentary.

And you're the one who's claiming that Critical Race Theory is behind the Civil Rights Movement, when in fact it was created by Harvard scholars in the 60s and 70s, after, and in response to the successes of, the Civil Right Movement. And you can't weasel your way of the out the timing by claiming you were referring to something broader, because another poster referred back to the older Critical Theory, and you rejected that and said you're referring to Critical Race Theory in specific.

So your entire first post, which tries to credit all kinds of earlier historical events to Critical Race Theory, is completely and objectively wrong. Which you can't defend, so you're just making unsubstantiated claims that everybody else knows nothing.

Critical Race Theory explores how the surrounding structures of laws allowed those things to happen. I didn't claim that it was behind the Civil Rights Movement. That would be absurd, and you probably got the idea from the individual who conflated Critical Race Theory (mostly started in the 1970s) with Critical Theory/the Frankfurt School (that got its start in 1920's Germany). I don't get how you managed to misread me that badly.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:26:59 AM

Quote from: Zelen on July 02, 2021, 01:54:47 AM
Sundown towns? Isn't it weird how we have all these scary names for things white people allegedly did a century ago (I'm sure there's some truth to it, but also a lot of motivated exaggeration), but our lexicon of ominous phrases doesn't have a word for the same phenomenon happening to whites?

Just on this one: I'm curious if you know of any US townships or counties where, by law, if you were white, you couldn't stay overnight (even in a payed lodging) without being arrested and thrown in jail for vagrancy. There were several of those for nonwhites in the early-to-mid twentieth century US. In fact, Washington Territory (now Washington State) actually declared a handful of Black families "officially white" when they passed their restrictive "anti-Negro" laws preventing any black person from owning real property.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds. Anti-racism training is an insane mish-mash of several things, including a warped view of CRT, usually pushed by people who don't know why anti-racism can be useful or important, and the actual trainings (including 90% of the ones I've been subjected to) are almost always poorly executed or so basic to be useless. Yes, everyone knows that racism is bad, and looking at ways in which the deck is stacked against people who aren't white (or white *enough* in some times and places) can be useful. But hearing for the eighth or ninth time in a 40-hour "training" that "white privilege" and "white fragility" need to be accepted (without going in-depth into what exactly those two phrases are shorthand for) before "racial healing" (again, left undefined) can begin is really difficult to swallow....

Unless you've had the 15 semester-hours that I've had on Critical Race Theory, Cultural Encounters and Reflection, Clinical Pastoral Education, and Imago Dei (M.Div. branch of understanding these things) that build a picture of just how fucked up the United States is on race relations. I had one class that was led by a Tejano whose family had lived in the San Antonio area since the 1500's, had an ancestor who got out of the Alamo before the Mexicans closed in, and was told by a guy whose parents were refugees from WWII Poland that he should "Leave the US to us Americans." in my presence. These things are really, really tricky and need some time to work through and nuanced discussion. They don't work so well in soundbites or "trainings" that are designed (even by well-meaning people) to make a buck and cover HR-required Continuing Education hours.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:48:23 AM

Quote from: deathknight4044 on July 02, 2021, 02:16:06 AM

"Unless youve been indoctrinated as I have, you arent allowed to have an opinion about our systemic vilification of White western people". Yeah man its so esoteric it's not like we can read the works of proponents of critical race theory like Robin DeAngelo, or the training material that teachers are being given, or the training corporation's like Disney and coca cola are pushing on to their employees.

Not what I was saying, but you do you. You can have any opinion you want, you can feel as vilified as you want, but I put it down to jargon. I mean, "white fragility" and "non-whites are better at this than whites are" (which are entirely from one person's academic work, mind you) are jarring to hear without a lot of context and conversations that need to occur in a better setting than with online randos like me.

But, no, it isn't supposed to be a vilification. It's part of a conversation about race that noticed, like you've shown, as soon as racial issues come up, a lot of white folk get really defensive. Why is that? I've seen it happen again and again in conversations I've had -- in fact, until I got my nose rubbed in it when I was 20, I was much the same way -- and "white fragility" is one way to shorthand what's going on.

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:59:16 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:52:37 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:40:40 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Nope, never listened to Fox News. My only exposure to any of their shows is watching the (not complimentary) Outfoxed documentary.

And you're the one who's claiming that Critical Race Theory is behind the Civil Rights Movement, when in fact it was created by Harvard scholars in the 60s and 70s, after, and in response to the successes of, the Civil Right Movement. And you can't weasel your way of the out the timing by claiming you were referring to something broader, because another poster referred back to the older Critical Theory, and you rejected that and said you're referring to Critical Race Theory in specific.

So your entire first post, which tries to credit all kinds of earlier historical events to Critical Race Theory, is completely and objectively wrong. Which you can't defend, so you're just making unsubstantiated claims that everybody else knows nothing.

Critical Race Theory explores how the surrounding structures of laws allowed those things to happen. I didn't claim that it was behind the Civil Rights Movement. That would be absurd, and you probably got the idea from the individual who conflated Critical Race Theory (mostly started in the 1970s) with Critical Theory/the Frankfurt School (that got its start in 1920's Germany). I don't get how you managed to misread me that badly.

I didn't misread anything. You literally said: "In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws...."

That's an explicit claim that Critical Race Theory owns those events, and all the other ones you named elsewhere in the paragraph. That Critical Race Theory is so enwrapped in those events, that arguing against Critical Race Theory is tantamount to supporting those events.

But, as I pointed out, all those events occurred, and were overcome, before Critical Race Theory even existed. They were defeated by the liberal principles, like equal treatment under the law, that Critical Race Theory has come to completely reject.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:18:43 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:59:16 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:52:37 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:40:40 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Nope, never listened to Fox News. My only exposure to any of their shows is watching the (not complimentary) Outfoxed documentary.

And you're the one who's claiming that Critical Race Theory is behind the Civil Rights Movement, when in fact it was created by Harvard scholars in the 60s and 70s, after, and in response to the successes of, the Civil Right Movement. And you can't weasel your way of the out the timing by claiming you were referring to something broader, because another poster referred back to the older Critical Theory, and you rejected that and said you're referring to Critical Race Theory in specific.

So your entire first post, which tries to credit all kinds of earlier historical events to Critical Race Theory, is completely and objectively wrong. Which you can't defend, so you're just making unsubstantiated claims that everybody else knows nothing.

Critical Race Theory explores how the surrounding structures of laws allowed those things to happen. I didn't claim that it was behind the Civil Rights Movement. That would be absurd, and you probably got the idea from the individual who conflated Critical Race Theory (mostly started in the 1970s) with Critical Theory/the Frankfurt School (that got its start in 1920's Germany). I don't get how you managed to misread me that badly.

I didn't misread anything. You literally said: "In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws...."

That's an explicit claim that Critical Race Theory owns those events, and all the other ones you named elsewhere in the paragraph. That Critical Race Theory is so enwrapped in those events, that arguing against Critical Race Theory is tantamount to supporting those events.

But, as I pointed out, all those events occurred, and were overcome, before Critical Race Theory even existed. They were defeated by the liberal principles, like equal treatment under the law, that Critical Race Theory has come to completely reject.

Again, Critical Race Theory is a historical study of how laws in the United States were used, and continue to be used, to keep White folks above folks who were/are seen as not-White. The Jim Crow laws are a clear case of laws that were used for right near a century to keep non-White folks below White folks in society. The fact that most of the Jim Crow laws were struck down by Federal Courts (including the Supreme Court) over the objections of state-level courts, and why that was, is part of the question.

As far as I know, Critical Race Theory doesn't reject the *principle* of equal treatment under the law, but it deeply questions whether the current United States criminal justice system actually *practices* equal treatment under the law (for instance, the difference in incarceration rates for black males vs. white males on non-distribution possession of a controlled substance laws, which is vast).

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:18:43 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:59:16 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:52:37 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 02:40:40 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Nope, never listened to Fox News. My only exposure to any of their shows is watching the (not complimentary) Outfoxed documentary.

And you're the one who's claiming that Critical Race Theory is behind the Civil Rights Movement, when in fact it was created by Harvard scholars in the 60s and 70s, after, and in response to the successes of, the Civil Right Movement. And you can't weasel your way of the out the timing by claiming you were referring to something broader, because another poster referred back to the older Critical Theory, and you rejected that and said you're referring to Critical Race Theory in specific.

So your entire first post, which tries to credit all kinds of earlier historical events to Critical Race Theory, is completely and objectively wrong. Which you can't defend, so you're just making unsubstantiated claims that everybody else knows nothing.

Critical Race Theory explores how the surrounding structures of laws allowed those things to happen. I didn't claim that it was behind the Civil Rights Movement. That would be absurd, and you probably got the idea from the individual who conflated Critical Race Theory (mostly started in the 1970s) with Critical Theory/the Frankfurt School (that got its start in 1920's Germany). I don't get how you managed to misread me that badly.

I didn't misread anything. You literally said: "In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws...."

That's an explicit claim that Critical Race Theory owns those events, and all the other ones you named elsewhere in the paragraph. That Critical Race Theory is so enwrapped in those events, that arguing against Critical Race Theory is tantamount to supporting those events.

But, as I pointed out, all those events occurred, and were overcome, before Critical Race Theory even existed. They were defeated by the liberal principles, like equal treatment under the law, that Critical Race Theory has come to completely reject.

Again, Critical Race Theory is a historical study of how laws in the United States were used, and continue to be used, to keep White folks above folks who were/are seen as not-White. The Jim Crow laws are a clear case of laws that were used for right near a century to keep non-White folks below White folks in society. The fact that most of the Jim Crow laws were struck down by Federal Courts (including the Supreme Court) over the objections of state-level courts, and why that was, is part of the question.

As far as I know, Critical Race Theory doesn't reject the *principle* of equal treatment under the law, but it deeply questions whether the current United States criminal justice system actually *practices* equal treatment under the law (for instance, the difference in incarceration rates for black males vs. white males on non-distribution possession of a controlled substance laws, which is vast).

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 02, 2021, 03:17:27 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:48:23 AM

Quote from: deathknight4044 on July 02, 2021, 02:16:06 AM

"Unless youve been indoctrinated as I have, you arent allowed to have an opinion about our systemic vilification of White western people". Yeah man its so esoteric it's not like we can read the works of proponents of critical race theory like Robin DeAngelo, or the training material that teachers are being given, or the training corporation's like Disney and coca cola are pushing on to their employees.

Not what I was saying, but you do you. You can have any opinion you want, you can feel as vilified as you want, but I put it down to jargon. I mean, "white fragility" and "non-whites are better at this than whites are" (which are entirely from one person's academic work, mind you) are jarring to hear without a lot of context and conversations that need to occur in a better setting than with online randos like me.

But, no, it isn't supposed to be a vilification. It's part of a conversation about race that noticed, like you've shown, as soon as racial issues come up, a lot of white folk get really defensive. Why is that? I've seen it happen again and again in conversations I've had -- in fact, until I got my nose rubbed in it when I was 20, I was much the same way -- and "white fragility" is one way to shorthand what's going on.

White fragility is a deflection from criticism by accusing, either implicitly or explicitly, that the subject is racist and in denial. It's a very sophisticated version of "Have you stopped beating your wife?" It's also a term made popular by a women who is an admitted racist and, in my opinion, projects her racism onto white people in general.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:40:09 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 02, 2021, 03:17:27 AM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:48:23 AM

Quote from: deathknight4044 on July 02, 2021, 02:16:06 AM

"Unless youve been indoctrinated as I have, you arent allowed to have an opinion about our systemic vilification of White western people". Yeah man its so esoteric it's not like we can read the works of proponents of critical race theory like Robin DeAngelo, or the training material that teachers are being given, or the training corporation's like Disney and coca cola are pushing on to their employees.

Not what I was saying, but you do you. You can have any opinion you want, you can feel as vilified as you want, but I put it down to jargon. I mean, "white fragility" and "non-whites are better at this than whites are" (which are entirely from one person's academic work, mind you) are jarring to hear without a lot of context and conversations that need to occur in a better setting than with online randos like me.

But, no, it isn't supposed to be a vilification. It's part of a conversation about race that noticed, like you've shown, as soon as racial issues come up, a lot of white folk get really defensive. Why is that? I've seen it happen again and again in conversations I've had -- in fact, until I got my nose rubbed in it when I was 20, I was much the same way -- and "white fragility" is one way to shorthand what's going on.

White fragility is a deflection from criticism by accusing, either implicitly or explicitly, that the subject is racist and in denial. It's a very sophisticated version of "Have you stopped beating your wife?" It's also a term made popular by a women who is an admitted racist and, in my opinion, projects her racism onto white people in general.

*shrug* well, yes. Everyone's a little bit racist (as "Avenue Q" puts it (Great show, I'd recommended it to anyone who wouldn't be freaked out by R-rated muppets)), but White fragility is an awful term that is poorly deployed in almost all of the places I've seen it. It does a reasonable job of putting a label on something I've experienced (and Deathknight4044 has been evincing with his "what about *me*? What about *my race*?" repetitions) It's nowhere near as universal as what you're saying DiAngelo claims, but it's there, right alongside the black woman waving her finger and saying, "Uh-UH! You did NOT just say that!"

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 03:35:04 AM
None of that has anything to do with what I said. Once again, you avoid the issue, this time by being a patronizing little asshole.

The actual topic: You literally claimed that anyone who argues against your racist hate ideology is denying Jim Crow.

And Critical Race Theory certainly rejects the principle of equality under the law. It initially took its lead from liberal principles, but almost instantly abandoned them in favor of rejecting evidence and assuming guilt.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:46:21 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 03:35:04 AM
None of that has anything to do with what I said. Once again, you avoid the issue, this time by being a patronizing little asshole.

The actual topic: You literally claimed that anyone who argues against your racist hate ideology is denying Jim Crow.

And Critical Race Theory certainly rejects the principle of equality under the law. It initially took its lead from liberal principles, but almost instantly abandoned them in favor of rejecting evidence and assuming guilt.

What I came here to say is this: There may be a racist hate ideology out there, and something that feels uncomfortably like anti-White racism certainly shows up in anti-racism training, but the actual racist hate ideology is not Critical Race Theory, which is much more limited than what Christopher Rufo (see: https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory (https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory) ) would like you to believe.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:46:21 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 03:35:04 AM
None of that has anything to do with what I said. Once again, you avoid the issue, this time by being a patronizing little asshole.

The actual topic: You literally claimed that anyone who argues against your racist hate ideology is denying Jim Crow.

And Critical Race Theory certainly rejects the principle of equality under the law. It initially took its lead from liberal principles, but almost instantly abandoned them in favor of rejecting evidence and assuming guilt.

What I came here to say is this: There may be a racist hate ideology out there, and something that feels uncomfortably like anti-White racism certainly shows up in anti-racism training, but the actual racist hate ideology is not Critical Race Theory, which is much more limited than what Christopher Rufo (see: https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory (https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory) ) would like you to believe.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I think I know what's going on, now. Someone seems to have conflated Anti-Racism Training and Critical Race Theory in the Foxosphere's minds.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
Unless you've had the 15 semester-hours that I've had on Critical Race Theory, Cultural Encounters and Reflection, Clinical Pastoral Education, and Imago Dei (M.Div. branch of understanding these things) that build a picture of just how fucked up the United States is on race relations.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:09:59 AM
I had one class that was led by a Tejano whose family had lived in the San Antonio area since the 1500's, had an ancestor who got out of the Alamo before the Mexicans closed in, and was told by a guy whose parents were refugees from WWII Poland that he should "Leave the US to us Americans." in my presence. These things are really, really tricky and need some time to work through and nuanced discussion. They don't work so well in soundbites or "trainings" that are designed (even by well-meaning people) to make a buck and cover HR-required Continuing Education hours.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:26:59 AM

Quote from: Zelen on July 02, 2021, 01:54:47 AM
Sundown towns? Isn't it weird how we have all these scary names for things white people allegedly did a century ago (I'm sure there's some truth to it, but also a lot of motivated exaggeration), but our lexicon of ominous phrases doesn't have a word for the same phenomenon happening to whites?

Just on this one: I'm curious if you know of any US townships or counties where, by law, if you were white, you couldn't stay overnight (even in a payed lodging) without being arrested and thrown in jail for vagrancy. There were several of those for nonwhites in the early-to-mid twentieth century US.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:26:59 AMIn fact, Washington Territory (now Washington State) actually declared a handful of Black families "officially white" when they passed their restrictive "anti-Negro" laws preventing any black person from owning real property.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:48:23 AM

But, no, it isn't supposed to be a vilification. It's part of a conversation about race that noticed, like you've shown, as soon as racial issues come up, a lot of white folk get really defensive. Why is that? I've seen it happen again and again in conversations I've had -- in fact, until I got my nose rubbed in it when I was 20, I was much the same way -- and "white fragility" is one way to shorthand what's going on.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:46:21 AM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 03:35:04 AM
None of that has anything to do with what I said. Once again, you avoid the issue, this time by being a patronizing little asshole.

The actual topic: You literally claimed that anyone who argues against your racist hate ideology is denying Jim Crow.

And Critical Race Theory certainly rejects the principle of equality under the law. It initially took its lead from liberal principles, but almost instantly abandoned them in favor of rejecting evidence and assuming guilt.

What I came here to say is this: There may be a racist hate ideology out there, and something that feels uncomfortably like anti-White racism certainly shows up in anti-racism training, but the actual racist hate ideology is not Critical Race Theory, which is much more limited than what Christopher Rufo (see: https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory (https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory) ) would like you to believe.

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 08:20:18 AM
So until fairly recently, then...

One wonders...Do you lecture your German friends on their Nazi heritage or your Japanese friends on how to absolve themselves for Korea and Nanking?

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 02, 2021, 08:01:04 AM
This may be relevant.

During the oughts and teens (2000-2010's), one of the big criticisms from the left about armed response against radical Islamism was that it would simply radicalize more Muslims and create more terrorists.

Now, skip forward to present day and we're told 'well, if you become radicalized by our racial agenda, you were probably already a bigot/Nazi/etc'.

Which is it? Because neither is a particularly good look for the left. Either the Islamists were always radicals, in which case we should have been putting the fear of Allah in them; or their agenda is radicalizing people and they don't want to admit it.

Quote from: SHARK on July 02, 2021, 07:02:29 AM
Greetings!

Critical Race Theory is pure anti-white RACISM deeply rooted in Marxist ideology and given an academic glossed paintjob.

All of the piggy-squealing in defense of Critical Race Theory amounts to nothing more than obtuse gaslighting promoted by anti-white racists, race-grifting charlatans, demagogues, and other malevolent agent-provocateurs that seek the corruption and degradation of America.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:31:48 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 02, 2021, 08:01:04 AM
This may be relevant.

During the oughts and teens (2000-2010's), one of the big criticisms from the left about armed response against radical Islamism was that it would simply radicalize more Muslims and create more terrorists.

Now, skip forward to present day and we're told 'well, if you become radicalized by our racial agenda, you were probably already a bigot/Nazi/etc'.

Which is it? Because neither is a particularly good look for the left. Either the Islamists were always radicals, in which case we should have been putting the fear of Allah in them; or their agenda is radicalizing people and they don't want to admit it.

A lot of Western Liberals *still* have no clue about the divisions and tensions in Islam.  The Wahhabist sect is founded on the concept of "Jihad is preemptive self-defence". It also aggressively proselytizes, including other sects of Islam (those madrassas set up in poorer countries by Saudi Arabia? Almost universally Wahhabist, because the House of Saud is Wahhabist). The mainline Sunni and Shi'a sects are much less militant, but are significantly less likely to proselytize. This is similar to the actions of the White Nationalist/White Supremacist movements in the United States, who have been actively recruiting white folks, especially white law enforcement and (ex-)military, into their movements since just shortly after Ruby Ridge. Does anyone else here remember the Aryan Nations changing to "White Separatists" from "White Supremacists" because "We aren't as crazy as those The Order people?" They were actively looking for ways to make themselves more palatable to Middle America -- and today we have the Oathkeepers and Proud Boys as their spiritual descendants.

So, no, neither group was radicalized by any one else. They simply were aggressively recruiting and then radicalizing the kind of people they thought would be useful to their cause.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:31:48 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 02, 2021, 08:01:04 AM
This may be relevant.

During the oughts and teens (2000-2010's), one of the big criticisms from the left about armed response against radical Islamism was that it would simply radicalize more Muslims and create more terrorists.

Now, skip forward to present day and we're told 'well, if you become radicalized by our racial agenda, you were probably already a bigot/Nazi/etc'.

Which is it? Because neither is a particularly good look for the left. Either the Islamists were always radicals, in which case we should have been putting the fear of Allah in them; or their agenda is radicalizing people and they don't want to admit it.

A lot of Western Liberals *still* have no clue about the divisions and tensions in Islam.  The Wahhabist sect is founded on the concept of "Jihad is preemptive self-defence". It also aggressively proselytizes, including other sects of Islam (those madrassas set up in poorer countries by Saudi Arabia? Almost universally Wahhabist, because the House of Saud is Wahhabist). The mainline Sunni and Shi'a sects are much less militant, but are significantly less likely to proselytize. This is similar to the actions of the White Nationalist/White Supremacist movements in the United States, who have been actively recruiting white folks, especially white law enforcement and (ex-)military, into their movements since just shortly after Ruby Ridge. Does anyone else here remember the Aryan Nations changing to "White Separatists" from "White Supremacists" because "We aren't as crazy as those The Order people?" They were actively looking for ways to make themselves more palatable to Middle America -- and today we have the Oathkeepers and Proud Boys as their spiritual descendants.

So, no, neither group was radicalized by any one else. They simply were aggressively recruiting and then radicalizing the kind of people they thought would be useful to their cause.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 02, 2021, 11:40:01 AM
That's nice. You didn't refute a thing I said.

The left has managed to generate its own radical-right opposition. Good job!

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 11:52:11 AM
Again with the Proud Boys? WTF did they do? Burned a BLM flag? A couple of them wandered into the Capitol building when others had already broken into it? (they weren't even there in force because they had nothing planned for that day) OK, sure, but did everyone forget all the shit that happened in 2020? Proud Boys don't even register, except for the hysteria. And how are they "spiritual descendants" of white supremacists?

Quote from: Zelen on July 02, 2021, 01:54:47 AMSundown towns? Isn't it weird how we have all these scary names for things white people allegedly did a century ago (I'm sure there's some truth to it, but also a lot of motivated exaggeration), but our lexicon of ominous phrases doesn't have a word for the same phenomenon happening to whites?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:46:21 AM
What I came here to say is this: There may be a racist hate ideology out there, and something that feels uncomfortably like anti-White racism certainly shows up in anti-racism training, but the actual racist hate ideology is not Critical Race Theory, which is much more limited than what Christopher Rufo (see: https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory (https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory) ) would like you to believe.

QuoteNo public institution of higher education, school district, or public school, including a public charter school, shall direct or otherwise compel students to personally affirm, adopt, or adhere to any of the following tenets:
  (i) That any sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin is inherently superior or inferior;
  (ii) That individuals should be adversely treated on the basis of their sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin; or
  (iii) That individuals, by virtue of sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin, are inherently responsible for actions committed in the past by other members of the same sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin.
(b) No distinction or classification of students shall be made on account of race or color.
(c) No course of instruction or unit of study directing or otherwise compelling students to personally affirm, adopt, or adhere to any of the tenets identified in paragraph (a) of this subsection shall be used or introduced in any institution of higher education, any school district, or any public school, including a public charter school.

QuoteWe likewise question the traditional ways that liberals have defended affirmative action as a useful exception to a presumed race-blind ideal of "merit." To us, the very definitions of merit reflect racial and other forms of social power.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:01:14 PM
Go and look at the NY Time's minute-by-minute video of the January 6 attack. Proud Boys were trying to get into the Capitol building before President Trump's speech was even ending. A Proud Boy was the first one to start breaking glass (with a stolen police riot shield) in the Capitol. Proud Boys in tactical gear were the people who lead the charge on the east side of the Capitol, and were the ones who were using radios to tell each other where the weak points in the police line were. They did *not* just walk in after other people were inside, they were at the front of an attempt to murder members of Congress and the Vice President.

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 01:31:41 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:01:14 PM
Go and look at the NY Time's minute-by-minute video of the January 6 attack. Proud Boys were trying to get into the Capitol building before President Trump's speech was even ending. A Proud Boy was the first one to start breaking glass (with a stolen police riot shield) in the Capitol. Proud Boys in tactical gear were the people who lead the charge on the east side of the Capitol, and were the ones who were using radios to tell each other where the weak points in the police line were. They did *not* just walk in after other people were inside, they were at the front of an attempt to murder members of Congress and the Vice President.

I don't particularly like giving NY Times clicks anymore, after I realized that they are willingly lying to everyone's face, race-baiting, hiring people who hate whites etc. But is this video the one you're talking about?
https://www.joemygod.com/2021/06/nyt-issues-astounding-minute-by-minute-video-analysis-of-the-cultist-insurrection-at-the-us-capitol-video/?__cf_chl_jschl_tk__=939e0bf2a3f4712ac7412292e331d011fe3ab007-1625246789-0-AZwadZyfGH_LSgOD-xsFa3f2cMUkcrEO6YvgcLin2mET1OAj6zIEIivhVL_YK9Ll0BXqh9nS0y6XLNXUvi2sZLb478DzBshabyOxeHggsUyVeqgpFN25KoRTOtbi1l2qgphIBJpOvIQQrwFoo4NlubJsFugYkJ_iItQG7qMGCAzOFIPHf3lRSBFORXO3tGFdrBtpxxrdTy49_CGU1mNAvgghM-7ka5HPm7UJbt70UB4Mf3ohFfKxcCwo_6_h5BGwL6l19WeQq8Pgib4sBnK9fAqewSm73L_xY4aiBY0vCcSJxSSAVu9ORmYftkhpLFnrpcfjtpvbMNFCj2HPlo2OQi8F3LK6IUrRvI9hztB5IGGKrzwMSdN6ByGsdX0UD73htkoAkXtESL60TEvOj5l0yLpJMqUOgAqueHsHJ_YkFKyBf6jcSJ8JpeKqYfCKrNrjRmjlS27C7SjG8zTS1Hzan7-PHgiJxNMISU1Ts1WIt_XJxkj9gmhgnYp8Vev8Vaxf79d4Kux_B0juN1VzkLgAAZPL-QaqHyqIn8hje5VYGdHx

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 11:52:11 AM
OK, sure, but did everyone forget all the shit that happened in 2020?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:01:14 PM
Go and look at the NY Time's minute-by-minute video of the January 6 attack. Proud Boys were trying to get into the Capitol building before President Trump's speech was even ending. A Proud Boy was the first one to start breaking glass (with a stolen police riot shield) in the Capitol. Proud Boys in tactical gear were the people who lead the charge on the east side of the Capitol, and were the ones who were using radios to tell each other where the weak points in the police line were. They did *not* just walk in after other people were inside, they were at the front of an attempt to murder members of Congress and the Vice President.

Quote from: DocJones on July 02, 2021, 02:43:04 PM

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 11:52:11 AM
OK, sure, but did everyone forget all the shit that happened in 2020?

Wait.  Sorry I'm confusing this with the "insurrection" of September 2018 when thousands stormed the Capitol in order to disrupt the confirmation hearings of a judge.  Around 1000 were arrested and frog marched out of the Capitol and immediately released.  For some reason they were never prosecuted.  So much for equal treatment under the law.

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 01:26:53 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 03:46:21 AM
What I came here to say is this: There may be a racist hate ideology out there, and something that feels uncomfortably like anti-White racism certainly shows up in anti-racism training, but the actual racist hate ideology is not Critical Race Theory, which is much more limited than what Christopher Rufo (see: https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory (https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory) ) would like you to believe.

Hi, ScytheSong. Thanks for the discussion. As far as I can tell, both liberals and conservatives have been unclear about what Critical Race Theory (CRT) is. Notably, liberals have still referred to Republican state laws as being "anti-CRT" even though they don't mention CRT and have nothing that prevents teaching about black history. For example, this is the relevant clause in Idaho Bill HB 377,

QuoteNo public institution of higher education, school district, or public school, including a public charter school, shall direct or otherwise compel students to personally affirm, adopt, or adhere to any of the following tenets:
  (i) That any sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin is inherently superior or inferior;
  (ii) That individuals should be adversely treated on the basis of their sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin; or
  (iii) That individuals, by virtue of sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin, are inherently responsible for actions committed in the past by other members of the same sex, race, ethnicity, religion, color, or national origin.
(b) No distinction or classification of students shall be made on account of race or color.
(c) No course of instruction or unit of study directing or otherwise compelling students to personally affirm, adopt, or adhere to any of the tenets identified in paragraph (a) of this subsection shall be used or introduced in any institution of higher education, any school district, or any public school, including a public charter school.

Yet this has still been referred to by liberals as being anti-CRT. I haven't studied CRT, but from a scanning of academic papers, it seems like it is a loose movement that doesn't have a clear core set of principles. This was an article by Gary Peller trying to describe,

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/06/30/critical-race-theory-lightning-rod-opinion-497046

QuoteCRT is not a racialist ideology that declares all whites to be privileged oppressors, and CRT is not taught in public schools.

QuoteNOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that the Durham City Council calls upon our
state and federal representatives to work toward the immediate, opposition to HB324
and work to ensure black history and critical race theory is included in our students'
public school education:

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:13:49 AM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 08:20:18 AM
So until fairly recently, then...

One wonders...Do you lecture your German friends on their Nazi heritage or your Japanese friends on how to absolve themselves for Korea and Nanking?

Heh. Born in 1970, thank you very much. But then, I went to a community college (1988-1990) where the two largest groups were the Black Student Union and the Gay and Lesbian Alliance.  Fundamentalist white boy goes to college and meets people who aren't like him, it's an old, old story.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:13:49 AM
And, no. My German friends get more crap for the entire Wars of Religion and Cuius regio, eius religio thing. I had Japanese Nissei and Issei friends growing up, but we mostly talked about Judo and what the best Japanese food was.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:38:07 AM

Quote from: SHARK on July 02, 2021, 07:02:29 AM
Greetings!

Critical Race Theory is pure anti-white RACISM deeply rooted in Marxist ideology and given an academic glossed paintjob.

All of the piggy-squealing in defense of Critical Race Theory amounts to nothing more than obtuse gaslighting promoted by anti-white racists, race-grifting charlatans, demagogues, and other malevolent agent-provocateurs that seek the corruption and degradation of America.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

You are wrong. But  then, what are you "always faithful" to, Mr. Shark? The United States of America, its people and Constitution, or just the kind of people who look and think like you? You seemed to be plenty happy when the constitution was being trampled on by a bunch of White Supremacist idiots back in January.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:59:49 PM

Quote from: DocJones on July 02, 2021, 02:43:04 PM

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 11:52:11 AM
OK, sure, but did everyone forget all the shit that happened in 2020?

Wait.  Sorry I'm confusing this with the "insurrection" of September 2018 when thousands stormed the Capitol in order to disrupt the confirmation hearings of a judge.  Around 1000 were arrested and frog marched out of the Capitol and immediately released.  For some reason they were never prosecuted.  So much for equal treatment under the law.

And what was the estimated damage to the Capitol? In dollars? Oh, right, Zero. And the number I get for numbers arrested is around 200, not around 1000. And at least one guy spent a night in jail. So, given minor nitpicks, sure. So what?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 02:59:49 PM
And what was the estimated damage to the Capitol? In dollars? Oh, right, Zero. And the number I get for numbers arrested is around 200, not around 1000. And at least one guy spent a night in jail. So, given minor nitpicks, sure. So what?

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 01:26:53 PM

I'm not saying these are inherently in Critical Race Theory, but they are perceived to be, by people on both sides.

Quote from: DocJones on July 02, 2021, 02:43:04 PM

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 11:52:11 AM
OK, sure, but did everyone forget all the shit that happened in 2020?

(https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/pQw9hVZiSX6a0uRdJgurK-7J3kY=/0x0:3000x2204/920x0/filters:focal(0x0:3000x2204):format(webp):no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/13149625/GettyImages_1039353720.jpg)
Wait.  Sorry I'm confusing this with the "insurrection" of September 2018 when thousands stormed the Capitol in order to disrupt the confirmation hearings of a judge.  Around 1000 were arrested and frog marched out of the Capitol and immediately released.  For some reason they were never prosecuted.  So much for equal treatment under the law.

Quote from: SHARK on July 02, 2021, 03:25:48 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:38:07 AM

Quote from: SHARK on July 02, 2021, 07:02:29 AM
Greetings!

Critical Race Theory is pure anti-white RACISM deeply rooted in Marxist ideology and given an academic glossed paintjob.

All of the piggy-squealing in defense of Critical Race Theory amounts to nothing more than obtuse gaslighting promoted by anti-white racists, race-grifting charlatans, demagogues, and other malevolent agent-provocateurs that seek the corruption and degradation of America.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

You are wrong. But  then, what are you "always faithful" to, Mr. Shark? The United States of America, its people and Constitution, or just the kind of people who look and think like you? You seemed to be plenty happy when the constitution was being trampled on by a bunch of White Supremacist idiots back in January.

Greetings!

Heh. No, I'm not wrong. I know what Critical Race Theory is all about. It is exactly as I described it. Anyone who wants to think about it differently is sadly ignorant, uninformed, or brainwashed.

I am faithful to that which is worthy of being faithful to. My God, Family, Corps, and Country. As for people and what they look like? I don't happen to give a damn if someone "Looks like me" or not. They can be purple, zebra striped, whatever. As for "Thinking like me"--well, yeah, obviously, there is some importance to that and having essential compatibilities and commonalties. Fucking racists, Marxists, anarchists, ANTIFA, BLM thugs and Woke Commissars have "thinking" that makes living them seem impossible, so fuck them.

I didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Zelen on July 02, 2021, 05:09:19 PM
What I've never had explained to me by a CRT person is why it's bad for European people to build societies that benefit European peoples. Seems like it's perfectly okay for Arabs to build Arab countries to benefit Arabs, for Africans to build African countries to benefit Africans, for Asians to build Asian countries to benefit Asians -- In many cases these people are doing shit that is way more shady and nefarious than what CRT people complain about -- But only European peoples are not allowed to build their own societies with their own rules for the benefit of themselves & their posterity.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

Quote from: SHARK on July 02, 2021, 03:25:48 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 11:38:07 AM

Quote from: SHARK on July 02, 2021, 07:02:29 AM
Greetings!

Critical Race Theory is pure anti-white RACISM deeply rooted in Marxist ideology and given an academic glossed paintjob.

All of the piggy-squealing in defense of Critical Race Theory amounts to nothing more than obtuse gaslighting promoted by anti-white racists, race-grifting charlatans, demagogues, and other malevolent agent-provocateurs that seek the corruption and degradation of America.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

You are wrong. But  then, what are you "always faithful" to, Mr. Shark? The United States of America, its people and Constitution, or just the kind of people who look and think like you? You seemed to be plenty happy when the constitution was being trampled on by a bunch of White Supremacist idiots back in January.

Greetings!

Heh. No, I'm not wrong. I know what Critical Race Theory is all about. It is exactly as I described it. Anyone who wants to think about it differently is sadly ignorant, uninformed, or brainwashed.

I am faithful to that which is worthy of being faithful to. My God, Family, Corps, and Country. As for people and what they look like? I don't happen to give a damn if someone "Looks like me" or not. They can be purple, zebra striped, whatever. As for "Thinking like me"--well, yeah, obviously, there is some importance to that and having essential compatibilities and commonalties. Fucking racists, Marxists, anarchists, ANTIFA, BLM thugs and Woke Commissars have "thinking" that makes living them seem impossible, so fuck them.

I didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 05:40:40 PM
...

I realize there are some people who exclusively focus on prejudice and imperialism by white people, but just because they are wrong, that doesn't mean that prejudice and imperialism are okay.

Quote from: Zelen on July 02, 2021, 05:09:19 PM
Question in my mind is whether ScytheSong is just trying to rile people up or is being sincere. It's hard to believe sincerity when engaging in such bad tactics. Jump into a thread, make a bunch of questionable statements meant to frame discussion, then derail the whole thread by being evasive.

Just to try and keep this on track, much of critiques of power from figures such as Foucault that form the foundation of CRT have valuable insights worth paying attention to. Cynical Theories by Lindsay & Pluckrose does a fairly good job at showing the genealogy of these ideas.

The issue we see when it comes to CRT is its particularist anti-white agenda and focus on legalism rather than real-world harm.

It's pretty obvious when you look at the language they've purposefully constructed, talking about "White Fragility" "Whiteness" etc. Of course the claim is that these aren't meant specifically as ethnic markers. Lets be real -- It's explicitly targeting Whites/Europeans, and that's precisely why CRT has any degree of popularity, because it trades on racially-motived envy and hatred. Without that emotional hook it's just up-its-own-ass philosophizing about the nature of power and privilege, which we've already seen has no blood to actually motivate people.

What I've never had explained to me by a CRT person is why it's bad for European people to build societies that benefit European peoples. Seems like it's perfectly okay for Arabs to build Arab countries to benefit Arabs, for Africans to build African countries to benefit Africans, for Asians to build Asian countries to benefit Asians -- In many cases these people are doing shit that is way more shady and nefarious than what CRT people complain about -- But only European peoples are not allowed to build their own societies with their own rules for the benefit of themselves & their posterity.

Not playing that game.

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

QuoteI didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:05:57 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

QuoteI didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Funny how those premeditated attempted murderers didn't bring a single firearm to the Capitol. Serious oversight, if you want to kill scumbags.

So by that logic, I assume you consider the 2018 insurrection during the confirmation hearings, where rioter/protestors/assholes broke into the Capitol to disrupt (which was partially successful) or prevent (unsuccessful) Kavanaugh's confirmation, possibly by assassinating him, was another example of trampling all over the Constitution, and that we should track down all those people, ruin their lives, file federal charges against all of them, and launch an investigation into the Critical Theorists and other leftist extremists who have proven to be such an existential threat to our democracy?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:19:33 PM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:05:57 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

QuoteI didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Funny how those premeditated attempted murderers didn't bring a single firearm to the Capitol. Serious oversight, if you want to kill scumbags.

So by that logic, I assume you consider the 2018 insurrection during the confirmation hearings, where rioter/protestors/assholes broke into the Capitol to disrupt (which was partially successful) or prevent (unsuccessful) Kavanaugh's confirmation, possibly by assassinating him, was another example of trampling all over the Constitution, and that we should track down all those people, ruin their lives, file federal charges against all of them, and launch an investigation into the Critical Theorists and other leftist extremists who have proven to be such an existential threat to our democracy?

You don't need firearms to kill people when you have baseball bats, police-grade zipties, and a gallows.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 02, 2021, 08:43:06 PM
(https://mablab.org/post/ropensci_files/wdijr.jpg)

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:50:27 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:19:33 PM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:05:57 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

QuoteI didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Funny how those premeditated attempted murderers didn't bring a single firearm to the Capitol. Serious oversight, if you want to kill scumbags.

So by that logic, I assume you consider the 2018 insurrection during the confirmation hearings, where rioter/protestors/assholes broke into the Capitol to disrupt (which was partially successful) or prevent (unsuccessful) Kavanaugh's confirmation, possibly by assassinating him, was another example of trampling all over the Constitution, and that we should track down all those people, ruin their lives, file federal charges against all of them, and launch an investigation into the Critical Theorists and other leftist extremists who have proven to be such an existential threat to our democracy?

You don't need firearms to kill people when you have baseball bats, police-grade zipties, and a gallows.

Zip ties have killed more people than covid!

Quote from: oggsmash on July 02, 2021, 08:54:43 PM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:50:27 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:19:33 PM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:05:57 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

QuoteI didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Funny how those premeditated attempted murderers didn't bring a single firearm to the Capitol. Serious oversight, if you want to kill scumbags.

So by that logic, I assume you consider the 2018 insurrection during the confirmation hearings, where rioter/protestors/assholes broke into the Capitol to disrupt (which was partially successful) or prevent (unsuccessful) Kavanaugh's confirmation, possibly by assassinating him, was another example of trampling all over the Constitution, and that we should track down all those people, ruin their lives, file federal charges against all of them, and launch an investigation into the Critical Theorists and other leftist extremists who have proven to be such an existential threat to our democracy?

You don't need firearms to kill people when you have baseball bats, police-grade zipties, and a gallows.

Zip ties have killed more people than covid!

  Baseball bats (and blugeons) have killed more people than AR-15s.   This guy is on to something, I didnt know that had a sweet gallows set up.  I guess the dumb motherfucker doesnt realize you are not getting past the guys with guns with baseball bats though.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:19:33 PM

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 08:05:57 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 05:29:07 PM

QuoteI didn't see the US Constitution trampled on back in January, so I don't know what you are talking about there, friend.

The part of the Constitution that was being trampled on was Article II, Section 1, as amended. You know the part where the Congress in separate sessions are required by the Constitution to open, read, and count the ballots? The process  that the rioters/protesters/assholes were breaking into the Capitol building to disrupt (which was successful) or prevent (Which was unsuccessful), possibly by killing the Speaker of the House and the President of the Senate (again, unsuccessful)?

Funny how those premeditated attempted murderers didn't bring a single firearm to the Capitol. Serious oversight, if you want to kill scumbags.

So by that logic, I assume you consider the 2018 insurrection during the confirmation hearings, where rioter/protestors/assholes broke into the Capitol to disrupt (which was partially successful) or prevent (unsuccessful) Kavanaugh's confirmation, possibly by assassinating him, was another example of trampling all over the Constitution, and that we should track down all those people, ruin their lives, file federal charges against all of them, and launch an investigation into the Critical Theorists and other leftist extremists who have proven to be such an existential threat to our democracy?

You don't need firearms to kill people when you have baseball bats, police-grade zipties, and a gallows.

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 06:48:05 PM
This is from a CRT textbook introduction:

The critical race theory (CRT) movement is a collection of activists and scholars interested in studying and transform- ing the relationship among race, racism, and power. The movement considers many of the same issues that conven- tional civil rights and ethnic studies discourses take up, but places them in a broader perspective that includes econom- ics, history, context, group- and self-interest, and even feel- ings and the unconscious. Unlike traditional civil rights, which embraces incrementalism and step-by-step progress, critical race theory questions the very foundations of the lib- eral order, including equality theory, legal reasoning, En- lightenment rationalism, and neutral principles of constitu- tional law.

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 04:45:19 PM

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 01:26:53 PM
I'm not saying these are inherently in Critical Race Theory, but they are perceived to be, by people on both sides.

None of that's Critical Race Theory. You're just adding a lot of confusion to the issue.

CRT starts with the assumption that everything is racist. Every person, every institution, and every interaction. That it's the norm. This is sometimes called systemic racism. Going deeper, it claims that race is an artificial construct created by white people, who used it to give themselves power, and exclude other people. They further claim that since white people benefit from it, they have a vested interest in maintaining the system, and usually can't even see how the structure of everything favors them. These are the unquestionable tenets of the movement.

This means Critical Race theorists never look for proof that racism exists in any situation.

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 09:30:24 PM
My point is that there is a lot of disagreement over a lot of what is considered Critical Race Theory, like systemic racism. I'm not expressing any expert opinion over that - but that's semantics, not a statement of position. What we're more concerned about is specific positions regarding race and racism, not the semantics of CRT. As I mentioned, many of the supposedly "anti-CRT" laws have no mention of CRT at all.

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 09:39:20 PM

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 09:30:24 PM
My point is that there is a lot of disagreement over a lot of what is considered Critical Race Theory, like systemic racism. I'm not expressing any expert opinion over that - but that's semantics, not a statement of position. What we're more concerned about is specific positions regarding race and racism, not the semantics of CRT. As I mentioned, many of the supposedly "anti-CRT" laws have no mention of CRT at all.

That's simply wrong. Look at what I said, and compare it to Trond's quotes. They're almost exactly the same. This isn't an accident. If you read almost any general book about Critical Race Theory, you'll find the same basic description, usually in the first chapter. This is not a case where there's a lot of confusion over what the term means. Everyone agrees on the basic elements that make up Critical Race Theory.

Quote from: oggsmash on July 02, 2021, 08:48:48 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

  I wince when I see people pretending to have actually read all of Das Capital and act like they were awake/remembered much of it.  Manifesto is manageable, but Marx was a terrible fucking writer.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 10:24:12 PM
My brain does not work normally, I don't think.

Quote from: Ogre on July 02, 2021, 10:51:26 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 10:24:12 PM
My brain does not work normally, I don't think.

Yeah I see that, you agree with CRT.

Quote from: oggsmash on July 02, 2021, 08:54:43 PM
Scythe song is on to something, I didnt know that had a sweet gallows set up.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 11:10:45 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

I never called anyone a Marxist...I pointed out that you were using the same tired old argument people have been using to defend communism forever.

...and anyone with your obvious knowledge of theology, etc., etc. would know that while Christianity may have ties to some of Marx's ideas, Christianity is a 'voluntarily' entered compact.

...and btw, where can I get these fancy 'police-grade' zip ties...all I have are the extra heavy-duty ones I picked at the hardware store.

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 11:10:45 PM

...and btw, where can I get these fancy 'police-grade' zip ties...all I have are the extra heavy-duty ones I picked at the hardware store.

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 02, 2021, 08:24:04 PM
To the trash bin you go ScytheSong.

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 09:30:24 PM

Quote from: Trond on July 02, 2021, 06:48:05 PM
This is from a CRT textbook introduction:

The critical race theory (CRT) movement is a collection of activists and scholars interested in studying and transform- ing the relationship among race, racism, and power. The movement considers many of the same issues that conven- tional civil rights and ethnic studies discourses take up, but places them in a broader perspective that includes econom- ics, history, context, group- and self-interest, and even feel- ings and the unconscious. Unlike traditional civil rights, which embraces incrementalism and step-by-step progress, critical race theory questions the very foundations of the lib- eral order, including equality theory, legal reasoning, En- lightenment rationalism, and neutral principles of constitu- tional law.

Thanks, Trond. To be specific, that seems to be from this book by Richard Delgado and Jean Stefancic:

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/344649.Critical_Race_Theory_An_Introduction

The rejection of neutral principles sounds like what I was talking about the rejection of race-neutral merit as an ideal.

Quote from: Pat on July 02, 2021, 04:45:19 PM

Quote from: jhkim on July 02, 2021, 01:26:53 PM
I'm not saying these are inherently in Critical Race Theory, but they are perceived to be, by people on both sides.

None of that's Critical Race Theory. You're just adding a lot of confusion to the issue.

CRT starts with the assumption that everything is racist. Every person, every institution, and every interaction. That it's the norm. This is sometimes called systemic racism. Going deeper, it claims that race is an artificial construct created by white people, who used it to give themselves power, and exclude other people. They further claim that since white people benefit from it, they have a vested interest in maintaining the system, and usually can't even see how the structure of everything favors them. These are the unquestionable tenets of the movement.

This means Critical Race theorists never look for proof that racism exists in any situation.

I haven't read anything that called itself Critical Race Theory, but I've read about systemic racism from more traditional social science in my education studies - like Beverly Tatum's "Why Are All The Black Kids Sitting Together in the Cafeteria?" and ​Michelle Alexander's "The New Jim Crow". Those are very concerned with looking at the data, but it is difficult to absolutely prove racism exists from social science data. Proof of any motivation or bias is difficult.

Some approaches assume that there is no racial prejudice, and only admit it exists if it can be definitely proven -- but in nearly any case, someone can propose alternate explanations. For example, maybe people are simply biased against names like Jamal rather than names like Greg, and it is the name rather than race. I think given the difficulty of absolute proof in social science, this sets the bar too high.

My point is that there is a lot of disagreement over a lot of what is considered Critical Race Theory, like systemic racism. I'm not expressing any expert opinion over that - but that's semantics, not a statement of position. What we're more concerned about is specific positions regarding race and racism, not the semantics of CRT. As I mentioned, many of the supposedly "anti-CRT" laws have no mention of CRT at all.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 03, 2021, 09:18:29 AM
Damn things are called flex cuffs, zip-cuffs, or disposable handcuffs. Whee.

And now I'm off for a vacation with my wife and kids, something most of you probably know nothing about. See you all in about a week.

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 03, 2021, 10:16:22 AM
What odds is anyone offering on the children in that household growing up with mental issues?

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 03, 2021, 10:23:31 AM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 03, 2021, 10:16:22 AM
What odds is anyone offering on the children in that household growing up with mental issues?

I doubt he's even got kids or a wife or has been to college. I'm starting to suspect another sockpuppet troll.

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 10:31:05 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 03, 2021, 10:23:31 AM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 03, 2021, 10:16:22 AM
What odds is anyone offering on the children in that household growing up with mental issues?

I doubt he's even got kids or a wife or has been to college. I'm starting to suspect another sockpuppet troll.

Pundit and the admins need to do some gatekeeping.  I already know that well liked long time user asked to have his account deleted and left this site.

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 10:31:05 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 03, 2021, 10:23:31 AM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 03, 2021, 10:16:22 AM
What odds is anyone offering on the children in that household growing up with mental issues?

I doubt he's even got kids or a wife or has been to college. I'm starting to suspect another sockpuppet troll.

Pundit and the admins need to do some gatekeeping.  I already know that well liked long time user asked to have his account deleted and left this site.

Quote from: SHARK on July 03, 2021, 10:36:48 AM

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 10:31:05 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 03, 2021, 10:23:31 AM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 03, 2021, 10:16:22 AM
What odds is anyone offering on the children in that household growing up with mental issues?

I doubt he's even got kids or a wife or has been to college. I'm starting to suspect another sockpuppet troll.

Pundit and the admins need to do some gatekeeping.  I already know that well liked long time user asked to have his account deleted and left this site.

Greetings!

WHO, Snowman?

Why did this member you are talking about leave the website here?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 11:20:42 AM

Quote from: SHARK on July 03, 2021, 10:36:48 AM

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 10:31:05 AM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 03, 2021, 10:23:31 AM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 03, 2021, 10:16:22 AM
What odds is anyone offering on the children in that household growing up with mental issues?

I doubt he's even got kids or a wife or has been to college. I'm starting to suspect another sockpuppet troll.

Pundit and the admins need to do some gatekeeping.  I already know that well liked long time user asked to have his account deleted and left this site.

Greetings!

WHO, Snowman?

Why did this member you are talking about leave the website here?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

I will tell you in pm.

Quote from: oggsmash on July 03, 2021, 11:28:07 AM
   Wasn't it the dude who posted the naked forest girl in an attempt to get banned?

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 11:58:43 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on July 03, 2021, 11:28:07 AM
   Wasn't it the dude who posted the naked forest girl in an attempt to get banned?

If that is Brad, then yes.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 03, 2021, 09:18:29 AM
Damn things are called flex cuffs, zip-cuffs, or disposable handcuffs. Whee.

And now I'm off for a vacation with my wife and kids, something most of you probably know nothing about. See you all in about a week.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 10:24:12 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on July 02, 2021, 08:48:48 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 08:16:52 PM

Quote from: moonsweeper on July 02, 2021, 06:25:58 PM
...and we're back to the old "but 'true' communism has never been tried" argument...

Sure it has. Just read the second chapter of Acts in the Bible. Sts. Peter and James were the first Communists, and Marxism is a deeply Christian philosophy. Not that the Leninism, Trotskyism, or Maoism that followed were at all Christian, but they sure wanted to be Marxist, even though neither Russia nor China had either a true proletariat nor well-developed enough means of production to make a real go of it other than in limited areas.

Not to mention that most labor unions are far closer to Marx and Engels' ideal of communism than the People's Republic of China has ever managed.

Every time I see you people using the term "Marxist", I also wince (just like when you're using "woke") because it doesn't seem like you have any idea what Karl Marx actually wrote, or who Friedrich Engels might even be, or what Marxism actually is other than "Something I dislike for reasons I can't explain other than it seems to be liberal or leftist."

  I wince when I see people pretending to have actually read all of Das Capital and act like they were awake/remembered much of it.  Manifesto is manageable, but Marx was a terrible fucking writer.

More like Engels was a fucking terrible editor. I know I got through all of the Manifesto, and I think I finished Das Kapital. But my reading list was insane when I was in Junior High and Highschool (because my dad was *really* *really* into giving me a Liberal Education (tm)). Plato's Republic and Discourses, Huxley's Brave New World, The Analects of Confucius, Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead, and a selection of Existentialists from Dostoevsky to Sartre. As well as Camus' The Stranger, Dianetics, the Book of Mormon, and the Bible (the last with Koine Greek lessons so I could read "the original"). I've been clocked reading theology textbooks at a page per minute for content. My brain does not work normally, I don't think.

Quote from: Snowman0147 on July 03, 2021, 11:58:43 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on July 03, 2021, 11:28:07 AM
   Wasn't it the dude who posted the naked forest girl in an attempt to get banned?

If that is Brad, then yes.

Quote from: Trond on July 03, 2021, 01:49:47 PM
You get banned for naked forest girls now? Asking for a friend ;D

Quote from: oggsmash on July 03, 2021, 11:36:17 PM

Quote from: Trond on July 03, 2021, 01:49:47 PM
You get banned for naked forest girls now? Asking for a friend ;D

   I think Pundit deleted the pic, and refused to delete the dude's history (was not Brad).  I think he didnt ban him either.   Edited to add.....or was it Brad after a name change?  hmm.

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM
I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

Quote from: Shasarak on July 08, 2021, 01:05:00 AM

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM
I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

He says adjusting his three masks to more completely cover his face.

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM
I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM
(https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/2021/07/05/PDTF/e15bb746-a87b-4dc1-9801-4133d0c4d7c4-60621ThompsonCriticalRaceWeb.jpg)

I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM

I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

Quote from: Trond on July 08, 2021, 09:27:38 AM

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM

I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

"Microaggressions" are very much a CRT thing. Ever heard of that? Ring a bell? Because BLM used it to try to ruin Comic-Con when I went there years ago, and more recently they were pushing it at my workplace. But those are just my personal experiences.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 08, 2021, 02:31:14 AM

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM
I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

Some of us have been concerned about Critical Theory for years now.

https://twitter.com/themitchellfink/status/1412909635099529219

Do try to keep up.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 08, 2021, 08:10:19 AM
CRT: it doesn't actually exist but we need to teach it in school, because reasons.

Quote from: Pat on July 08, 2021, 01:26:32 PM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 08, 2021, 08:10:19 AM
CRT: it doesn't actually exist but we need to teach it in school, because reasons.

NPR did an interview a couple weeks ago with a professor at some university. She said they only teach Critical Race Theory to graduate students, and only some of them, when it's relevant to their studies. The whole thrust of the piece was the worry about CRT in primary school was complete nonsense, because it's this very advanced and esoteric set of concepts that nobody's exposed to until they're Masters students, so all the parents are idiots who have no idea what they're talking about. NPR never talked to a primary school teacher, or to any of the people with concerns about CRT being taught to children.

It's evasion based on technical definitions. NPR is saying children aren't reading Gramsci and Crenshaw. Which is correct, but completely dishonest. Because people aren't concerned their children are being formally taught about CRT as a body of scholarship. They're concerned that the principles and conclusions of CRT are being incorporated into primary school education. Which is absolutely happening, as can be seen in things like the 1619 Project.

The dismissal of those concerns is completely two-faced, and the National Education Association's moves in the last few days is a perfect example. They started by passing a motion that supported CRT, with the clear intent to keep pushing it despite the resistance of parents (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9754609/Americas-largest-teachers-union-says-supports-teaching-children-critical-race-theory-schools.html), while at the same time they're scrubbing their website of all traces of CRT. (https://news.yahoo.com/largest-teachers-union-erases-campaign-232740715.html) That goes beyond strawmanning the arguments of their opposition. It's blatant hypocrisy. They're overtly supporting it, while pretending it doesn't exist.

Quote from: Merrill on July 08, 2021, 09:43:25 AM

Quote from: Trond on July 08, 2021, 09:27:38 AM

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM

I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

"Microaggressions" are very much a CRT thing. Ever heard of that? Ring a bell? Because BLM used it to try to ruin Comic-Con when I went there years ago, and more recently they were pushing it at my workplace. But those are just my personal experiences.

what happened at Comin-Con?

don't think I heard about that

Quote from: Daztur on July 08, 2021, 12:46:14 AM
(https://www.gannett-cdn.com/presto/2021/07/05/PDTF/e15bb746-a87b-4dc1-9801-4133d0c4d7c4-60621ThompsonCriticalRaceWeb.jpg)

I wonder what fringe thing all of you will suddenly and in perfect unison become outraged about at the exact same time?

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 10, 2021, 02:50:38 PM
(The icing on the cake is how more than a couple of those ... persons are registered sex offenders. Oops.)

Quote from: Trond on July 10, 2021, 03:34:57 PM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 10, 2021, 02:50:38 PM
(The icing on the cake is how more than a couple of those ... persons are registered sex offenders. Oops.)

Where did you get that from?

Quote from: Pat on July 10, 2021, 04:10:40 PM

Quote from: Trond on July 10, 2021, 03:34:57 PM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 10, 2021, 02:50:38 PM
(The icing on the cake is how more than a couple of those ... persons are registered sex offenders. Oops.)

Where did you get that from?

I heard in some podcast that 4chan was tracking them down. Don't think it's been confirmed, so it should be considered highly suspect at the moment.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 10, 2021, 08:03:58 PM
The sex offender angle is shaky, and should be kept at arm's length until they have some solid information.

But a bunch of gay guys singing about how they're coming for your children is stupendously tone deaf, regardless of their intentions.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 11, 2021, 09:18:53 PM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 10, 2021, 08:03:58 PM
The sex offender angle is shaky, and should be kept at arm's length until they have some solid information.

But a bunch of gay guys singing about how they're coming for your children is stupendously tone deaf, regardless of their intentions.

'Tone deaf' is probably the most generous way to put it.

I mean, how goddamn rock fucking stupid do you have to be to sing a song about how 'we're going to convert your kids'? Watching them scramble to say 'It's just a joke, bro!' reminds me of jackasses in high school who'd push someone to their limit then try to retreat behind 'it's just a joke!'.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on July 11, 2021, 09:18:53 PM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 10, 2021, 08:03:58 PM
The sex offender angle is shaky, and should be kept at arm's length until they have some solid information.

But a bunch of gay guys singing about how they're coming for your children is stupendously tone deaf, regardless of their intentions.

'Tone deaf' is probably the most generous way to put it.

I mean, how goddamn rock fucking stupid do you have to be to sing a song about how 'we're going to convert your kids'? Watching them scramble to say 'It's just a joke, bro!' reminds me of jackasses in high school who'd push someone to their limit then try to retreat behind 'it's just a joke!'.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on July 12, 2021, 03:57:30 PM
First off: Having listened to and read the actual lyrics of the song, "converting your children" is supposedly meant to mean that they'll make them "more tolerant, non-bigoted and into allies" and not actually into gay people. (And after them, you're next)

So, not gay, just people who wount persecute them for being gay.

That said...

Secondly: Seriously, "coming for your children" makes me think they should have watched this sketch first
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqgiEQXGetI because that is seriously lacking in forethought

Thirdly: I work with kids/teenagers. They are natural rebels, and now you're giving them wokeness to rebel against.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on July 12, 2021, 03:57:30 PMSecondly: Seriously, "coming for your children" makes me think they should have watched this sketch first

Quote from: oggsmash on July 12, 2021, 04:08:00 PM

   Well, the thing is their definition of tolerant and non bigoted is not really that.  Their definition of tolerance is full acceptance and celebration.   I wonder how funny they would have thought it was if some right wing people did a country song about locking up/killing all the gays (since that is a trope these people feel is true, just as there are many conservative types who believe many homosexuals are also child predators) as satire?

Quote

The song didn't just appear from the ether. The men in question are well aware of the double meaning; it's not like it's some obscure or fringe slang. They wrote the song purposefully with the innuendo in mind. And there's a lot of men in this group, who all heard the song and approved of the messages that it's communicating.

This wasn't done on a lark. They wrote the song, practiced it, got a recording studio, video equipment, performed it, did audio & video production, and publicized their work. They demonstrated a lot of effort into the whole endeavor, to communicate a message, and they knew this message would be offensive and subversive.

Nevertheless they went ahead with it all. They show a lot of enthusiasm for the message, so I'm going to take them at their word.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on July 12, 2021, 06:44:19 PM
Sounds like you're saying they were counting on easily triggered right wing pundits like Ben Shapiro and youtubers getting their 15 minutes of content
(with some witty title like "homosexual libtards own by facts and immediately regrets it") before they move on to the next thing to be outraged by so they can get their daily clicks.

Now why would they (the SFGC) do such a thing?

Quote from: Wntrlnd on July 12, 2021, 06:44:19 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on July 12, 2021, 04:08:00 PM

   Well, the thing is their definition of tolerant and non bigoted is not really that.  Their definition of tolerance is full acceptance and celebration.   I wonder how funny they would have thought it was if some right wing people did a country song about locking up/killing all the gays (since that is a trope these people feel is true, just as there are many conservative types who believe many homosexuals are also child predators) as satire?

I see. So what would the real (i.e your) definition of tolerance and non-bigoted be?

Quote

The song didn't just appear from the ether. The men in question are well aware of the double meaning; it's not like it's some obscure or fringe slang. They wrote the song purposefully with the innuendo in mind. And there's a lot of men in this group, who all heard the song and approved of the messages that it's communicating.

This wasn't done on a lark. They wrote the song, practiced it, got a recording studio, video equipment, performed it, did audio & video production, and publicized their work. They demonstrated a lot of effort into the whole endeavor, to communicate a message, and they knew this message would be offensive and subversive.

Nevertheless they went ahead with it all. They show a lot of enthusiasm for the message, so I'm going to take them at their word.

Sounds like you're saying they were counting on easily triggered right wing pundits like Ben Shapiro and youtubers getting their 15 minutes of content
(with some witty title like "homosexual libtards own by facts and immediately regrets it") before they move on to the next thing to be outraged by so they can get their daily clicks.

Now why would they (the SFGC) do such a thing?

Quote from: Zelen on July 12, 2021, 09:54:24 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on July 12, 2021, 06:44:19 PM
Sounds like you're saying they were counting on easily triggered right wing pundits like Ben Shapiro and youtubers getting their 15 minutes of content
(with some witty title like "homosexual libtards own by facts and immediately regrets it") before they move on to the next thing to be outraged by so they can get their daily clicks.

Now why would they (the SFGC) do such a thing?

I don't see a need to invent weird theories about how this was a super-secret ploy. These guys get excited about the prospect of coming for your children, and they don't think there will be any consequences for admitting it.

Quote from: Trond on July 13, 2021, 12:12:55 AM
If you ask me the gay quire boys are trolling, the way Proud Boys are trolling by constantly showing the ludicrous "white supremacy" hand signals. Both groups know that they're going to get a reaction and a good laugh at the others' expense.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 13, 2021, 12:19:45 AM

Quote from: Trond on July 13, 2021, 12:12:55 AM
If you ask me the gay quire boys are trolling, the way Proud Boys are trolling by constantly showing the ludicrous "white supremacy" hand signals. Both groups know that they're going to get a reaction and a good laugh at the others' expense.

Seems their latest tactic is to put the video back up and then squeal about how they've gotten death threats.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sf/article/Soloists-of-S-F-Gay-Men-s-Chorus-receive-death-16305155.php

Quote from: Ratman_tf on July 13, 2021, 12:19:45 AM
Seems their latest tactic is to put the video back up and then squeal about how they've gotten death threats.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sf/article/Soloists-of-S-F-Gay-Men-s-Chorus-receive-death-16305155.php

Quote from: Zelen on July 12, 2021, 05:33:27 PM
Nevertheless they went ahead with it all. They show a lot of enthusiasm for the message, so I'm going to take them at their word.

Quote from: Zelen on July 13, 2021, 02:48:13 AM
For the record, I fully support death threats against people who promote sexual violence against children.

Quote from: jhkim on July 13, 2021, 03:29:22 AM
If you are taking them at their word, then what they intend to do is convert children into being "tolerant and fair", and "teach them not to hate"...

Quote from: jhkim on July 13, 2021, 03:29:22 AM
One can say it is in bad taste, but...

Quote from: Zelen on July 13, 2021, 05:16:35 AM

Quote from: jhkim on July 13, 2021, 03:29:22 AM
If you are taking them at their word, then what they intend to do is convert children into being "tolerant and fair", and "teach them not to hate"...

Quote from: jhkim on July 13, 2021, 03:29:22 AM
One can say it is in bad taste, but...

If taking them at their word means making kids "tolerant and fair" and "teaching them not to hate" then how is it also simultaneously in bad taste?

Seems like you are being disingenuous here.

Quote from: oggsmash on July 13, 2021, 11:32:35 AM
I have to LOL at death threats over the internet though.  That is what most people call Monday.  Now someone shows up to where you are, or even calls you on a personal line, I might start to have concerns.   Those fellas in their future satire moments, where they already know they are going to royally piss people off might want to be careful about their language if online threats bother them.  You can sandwich tolerant and non-bigoted into lyrics calling gen Z gayer than Grinder and talking about coming for children if you like, but my advice is it is better to back away from the Rubicon.

Quote from: jhkim on July 13, 2021, 03:29:22 AM

Quote from: Zelen on July 12, 2021, 05:33:27 PM
Nevertheless they went ahead with it all. They show a lot of enthusiasm for the message, so I'm going to take them at their word.

Quote from: Zelen on July 13, 2021, 02:48:13 AM
For the record, I fully support death threats against people who promote sexual violence against children.

If you are taking them at their word, then what they intend to do is convert children into being "tolerant and fair", and "teach them not to hate". That's what the lyrics of the song actually say. It sounds like you're *not* taking them at their word, and instead reading something other than the literal meaning into the song.

It is absolutely a reference and parody of conservative allegations that gay people are all child molesters, but the intent of the song is to deny those allegations and push a different message instead. One can say it is in bad taste, but the literal meaning of the words spoken is clear.

Quote from: Zelen on July 13, 2021, 05:16:35 AM
If taking them at their word means making kids "tolerant and fair" and "teaching them not to hate" then how is it also simultaneously in bad taste?

Seems like you are being disingenuous here.

Quote from: Doc Sammy on July 13, 2021, 07:25:05 PM
Fuck the SF Chorus.

Most of those "SF" queers are either NAMBLA rejects or wannabe trannies who do not have the balls to go all the way with transitioning (no pun intended)

Seriously though, fuck those guys for undoing decades of hard-fought work. Now the traditionalist redneck whores are going to have a field day with this little stunt.

On behalf of the GLB community, let me say that the San Francisco Gay Chorus can go fuck itself and we are NOT coming after your children. No matter how much both far-right puritan rednecks and far-left pedophiles wish it were the case.

Quote from: DocJones on July 13, 2021, 07:00:03 PM
...
Clearly there's a huge overlap in the SF gay choir membership and NAMBLA.

Quote from: Doc Sammy on July 13, 2021, 07:25:05 PM
Fuck the SF Chorus.

Most of those "SF" queers are either NAMBLA rejects ...

Quote from: Trond on September 06, 2021, 06:54:40 PM
As I have been saying for a long time: "Wokeness" is so often just an excuse to bully and belittle people:

https://mobile.twitter.com/sarahbeth345/status/1433949909846085638

Quote from: Trond on September 06, 2021, 06:54:40 PM
As I have been saying for a long time: "Wokeness" is so often just an excuse to bully and belittle people:

https://mobile.twitter.com/sarahbeth345/status/1433949909846085638

Quote from: Doc Sammy on July 13, 2021, 07:25:05 PM
Fuck the SF Chorus.

Most of those "SF" queers are either NAMBLA rejects or wannabe trannies who do not have the balls to go all the way with transitioning (no pun intended)

Seriously though, fuck those guys for undoing decades of hard-fought work. Now the traditionalist redneck whores are going to have a field day with this little stunt.

On behalf of the GLB community, let me say that the San Francisco Gay Chorus can go fuck itself and we are NOT coming after your children. No matter how much both far-right puritan rednecks and far-left pedophiles wish it were the case.

Quote from: wmarshal on October 11, 2021, 04:32:02 PM
This thread would seem to fit for this:
https://hotair.com/john-s-2/2021/10/11/ny-times-story-on-the-bad-art-friend-is-remarkable-n421650

The utter evil of taking someone else's generosity and work, and turning it into an issue resisting a "white savior" and appropriation.

I usually view the current progressive emphasis on being Woke and CRT as a kind of secular totalitarian cult, but I wonder if for a significant percentage it's just a super-convenient vector for narcissists to build themselves up while tearing others down. Somehow, I think a true believer in the Woke cult couldn't be this damn evil.

Quote from: Trond on October 11, 2021, 05:43:48 PM
I am generally positive in my interactions with people; HOWEVER Always remember that if you interact with a group of people, 3-4 % of them are likely to be on the sociopath/narcissistic spectrum, or possibly more.

Quote from: FelixGamingX1 on October 12, 2021, 05:14:34 PM

Quote from: Trond on October 11, 2021, 05:43:48 PM
I am generally positive in my interactions with people; HOWEVER Always remember that if you interact with a group of people, 3-4 % of them are likely to be on the sociopath/narcissistic spectrum, or possibly more.

This largely varies by several factors. If you were raised in a shitty background, and struggles with insecurity problems then you'd ultimately believe someone like me is a narcissist.

If you were brought up the right away, then what other people do or don't do, wouldn't affect you at all. The woke movement is basically full of people with insecurity problems being manipulated by a grand master.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 01, 2021, 01:41:48 PM
It's been a rough week for the race grifters.

Ibram X. Kendi managed to shred his own arguments about 'white privilege' when he posted a story about how white students were getting scholarships by lying about their color.

And someone pointed out 'if they're having to lie about their race to get a scholarship, are they really enjoying any privilege?'.

Whoops. Delete! Delete! LOL.

Meanwhile, Colin Kaepernick talks about how the NFL draft is like a slave auction.

No really. This fro-headed overpaid moron went there. Who knew that racism involved offering you million dollar contracts if you could cut it in the combines?

Quote from: Trond on November 04, 2021, 09:07:19 AM
Some Democrats finally starting to get it? Took long enough. Here's James Carville:

"What went wrong is stupid wokeness. Don't just look at Virginia and New Jersey. Look at Long Island, Buffalo, look at Minneapolis, even look at Seattle, Washington. I mean this 'defund the police' lunacy, this take Abraham Lincoln's name off of schools, people see that. And it really has a suppressive effect on all across the country on Democrats. Some of these people need to go to a woke detox center or something," Carville said.

Quote from: Trond on November 04, 2021, 09:07:19 AM
Some Democrats finally starting to get it? Took long enough. Here's James Carville:

"What went wrong is stupid wokeness. Don't just look at Virginia and New Jersey. Look at Long Island, Buffalo, look at Minneapolis, even look at Seattle, Washington. I mean this 'defund the police' lunacy, this take Abraham Lincoln's name off of schools, people see that. And it really has a suppressive effect on all across the country on Democrats. Some of these people need to go to a woke detox center or something," Carville said.

Quote from: KingCheops on November 04, 2021, 09:50:18 AM

He's actually been bringing this up since Trump's election.

Quote from: Trond on November 04, 2021, 03:28:09 PM

Quote from: KingCheops on November 04, 2021, 09:50:18 AM

He's actually been bringing this up since Trump's election.

Maybe not too surprising since he has a conservative wife. That way, he can't be too far into the bubble.

Quote from: Zelen on November 04, 2021, 09:19:18 PM
Carville's perspective is not, "Don't do this," it's "Don't be so obvious." Big difference.

Quote from: Zelen on November 04, 2021, 09:19:18 PM
Carville's perspective is not, "Don't do this," it's "Don't be so obvious." Big difference.

Quote from: Zelen on November 04, 2021, 09:19:18 PM
Carville's perspective is not, "Don't do this," it's "Don't be so obvious." Big difference.

Quote from: Trond on November 06, 2021, 09:35:12 AM
I don't believe this is necessarily the case...

Quote from: Trond on November 06, 2021, 09:35:12 AM
I don't believe this is necessarily the case. Just because you want socialized medical care, and better nature conservation etc doesn't mean that you agree that EVERYTHING has to be about race, or that the police should be abandoned for instance. I know a lot of people on the left, and many of them have been in denial about how strong the far left has gotten. In some cases it dawned on them when the news told them that things happening right before their eyes weren't really happening, in other cases they will never change their minds. People are stubborn like that.

Quote from: Zelen on November 07, 2021, 02:55:25 PM
Sure but Carville is an insider and he's been in politics for decades. He's not a blue dog democrat whose sole attachment to the Democrat party is having been a union member. The modern Democrat party is the party of the oligarchs & the radicals they use to push their agenda, and Carville played a big part in making it that way.

Quote from: DragonBane on November 08, 2021, 07:19:10 PM
The woke are NOT turning a corner towards defeat. They are winning. People are too scared to really speak up.

Look at the culture wars. The non-left has lost every single battle. Biden is president; have you seen the budget he has planned? Nerdrotic is literally running away from California.

No, no "corner" has been turned.

Quote from: jhkim on November 08, 2021, 05:48:35 PM

Quote from: Trond on November 06, 2021, 09:35:12 AM
I don't believe this is necessarily the case. Just because you want socialized medical care, and better nature conservation etc doesn't mean that you agree that EVERYTHING has to be about race, or that the police should be abandoned for instance. I know a lot of people on the left, and many of them have been in denial about how strong the far left has gotten. In some cases it dawned on them when the news told them that things happening right before their eyes weren't really happening, in other cases they will never change their minds. People are stubborn like that.

Quote from: Zelen on November 07, 2021, 02:55:25 PM
Sure but Carville is an insider and he's been in politics for decades. He's not a blue dog democrat whose sole attachment to the Democrat party is having been a union member. The modern Democrat party is the party of the oligarchs & the radicals they use to push their agenda, and Carville played a big part in making it that way.

I would say that the modern Democrat party and the modern Republican party are both the party of the oligarchs. The far left has gotten stronger as part of the general trend of increasing partisanship. However, they're still a minority, as demonstrated by Biden getting the nomination - who is far from progressive or radical.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on November 08, 2021, 07:52:18 PM

Quote from: DragonBane on November 08, 2021, 07:19:10 PM
The woke are NOT turning a corner towards defeat. They are winning. People are too scared to really speak up.

Look at the culture wars. The non-left has lost every single battle. Biden is president; have you seen the budget he has planned? Nerdrotic is literally running away from California.

No, no "corner" has been turned.

We can point at specific instances. VA just got blasted, despite the Democrats trying hard to turn it into their usual "Handmaids racism!" trick.

Hard blue, leftist activist areas are going to hold out for quite a while longer, But there's some hope. No one was talking about Critical Race Theory just a few years ago, and now it was one of the important issues for VA voters.

I'd say we have turned a corner, but there's still a long way to go.

Quote from: Pat on November 04, 2021, 09:34:16 PM

Quote from: Zelen on November 04, 2021, 09:19:18 PM
Carville's perspective is not, "Don't do this," it's "Don't be so obvious." Big difference.

That's pretty much the perspective of all the supposed moderates on the left.

I still don't understand how this happened. Ten years ago, or 15 years ago, none of these people believed any of this. Then, very suddenly, the extreme of the extreme of the extreme far left became the norm.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on November 08, 2021, 07:55:20 PM

Quote from: jhkim on November 08, 2021, 05:48:35 PM
I would say that the modern Democrat party and the modern Republican party are both the party of the oligarchs. The far left has gotten stronger as part of the general trend of increasing partisanship. However, they're still a minority, as demonstrated by Biden getting the nomination - who is far from progressive or radical.

No, but he still pays lip service to radical progressives.

Quote from: Banjo Destructo on November 09, 2021, 10:06:14 AM

Quote from: Pat on November 04, 2021, 09:34:16 PM
I still don't understand how this happened. Ten years ago, or 15 years ago, none of these people believed any of this. Then, very suddenly, the extreme of the extreme of the extreme far left became the norm.

Hilary Clinton wanted to push some kind of healthcare for everyone plan back when she was first lady during her husband's presidency, so that was 1992-2000,  20-30 years ago.   I think most of the people at the top of the DNC, Democratic Party have been basically some form of progressive, or a marxist, or sympathetic to the USSR and other communist revolutions for over 40 years now, they just haven't been publicly obvious about it.

Quote from: jhkim on November 09, 2021, 12:54:09 PM

Quote from: Ratman_tf on November 08, 2021, 07:55:20 PM

Hilary Clinton wanted to push some kind of healthcare for everyone plan back when she was first lady during her husband's presidency, so that was 1992-2000,  20-30 years ago.   I think most of the people at the top of the DNC, Democratic Party have been basically some form of progressive, or a marxist, or sympathetic to the USSR and other communist revolutions for over 40 years now, they just haven't been publicly obvious about it.

Truman and JFK both pushed universal health care decades earlier, and the creation of Medicare and Medicaid were compromises to that. But if you define universal health care as openly communist, then Israel is openly communist -- along with Japan, South Korea, Australia, and every other First World country with the exception of the U.S. That doesn't seem like a useful distinction.

Quote from: SHARK on November 09, 2021, 07:18:52 PM
Greetings!

Biden's "Lip Service" to the Leftist Radicals is somehow not reflected in his actions or policies?

Geesus. Put the fucking delusional Kool-Aid down.

Biden is one of the most Left-wing, radical, Marxist, fucking tyrant nutjobs that has ever ruled this country.

Listen to Dan Bongino, as well as Ben Shapiro, along with Walsh, Klaven, and others at the Daily Wire to learn all about how fucking radical and fucking left wing Biden has been with his actions and policies.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: SHARK on November 09, 2021, 07:18:52 PM
Biden's "Lip Service" to the Leftist Radicals is somehow not reflected in his actions or policies?

Geesus. Put the fucking delusional Kool-Aid down.

Biden is one of the most Left-wing, radical, Marxist, fucking tyrant nutjobs that has ever ruled this country.

Listen to Dan Bongino, as well as Ben Shapiro, along with Walsh, Klaven, and others at the Daily Wire to learn all about how fucking radical and fucking left wing Biden has been with his actions and policies.

Quote from: jhkim on November 10, 2021, 01:57:14 PM

Quote from: SHARK on November 09, 2021, 07:18:52 PM
Biden's "Lip Service" to the Leftist Radicals is somehow not reflected in his actions or policies?

Geesus. Put the fucking delusional Kool-Aid down.

Biden is one of the most Left-wing, radical, Marxist, fucking tyrant nutjobs that has ever ruled this country.

Listen to Dan Bongino, as well as Ben Shapiro, along with Walsh, Klaven, and others at the Daily Wire to learn all about how fucking radical and fucking left wing Biden has been with his actions and policies.

Do you have any specific arguments to discuss? I've been subscribed to updates from Ben Shapiro and the Daily Wire for a while now.

Quote from: SHARK on November 11, 2021, 11:36:07 AM

Quote from: jhkim on November 10, 2021, 01:57:14 PM
Do you have any specific arguments to discuss? I've been subscribed to updates from Ben Shapiro and the Daily Wire for a while now.

Well, if you are a regular listener to Ben Shapiro, Michael Knowles, Andrew Klaven, Michael Walsh, then you would know how fucking extreme LEFT and RADICAL Biden's actions and policies have been. Dan Bongino has also discussed on his program numerous occasions and episodes about how extreme LEFT and disastrous Biden has been for America.

Quote from: Trond on November 28, 2021, 10:31:26 AM
If anyone still wonders why people are seriously fed up with the "woke":


" Canadian school cancels ISIS survivor Nadia Murad over Islamophobia fears"
https://archive.md/XpitD

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 28, 2021, 11:45:48 AM
For those of you who are terminally uninformed, Nadia Murad is a Yazidi woman who was kidnapped into sex slavery by ISIS.

One more example of wokeists being quite comfortable with sex trafficking and rape. Whodathunk it?

Quote from: Trond on November 28, 2021, 11:55:06 PM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 28, 2021, 11:45:48 AM
For those of you who are terminally uninformed, Nadia Murad is a Yazidi woman who was kidnapped into sex slavery by ISIS.

One more example of wokeists being quite comfortable with sex trafficking and rape. Whodathunk it?

I don't think they're "comfortable" with it. That's the kind of thinking that led us into this hopeless divisiveness. I just think that "Muslims doing bad" causes an cognitive error and near-shutdown of their brains.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 29, 2021, 08:16:19 AM

Quote from: Trond on November 28, 2021, 11:55:06 PM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 28, 2021, 11:45:48 AM
For those of you who are terminally uninformed, Nadia Murad is a Yazidi woman who was kidnapped into sex slavery by ISIS.

One more example of wokeists being quite comfortable with sex trafficking and rape. Whodathunk it?

I don't think they're "comfortable" with it. That's the kind of thinking that led us into this hopeless divisiveness. I just think that "Muslims doing bad" causes an cognitive error and near-shutdown of their brains.

Feel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

Quote from: Trond on November 29, 2021, 11:29:48 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 29, 2021, 08:16:19 AM

Quote from: Trond on November 28, 2021, 11:55:06 PM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 28, 2021, 11:45:48 AM
For those of you who are terminally uninformed, Nadia Murad is a Yazidi woman who was kidnapped into sex slavery by ISIS.

One more example of wokeists being quite comfortable with sex trafficking and rape. Whodathunk it?

I don't think they're "comfortable" with it. That's the kind of thinking that led us into this hopeless divisiveness. I just think that "Muslims doing bad" causes an cognitive error and near-shutdown of their brains.

Feel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

I know many "woke" leftists. Some think that Polanski should rot in jail for a lifetime, or even shot. I have seen this so many times; "pedophile" and "rape apologist" are insults that both sides like to hurl at each other, and of course when we're talking about millions of people it's always possible to find "evidence" that supports this view. Add to that a good dose of "my side means well, but sometimes things just go wrong. Those others though? Tsk tsk!"

Quote from: Trond on November 29, 2021, 11:29:48 AMI know many "woke" leftists. Some think that Polanski should rot in jail for a lifetime, or even shot.

Quote from: Stephen Tannhauser on November 29, 2021, 12:26:06 PM

Quote from: Trond on November 29, 2021, 11:29:48 AMI know many "woke" leftists. Some think that Polanski should rot in jail for a lifetime, or even shot.

I don't doubt it, but the problem is that such leftists don't generally speak up to call out their more blind-eye-turning fellows in public. I am perfectly willing not to tar the moderates of any movement with an extremists' brush -- there is no movement which doesn't have destructive extremists -- but when the moderates stay conveniently silent as long as their extremist fringe's actions are still working to their benefit, that distinction becomes harder to buy.

(Larry Correia just recently posted a great rant (http://monsterhunternation.com/2021/11/23/do-i-unfairly-paint-the-left-with-a-broad-brush/) about this topic.)

I think one way we will know Wokism is on the decline is when its extremists finally start losing their own moderates' support.

QuoteFeel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

Quote from: Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM

QuoteFeel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

Quote from: 3catcircus on November 29, 2021, 07:59:58 PM

Quote from: Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM

QuoteFeel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

While not condoning him, I think that having his wife and unborn kid stabulated by a bunch of cultist psychos probably helped along Polanski's baser urges, which seems a bit different than the  "Wut? Wut's the problem?!?!" way in which the current crop of pedos are trying to normalize criminally deviant behavior.

Quote from: Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM

QuoteFeel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

Quote from: Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM

QuoteFeel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

Quote from: 3catcircus on November 30, 2021, 02:07:08 PM

Quote from: Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM
From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

But it wasn't that that were out for him for being a pedo - the current crop of leftists support it so long as it's lumped into the current "LGBT$_&* abbreviation salad" and given a cutesy moniker.

Quote from: oggsmash on November 30, 2021, 02:56:17 PM
  Hollywood has also had several movies it produced that were putting pedo's in a sympathetic role.  Others where they made some innuendos, and so forth.  Not a doubt in my mind they have a large contingent of blood suckers that bang kids IRL all the time.  I think it is nice we can still seem to all agree "Pedos bad", but I have a feeling all the shifting will eventually lead to a more direct course to make society more accepting of pedos.

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 04:18:37 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on November 30, 2021, 02:56:17 PM
  Hollywood has also had several movies it produced that were putting pedo's in a sympathetic role.  Others where they made some innuendos, and so forth.  Not a doubt in my mind they have a large contingent of blood suckers that bang kids IRL all the time.  I think it is nice we can still seem to all agree "Pedos bad", but I have a feeling all the shifting will eventually lead to a more direct course to make society more accepting of pedos.

Society used to be more accepting of many practices that are now increasingly frowned on -- like how the age of consent has generally gone up, marital rape is now generally illegal, and there are a growing number of states that have made child marriage illegal. So I'd consider those to be positive developments.

That doesn't mean that things can't get worse in the future, of course. I certainly hope we don't backslide on this.

Quote from: 3catcircus on November 30, 2021, 07:07:13 PM

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 04:18:37 PM
Society used to be more accepting of many practices that are now increasingly frowned on -- like how the age of consent has generally gone up, marital rape is now generally illegal, and there are a growing number of states that have made child marriage illegal. So I'd consider those to be positive developments.

That doesn't mean that things can't get worse in the future, of course. I certainly hope we don't backslide on this.

To be fair, those all stem from a time when Western Europe was still shitting in the streets.  Married in early teens, squirt out a dozen pups hoping one or two survive, a grandparent in your 30s, dead by 40 or 45.  That, and there was just a lot less to have to learn back then, so there was less time to have to invest in ensuring society survived in future generations.

Quote from: 3catcircus on November 30, 2021, 07:07:13 PM

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 04:18:37 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on November 30, 2021, 02:56:17 PM
  Hollywood has also had several movies it produced that were putting pedo's in a sympathetic role.  Others where they made some innuendos, and so forth.  Not a doubt in my mind they have a large contingent of blood suckers that bang kids IRL all the time.  I think it is nice we can still seem to all agree "Pedos bad", but I have a feeling all the shifting will eventually lead to a more direct course to make society more accepting of pedos.

Society used to be more accepting of many practices that are now increasingly frowned on -- like how the age of consent has generally gone up, marital rape is now generally illegal, and there are a growing number of states that have made child marriage illegal. So I'd consider those to be positive developments.

That doesn't mean that things can't get worse in the future, of course. I certainly hope we don't backslide on this.

To be fair, those all stem from a time when Western Europe was still shitting in the streets.  Married in early teens, squirt out a dozen pups hoping one or two survive, a grandparent in your 30s, dead by 40 or 45.  That, and there was just a lot less to have to learn back then, so there was less time to have to invest in ensuring society survived in future generations.

Quote from: jhkim on July 13, 2021, 03:29:22 AM

Quote from: Zelen on July 12, 2021, 05:33:27 PM
Nevertheless they went ahead with it all. They show a lot of enthusiasm for the message, so I'm going to take them at their word.

Quote from: Zelen on July 13, 2021, 02:48:13 AM
For the record, I fully support death threats against people who promote sexual violence against children.

If you are taking them at their word, then what they intend to do is convert children into being "tolerant and fair", and "teach them not to hate". That's what the lyrics of the song actually say. It sounds like you're *not* taking them at their word, and instead reading something other than the literal meaning into the song.

It is absolutely a reference and parody of conservative allegations that gay people are all child molesters, but the intent of the song is to deny those allegations and push a different message instead. One can say it is in bad taste, but the literal meaning of the words spoken is clear.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 02, 2021, 10:35:49 AM
Some days, you wonder if we really are turning the corner. Other days you want to see stuff like this because only the truly deluded accept it.

https://mynorthwest.com/3116002/rantz-wsu-farmers-markets-food-charity-white-supremacy/

Evidently, agriculture and food charity are now 'white'.

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 02:30:25 PM

Quote from: 3catcircus on November 30, 2021, 02:07:08 PM

Quote from: Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM
From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

But it wasn't that that were out for him for being a pedo - the current crop of leftists support it so long as it's lumped into the current "LGBT$_&* abbreviation salad" and given a cutesy moniker.

Kevin Spacey was accused of same-sex pedophilia, and it seems to me he was cancelled just as thoroughly as straight pedophiles.

The old guard at Hollywood has for over a century covered up lots of scandals including pedophilia - with figures like Harvey Weinstein and Jeffrey Epstein and their many predecessors. However, I don't see the current crop of leftists supporting this for same-sex cases like Spacey. Those who I know have been enthusiastic in the movement against Spacey just as much as figures like Weinstein and Epstein.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on December 07, 2021, 05:23:17 PM

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 02:30:25 PM
Kevin Spacey was accused of same-sex pedophilia, and it seems to me he was cancelled just as thoroughly as straight pedophiles.

The old guard at Hollywood has for over a century covered up lots of scandals including pedophilia - with figures like Harvey Weinstein and Jeffrey Epstein and their many predecessors. However, I don't see the current crop of leftists supporting this for same-sex cases like Spacey. Those who I know have been enthusiastic in the movement against Spacey just as much as figures like Weinstein and Epstein.

Where then is or was the rage against Spacey? He "came out" as gay and the news shifted to how brave he was.

Quote from: jhkim on December 07, 2021, 06:12:36 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on December 07, 2021, 05:23:17 PM

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 02:30:25 PM
Kevin Spacey was accused of same-sex pedophilia, and it seems to me he was cancelled just as thoroughly as straight pedophiles.

The old guard at Hollywood has for over a century covered up lots of scandals including pedophilia - with figures like Harvey Weinstein and Jeffrey Epstein and their many predecessors. However, I don't see the current crop of leftists supporting this for same-sex cases like Spacey. Those who I know have been enthusiastic in the movement against Spacey just as much as figures like Weinstein and Epstein.

Where then is or was the rage against Spacey? He "came out" as gay and the news shifted to how brave he was.

Spacey came out on the same day as the accusations (Oct 29, 2017). After this, his Gore Vidal biopic with Netflix was cancelled, and he was dropped from House of Cards and all other Netflix projects. His already-shot role in "All the Money in the World" was cut and re-shot with Christopher Plummer in his former role. The International Academy of Television Arts and Sciences rescinded his International Emmy Founders Award. His publicist Staci Wolfe and talent agency Creative Artists Agency dropped him. His UK-based non-profit the Kevin Spacey Foundation was closed. Here's a timeline:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/rise-fall-kevin-spacey-timeline-sexual-assault-allegations/story?id=63420983

As far as I can see, his only project in the 4 years since the scandal has been a small part in an Italian movie. From what I've seen, it's fair to say that he was cancelled. If you have any links that contradicts this, I'd be interested.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on December 07, 2021, 06:22:13 PM

Quote from: jhkim on December 07, 2021, 06:12:36 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on December 07, 2021, 05:23:17 PM

Quote from: jhkim on November 30, 2021, 02:30:25 PM
Kevin Spacey was accused of same-sex pedophilia, and it seems to me he was cancelled just as thoroughly as straight pedophiles.

The old guard at Hollywood has for over a century covered up lots of scandals including pedophilia - with figures like Harvey Weinstein and Jeffrey Epstein and their many predecessors. However, I don't see the current crop of leftists supporting this for same-sex cases like Spacey. Those who I know have been enthusiastic in the movement against Spacey just as much as figures like Weinstein and Epstein.

Where then is or was the rage against Spacey? He "came out" as gay and the news shifted to how brave he was.

Spacey came out on the same day as the accusations (Oct 29, 2017). After this, his Gore Vidal biopic with Netflix was cancelled, and he was dropped from House of Cards and all other Netflix projects. His already-shot role in "All the Money in the World" was cut and re-shot with Christopher Plummer in his former role. The International Academy of Television Arts and Sciences rescinded his International Emmy Founders Award. His publicist Staci Wolfe and talent agency Creative Artists Agency dropped him. His UK-based non-profit the Kevin Spacey Foundation was closed. Here's a timeline:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/rise-fall-kevin-spacey-timeline-sexual-assault-allegations/story?id=63420983

As far as I can see, his only project in the 4 years since the scandal has been a small part in an Italian movie. From what I've seen, it's fair to say that he was cancelled. If you have any links that contradicts this, I'd be interested.

So he got the same treatment as those who got metooed for making a deal with grown ass women for sex in exchange of fame?

After raping minors? Where are the calls to put him in prison? Because I sure as fuck saw lots of that for the metoo movement.

And you don't adress the rest of my post, maybe because you know you can't argue against facts?

Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 08, 2021, 08:16:21 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on December 07, 2021, 06:22:13 PM

Quote from: jhkim on December 07, 2021, 06:12:36 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on December 07, 2021, 05:23:17 PM
Where then is or was the rage against Spacey? He "came out" as gay and the news shifted to how brave he was.

Spacey came out on the same day as the accusations (Oct 29, 2017). After this, his Gore Vidal biopic with Netflix was cancelled, and he was dropped from House of Cards and all other Netflix projects. His already-shot role in "All the Money in the World" was cut and re-shot with Christopher Plummer in his former role. The International Academy of Television Arts and Sciences rescinded his International Emmy Founders Award. His publicist Staci Wolfe and talent agency Creative Artists Agency dropped him. His UK-based non-profit the Kevin Spacey Foundation was closed. Here's a timeline:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/rise-fall-kevin-spacey-timeline-sexual-assault-allegations/story?id=63420983

As far as I can see, his only project in the 4 years since the scandal has been a small part in an Italian movie. From what I've seen, it's fair to say that he was cancelled. If you have any links that contradicts this, I'd be interested.

So he got the same treatment as those who got metooed for making a deal with grown ass women for sex in exchange of fame?

After raping minors? Where are the calls to put him in prison? Because I sure as fuck saw lots of that for the metoo movement.

And you don't adress the rest of my post, maybe because you know you can't argue against facts?

Tsk, Geeky, the problem isn't that Spacey was raping minors. Hollyweird has no problem with that.

The problem was that he got caught. So they HAD to jettison him.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 10, 2021, 08:12:06 AM
*sad trombones*

https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/12/chicago-jury-reaches-verdict-in-jussie-smollett-for-alleged-fake-hate-crime/

Jussie Smollett gets convicted on five out of six counts of spinning his bullshit hate crime hoax to the CPD. Not sure how he skated on count 6, but oh well.

LOL.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 10, 2021, 08:12:06 AM
*sad trombones*

https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/12/chicago-jury-reaches-verdict-in-jussie-smollett-for-alleged-fake-hate-crime/

Jussie Smollett gets convicted on five out of six counts of spinning his bullshit hate crime hoax to the CPD. Not sure how he skated on count 6, but oh well.

LOL.

Quote from: kreegan on December 10, 2021, 10:20:34 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 10, 2021, 08:12:06 AM
*sad trombones*

https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/12/chicago-jury-reaches-verdict-in-jussie-smollett-for-alleged-fake-hate-crime/

Jussie Smollett gets convicted on five out of six counts of spinning his bullshit hate crime hoax to the CPD. Not sure how he skated on count 6, but oh well.

LOL.

Count 6 was technically true, since he was a victim of battery, just it was battery he both requested and paid for.

Quote from: kreegan on December 10, 2021, 10:20:34 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on December 10, 2021, 08:12:06 AM
*sad trombones*

https://legalinsurrection.com/2021/12/chicago-jury-reaches-verdict-in-jussie-smollett-for-alleged-fake-hate-crime/

Jussie Smollett gets convicted on five out of six counts of spinning his bullshit hate crime hoax to the CPD. Not sure how he skated on count 6, but oh well.

LOL.

Count 6 was technically true, since he was a victim of battery, just it was battery he both requested and paid for.

Quote from: Trond on December 21, 2021, 11:57:33 PM
Also a fairly accurate representation of a woke takeover  ;D

(https://i.redd.it/2gsx6cz4lx681.jpg)

QuoteYes, you'll definitely find leftists who are strongly opposed to any child molestation etc. Also check out several videos by Shoe0nhead (a Bernie supporter) for instance.

QuoteBut it wasn't that that were out for him for being a pedo

QuoteI think it is nice we can still seem to all agree "Pedos bad", but I have a feeling all the shifting will eventually lead to a more direct course to make society more accepting of pedos.

QuoteI remember people clapping for him in absentia during the Oscars, even when his abuse case was well known. Later I assume he was considered toxic again. Rightly so because that thing was creepy as hell.

QuoteChild marriage is still legal in much of the US TODAY. Only six states have a total ban on all underage marriages (New Jersey, Delaware, Pennsylvania, Minnesota, Rhode Island, and New York). This is not a rare thing, thousands of perfectly legal marriages of children to adults happen every year in the US.

6 twelve year-olds were legally married between 2000 and 2015.

QuoteWhere then is or was the rage against Spacey? He "came out" as gay and the news shifted to how brave he was.

QuoteAfter raping minors? Where are the calls to put him in prison? Because I sure as fuck saw lots of that for the metoo movement.

QuoteRoman Polanski's work in cinema will be remembered, studied and revered for generations. The woke mobs will be mocked and forgotten, and hopefully beaten with crowbars.

Quote from: thomden on January 02, 2022, 11:11:58 PM
Larry Fink (CEO of BlackRock) has been funding the Woke messaging coming out of corporations for years now. A fascinating reveal by Felix Rex:

Quote from: Trond on January 04, 2022, 11:22:54 AM

Quote from: thomden on January 02, 2022, 11:11:58 PM
Larry Fink (CEO of BlackRock) has been funding the Woke messaging coming out of corporations for years now. A fascinating reveal by Felix Rex:

Pretty interesting, but you also have to look at a guy like Larry Fink and wonder; how did someone like this get woke in the first place? He didn't become a billionaire by being an idealist all the way.  I think people like this basically read the room; they see what's going on and take on the political leanings of the day (Tolstoy described this very well as someone takes on whatever opinions are in vogue just like they would change their fashion style the same way).

Quote from: Redwanderer on January 05, 2022, 03:45:52 PMJust what kind of total losers does the 92% have to be to keep losing to the 8% losers?

Quote from: Stephen Tannhauser on January 06, 2022, 04:11:14 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on January 05, 2022, 03:45:52 PMJust what kind of total losers does the 92% have to be to keep losing to the 8% losers?

When one side of a conflict is far more invested in the subject matter than the other, weight of numbers becomes far less relevant than one might expect. Nassim Nicholas Taleb's article "The Most Intolerant Wins (http://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15)" is an excellent examination of how this process works.

For myself I have always taken a bleak sort of comfort in a popular saying of Glenn "InstaPundit" Reynolds: "That which can't go on forever, won't."  Wokism has always depended on a fresh supply of stoked outrage, and I see definite signs of burnout in the public appetite for that sentiment.

Quote from: Shasarak on January 07, 2022, 12:15:47 AM

Quote from: Stephen Tannhauser on January 06, 2022, 04:11:14 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on January 05, 2022, 03:45:52 PMJust what kind of total losers does the 92% have to be to keep losing to the 8% losers?

When one side of a conflict is far more invested in the subject matter than the other, weight of numbers becomes far less relevant than one might expect. Nassim Nicholas Taleb's article "The Most Intolerant Wins (http://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15)" is an excellent examination of how this process works.

For myself I have always taken a bleak sort of comfort in a popular saying of Glenn "InstaPundit" Reynolds: "That which can't go on forever, won't."  Wokism has always depended on a fresh supply of stoked outrage, and I see definite signs of burnout in the public appetite for that sentiment.

So we may have to rely on the Muslims to save us from the Woke.

But then we will need the CCP to save us from the Muslims.

Things could get messy before the end.

Quote from: Redwanderer on January 05, 2022, 03:45:52 PM
I really hate to say this, but how can people say any corner is being turned? I heard this back in 2014 and 2016 and now it's worse.

Quote from: Shasarak on January 07, 2022, 12:41:19 AM

Quote from: Shasarak on January 07, 2022, 12:15:47 AM

Quote from: Stephen Tannhauser on January 06, 2022, 04:11:14 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on January 05, 2022, 03:45:52 PMJust what kind of total losers does the 92% have to be to keep losing to the 8% losers?

When one side of a conflict is far more invested in the subject matter than the other, weight of numbers becomes far less relevant than one might expect. Nassim Nicholas Taleb's article "The Most Intolerant Wins (http://medium.com/incerto/the-most-intolerant-wins-the-dictatorship-of-the-small-minority-3f1f83ce4e15)" is an excellent examination of how this process works.

For myself I have always taken a bleak sort of comfort in a popular saying of Glenn "InstaPundit" Reynolds: "That which can't go on forever, won't."  Wokism has always depended on a fresh supply of stoked outrage, and I see definite signs of burnout in the public appetite for that sentiment.

So we may have to rely on the Muslims to save us from the Woke.

But then we will need the CCP to save us from the Muslims.

Things could get messy before the end.

Come to think of it, that article also explains why DnD is the default RPG - there is always that one person that does not want to play the exotic new RPG so the whole group defaults to the standard.

Quote from: Trond on January 06, 2022, 08:58:17 AM
It's not 8% vs 92%. It's very roughly 8% supported by 42% useful idiots* who think that the 8% "mean well" even when they sound crazy, vs 50%.

*also some clever opportunists

Quote from: 3catcircus on January 08, 2022, 03:15:50 PM

Quote from: Trond on January 06, 2022, 08:58:17 AM
It's not 8% vs 92%. It's very roughly 8% supported by 42% useful idiots* who think that the 8% "mean well" even when they sound crazy, vs 50%.

*also some clever opportunists

I would even go so far as to say that the woke and non-woke activism is only a thing in large urban areas and on college campuses and is only amplified because of social media.  Most people only care once it affects them directly - a Democrat who is a shrimper in Louisiana and a Republican who is a plumber in Nebraska just want to be left alone.

QuoteThat's the essence of what I find disturbing about some of the stuff on the left. Does this have anything to do with making life better for anyone, or is this just a game? Is this just about making you feel superior?

Quote from: Trond on January 29, 2022, 07:19:46 PM
Is this a sign?

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/sean-penn-criticizes-men-feminized-1235166106/

Probably not....but I think I can hear the sound of axes grinding  ;D

Quote from: KingCheops on January 29, 2022, 08:53:32 PM

Well given that he kidnapped Madonna and abused her he's kind of the epitome of "toxic masculinity" so I wouldn't necessarily take his word on gender.

Quote from: KingCheops on January 29, 2022, 08:53:32 PM

Quote from: Trond on January 29, 2022, 07:19:46 PM
Is this a sign?

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/sean-penn-criticizes-men-feminized-1235166106/

Probably not....but I think I can hear the sound of axes grinding  ;D

Well given that he kidnapped Madonna and abused her he's kind of the epitome of "toxic masculinity" so I wouldn't necessarily take his word on gender.

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

Quote from: Fheredin on January 31, 2022, 12:33:54 PM
I think that Wokeness will break quite abruptly. Metaphorically, speaking, it's a fever of absurdist ideas, driven by people who intentionally play offense as much as possible because they are too afraid of each other to be creative, and so cannot constructively build; only destroy.

When things start going to pot--as they will when COVID's economic aftershocks catch up with us--all that will really matter is the ability to build. There will be very few things left to tear down. Economics trumps ideology every time.

Quote from: 3catcircus on January 31, 2022, 01:41:24 PM

Quote from: Fheredin on January 31, 2022, 12:33:54 PM
I think that Wokeness will break quite abruptly. Metaphorically, speaking, it's a fever of absurdist ideas, driven by people who intentionally play offense as much as possible because they are too afraid of each other to be creative, and so cannot constructively build; only destroy.

When things start going to pot--as they will when COVID's economic aftershocks catch up with us--all that will really matter is the ability to build. There will be very few things left to tear down. Economics trumps ideology every time.

The problem is that as long as there are people or organizations willing to entertain their mental illness and take them seriously, there will continue to be people who continue to exploit the wokeness grift.  It's not enough to ignore their false claims of racism or sexism or transphobia or homophobia - you need to publicly embarrass them.  Whether you like him or not, Dave Portnoy's response to the claims of abuse by former sex partners being promoted by Business Insider was to sue BI *and* publicly post the texts of his accusers that clearly illustrated that they not only liked and wanted rough sex, they came back for second helpings of it.  That direct action response to false claims is exactly what should be done in response to every woke claim.  Never issue a groveling apology for something that someone else is offended by and always go on the offensive.  Actual wrong-doing would result in criminal charges, not blackmail/extortion attempts.  Because that's what most of these woke grievances are - extortion.

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

On the other hand, "woke" is and has always been stupid when taken out of the context of Black culture. It's a phrase coined by black folks in the South to talk about other folks (usually white but occasionally black or other race) and how well they understand what black folks go through on a daily basis. If anyone who passes the paper bag test is talking about wokeness in any form, I feel completely free to ignore them as uninformed, whether they are on the left or the right side of the spectrum.

Quote from: Fheredin on January 31, 2022, 12:33:54 PMEconomics trumps ideology every time.

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 06:30:35 PM

Quote from: ScytheSong on July 02, 2021, 12:55:06 AM
So Critical Race Theory is, at it's base, looking at the legal history of the United States of America and seeing how much of our laws were designed to keep WASP men in power, and particularly to keep black folks in line beneath the WASPs. It's hard to argue that redlining didn't happen, or that 'sundown' towns didn't exist, or that several hundred people were not murdered in Tulsa, and a couple thousand more were not burned out of their homes. In order to argue against Critical Race Theory, you have to ignore all of the Jim Crow laws and all of the times when 'driving while black' got someone tossed in jail.

On the other hand, "woke" is and has always been stupid when taken out of the context of Black culture. It's a phrase coined by black folks in the South to talk about other folks (usually white but occasionally black or other race) and how well they understand what black folks go through on a daily basis. If anyone who passes the paper bag test is talking about wokeness in any form, I feel completely free to ignore them as uninformed, whether they are on the left or the right side of the spectrum.

American racism is vastly exaggerated. My wife is obviously "of color"we have traveled together throughout much of the country and we can't tell the difference. I'd say that even the past troubles are being exaggerated even though some truly horrifying things did happen. It's turned into a never-ending repetition of the same old stories (but always tweaked just a little, to make it seem even worse and even more one-sided than it actually was, like Tulsa), and there's no end in sight. Such bad historical events should of course be remembered, but not turned into some sort of religious victimhood ritual. You should check out some of John McWhorter's interviews and writings.

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 04:14:20 PM
Because I've seen over and over again how even mild criticism of certain groups gets one banned faster than than a non-woke from rpg.net, that's why. By that one's OWN PEOPLE! Gaaah, maybe I'll tell you about my waking up moment during a hangover one of these days.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 04:19:11 PM
  Well, I am not criticizing any group here, only a specific organization.  And much like SPLC, BLM, the ADL these days seems to be pretty much hijacked by people with an extreme left agenda on many positions.  This is critical from my perspective, as I think extreme left positions are generally harmful, but I also do not think any of those organizations really represent any group anywhere any more.  I think they are there to generate revenue for the people working in them.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 04:22:35 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 04:19:11 PM
  Well, I am not criticizing any group here, only a specific organization.  And much like SPLC, BLM, the ADL these days seems to be pretty much hijacked by people with an extreme left agenda on many positions.  This is critical from my perspective, as I think extreme left positions are generally harmful, but I also do not think any of those organizations really represent any group anywhere any more.  I think they are there to generate revenue for the people working in them.

All right, do you hear those groups speaking out against the extremists?

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 04:41:34 PM
I'll warn you again, youre all stomping through a ban minefield here.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 04:41:34 PM
I'll warn you again, youre all stomping through a ban minefield here.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 05:00:13 PM
  I do not watch any TV, so I will take your word for it.  I still do not quite get where the ban minefield is.  I guess I am just missing the hidden message.

Quote from: DocJones on February 01, 2022, 08:23:13 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

The ADL has went the way of the ACLU some time ago. 
ADL Hires Jewish Jew-Hater as Director for Jewish Outreach (https://www.jewishpress.com/indepth/columns/daniel-greenfield/adl-hires-jewish-jew-hater-as-director-for-jewish-outreach/2022/02/01/)

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:26:22 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 05:00:13 PM
  I do not watch any TV, so I will take your word for it.  I still do not quite get where the ban minefield is.  I guess I am just missing the hidden message.

He thinks this site is like TBP or any other leftist run site. He's wrong.

Quote from: RandyB on February 01, 2022, 10:01:59 PM
His concern is duly noted. After all, he created a new account here just to express his concern.

Quote from: ThatChrisGuy on February 01, 2022, 10:11:00 PM

Quote from: RandyB on February 01, 2022, 10:01:59 PM
His concern is duly noted. After all, he created a new account here just to express his concern.

And to say "92%" an awful lot.  I don't know what that's alluding to but I suspect it's not benign.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 04:41:34 PM
Any of them. Look, just flipping through the cursed channels on free tv all I see are ads and programs about evil whites and racism.

So why don't the people those groups- ALL OF THEM- are supposed to speak for ever speak up loud and clear about them being extremists?

I'll warn you again, youre all stomping through a ban minefield here.

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on February 02, 2022, 04:18:58 PM
Considering the sheer amount of ideological capture, I don't think the woke will be going away any time soon no matter how much public attitude turns against them.

Quote from: Pat on February 02, 2022, 04:38:56 PM

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on February 02, 2022, 04:18:58 PM
Considering the sheer amount of ideological capture, I don't think the woke will be going away any time soon no matter how much public attitude turns against them.

We've turned the corner! They only control the entire education establishment, the deep state bureaucracy, the Washington establishment, the military, big tech, the Fortune 500, and the last two generations of kids! They're on the ropes!

Quote from: oggsmash on February 02, 2022, 06:23:01 PM
  Sort of made me LOL to see Whoopi Goldberg make the point for me on this whole thing with the holocaust and how the ADL would view the perspective she presented (after their change of the definition of racism).

Quote from: oggsmash on February 02, 2022, 06:23:01 PM
  Sort of made me LOL to see Whoopi Goldberg make the point for me on this whole thing with the holocaust and how the ADL would view the perspective she presented (after their change of the definition of racism).

Quote from: Trond on February 03, 2022, 09:57:07 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 02, 2022, 06:23:01 PM
  Sort of made me LOL to see Whoopi Goldberg make the point for me on this whole thing with the holocaust and how the ADL would view the perspective she presented (after their change of the definition of racism).

The ADL changed their definition back to a more sensible one again due to that whole situation. Their behavior does make them look pretty pathetic on the whole.

Quote from: Shasarak on February 02, 2022, 10:27:10 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 02, 2022, 06:23:01 PM
  Sort of made me LOL to see Whoopi Goldberg make the point for me on this whole thing with the holocaust and how the ADL would view the perspective she presented (after their change of the definition of racism).

I must admit that I never had Whoopi running defense for Nazis on my 2022 bingo card.

Quote from: RandyB on February 01, 2022, 10:01:59 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:26:22 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 05:00:13 PM
  I do not watch any TV, so I will take your word for it.  I still do not quite get where the ban minefield is.  I guess I am just missing the hidden message.

He thinks this site is like TBP or any other leftist run site. He's wrong.

His concern is duly noted. After all, he created a new account here just to express his concern.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 04:19:11 PM
  Well, I am not criticizing any group here, only a specific organization.  And much like SPLC, BLM, the ADL these days seems to be pretty much hijacked by people with an extreme left agenda on many positions.  This is critical from my perspective, as I think extreme left positions are generally harmful, but I also do not think any of those organizations really represent any group anywhere any more.  I think they are there to generate revenue for the people working in them.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:25:00 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Few things will get you banned here:

Posting politics unrelated to gamming anywhere else but this part of the forum.

Spouting ACTUAL white supremacist spiels

Spouting ACTUAL anti-semitism

From what I've seen criticizing anything/anyone is valid and won't even earn you a warning.

This place is owned by an actual libertarian/conservative

The mods either share his political views or at least his love for free speech.

Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale.

And you'll find a few non-white people here that do agree that seems to be the case. I for example.

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 16, 2022, 09:24:27 PM
The ADL actually really hates Jews.

https://www.jns.org/opinion/the-adls-new-jewish-outreach-director-hates-jews/ (https://www.jns.org/opinion/the-adls-new-jewish-outreach-director-hates-jews/)

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:32:34 PM
I'll try to keep this as simple as possible for anyone who still doesn't get it yet. What the hell is WRONG with the 92%!?

Quote from: oggsmash on February 16, 2022, 09:31:15 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 16, 2022, 09:24:27 PM
The ADL actually really hates Jews.

https://www.jns.org/opinion/the-adls-new-jewish-outreach-director-hates-jews/ (https://www.jns.org/opinion/the-adls-new-jewish-outreach-director-hates-jews/)

  I do not think the ADL hates Jews.  I do think they may have screwed the pooch letting some of the nutty leftists in the door forgetting they only exist to tear down and reform institutions in their own image.  And the ADL is very left on policies in the USA, like immigration. But suddenly extremely right wing from the leftist lens regarding immigration for Israel. That can not be tolerated by the woke.   So I think it is early to say the ADL hates Jews...but if they keep recruiting people like that lady, they will make the full turn in no time.

Quote from: Trond on February 17, 2022, 12:50:38 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 16, 2022, 09:31:15 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on February 16, 2022, 09:24:27 PM
The ADL actually really hates Jews.

https://www.jns.org/opinion/the-adls-new-jewish-outreach-director-hates-jews/ (https://www.jns.org/opinion/the-adls-new-jewish-outreach-director-hates-jews/)

  I do not think the ADL hates Jews.  I do think they may have screwed the pooch letting some of the nutty leftists in the door forgetting they only exist to tear down and reform institutions in their own image.  And the ADL is very left on policies in the USA, like immigration. But suddenly extremely right wing from the leftist lens regarding immigration for Israel. That can not be tolerated by the woke.   So I think it is early to say the ADL hates Jews...but if they keep recruiting people like that lady, they will make the full turn in no time.

I agree that hate is a strong word, but why would a Jewish organization use the definition of racism as they did recently? (i.e. racism is only by white people agains POC. The Whoopi Goldberg controversy apparently made them change it)

Quote from: Larry Correia
APPROACHING PEAK WOKE


I truly believe we are at or nearing Peak Woke.

The San Fransisco school board was just overwhelmingly voted to be recalled. Pundits are already blaming it on "secret conservatives". In San Fransisco. The bluest big city in America.

Across the nation regular normal people are done with Woke shit. They are done with Covid control freaks. They are done with incompetent petty tyranny. They are done with self proclaimed experts being constantly wrong but still handing down arbitrary commands.

That combo is going to make the upcoming mid terms the biggest blood bath election of the last hundred years.

Purple is gonna flip red. Blue is turning purple. 30 congressional dems have retired because they see more accurate polling than we do. Seats that are normally D+13 aren't safe.

The polls about how people identify have flipped in a manner that the establishment can't even sorta understand yet. Some do. Those are the proverbial rats fleeing the sinking ship.

Polls always oversample democrats, but even the ones that show D+7 have them being trounced. It won't be D+7. It's going to be R+ however many people said enough.

The progressive left has driven off many of the people who they always assumed would make up their "permanent demographic majority".

Democrats have infuriated independents.

Nobody expected New Jersey to be in play.

Nobody expected Virginia to flip and as the polls swung the left could do nothing but panic and do dumber and dumber stunts. I expect to see lots of tiki torches and fake hate crimes in the coming months.

Their figure head, Joe Biden, is despised by his enemies and pitied by his allies. He inspires no one. They have no wins. Nothing to run on. Nothing to point to.

If they were smart they would do an emergency course correction and abandon the control freaks, but they can't. The liberals abdicated. The moderates fled. The woke progs are steering the ship, and they are addicted to outrage. They only have one play in their playbook, which is scream about how everyone else is some kinda hatemonger.

Regular people just want their money to be worth something and their stores to not be empty and their schools to not be indoctrination centers.
While the woke running the left can only offer them increasingly batshit insane identity politics instead.
A reckoning is coming. The left is about to reap the whirlwind of their hubris.

Of course the GOP will flop and squish and squander this, unless these same angry voters won't allow them to.

The invertebrates like Mitt Romney will see the democrats take this generational loss and will want to "reach across the aisle" to help them back to their feet. They'll be "bipartisan". No. They lost because they deserved to lose because their ideas are evil and the middle has realized the left is actively destroying America. Crush them. Drive them from any position of leadership.

This loss needs to hurt. It needs to be a wake up call to the democrats who aren't insane leftists, however many of those may remain. The Woke must be cast down. Their philosophy is a cancer in the bones of our country.

The monied "educated" elite of the left have loved the Woke because they have been a useful club to beat their ideological enemies with. But once the Woke become a liability, they will be dismissed and forgotten. Just like the hippies were a great big deal until suddenly, they weren't. And they became a fringe joke.

That's a big if though, because I'm not sure how much the Venn diagrams of Woke and Elite overlap. So if democrats can't jettison Wokeness, then regular people will make sure they lose so damned bad they don't have a choice.

That's what's coming.

Pundits will blame it on Covid fatigue or racism or sexism or Russians or something else. But it's not. It's all tied together. It's a backlash against one giant overwhelming philosophy combining the federal leviathan, woke megacorps, and a mob of useful idiots into a bizarre pseudo religion. It is completely disconnected from reality, and rules with a very stupid fist. And regular people aren't ever allowed to question it or stand in its way.

All the stuff that's infuriating regular Americans is a result of that unholy abomination. Their jobs aren't safe. Their kids aren't safe. Nothing makes any sense anymore. They look around and discover they are living in clown world. When they express concern they are told to shut up, bigot, put your three masks back on and get back to serving me. How dare you question your moral and intellectual betters?

The political reckoning is coming soon. The cultural reckoning will take longer, but it's already happening. The left has owned every major cultural institution for a long time, the media, Hollywood, academia, publishing, and look how great all of those are doing. It is like minded, insufferable finger shaking scolds, all the way down.

But once a preference cascade begins, it won't stop. Voting is just the big obvious one, but as soon as enough shade holders in those various institutions decide they are tired of going broke to support a failing philosophy they'll dump it. And if they don't, competitors will crush them.

Because people are sick of this shit.

I'm actually really optimistic. I've been talking about this nefarious culture war for a long time, and I'm seeing an ever increasing number of regular folks catching on and realizing they've been getting scammed. I'm seeing more people who thought they were liberal realizing they got conned. I'm seeing more moderates realizing that moral equivalence is bullshit, because both sides suck, but at least one isn't actively trying to destroy our civilization.

On that last note, if anybody can screw this opportunity up, it's the republicans. Many of them are corrupt, lazy, cowards. But I'm even seeing a shift there, where more of them are saying enough of this fake civility, where the left can do whatever malicious thing it wants and we have to smile and take it. About damned time.

Expect the left to become increasingly desperate as their total control of every institution is threatened. Just look toward our neighbors to the north to see how petulant they can get when their power is endangered. They burn cities. Awesome. You get uppity, martial law.

Sure. They'll lie. They'll "fact checkers". The media companies that carry their water are getting crushed by Indy media, even with the big tech companies actively trying to silence them. CNN is getting its ass beat by Joe Rogan. Elon Musk accomplishes more with one cryptic tweet then a thousand New York Times OpEds. The strangle hold on media is over because the left shot their wad. They lied too much and now nobody believes them. Polls show more Americans trust gas station sushi than the media.

They will lie, cheat, and steal. That's just human nature. But don't go all doomer black pill that the left will automatically win. They want you to think that's inevitable. And if you are worried about cheating, Virginia showed us the way. Watchers everywhere and 500 lawyers waiting at a hotline perched like fucking falcons to swoop down the instant anything is weird. Get your shit together, GOP, and this won't be an issue.

In the meantime just keep talking. Keep telling the truth. Keep standing for what you believe in. And if you aren't doing that, start. You aren't alone. There are millions who are just as annoyed by this crap as you are.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 07:12:58 PM
  Seems the extremely woke, Trump Hating community outreach head over at Facebook got caught on video meeting up with a 13 year old boy at a hotel room for sex.  That is going to be uncomfortable to explain.

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 17, 2022, 08:06:13 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 07:12:58 PM
  Seems the extremely woke, Trump Hating community outreach head over at Facebook got caught on video meeting up with a 13 year old boy at a hotel room for sex.  That is going to be uncomfortable to explain.

Got a link?

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 09:34:59 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 17, 2022, 08:06:13 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 07:12:58 PM
  Seems the extremely woke, Trump Hating community outreach head over at Facebook got caught on video meeting up with a 13 year old boy at a hotel room for sex.  That is going to be uncomfortable to explain.

Got a link?

  https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/suvvl5/everyone_id_like_to_introduce_jeren_miles_repost/

  That is the video the people who busted him posted on reddit.  I think the quartering also covers this.  I think it is breaking/today's news.

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 17, 2022, 09:45:49 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 09:34:59 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 17, 2022, 08:06:13 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 07:12:58 PM
  Seems the extremely woke, Trump Hating community outreach head over at Facebook got caught on video meeting up with a 13 year old boy at a hotel room for sex.  That is going to be uncomfortable to explain.

Got a link?

  https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/suvvl5/everyone_id_like_to_introduce_jeren_miles_repost/

  That is the video the people who busted him posted on reddit.  I think the quartering also covers this.  I think it is breaking/today's news.

Video has already been pulled.

Link to where this all started apparently. Have not watched entire video, but I am assuming that it is NSFW.

https://netpredators.com/jeren-miles/

Quote from: Zelen on February 17, 2022, 10:07:52 PM
The only corner we're turning is from subterfuge to open warfare of hostile governments on their people.
The woke are useful idiots and will cheer it on.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 09:34:59 PM
  https://www.reddit.com/r/JoeRogan/comments/suvvl5/everyone_id_like_to_introduce_jeren_miles_repost/

  That is the video the people who busted him posted on reddit.  I think the quartering also covers this.  I think it is breaking/today's news.

QuoteMeta, the parent company of Facebook, has confirmed to TechCrunch that Jeren A. Miles, who had been a manager of global community development, is no longer employed by the company after a video went viral on YouTube, which was then reposted on Reddit and other sites, featuring him in a sting operation conducted by amateurs with the intent of catching paedophiles.

The two-hour video, posted by an amateur group called PCI Predator Catchers Indianapolis on its YouTube page, does not depict Miles caught in any sex act, nor admitting to any specific sex act, nor admitting to intending to carry out any sex act. And it is not clear what the legal ramifications of this will be, if any.

But it does feature two people questioning Miles, who in the course of the interrogation admits to having graphic and inappropriate communications with a 13-year-old boy. It's a damning enough exchange that Miles has subsequently deleted his social profiles on sites like Facebook and Twitter, and — whether he was fired or resigned voluntarily — Miles has left his role at Facebook over the matter.

"The seriousness of these allegations cannot be overstated. The individual is no longer employed with the company. We are actively investigating this situation and cannot provide further comment at this time," said a statement from a Meta spokesperson provided to us by Drew Pusateri.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:59:45 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:25:00 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Few things will get you banned here:

Posting politics unrelated to gamming anywhere else but this part of the forum.

Spouting ACTUAL white supremacist spiels

Spouting ACTUAL anti-semitism

From what I've seen criticizing anything/anyone is valid and won't even earn you a warning.

This place is owned by an actual libertarian/conservative

The mods either share his political views or at least his love for free speech.

Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale.

And you'll find a few non-white people here that do agree that seems to be the case. I for example.

And here 92% is why you keep losing to the 8% and why we're going to woke hell that'll make the hills of damnation look like Hawaii.

This line is about what? certain black and jewish groups bashing whites and calling for MASS MURDER of whites.

So what does this geekybugle guy go on about? No white supremist or anti jewish stuff.

Not "no supremist yammer of any kind", just white supremist and anti-jewish stuff in a line about jewish and black groups bashing whites!

"Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale."

Only as long as it's safe tough talk.

I swear, the 92% will cringe and say it's sorry when theyre being led to the gulag. Here's a question- if anyone joined here and said he was a member of those groups would he be banned for being part of hate groups? Yea, and I'll find a pot of gold left on my doorstep by friendly leprechauns after riding a rainbow to Ireland.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 19, 2022, 05:41:05 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:59:45 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:25:00 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Few things will get you banned here:

Posting politics unrelated to gamming anywhere else but this part of the forum.

Spouting ACTUAL white supremacist spiels

Spouting ACTUAL anti-semitism

From what I've seen criticizing anything/anyone is valid and won't even earn you a warning.

This place is owned by an actual libertarian/conservative

The mods either share his political views or at least his love for free speech.

Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale.

And you'll find a few non-white people here that do agree that seems to be the case. I for example.

And here 92% is why you keep losing to the 8% and why we're going to woke hell that'll make the hills of damnation look like Hawaii.

This line is about what? certain black and jewish groups bashing whites and calling for MASS MURDER of whites.

So what does this geekybugle guy go on about? No white supremist or anti jewish stuff.

Not "no supremist yammer of any kind", just white supremist and anti-jewish stuff in a line about jewish and black groups bashing whites!

"Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale."

Only as long as it's safe tough talk.

I swear, the 92% will cringe and say it's sorry when theyre being led to the gulag. Here's a question- if anyone joined here and said he was a member of those groups would he be banned for being part of hate groups? Yea, and I'll find a pot of gold left on my doorstep by friendly leprechauns after riding a rainbow to Ireland.

Care to clarify WHO exactly is going to ban me from here for something like criticizing the ADL, ACLU, Burn Loot Murder, etc?

Quote from: RandyB on February 19, 2022, 06:46:54 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 19, 2022, 05:41:05 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:59:45 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:25:00 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Few things will get you banned here:

Posting politics unrelated to gamming anywhere else but this part of the forum.

Spouting ACTUAL white supremacist spiels

Spouting ACTUAL anti-semitism

From what I've seen criticizing anything/anyone is valid and won't even earn you a warning.

This place is owned by an actual libertarian/conservative

The mods either share his political views or at least his love for free speech.

Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale.

And you'll find a few non-white people here that do agree that seems to be the case. I for example.

And here 92% is why you keep losing to the 8% and why we're going to woke hell that'll make the hills of damnation look like Hawaii.

This line is about what? certain black and jewish groups bashing whites and calling for MASS MURDER of whites.

So what does this geekybugle guy go on about? No white supremist or anti jewish stuff.

Not "no supremist yammer of any kind", just white supremist and anti-jewish stuff in a line about jewish and black groups bashing whites!

"Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale."

Only as long as it's safe tough talk.

I swear, the 92% will cringe and say it's sorry when theyre being led to the gulag. Here's a question- if anyone joined here and said he was a member of those groups would he be banned for being part of hate groups? Yea, and I'll find a pot of gold left on my doorstep by friendly leprechauns after riding a rainbow to Ireland.

Care to clarify WHO exactly is going to ban me from here for something like criticizing the ADL, ACLU, Burn Loot Murder, etc?

You don't understand. He's concerned. And we have to address his concerns. If that means changing our behavior here, well... he's concerned.

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

Quote from: oggsmash on February 22, 2022, 03:17:58 PM
It seems at least one home owner in Portland had enough of antifa protests.  Seems a few "protesters" who were armed F'd around and found out, leaving 5 shot and one dead.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 22, 2022, 03:25:49 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 22, 2022, 03:17:58 PM
It seems at least one home owner in Portland had enough of antifa protests.  Seems a few "protesters" who were armed F'd around and found out, leaving 5 shot and one dead.

And nothing of value was lost on that day.

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 22, 2022, 03:25:49 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 22, 2022, 03:17:58 PM
It seems at least one home owner in Portland had enough of antifa protests.  Seems a few "protesters" who were armed F'd around and found out, leaving 5 shot and one dead.

And nothing of value was lost on that day.

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 22, 2022, 04:14:34 PM

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

I'd like to hear what DriveThruRPG and D&D BEYOND have to say about throwing away their money to con artists.

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/drivethrurpg-supporting-blm/

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/dd-beyond-supporting-blm/

Quote from: 3catcircus on February 22, 2022, 07:09:49 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 22, 2022, 04:14:34 PM

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

I'd like to hear what DriveThruRPG and D&D BEYOND have to say about throwing away their money to con artists.

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/drivethrurpg-supporting-blm/

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/dd-beyond-supporting-blm/

Funny. When enworld posted a link to dtrpg donating to BLM, NAACP, and another org, I asked a very simple question of *which* BLM org then money was going and for denounced.  But, being correct and denounced seems to be the only way leftists know how to deal with those who speak the truth.

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 22, 2022, 07:32:25 PM

Quote from: 3catcircus on February 22, 2022, 07:09:49 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 22, 2022, 04:14:34 PM

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

I'd like to hear what DriveThruRPG and D&D BEYOND have to say about throwing away their money to con artists.

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/drivethrurpg-supporting-blm/

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/dd-beyond-supporting-blm/

Funny. When enworld posted a link to dtrpg donating to BLM, NAACP, and another org, I asked a very simple question of *which* BLM org then money was going and for denounced.  But, being correct and denounced seems to be the only way leftists know how to deal with those who speak the truth.

Not to be a Mistwell and defend ENWorld, but the NAACP and UNCF are both valid 501(c)3 charity organizations with long histories. Burn Loot Murder has been around for only 8 years and is a corporation without any charitable licensing - it is a political action group of a very questionable nature.

So if it involves giving money to BLM, fuck them in the ass with a hot curling iron.

Quote from: CharityWatch Executive Director, Laurie Styron[BLM is] like a giant ghost ship full of treasure drifting in the night with no captain, no discernible crew, and no clear direction.

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

Quote from: Pat on February 22, 2022, 08:08:59 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 22, 2022, 07:32:25 PM

Quote from: 3catcircus on February 22, 2022, 07:09:49 PM

Quote from: jeff37923 on February 22, 2022, 04:14:34 PM

Quote from: Trond on February 22, 2022, 01:46:47 PM
Do you guys know anyone who made donations to BLM? I'm just wondering what they feel about it now that there have been some revelations about their use of the cash.

(I also have to say that I'm continually surprised at people who could not see this coming. The way they pushed their supporter Bernie Sanders off the stage and started ranting about white people, the way they argued for theft, etc.)

I'd like to hear what DriveThruRPG and D&D BEYOND have to say about throwing away their money to con artists.

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/drivethrurpg-supporting-blm/

https://www.therpgsite.com/pen-paper-roleplaying-games-rpgs-discussion/dd-beyond-supporting-blm/

Funny. When enworld posted a link to dtrpg donating to BLM, NAACP, and another org, I asked a very simple question of *which* BLM org then money was going and for denounced.  But, being correct and denounced seems to be the only way leftists know how to deal with those who speak the truth.

Not to be a Mistwell and defend ENWorld, but the NAACP and UNCF are both valid 501(c)3 charity organizations with long histories. Burn Loot Murder has been around for only 8 years and is a corporation without any charitable licensing - it is a political action group of a very questionable nature.

So if it involves giving money to BLM, fuck them in the ass with a hot curling iron.

BLM did receive 501(c)(3) status from the IRS in December 2020, and at that point no longer had to rely on the 501(c)(3) status of its sponsors, Thousands Currents and Tides. But it's been charged as out of compliance, didn't file tax reports in 2020, lists a false address, nobody knows who's the executive officer, legal action has been started by multiple states, and on and on and on. Here's a good quote:

Quote from: CharityWatch Executive Director, Laurie Styron[BLM is] like a giant ghost ship full of treasure drifting in the night with no captain, no discernible crew, and no clear direction.

https://www.charitywatch.org/about-charitywatch/in-the-news

Quote from: Spinachcat on February 22, 2022, 10:23:09 PM
Wokeness will not end until the woke are ended.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 19, 2022, 10:17:17 PM

Quote from: RandyB on February 19, 2022, 06:46:54 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 19, 2022, 05:41:05 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:59:45 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on February 01, 2022, 08:25:00 PM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 01, 2022, 03:24:05 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 01, 2022, 08:24:31 AM

Quote from: Trond on January 31, 2022, 10:54:10 AM
So The Anti Defamation League is now defining racism as being only by white people against people of color. But doesn't that exclude a lot of what happened during the holocaust?

https://www.adl.org/racism

  Well, I think the ADL feels its a bit early to simply say their true position, that they hate white people.  It also seems the ADL does not feel jews, regardless of skin color, are white.  So no, it does not exclude a thing I am sure.

If I were you people I'd abandon this line FAST. It's ban bait as surely as it rains in Ireland.

Few things will get you banned here:

Posting politics unrelated to gamming anywhere else but this part of the forum.

Spouting ACTUAL white supremacist spiels

Spouting ACTUAL anti-semitism

From what I've seen criticizing anything/anyone is valid and won't even earn you a warning.

This place is owned by an actual libertarian/conservative

The mods either share his political views or at least his love for free speech.

Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale.

And you'll find a few non-white people here that do agree that seems to be the case. I for example.

And here 92% is why you keep losing to the 8% and why we're going to woke hell that'll make the hills of damnation look like Hawaii.

This line is about what? certain black and jewish groups bashing whites and calling for MASS MURDER of whites.

So what does this geekybugle guy go on about? No white supremist or anti jewish stuff.

Not "no supremist yammer of any kind", just white supremist and anti-jewish stuff in a line about jewish and black groups bashing whites!

"Saying that those ONGs/groups hate white people doesn't even register in the richter scale."

Only as long as it's safe tough talk.

I swear, the 92% will cringe and say it's sorry when theyre being led to the gulag. Here's a question- if anyone joined here and said he was a member of those groups would he be banned for being part of hate groups? Yea, and I'll find a pot of gold left on my doorstep by friendly leprechauns after riding a rainbow to Ireland.

Care to clarify WHO exactly is going to ban me from here for something like criticizing the ADL, ACLU, Burn Loot Murder, etc?

You don't understand. He's concerned. And we have to address his concerns. If that means changing our behavior here, well... he's concerned.

His concern has been dully noted, even if he doesn't always makes ANY sense.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 07:12:58 PM
  Seems the extremely woke, Trump Hating community outreach head over at Facebook got caught on video meeting up with a 13 year old boy at a hotel room for sex.  That is going to be uncomfortable to explain.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 28, 2022, 03:20:21 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 17, 2022, 07:12:58 PM
  Seems the extremely woke, Trump Hating community outreach head over at Facebook got caught on video meeting up with a 13 year old boy at a hotel room for sex.  That is going to be uncomfortable to explain.

Won't matter. People were finally getting word of kiddie sex in Hollywood- calling Epstein Island- but they cooked up that metoo crap and sure as hell people forgot about it. The 92% still make the bastard diddlers rich by paying for cable and seeing movies. Except for suing the Boy Scouts and getting money nobody is exactly complaining about how that happened by letting homos in as scout masters, think that wasn't planned?

Over in the UK nobody wanted to talk about little girls being diddled by migrant "grooming gangs" (damned child molesters). It was blamed on "asians" because the media and stinking authorities know when you say asian people think japanese, chinese, korean, something like that, they ain't thinking muslims from Pakistan. Hell one guy who did try to get attention to it ended up in jail!

So why the hell would this hurt the woke?

Quote from: DocJones on February 17, 2022, 09:31:09 AM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:32:34 PM
I'll try to keep this as simple as possible for anyone who still doesn't get it yet. What the hell is WRONG with the 92%!?

You are way off on your figures.  It's actually 87.35%.  And 57.48% of the 87.35% will not put up with the bullshit of the 12.65%. 
That makes 50.20% who are mad as hell and are not going to take it any more. 
Which way way higher than the 3% some far right groups claim it took to win the American Revolutionary war.

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 28, 2022, 03:34:30 PM

Quote from: DocJones on February 17, 2022, 09:31:09 AM

Quote from: Redwanderer on February 16, 2022, 03:32:34 PM
I'll try to keep this as simple as possible for anyone who still doesn't get it yet. What the hell is WRONG with the 92%!?

You are way off on your figures.  It's actually 87.35%.  And 57.48% of the 87.35% will not put up with the bullshit of the 12.65%. 
That makes 50.20% who are mad as hell and are not going to take it any more. 
Which way way higher than the 3% some far right groups claim it took to win the American Revolutionary war.

1- I'm going by Pundit's videos. Because why not. He's supposed to be running this place.

2- Sure, sure, yeah sure your 50.20 is mad as hell and won't take it any more. Sure. Hey there's that rainbow! Been hearing that for years. Hey guess what? Last year they BANNED BOOKS BY DR. SUESS and saying orcs are evil is racist! Groups like the ADL saying only whites can be racist and BLM saying kill whitey out in the open AND GETTING AWAY WITH IT. Your 50.25% been taking it over and over and still are.

In places like California you might as well not bother voting because if it goes the wrong way they "find" more votes until it goes the way the left wants. Notice how now Biden got in those Russians were nowhere around in 2016? If Trump got in again what do you think the media- owned by the woke- would be crying on about?

And even if we go by your figures the mad as hell types still really outnumber the 12.65% losers but are still losing more and more to them. People who say anything else are like that king from "Erik the Viking" when his island was sinking.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 28, 2022, 04:29:40 PM
It honestly makes you look a little like you joined the forum from an office in an FBI building.

Quote from: Shasarak on February 28, 2022, 04:43:09 PM

Quote from: oggsmash on February 28, 2022, 04:29:40 PM
It honestly makes you look a little like you joined the forum from an office in an FBI building.

If that is true then I have some autistic ideas regarding my government that could be turned into reality with appropriate funding.

In cash please.

Quote from: oggsmash on February 28, 2022, 04:29:40 PM
    Message me to make the point you want to make.  I do not understand where you are on this, and how you feel shaking a fist at the clouds changes it.  It honestly makes you look a little like you joined the forum from an office in an FBI building.

Quote from: Redwanderer on March 17, 2022, 06:33:23 PM
And here we go.


Look, I'll take a chance riverdancing in hobnail boots through the ban minefield like Lord of the Dunce so maybe the 92% learns something and finally starts figuring out why they've always been hopeless losers to the 8% losers. Maybe tomorrow morning I'll find a pot of gold left by friendly leprechauns. Hard to say what's more likely. We'll also see just how much free speech is really allowed here or if it's rpg.net blarney, watch for that stupid line through my name.

The biggest problem is the 92%s obeying to what the 8% wants. The 8% draws lines saying "don't say this don't do that" pushing the 92% closer and closer to the edge of the cliff and the 92% obeys when it's not busying itself pushing each other off first. The 8% tells the 92% to fight polite and clean while the 8% can fight dirty as all hell. HEY 92% YOU DON'T WIN FIGHTS DOING WHAT THE 8% TELLS YOU TO DO.
Ask about banning here and surely someone babbles about "anti semite white supremist whatever". We're talking about black and jewish bigot groups saying only white people can be racist and needing to be MURDERED so what does someone here go on about? White supremist anti semite of course- so other supremist talk is okey dokey fine? But did anyone complain about that except Yours Truly? Course not, we're talking about the 92% here.
Since the 92% ain't ever going to figure this out I'll keep saying it- you have a black group like BLM saying kill all the whites and jewish groups like the ADL and SPLC saying only whites can be racist. SO- if all the whites are killed no more racism giving BLM real good reason to say kill all whites! Gah, just a coincidence I'm sure, like always. Could it be maybe just maybe the problem today is- gasp!- jews and blacks hating on whites and not white supremist anti semitism? Ooooo I'm surely dancing on a ban mine for saying the obvious ain't I? HAH!
Since that post will never be approved here's some of it- government, schools, pop culture like dnd and media aren't going anywhere so SOMEONE'S got to run them. It's either you 92% or the 8% and those are the only two choices. If by some miracle the 92% is ever running things again maybe it'll remember what happened when they let the 8% get it's foot in the door by being told to be "reasonable" by the 8%- and how the 8% returned the favor by taking EVERYTHING? How bad the 92% got itself screwed over and over and over? If there is a next time it won't give ONE DAMN INCH?

Another problem is the 92% don't want to do anything about the 8%. Yeah you heard me right Pundit and you lot, none of you wants to do anything about them. What you want is SOMEONE ELSE to do something about them, problem is anyone who isn't a damned coward knows the 92% will NEVER back him up, they'll either do nothing or more likely push him off the cliff to suck up to the 8% when it comes down to it. So nothing gets done and if you think it's bad now just what the hell do you think it's going to be like twenty years from now? We're in this dungheap now because worthless cowards did nothing about it years ago and the same cowardice now surely means worse years from now.

Another problem is that "just extremists not the whole groups" blarney because you'll notice nobody in those groups is saying anything against them?
You have BLM saying kill white people. All right, how come the non-BLM black people're not saying anything against it? And I mean a whole lot of them, not just a few, loud for ALL to hear? But surprise! nothing.
With the SPLC and ADL it gets a wee bit more complicated so pay attention- those groups are jewish, right? And they're trashing white people.
Now here's the wee bit more complicated part- when you look at a list of who runs what in the media it's plain to anyone no matter how sloshed if there is anyone on this world can speak up against those "extremists" it's that group. Nobody can say anything against them or else. So NOBODY is in a better position to say something so why don't I hear that group protesting? But all you get from the media is leftism and stuff about white racism and white bashing. Guess what I DIDN'T see- anything about those "extremist" bigot groups bashing and even calling for white murder. Nothing. And the non-media types ain't exactly marching in the streets protesting any of it are they?

So just what the hell am I supposed to think? Imagine if powerful Irish groups started saying jews and blacks were rotten hooligans who should be killed and suppose the media and ad business was run by Irishmen and pushed nasty anti black and jewish stuff and the Irish never said anything about any of it, what do you think jews and blacks would think about the Irish? Got that part now? "Silence is violence" did some people suddenly forget that? Gah!
Some whites say anything bad about those groups- even if they ain't calling for murder- ALL whites better damn them to hell and back good and loud but when it's the other way around it's whites better just make excuses for them and damn themselves about white supremists. Ever notice those other groups never return the favor?


The 92% been dumbed down and scared so much the 8% already won but this really goes for white people because they can't even figure out people hedging their bets. Sooner or later something's got to give if this keeps up, so one of two things got to happen- one, and my money's on this one, whites just bend over and let themselves get screwed over and killed rather than be called names even helping by pushing each other off the cliff like the whole 92% been doing for years. Well those other groups will surely want to share in the spoils of victory. Think they'll cry over what happened and damn the "extremists"? HAH! You believe that then I got some really nice tropical property in Dublin I'd like to sell you!
But suppose the moon rises in the west and whites crack open a dictionary and look up words like courage and unity then finally stand up for themselves and WIN? Oh then SOMEONE is going to be neck deep in the dungheap for sure- NOW those groups will speak up good and loud, whining about how it wasn't them it was those "extremists".
Could it be they figure not saying anything now then no matter what happens later they win or at least lose nothing?
This is why I'm not going to give a rat's arse anymore if anything ever happens to those groups. They never did speak up for me, maybe they hated on me and agreed with it all, either way why the hell should I do anything for them? I'll just sit back and do what they did for me- NOTHING. I'm not wasting my time crying over anyone never did anything for me.

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Quote from: Chris24601 on April 10, 2022, 07:06:06 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Another key point for the "nonpartisan" (i.e. Leftists pretending to not be) report... it covers up to 2020... not through 2020. In other words, they cut off their data just before Burn Loot Murder went on its rampage.

And my gut instinct was right... I looked them up and nonpartisan centrist my ass. Their board is a who's who of anti-Trump and big government figures and their sponsors read like a listing of the top Forever War military contractors.

Leftists lie.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 07:09:20 PM

Also... Using expressions like "anti-trump" and "big goverment" is just such a great way to make me disregard anything you say, because every opinion you have comes from the mouth of your right-wing media overlords.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 06:59:29 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Why?

It's not like it would matter to you if I directly linked to the CSIS database because you've already made up your mind.

And I'm the one who is drinking kool-aid?

Quote from: Pat on April 10, 2022, 07:23:58 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 07:09:20 PM

Also... Using expressions like "anti-trump" and "big goverment" is just such a great way to make me disregard anything you say, because every opinion you have comes from the mouth of your right-wing media overlords.

There are right-wing media overlords? I thought the right had whatshisface over at Fox, and... echo echo? A bunch of podcasts? Maybe a few radio stations? A few youtube channels?

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Quote from: Ocule on April 10, 2022, 10:09:07 PM
At this point I wonder if violence is the only language these people understand. Of course left wing terrorism is going to be under represented given that they don't classify these attacks as left wing, and usually try to pin it on the right anyway. 17? What was that like day 2 of chaz?

To reference a philosopher the left loves to quote out of context when convenient, maybe it is time for the fist and the pistol. Look at what they are doing? And continuing to do. This is an active attack on a whole country and all these fucking "muh 2A" dudes who are more comfortable behind their keyboard than behind a trigger. When they do show up they allow themselves to be murdered by random lefty asshole.

" Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor."

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 08:35:27 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 06:59:29 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Why?

It's not like it would matter to you if I directly linked to the CSIS database because you've already made up your mind.

And I'm the one who is drinking kool-aid?

Unlike YOU, I do change my mind when evidence is provided.

World wide, terrorism is mainly Islamist, followed by left wing in a distant second place, then right wing.

You provide the number of deaths and not the number of attacks to obscure the fact that YOUR side IS the more violent one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present)

Check it year by year if you wish.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 02:57:45 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 08:35:27 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 06:59:29 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Why?

It's not like it would matter to you if I directly linked to the CSIS database because you've already made up your mind.

And I'm the one who is drinking kool-aid?

Unlike YOU, I do change my mind when evidence is provided.

World wide, terrorism is mainly Islamist, followed by left wing in a distant second place, then right wing.

You provide the number of deaths and not the number of attacks to obscure the fact that YOUR side IS the more violent one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present)

Check it year by year if you wish.

Which side is more violent?

10 antifa throwing rocks or bangers at a demonstration at armored police or 1 right winger armed with a AR going into a black church or a mosque killing several people? Or blowing up a abortion clinic?

I know which side is definitely more lethal.

I did not obscure the number of attacks, as this image was in the pdf i shared that you obviously didnt look at (or understood)

This picture below shows the share between different type of attacks from different factions.
Light blue is rightwing, green is leftwing.

Last time leftwing stood for the majority of violence was in 2005 unless you want to nitpick about 2013 where the left were about even with the right.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg)

Trond asked why it appeared to him that the leftwing had become more violent in the last 10 years in the US.

Looking at the blue line on this picture makes me wonder what made him believe that.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-02.jpg)

Also. HAHAHA wikipedia!

you're killing me!

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 02:57:45 AM....,

Last time leftwing stood for the majority of violence was in 2005 unless you want to nitpick about 2013 where the left were about even with the right.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg)

Trond asked why it appeared to him that the leftwing had become more violent in the last 10 years in the US.

Looking at the blue line on this picture makes me wonder what made him believe that.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-02.jpg)

Also. HAHAHA wikipedia!

you're killing me!

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 08:36:11 PM

Quote from: Pat on April 10, 2022, 07:23:58 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 07:09:20 PM

Also... Using expressions like "anti-trump" and "big goverment" is just such a great way to make me disregard anything you say, because every opinion you have comes from the mouth of your right-wing media overlords.

There are right-wing media overlords? I thought the right had whatshisface over at Fox, and... echo echo? A bunch of podcasts? Maybe a few radio stations? A few youtube channels?

I bet the idiot thinks Biden is right wing too.

Quote from: oggsmash on April 11, 2022, 09:14:25 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 08:36:11 PM

Quote from: Pat on April 10, 2022, 07:23:58 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 07:09:20 PM

Also... Using expressions like "anti-trump" and "big goverment" is just such a great way to make me disregard anything you say, because every opinion you have comes from the mouth of your right-wing media overlords.

There are right-wing media overlords? I thought the right had whatshisface over at Fox, and... echo echo? A bunch of podcasts? Maybe a few radio stations? A few youtube channels?

I bet the idiot thinks Biden is right wing too.

  Well, I think its impossible to call Biden any wing.  That dude has no idea if he has shit his pants, what time of day it is, or where he is.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 02:57:45 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 08:35:27 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 06:59:29 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Why?

It's not like it would matter to you if I directly linked to the CSIS database because you've already made up your mind.

And I'm the one who is drinking kool-aid?

Unlike YOU, I do change my mind when evidence is provided.

World wide, terrorism is mainly Islamist, followed by left wing in a distant second place, then right wing.

You provide the number of deaths and not the number of attacks to obscure the fact that YOUR side IS the more violent one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present)

Check it year by year if you wish.

Which side is more violent?

10 antifa throwing rocks or bangers at a demonstration at armored police or 1 right winger armed with a AR going into a black church or a mosque killing several people? Or blowing up a abortion clinic?

I know which side is definitely more lethal.

I did not obscure the number of attacks, as this image was in the pdf i shared that you obviously didnt look at (or understood)

This picture below shows the share between different type of attacks from different factions.
Light blue is rightwing, green is leftwing.

Last time leftwing stood for the majority of violence was in 2005 unless you want to nitpick about 2013 where the left were about even with the right.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg)

Trond asked why it appeared to him that the leftwing had become more violent in the last 10 years in the US.

Looking at the blue line on this picture makes me wonder what made him believe that.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-02.jpg)

Also. HAHAHA wikipedia!

you're killing me!

Quote from: Shasarak on April 11, 2022, 05:20:12 AM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 02:57:45 AM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 08:35:27 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 06:59:29 PM

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 10, 2022, 06:02:34 PM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 10, 2022, 05:20:22 PM

Quote from: Trond on April 10, 2022, 04:02:34 PM
Perhaps violence is a sign of desperation? I arrived in the USA about ten years ago, and it's hard not to notice the political left has turned more and more violent. Despite what some "studies" say about the right I'm no longer in doubt that the left has completely overtaken the right in the use of violence. Andy Ngo alone has suffered several injuries (and some leftists again called for violence against him recently, turns out they harassed the wrong Asian though). I also know of Trump supporters who were killed for their politics but not a single case the other way round (correct me if I'm wrong).

You are wrong.

CSIS (Center for Strategic and International Studies) a centrist and bipartisan thinktank has taken a look at almost 900 politically motivated attacks and plots since 1994 (up to 2020)

What they found was 21 victims killed in leftwing attacks and 117 victims killed in rightwing attacks (between 2010 and 2020) in the US.

Could it be that left wing attacks are overrepresented in the last 10 years are non-lethal attacks that doesnt end up in fatalities while rightwingers are more prone to shoot to kill? Possible.

Could also be that the news sources you watch doesn't frame the right wing attacks as politically motivated but "just one  mentally ill person"

Please cite those attacks, both the "left wing" and the "right wing" ones. Because I have noticed that black separatists, black ethno-nationalists tend to be counted as "right-wing never mind their political ideas are socialism/communism.

Also, do we count how many people have died or do we count how many attacks were commited?

Because by YOUR standard all the people attacked by the antifart and burn loot murder that didn't die means those don't count.

Just during the latest "summer of love" during the "fiery but mostly peaceful 30+ people were killed by those two leftwing groups. BILLIONS in damages, how many wounded?

But you go ahead and keep on drinking the koolaid.

Why?

It's not like it would matter to you if I directly linked to the CSIS database because you've already made up your mind.

And I'm the one who is drinking kool-aid?

Unlike YOU, I do change my mind when evidence is provided.

World wide, terrorism is mainly Islamist, followed by left wing in a distant second place, then right wing.

You provide the number of deaths and not the number of attacks to obscure the fact that YOUR side IS the more violent one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents#1970%E2%80%93present)

Check it year by year if you wish.

Which side is more violent?

10 antifa throwing rocks or bangers at a demonstration at armored police or 1 right winger armed with a AR going into a black church or a mosque killing several people? Or blowing up a abortion clinic?

I know which side is definitely more lethal.

I did not obscure the number of attacks, as this image was in the pdf i shared that you obviously didnt look at (or understood)

This picture below shows the share between different type of attacks from different factions.
Light blue is rightwing, green is leftwing.

Last time leftwing stood for the majority of violence was in 2005 unless you want to nitpick about 2013 where the left were about even with the right.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg)

Trond asked why it appeared to him that the leftwing had become more violent in the last 10 years in the US.

Looking at the blue line on this picture makes me wonder what made him believe that.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-02.jpg)

Also. HAHAHA wikipedia!

you're killing me!

Wntrlnd, with all due respect, do you seriously believe that 2020 the summer of love was just some kind of right wing organised event?

Or is it that riots dont fall under the "terrorist" label?

Quote from: Trond on April 11, 2022, 08:46:26 AM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 02:57:45 AM....,

Last time leftwing stood for the majority of violence was in 2005 unless you want to nitpick about 2013 where the left were about even with the right.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-01.jpg)

Trond asked why it appeared to him that the leftwing had become more violent in the last 10 years in the US.

Looking at the blue line on this picture makes me wonder what made him believe that.

(https://csis-website-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/s3fs-public/TNT_Graphics_Web-02.jpg)

Also. HAHAHA wikipedia!

you're killing me!

Counting 2020? Oh yeah, that is a f***ing joke. People on the left, politicians and public figures even, were literally cheering on people going nuts in the streets and setting buildings, including police stations, on fire. It screams "unreliable data" to the high heavens.

Quote from: Ocule on April 11, 2022, 11:21:31 AM
How many people died during January 6th protest? The only violent death was a protestor being shot unjustly so unless you count harsh language as violence...wait lefties usually do

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 11:25:48 AM

Quote from: Ocule on April 11, 2022, 11:21:31 AM
How many people died during January 6th protest? The only violent death was a protestor being shot unjustly so unless you count harsh language as violence...wait lefties usually do

I guess you missed all the footage of the domestic terrorists assaulting police. So much for the "blue lives matter"

Quote from: oggsmash on April 11, 2022, 11:28:15 AM

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 11:25:48 AM

Quote from: Ocule on April 11, 2022, 11:21:31 AM
How many people died during January 6th protest? The only violent death was a protestor being shot unjustly so unless you count harsh language as violence...wait lefties usually do

I guess you missed all the footage of the domestic terrorists assaulting police. So much for the "blue lives matter"

   So rioters are domestic terrorists?  I think that is going to skew your shitty study quite a bit.  As for "blue lives matter", normies are idiots to think the police are on their side.  I am ok with calling all the rioters domestic terrorists though, but I think that is going to put quite a bruise on BLM...not that it needs more bad publicity.

Quote from: Wntrlnd on April 11, 2022, 10:45:25 AM

As I said. It was published in June 2020. Is it possible it didnt have all the data for the summer 2020 yet? Is it possible it WAS published to highlight that whatever leftwing violence that happened, it was to remind us that this have been after period of rising rightwing violence?

But its true that whatever data happened during and after 2020 should be added. You might not like the addition of january 6th though..

Quote from: GeekyBugle on April 11, 2022, 02:12:58 PM
How many incidents of left wing terrorism like this one have been since well before 2016?