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Author Topic: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM  (Read 5313 times)

oggsmash

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #30 on: February 23, 2022, 09:55:36 AM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).

  The reality with drugs, if the USA does not correct the issues that create a demand for product, there will never be an end to people willing to risk everything to provide said product.   I can not agree to sending money to Mexico to fix this, as I honestly think it will not be used to fix anything.  I am apprehensive to have a budget to destroy cartels too, because I think what ends up happening is the US government decides there will be one Crime family, destroys the rest and is more or less in business with the remaining drug runners.  Now this would bring a level of order if the the cartels are not fighting it out, but I do not think it reduces the corruption and influence of the remaining crime lords in business with the CIA (the CIA, as it exists if so fucked up it needs burning to the ground and restarting) and thus, institutionalizes corruption even more so in many ways and I doubt makes it any better for a Mexican citizen. 

   I think that whole disaster has gone on long enough that it would take monumental changes in both the USA and Mexico to do anything meaningful to cartels and the drug trade.

oggsmash

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #31 on: February 23, 2022, 10:17:18 AM »
  It was easier for the establishment to push when they controlled the organs of propaganda (all media).  But these days when you can see what the people in other nations think, see other perspectives, get a lot more details about what a conflict or prospective conflict is really about, etc with the internet.   Now that the MSM can not simply manufacture consent for a war among the people with constant propaganda, I am not so certain it is going to be an American thing moving forward.   I am starting to feel a lot less lonely with my stance of not exporting democracy via bullets and bombs.

I am also glad for this change. I might not agree with you about some specifics like the Korean War, but I appreciate that more Americans are becoming opposed to our typical foreign interventions.

I'm not so sure this change is because media and propaganda have less power over the population, though. Outside of this specific issue, it seems to me that recently, people are more likely than ever to believe stories from their own political side. Because there are so many different versions of truth on the Internet, they are more used to rejecting stories that they don't want to believe. As long as an establishment can make a story viral, it will be believed.

In some cases, though, behavior is changing for the better. I hope this leads to less war-mongering by the U.S., which would be a good thing.

  You benefitted personally from that war.  You should be in favor of it.   It did jack shit for the USA though, other than get Americans killed and spend money.   I am glad your father was able to flee from North Korea to a better nation.  How did he feel about socialism/marxism/communism?  Did he Urge you or your siblings to enter military service since US military force did so much to change the trajectory of his life and yours?

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #32 on: February 23, 2022, 10:20:08 AM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).
Until you fix your government, any aid would be an invasion.

A discreet seal team with a sharpshooter armed with one of those fancy rifles that shoot about a mile?

Honestly just find and seize their money. Seize their bank accounts, and burn whatever they have stashed in bills..
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #33 on: February 23, 2022, 10:24:11 AM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).

  The reality with drugs, if the USA does not correct the issues that create a demand for product, there will never be an end to people willing to risk everything to provide said product.   I can not agree to sending money to Mexico to fix this, as I honestly think it will not be used to fix anything.  I am apprehensive to have a budget to destroy cartels too, because I think what ends up happening is the US government decides there will be one Crime family, destroys the rest and is more or less in business with the remaining drug runners.  Now this would bring a level of order if the the cartels are not fighting it out, but I do not think it reduces the corruption and influence of the remaining crime lords in business with the CIA (the CIA, as it exists if so fucked up it needs burning to the ground and restarting) and thus, institutionalizes corruption even more so in many ways and I doubt makes it any better for a Mexican citizen. 

   I think that whole disaster has gone on long enough that it would take monumental changes in both the USA and Mexico to do anything meaningful to cartels and the drug trade.

You can't fix people, there will ALWAYS be demand for it, and I'm all for legalizing everything, but first you'd need to destroy the cartels.

I didn't meant gtiving money to my government, I meant the USA destroying the cartels, find and seize their money, destroy their supply, kill them all.

IMHO the cartels are a bigger threat to the USA citizens than some goat fuckers in the desert.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

oggsmash

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #34 on: February 23, 2022, 10:28:44 AM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).

  The reality with drugs, if the USA does not correct the issues that create a demand for product, there will never be an end to people willing to risk everything to provide said product.   I can not agree to sending money to Mexico to fix this, as I honestly think it will not be used to fix anything.  I am apprehensive to have a budget to destroy cartels too, because I think what ends up happening is the US government decides there will be one Crime family, destroys the rest and is more or less in business with the remaining drug runners.  Now this would bring a level of order if the the cartels are not fighting it out, but I do not think it reduces the corruption and influence of the remaining crime lords in business with the CIA (the CIA, as it exists if so fucked up it needs burning to the ground and restarting) and thus, institutionalizes corruption even more so in many ways and I doubt makes it any better for a Mexican citizen. 

   I think that whole disaster has gone on long enough that it would take monumental changes in both the USA and Mexico to do anything meaningful to cartels and the drug trade.

You can't fix people, there will ALWAYS be demand for it, and I'm all for legalizing everything, but first you'd need to destroy the cartels.

I didn't meant gtiving money to my government, I meant the USA destroying the cartels, find and seize their money, destroy their supply, kill them all.

IMHO the cartels are a bigger threat to the USA citizens than some goat fuckers in the desert.

  I agree about level of threat.  I honestly think it is a great idea on paper, but reality is once it is what is essentially a large police action on foreign soil, the CIA will be balls deep in it and it will end up so screwed up, I am not sure we could conceive just how bad it would be.   

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #35 on: February 23, 2022, 10:42:11 AM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).

  The reality with drugs, if the USA does not correct the issues that create a demand for product, there will never be an end to people willing to risk everything to provide said product.   I can not agree to sending money to Mexico to fix this, as I honestly think it will not be used to fix anything.  I am apprehensive to have a budget to destroy cartels too, because I think what ends up happening is the US government decides there will be one Crime family, destroys the rest and is more or less in business with the remaining drug runners.  Now this would bring a level of order if the the cartels are not fighting it out, but I do not think it reduces the corruption and influence of the remaining crime lords in business with the CIA (the CIA, as it exists if so fucked up it needs burning to the ground and restarting) and thus, institutionalizes corruption even more so in many ways and I doubt makes it any better for a Mexican citizen. 

   I think that whole disaster has gone on long enough that it would take monumental changes in both the USA and Mexico to do anything meaningful to cartels and the drug trade.

You can't fix people, there will ALWAYS be demand for it, and I'm all for legalizing everything, but first you'd need to destroy the cartels.

I didn't meant gtiving money to my government, I meant the USA destroying the cartels, find and seize their money, destroy their supply, kill them all.

IMHO the cartels are a bigger threat to the USA citizens than some goat fuckers in the desert.

  I agree about level of threat.  I honestly think it is a great idea on paper, but reality is once it is what is essentially a large police action on foreign soil, the CIA will be balls deep in it and it will end up so screwed up, I am not sure we could conceive just how bad it would be.

Yeah, you'd need to find a way to leave the CIA in the dark.

Then drone the fuckers, salt the earth of their properties, rinse and repeat till everyone is too afraid to even think of dealing in illegal drugs.

After that legalize everything.

But you're correct on one thing, most mexicans are too stupid to be in favor of USA armed forces operating on our soil. Even if it would mean a better life for themselves. Fucking pinkos.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

oggsmash

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #36 on: February 23, 2022, 10:51:25 AM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).

  The reality with drugs, if the USA does not correct the issues that create a demand for product, there will never be an end to people willing to risk everything to provide said product.   I can not agree to sending money to Mexico to fix this, as I honestly think it will not be used to fix anything.  I am apprehensive to have a budget to destroy cartels too, because I think what ends up happening is the US government decides there will be one Crime family, destroys the rest and is more or less in business with the remaining drug runners.  Now this would bring a level of order if the the cartels are not fighting it out, but I do not think it reduces the corruption and influence of the remaining crime lords in business with the CIA (the CIA, as it exists if so fucked up it needs burning to the ground and restarting) and thus, institutionalizes corruption even more so in many ways and I doubt makes it any better for a Mexican citizen. 

   I think that whole disaster has gone on long enough that it would take monumental changes in both the USA and Mexico to do anything meaningful to cartels and the drug trade.

You can't fix people, there will ALWAYS be demand for it, and I'm all for legalizing everything, but first you'd need to destroy the cartels.

I didn't meant gtiving money to my government, I meant the USA destroying the cartels, find and seize their money, destroy their supply, kill them all.

IMHO the cartels are a bigger threat to the USA citizens than some goat fuckers in the desert.

  I agree about level of threat.  I honestly think it is a great idea on paper, but reality is once it is what is essentially a large police action on foreign soil, the CIA will be balls deep in it and it will end up so screwed up, I am not sure we could conceive just how bad it would be.

Yeah, you'd need to find a way to leave the CIA in the dark.

Then drone the fuckers, salt the earth of their properties, rinse and repeat till everyone is too afraid to even think of dealing in illegal drugs.

After that legalize everything.

But you're correct on one thing, most mexicans are too stupid to be in favor of USA armed forces operating on our soil. Even if it would mean a better life for themselves. Fucking pinkos.

   Sounds like the Mexican government, or a state that really wants cartels gone (my understanding is some states in Mexico are much better at handling corruption than the federal government and do police the state for drug runners) needs to hire Eric Prince.  I have confidence he can, and will eradicate cartels.  If not him, a personality like him running a professional mercenary company.  What happens after that, I do not know.

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #37 on: February 23, 2022, 12:19:07 PM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).

  The reality with drugs, if the USA does not correct the issues that create a demand for product, there will never be an end to people willing to risk everything to provide said product.   I can not agree to sending money to Mexico to fix this, as I honestly think it will not be used to fix anything.  I am apprehensive to have a budget to destroy cartels too, because I think what ends up happening is the US government decides there will be one Crime family, destroys the rest and is more or less in business with the remaining drug runners.  Now this would bring a level of order if the the cartels are not fighting it out, but I do not think it reduces the corruption and influence of the remaining crime lords in business with the CIA (the CIA, as it exists if so fucked up it needs burning to the ground and restarting) and thus, institutionalizes corruption even more so in many ways and I doubt makes it any better for a Mexican citizen. 

   I think that whole disaster has gone on long enough that it would take monumental changes in both the USA and Mexico to do anything meaningful to cartels and the drug trade.

You can't fix people, there will ALWAYS be demand for it, and I'm all for legalizing everything, but first you'd need to destroy the cartels.

I didn't meant gtiving money to my government, I meant the USA destroying the cartels, find and seize their money, destroy their supply, kill them all.

IMHO the cartels are a bigger threat to the USA citizens than some goat fuckers in the desert.

  I agree about level of threat.  I honestly think it is a great idea on paper, but reality is once it is what is essentially a large police action on foreign soil, the CIA will be balls deep in it and it will end up so screwed up, I am not sure we could conceive just how bad it would be.

Yeah, you'd need to find a way to leave the CIA in the dark.

Then drone the fuckers, salt the earth of their properties, rinse and repeat till everyone is too afraid to even think of dealing in illegal drugs.

After that legalize everything.

But you're correct on one thing, most mexicans are too stupid to be in favor of USA armed forces operating on our soil. Even if it would mean a better life for themselves. Fucking pinkos.

   Sounds like the Mexican government, or a state that really wants cartels gone (my understanding is some states in Mexico are much better at handling corruption than the federal government and do police the state for drug runners) needs to hire Eric Prince.  I have confidence he can, and will eradicate cartels.  If not him, a personality like him running a professional mercenary company.  What happens after that, I do not know.

I don't believe there's a single state that handles corruption, when you see them go against cartel X it's because they're in cahoots with cartel Y  >:(

Dunno who that guy is but I'm in favor of eradicating the cartels with extreme prejudice.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

Zirunel

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #38 on: February 23, 2022, 12:25:59 PM »
The Canadian government finally revealed how they know the Freedom Convoy is full of Nazis:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10540325/Woke-Canadian-MP-claims-Freedom-Convoys-Honk-Honk-catchphrase-secret-code-HEIL-HITLER.html

Canadians, be careful when you're visiting a playground! The toddlers playing with little trucks and going "honk honk" are undercover agents of the Fuhrer!

Huh.

I don't know much about memes and secret codes and whatnot, so I can't really speak to that. Is there a there there or is she out to lunch? No idea. But I will say, a single backbench MP doesn't exactly constitute "the Canadian government."

Pat

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #39 on: February 23, 2022, 12:33:15 PM »
The Canadian government finally revealed how they know the Freedom Convoy is full of Nazis:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10540325/Woke-Canadian-MP-claims-Freedom-Convoys-Honk-Honk-catchphrase-secret-code-HEIL-HITLER.html

Canadians, be careful when you're visiting a playground! The toddlers playing with little trucks and going "honk honk" are undercover agents of the Fuhrer!

Huh.

I don't know much about memes and secret codes and whatnot, so I can't really speak to that. Is there a there there or is she out to lunch? No idea. But I will say, a single backbench MP doesn't exactly constitute "the Canadian government."
You're seriously entertaining the idea?

Pat

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #40 on: February 23, 2022, 12:34:00 PM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).
Until you fix your government, any aid would be an invasion.

A discreet seal team with a sharpshooter armed with one of those fancy rifles that shoot about a mile?

Honestly just find and seize their money. Seize their bank accounts, and burn whatever they have stashed in bills..
Best I can do is $28 billion for a gender studies curriculum.

Zirunel

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #41 on: February 23, 2022, 12:47:41 PM »
The Canadian government finally revealed how they know the Freedom Convoy is full of Nazis:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10540325/Woke-Canadian-MP-claims-Freedom-Convoys-Honk-Honk-catchphrase-secret-code-HEIL-HITLER.html

Canadians, be careful when you're visiting a playground! The toddlers playing with little trucks and going "honk honk" are undercover agents of the Fuhrer!

Huh.

I don't know much about memes and secret codes and whatnot, so I can't really speak to that. Is there a there there or is she out to lunch? No idea. But I will say, a single backbench MP doesn't exactly constitute "the Canadian government."
You're seriously entertaining the idea?

I would say no, I am provisionally not seriously entertaining the idea.

I did try some googling and found  people saying honk honk was some pepe the frog thing meaning  heil Hitler from 2-3 years ago, long before the "trucker" protest. That may be where she gets it from. But I'm still uncertain whether it was just some trolling joke. So I dunno. And I don't care to drill down super deep into all that.

My gut tells me, even if a few protesters were in on some neo-Nazi " joke, " the rest of them ( just about all) surely meant honk honk just literally as trucks horns not some neo-Nazi code. But that's only my gut.

Anyway, my point is, a backbench MP, speaking as a backbench MP, almost never speaks for "the Canadian Government."

moonsweeper

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #42 on: February 23, 2022, 12:58:44 PM »
The Canadian government finally revealed how they know the Freedom Convoy is full of Nazis:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10540325/Woke-Canadian-MP-claims-Freedom-Convoys-Honk-Honk-catchphrase-secret-code-HEIL-HITLER.html

Canadians, be careful when you're visiting a playground! The toddlers playing with little trucks and going "honk honk" are undercover agents of the Fuhrer!

I think my favorite was the white MP who claimed that the indigenous supporters at the convoy who had been interviewed didn't actually represent "real indigenous" people and were probably guilty of cultural misappropriation...

"I have a very hard time taking seriously someone who has the time and resources to protest capitalism, while walking around in Nike shoes and drinking Starbucks, while filming it on their iPhone."  --  Alderaan Crumbs

"Just, can you make it The Ramones at least? I only listen to Abba when I want to fuck a stripper." -- Jeff37923

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Zirunel

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #43 on: February 23, 2022, 01:04:53 PM »

I think my favorite was the white MP who claimed that the indigenous supporters at the convoy who had been interviewed didn't actually represent "real indigenous" people and were probably guilty of cultural misappropriation...

Who was the MP?

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Left gave up on free speech, now they're giving up on FREEDOM
« Reply #44 on: February 23, 2022, 01:16:30 PM »
I think the USA should have a foreign aid budget of exactly zero

There is no such thing as "foreign aid"

There is only the price for other people to do things that you want them to do.

Howbout a budget to destroy the cartels? I know my government doesn't want to because sovereignty (they line their pockets).
Until you fix your government, any aid would be an invasion.

A discreet seal team with a sharpshooter armed with one of those fancy rifles that shoot about a mile?

Honestly just find and seize their money. Seize their bank accounts, and burn whatever they have stashed in bills..
Best I can do is $28 billion for a gender studies curriculum.

Meanwhile over 60% of USA citizens ages 17-60 can't read for shit and don't get me started on Maths.

But hey, it's slowly becoming the same here! Grievance studies on the UNAM (Tax payer supported offcourse).
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell