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Author Topic: Reconciliation  (Read 40324 times)

Bruwulf

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #60 on: November 22, 2022, 05:23:32 PM »
Right and Obama and Clinton both opposed gay marriage as well. However they didn't think gay people were grooming children.

A good example of them managing to be wrong about everything, if you ask me. A stopped clock can be wrong twice a day? Something.

oggsmash

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #61 on: November 22, 2022, 05:28:51 PM »
I love that in a thread named reconciliation the majority of the forumites here came out to the conclusion that to accomplish everyone to the left of GWBush needs to be put against the wall and shot.

Yep, totally sane and well-adjusted adults here, that's for sure.

Don't worry, one of them made an exception for his personal friends.
But joking aside, yes the clique of boneheads took over the thread pretty fast.

Indeed. And it's not "to the left of GWBush" it's "to the left of Trump." These guys would think GW Bush is a RINO these days. Because he was a neocon who believed in a level of globalism and immigration and didn't think gay people were groomers by definition.


  LMAO.....GW was RIGHT of Trump in office.  Wow how short the memories....he OPPOSED GAY MARRIAGE and waged wars at the drop of a hat.  He is an elitist and a globalist...but pretending he is left of trump is short memory retarded.

Right and Obama and Clinton both opposed gay marriage as well. However they didn't think gay people were grooming children.

Waging war is neither right nor left wing. Democrats also wage a lot of war.

You can call him whatever you want relative to Trump, but it's obvious anyone not on board with Trumpian politics is considered a RINO these days. A GW Bush supporter. like myself, is called a RINO. Right here in fact.

  The problem with that term RINO, is it is meaningless.  Republicans do not stand for shit, the past 3 decades bombing people into democracy and slow walking any uber left bullshit, but never pushing back.    If you supported GW, you are not a RINO, you are just an idiot.   I don't call GW anything I want, I just call it like it was and is.  Trump is LEFT of GW on almost everything, and he is called a right wing extremist (I guess having the audacity to think American leaders should put the needs of America and Americans first is nutty right wing bullshit). 
« Last Edit: November 22, 2022, 05:30:38 PM by oggsmash »

SHARK

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #62 on: November 22, 2022, 05:43:01 PM »
Greetings!

GW Bush was a mediocre President, at the end of the day. He was somewhat *Conservative*--but not nearly as strong a Conservative as he should have been. Too much fucking RINO in him. Too fucking weak; too fucking greedy and self interested; and too fucking corrupt; Morally a spineless jellyfish far too eager to suck Leftist cock, and engage in *Compromise*. Conveniently, the RINOS always sell Conservative principles down the river when it means they can make a profit, gain popularity, or ensure their cushy political position with more certainty. Globalist, Corporatist, neocon scum. Political Jellyfish like John McCain, Mitt Romney, Liz Chaney, Katzinger, et al. They are all useless, weak, and pathetic. Noe of them have been strong champions for Conservative values and objectives.

So, fuck them.

GW Bush wasn't as bad as most of the Neocon RINO scum, but that doesn't make him a Conservative Champion. As I said, he was mediocre, or Ok as a President. His second term as President was fucking embarrassing, being full of absolute incompetence, moral scandals, and various flavours of corruption. Ultimately, GW's Presidency didn't do *Conservatism* any favours, and let down many Conservative voters and supporters that expected far more from GW Bush. For a Republican President that won two elections in a row, had Republican majorities in both the Senate and the House--and yet, again, at the end of the day, the overall Republican performance and achievement during those 8 fucking years was at best, mediocre.

On a broader sweep, it is the RINO cock-sucking, compromise, self-interest, and lying that has ultimately led to people fervently supporting TRUMP. Too much cock sucking and weakness from RINOS for the last 30 years. Lots of talking; lots of compromising--but meanwhile, the fucking Libtards get more and more of their hateful agenda accomplished.

So, again, FUCK THE RINO SCUM.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
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Trond

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #63 on: November 22, 2022, 06:14:36 PM »
From the very first post.  There's nothing more boneheaded than a foreigner deciding to lecture Americans on how to solve American politics....

You do seem to be a "special" case don't you? I start a thread, letting several posters respond before I give my own opinion. But you can't handle that apparently, an opinion on a gaming board, and a pretty balanced one too. Which version of Americans should I listen to in order to become American? The hippies? Oh wait that would be way too far to the American left (but typically American still). Bill Maher? Don't think so, he's funny but too high on weed. DeSantis? Isn't he from that state you just disparaged?  The "cowboys" in general? But just a sec, a lot of the typical cowboy outfit was actually of Mexican origin. A lot of wokeness is a mishmash too; some of it American in origin, some from other places. I happen to like America, my wife and I were the ones with the most 4th of July American flags out in our neighborhood when the general mood around was negative during the riots. Hell, I think you just convinced me to become a citizen.

Trond

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #64 on: November 22, 2022, 06:20:17 PM »
BTW, since I mentioned some people who have shifted political stance lately, and who try to bridge the gap so to speak, what do you guys think of Tulsi Gabbard?

jhkim

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #65 on: November 22, 2022, 07:40:18 PM »
Regarding reconciliation, I think one hopeful thing is that despite the rhetoric - we have had less political violence so far than in the 1960s. Still, there are events like the recent nightclub shooting in Colorado. I think in general, while people are worked up by clickbait, for the most part people's lives are fairly stable, and they are more inclined to tweet about violence than actually murder people - which is good. If one side is perceived to move into violence first, I think they will lose a lot of support.

They don’t think we’re wrong, they think we’re EVIL, so anything they do to us is warranted.  I was foolish to think otherwise, but no more.  War.

My progressive friends get the benefit of the doubt, thanks to years of friendship.  All the new ones I meet are presumed enemies unless they prove otherwise.
The Left are godless zombies that have embraced a globalist, Marxist philosophy. The Left--in whatever permutation or flavour--desire a society, country, and world, that is diametrically and fundamentally opposed to that of right-thinking Americans.

In such a situation, there is only one solution--WAR.

Either one side or the other wins. Whoever loses this struggle will be exterminated like cockroaches.

For either of you - how do you perceive the current situation progressing into active civil war?

Mistwell

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #66 on: November 22, 2022, 09:13:52 PM »
I love that in a thread named reconciliation the majority of the forumites here came out to the conclusion that to accomplish everyone to the left of GWBush needs to be put against the wall and shot.

Yep, totally sane and well-adjusted adults here, that's for sure.

Don't worry, one of them made an exception for his personal friends.
But joking aside, yes the clique of boneheads took over the thread pretty fast.

Indeed. And it's not "to the left of GWBush" it's "to the left of Trump." These guys would think GW Bush is a RINO these days. Because he was a neocon who believed in a level of globalism and immigration and didn't think gay people were groomers by definition.


  LMAO.....GW was RIGHT of Trump in office.  Wow how short the memories....he OPPOSED GAY MARRIAGE and waged wars at the drop of a hat.  He is an elitist and a globalist...but pretending he is left of trump is short memory retarded.

Right and Obama and Clinton both opposed gay marriage as well. However they didn't think gay people were grooming children.

Waging war is neither right nor left wing. Democrats also wage a lot of war.

You can call him whatever you want relative to Trump, but it's obvious anyone not on board with Trumpian politics is considered a RINO these days. A GW Bush supporter. like myself, is called a RINO. Right here in fact.

  The problem with that term RINO, is it is meaningless.  Republicans do not stand for shit, the past 3 decades bombing people into democracy and slow walking any uber left bullshit, but never pushing back.    If you supported GW, you are not a RINO, you are just an idiot.   I don't call GW anything I want, I just call it like it was and is.  Trump is LEFT of GW on almost everything, and he is called a right wing extremist (I guess having the audacity to think American leaders should put the needs of America and Americans first is nutty right wing bullshit).

He is 1) an extremist, and 2) to the right of center. Therefore he is a right winger who is an extremist. But he's not a right wing extremist in the sense his extremism isn't focused on right wing issues.

Mistwell

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #67 on: November 22, 2022, 09:16:07 PM »
Regarding reconciliation, I think one hopeful thing is that despite the rhetoric - we have had less political violence so far than in the 1960s. Still, there are events like the recent nightclub shooting in Colorado. I think in general, while people are worked up by clickbait, for the most part people's lives are fairly stable, and they are more inclined to tweet about violence than actually murder people - which is good. If one side is perceived to move into violence first, I think they will lose a lot of support.

They don’t think we’re wrong, they think we’re EVIL, so anything they do to us is warranted.  I was foolish to think otherwise, but no more.  War.

My progressive friends get the benefit of the doubt, thanks to years of friendship.  All the new ones I meet are presumed enemies unless they prove otherwise.
The Left are godless zombies that have embraced a globalist, Marxist philosophy. The Left--in whatever permutation or flavour--desire a society, country, and world, that is diametrically and fundamentally opposed to that of right-thinking Americans.

In such a situation, there is only one solution--WAR.

Either one side or the other wins. Whoever loses this struggle will be exterminated like cockroaches.

For either of you - how do you perceive the current situation progressing into active civil war?

It's gonna be a civil war in the metaverse. Throwing words at each other and posturing like they're winning or losing something by declaring it to be so.

Stephen Tannhauser

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #68 on: November 22, 2022, 10:25:44 PM »
Regarding reconciliation, I think one hopeful thing is that despite the rhetoric - we have had less political violence so far than in the 1960s. Still, there are events like the recent nightclub shooting in Colorado.

For which no confirmed motive has yet been actually released to the public, which is telling given that politically motivated shooters tend to make that motive very clear before or during their attacks; much of the violence that does occur these days in the U.S. is the product of mental instability rather than political radicalization.

I've said before that I personally think it very unlikely that anything like an actual civil war could occur now in the States, certainly not on the model of the 1861-1865 war, because today's primary political polarization isn't between easily geographically separable political and economic entities; the primary divide is between urban and rural counties all across the country by socioeconomic class, neither side of which commands anything like an independent, organized and self-sufficient military force that could be easily turned against the opposition without major internal discord.

That said, there could certainly be significant disorganized violence and disruption (viz. most of 2020), but if it accomplished political objectives at all it would be through exploiting existing political structures, not overthrowing and rebuilding them. More disturbing would be if private paramilitary groups started engaging in active violent campaigns, like what happened in the Troubles in Northern Ireland, but it is a lot harder for such groups to get off the ground, gather materiel and financing and preserve secrecy in the 2020s than it was in the 1960s. It might still be possible with sufficient high-level government support from somewhere, but that, too, would be very difficult to conceal in this day and age, and I don't see any state government thinking its own position so economically or legally disenfranchised to consider that a risk worth taking.
Better to keep silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt. -- Mark Twain

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DocJones

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #69 on: November 22, 2022, 11:07:20 PM »
Still, there are events like the recent nightclub shooting in Colorado.
There is no evidence that this was political violence. 
Shooter is nonbinary and a meth addict.
You sort of ignore the political violence of 2020 riots which saw 25 people killed, thousands injured and billions of dollars in damages
while the worst violence of the 1968 riots which saw 39 people killed, thousands injured, and less damage.
They are quite comparable.
« Last Edit: November 22, 2022, 11:15:15 PM by DocJones »

I

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #70 on: November 23, 2022, 12:50:44 AM »
BTW, since I mentioned some people who have shifted political stance lately, and who try to bridge the gap so to speak, what do you guys think of Tulsi Gabbard?

I liked her even back when Trump was early into his presidency, and hoped he would ask her to be in his cabinet.  I didn't want her to be President and still don't -- too many important issues I disagree with her on -- but I really liked her foreign policy ideas.  I think it's important for Presidents to hear opposing views and get pushback sometimes.  If I were President I'd look for a sensible liberal or two like her for my Cabinet.  Predictably, her fellow Democrats tore her a new one for even having a discussion with Trump about U.S. involvement in Syria.  At the time, she quite reasonably said that if Trump and Democrats could work toward a common goal, why shouldn't they?  But see, that's what happens when you try to "have a discussion" or "compromise" with Leftists -- they absolutely will not tolerate it, even coming from one of their own.  I don't blame her for leaving the Democrat party.  She was basically even blacklisted from most media; only Fox news would even have her on.  (Then libtards would call her a Nazi for appearing on Fox).   She had basically already been forced out of the Party anyway.  If Trump had made her Secretary of State that would have been fine with me.  She'd certainly have been better than a lot of the Neocon trash Trump surrounded himself with, like John Bolton.

jhkim

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #71 on: November 23, 2022, 01:14:40 AM »
You sort of ignore the political violence of 2020 riots which saw 25 people killed, thousands injured and billions of dollars in damages
while the worst violence of the 1968 riots which saw 39 people killed, thousands injured, and less damage.
They are quite comparable.

The 1968 riots after MLK's assassination was just one piece of violence of the 1960s, though. The summer 1967 race riots killed at least 85 people across dozens of cities. There were the 1964 Watts riots that had 34 deaths. There were dozens of other major riot incidents throughout the 1960s.

There were also a string of assassinations including JFK, MLK, and other notable figures. There was the Kent State shooting (technically in 1970 but clearly part of the period). Domestic terrorist groups including the KKK and others were highly active.

I

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #72 on: November 23, 2022, 09:38:36 AM »
Well, for a couple of reasons, this thread is part of the problem in American politics.  First, it treats compromise as if it is always the best resolution of a problem, when that is not always the case.  Let's say I want to rape your 4 daughters.  You don't want me to rape your daughters at all.  Is the proper resolution to this letting me rape two of them?  Sometimes the "middle" is just as wrong as the extremes.

Fifty years ago, democrats and republicans both believed in the American Dream.  They believed that America offered the best possible outcome for its citizens, compared to any other country or culture.  They were all American Exceptionalists.  They saw American culture and its ethos as a force for good in the world.  They just differed on how that ethos was to be spread, safeguarded, and extended to all of its citizens (and immigrants).  Both sides believed in the great melting pot.

Now, both sides do NOT share a common vision of what America should be.  One sides hates the American Dream, calls it racist, sexist, and bigoted, believes it is illegitimate and evil at its founding.  One side no longer believes that immigrants should be assimilated into American culture; in fact, they believe that immigrant cultures are equal to or better than American culture.  One side no longer accepts the institutions of America, the law, the self-reliance, the freedom of speech.  Are you suggesting that I should compromise with those who say I can't state what I see as a biological fact, because it might hurt the feelings of some dude who wishes he was a chick?  That's "reconciliation"?  Sounds a lot more like "capitulation"...


Exactly.  It used to be that the destination was the same, the sides just disagreed on the path to take to get there.  Now they don't even agree on the destination.

And yeah, it seems to be an assumption among the leftoids/ neocons here that compromise is always the best solution.  So let me ask them:  what compromises are YOU willing to make?  I think most conservatives like myself think that "compromises" intended to keep the states together, like the Electoral College and the Tenth Amendment are just fine.  It's libtards who are always attacking those things, not us.  They can't even stand the fact that abortion was simply handed back to the states for a decision (as our Bill of Rights would dictate) -- nope, they've gotta impose an authoritarian one-size-fits-all "solution" at the national level.

So let's hear it:  what compromises are the Democrats and neocons willing to make?  I've given you two examples of compromises that practically all conservatives agree with and the Left doesn't.  Would you people have compromised on slavery to keep the country together, as the Founding Fathers did?  How about the Three-Fifths Compromise?  I mean, those compromises did so much to preserve the national peace and maintain unity, you people must think they're great, right?

SHARK

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #73 on: November 23, 2022, 12:55:54 PM »
Regarding reconciliation, I think one hopeful thing is that despite the rhetoric - we have had less political violence so far than in the 1960s. Still, there are events like the recent nightclub shooting in Colorado. I think in general, while people are worked up by clickbait, for the most part people's lives are fairly stable, and they are more inclined to tweet about violence than actually murder people - which is good. If one side is perceived to move into violence first, I think they will lose a lot of support.

They don’t think we’re wrong, they think we’re EVIL, so anything they do to us is warranted.  I was foolish to think otherwise, but no more.  War.

My progressive friends get the benefit of the doubt, thanks to years of friendship.  All the new ones I meet are presumed enemies unless they prove otherwise.
The Left are godless zombies that have embraced a globalist, Marxist philosophy. The Left--in whatever permutation or flavour--desire a society, country, and world, that is diametrically and fundamentally opposed to that of right-thinking Americans.

In such a situation, there is only one solution--WAR.

Either one side or the other wins. Whoever loses this struggle will be exterminated like cockroaches.

For either of you - how do you perceive the current situation progressing into active civil war?

Greetings!

Well, I definitely see a kind of national divorce going on--a process--where like minded people separate and gather together with others that embrace their same ideology and world view. There's a flood of Californians pouring into the state to escape the shithole that California has become. I think politically and legally, you will see an increase of states basically asserting their autonomy and telling the federal government to get fucked. Yes, lots of legalese and hoop jumping, but individual states are simply not going to comply with Libtard bs on so many issues, especially when such measures are put upon by the federal government. So, legally, politically, there's an increase in separation. Socially, you see hordes of people fleeing Libtard states. I think you will see more separation through church, through work--people working at ideologically acceptable places--and consumer experiences. We see this right here, in action--companies and customers alike segregating based on political ideology, essentially.

I think of course you see separation also in dating circles--i.e. "Trumpers pass me by"; and "Liberals swipe left" and so on.

All of this is the strands of separation. In past generations, these things were largely foreign to most people. Now, these things are increasingly being seen as normal, and also as necessary and good.

I have doubts about any kind of full-fledged "Civil War". However, I do think there will be an increase in irregular disorganized violence, killings, riots, and more going on throughout the country. Certainly, there are many people that are unwilling to crush someone else's head in with a lead pipe based upon their ideology. Short of that, though, more and more people actively work to oppose the others. To resist them, to exclude them, to oppose them in every way. I think that Conservatives in general hold a deep respect for human life, and are hesitant to become violent. The Libtards are mentally unstable, however, and will increasingly become more and more violent. As the victims pile up, and the Libtards get crazy stupid, then you will see Conservatives embrace violence with more enthusiasm.

I think this is how things get going and will proceed.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

Eirikrautha

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Re: Reconciliation
« Reply #74 on: November 23, 2022, 01:21:12 PM »
Regarding reconciliation, I think one hopeful thing is that despite the rhetoric - we have had less political violence so far than in the 1960s. Still, there are events like the recent nightclub shooting in Colorado. I think in general, while people are worked up by clickbait, for the most part people's lives are fairly stable, and they are more inclined to tweet about violence than actually murder people - which is good. If one side is perceived to move into violence first, I think they will lose a lot of support.

They don’t think we’re wrong, they think we’re EVIL, so anything they do to us is warranted.  I was foolish to think otherwise, but no more.  War.

My progressive friends get the benefit of the doubt, thanks to years of friendship.  All the new ones I meet are presumed enemies unless they prove otherwise.
The Left are godless zombies that have embraced a globalist, Marxist philosophy. The Left--in whatever permutation or flavour--desire a society, country, and world, that is diametrically and fundamentally opposed to that of right-thinking Americans.

In such a situation, there is only one solution--WAR.

Either one side or the other wins. Whoever loses this struggle will be exterminated like cockroaches.

For either of you - how do you perceive the current situation progressing into active civil war?

Greetings!

Well, I definitely see a kind of national divorce going on--a process--where like minded people separate and gather together with others that embrace their same ideology and world view. There's a flood of Californians pouring into the state to escape the shithole that California has become. I think politically and legally, you will see an increase of states basically asserting their autonomy and telling the federal government to get fucked. Yes, lots of legalese and hoop jumping, but individual states are simply not going to comply with Libtard bs on so many issues, especially when such measures are put upon by the federal government. So, legally, politically, there's an increase in separation. Socially, you see hordes of people fleeing Libtard states. I think you will see more separation through church, through work--people working at ideologically acceptable places--and consumer experiences. We see this right here, in action--companies and customers alike segregating based on political ideology, essentially.

I think of course you see separation also in dating circles--i.e. "Trumpers pass me by"; and "Liberals swipe left" and so on.

All of this is the strands of separation. In past generations, these things were largely foreign to most people. Now, these things are increasingly being seen as normal, and also as necessary and good.

I have doubts about any kind of full-fledged "Civil War". However, I do think there will be an increase in irregular disorganized violence, killings, riots, and more going on throughout the country. Certainly, there are many people that are unwilling to crush someone else's head in with a lead pipe based upon their ideology. Short of that, though, more and more people actively work to oppose the others. To resist them, to exclude them, to oppose them in every way. I think that Conservatives in general hold a deep respect for human life, and are hesitant to become violent. The Libtards are mentally unstable, however, and will increasingly become more and more violent. As the victims pile up, and the Libtards get crazy stupid, then you will see Conservatives embrace violence with more enthusiasm.

I think this is how things get going and will proceed.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Yeah, SHARK.  I've seen your last point summarized as, "leftists think of violence as a dial; conservatives as a switch."  The problem is that leftists, as they dial up the violence, see our restraint as weakness.  That's why they are always surprised (and outraged) when the helicopter rides start...