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Author Topic: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021  (Read 117736 times)

Shasarak

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #855 on: March 04, 2021, 03:28:15 PM »
ANTIFA is funded by the Democrats, why wouldn't their charges be dropped?

Brad, ANTIFA is just an idea so how can you even prosecute an idea?
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Ghostmaker

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #856 on: March 05, 2021, 08:18:46 AM »
The Sicknick story is really quite fascinating, in a morbid way.

The NYT originally stated he was beaten to death with a fire extinguisher. Then they 'updated' the story to state he was affected by bear mace. His mother thinks he died of a stroke, but nobody knows for sure because the D.C. medical examiner's office won't release the coroner's report (if I was facing any charges related to Sicknick I'd immediately push that angle hard -- go full corpus delicti, demand that the prosecution prove he was actually dead, the whole nine yards).

Then there's the case of Bruno Cua, a young idiot who decided to join in the 1/6 peaceful protest (yeah, I'm calling it that, until people stop calling the BLM riots peaceful protests). He's up on 12 federal counts, including assaulting a police officer (you know, the same charge DOJ dropped against the Antifa shitheads) and possessing a dangerous or deadly weapon. I won't excuse him -- my mantra's been 'don't go to stupid places' -- but I find it darkly hilarious that the federal prosecutors are playing up a homeschooled eighteen year old as some kind of malevolent terrorist while they pretend they don't see actual terrorists burning things down and attacking cops and journalists.

This is how things go kinetic, folks. Two sets of rules, and people start to think they can't get a fair shake in the system.

jhkim

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #857 on: March 05, 2021, 03:19:11 PM »
The Sicknick story is really quite fascinating, in a morbid way.

The NYT originally stated he was beaten to death with a fire extinguisher. Then they 'updated' the story to state he was affected by bear mace. His mother thinks he died of a stroke, but nobody knows for sure because the D.C. medical examiner's office won't release the coroner's report (if I was facing any charges related to Sicknick I'd immediately push that angle hard -- go full corpus delicti, demand that the prosecution prove he was actually dead, the whole nine yards).

It's definitely strange. The FBI reported to the Senate this Tuesday, and said that they couldn't disclose cause of death.

Quote
Grassley: We all want to know what happened to Officer Brian Sicknick. Tragic death as a result of that January 6th assault. There's been conflicting reports about his cause of death. Have you determined the exact cause of death?

Wray: There is an ongoing investigation into his death. I have to be careful at this stage because it's ongoing not to get out in front of it. But I certainly understand and respect and appreciate the keen interest in what happened to him. After all, he was here protecting all of you. And as soon as there is information that we can appropriately share, we want to be able to do that. But at the moment, the investigation is still ongoing.

Grassley: So does that mean since the investigation going on, you have not determined the exact cause of the death?

Wray: That means we can't yet disclose the cause of death at this stage.

Grassley: But you have determined the cause of death?

Wray: I didn't say that. We're not at a point where we could disclose or confirm the cause of death.
https://www.c-span.org/video/?509033-1/fbi-director-christopher-wray-testifies-january-6-capitol-attack&live

I'm sure this leads to all sorts of speculation, but I don't see that it's clear. Some are saying that this is all a Biden-lead conspiracy, but Director Wray who is testifying is Trump's pick for FBI director to replace Comey. And the initial investigation was all handled under the Trump administration for at least two weeks.


Then there's the case of Bruno Cua, a young idiot who decided to join in the 1/6 peaceful protest (yeah, I'm calling it that, until people stop calling the BLM riots peaceful protests). He's up on 12 federal counts, including assaulting a police officer (you know, the same charge DOJ dropped against the Antifa shitheads) and possessing a dangerous or deadly weapon. I won't excuse him -- my mantra's been 'don't go to stupid places' -- but I find it darkly hilarious that the federal prosecutors are playing up a homeschooled eighteen year old as some kind of malevolent terrorist while they pretend they don't see actual terrorists burning things down and attacking cops and journalists.

This is how things go kinetic, folks. Two sets of rules, and people start to think they can't get a fair shake in the system.

Both sides are biased -- but saying "I'll be biased until the other side becomes unbiased" just means constantly increasing bias. I think people who assault police officers should be prosecuted and jailed regardless of their politics. Regardless of what happened to Sicknick, cops were actually attacked at the Capitol. From police news,

Quote
“I have officers who were not issued helmets prior to the attack who have sustained head injuries,” said the Capitol Police officer’s union chairman, Gus Papathanasiou, in a statement Wednesday. “One officer has two cracked ribs and two smashed spinal discs and another was stabbed with a metal fence stake, to name some of the injuries.”

According to The Post, 65 D.C. police officers suffered concussions, swollen ankles and wrists, bruises, and irritated lungs from pepper spray. Officers were pushed down stairs, trampled and punched. 81 Capitol police officers were assaulted during the siege, but the extent of their injuries was not detailed in reports.

“The officers are angry, and I don’t blame them. The entire executive team failed us, and they must be held accountable,” he said. “Their inaction cost one officer his life, and we have almost 140 responding officers injured. They have a lot to atone for.”
Source: https://www.police1.com/officer-safety/articles/police-union-over-140-officers-injured-in-capitol-siege-NSi5xcpt1sIELYvJ/

Ratman_tf

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #858 on: March 05, 2021, 03:49:42 PM »
Both sides are biased -- but saying "I'll be biased until the other side becomes unbiased" just means constantly increasing bias.

I agree, but who will de-escalate first? Should one side de-escalate when the other side is still escalating? If I can convince the public that my side are misguided, and my opponents are horrible assholes, I gain a huge propoganda advantage.
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jhkim

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #859 on: March 05, 2021, 04:22:42 PM »
Both sides are biased -- but saying "I'll be biased until the other side becomes unbiased" just means constantly increasing bias.

I agree, but who will de-escalate first? Should one side de-escalate when the other side is still escalating? If I can convince the public that my side are misguided, and my opponents are horrible assholes, I gain a huge propoganda advantage.

I'd say it has to be done in tiny steps at a time from both sides.

I think the main thing to call out is the pattern of clickbait and outrage. I find it's very common that the *only* thing one side reads of the opposing side is the cherry-picked most outrageous stuff -- carefully selected as clickbait either by social media algorithms or by their preferred media.

Because of all the clickbait outrage, they are convinced that the other side is escalating -- and they have to escalate to. And this becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy for both sides.

Shasarak

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #860 on: March 05, 2021, 04:23:13 PM »
Both sides are biased -- but saying "I'll be biased until the other side becomes unbiased" just means constantly increasing bias.

I agree, but who will de-escalate first? Should one side de-escalate when the other side is still escalating? If I can convince the public that my side are misguided, and my opponents are horrible assholes, I gain a huge propoganda advantage.

Don’t de-escalate, hold them to their new standards.  Don’t accept kids in cages!  Believe all women!

Make them walk it back.
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Mistwell

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #861 on: March 05, 2021, 05:08:22 PM »
It's the same standard I set on election day. The only question you ever needed to answer was if it was enough to alter the results of the election. It was not, so shut the fuck up you sore losers.

So you're going with, "LOL SUCKERS!". Pathetic.

I said from the beginning the same exact thing I said throughout and to the end. People kept accusing others of a moving standard but my standard was extremely consistent. There was only ever one question, "But for the argument you are making, would Biden still have won?"

That's it. It was the only question which ever mattered. The rest was a distraction. If fraud happened, but not enough to change the result, then that's not a topic about a stolen election (though it is an argument to make some changes to our elections system to prevent future fraud).

Everyone failed to prove the election was stolen. They argue about fraud here and there, but never in anything close to sufficient quantities to steal the election.  Which from day one was the only question I ever challenged people with.

So now they're defaulting to, "But some fraud happened and..." to which I answer "And that means the election was not stolen."
« Last Edit: March 05, 2021, 05:10:29 PM by Mistwell »

Ghostmaker

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #862 on: March 05, 2021, 06:45:17 PM »
It's the same standard I set on election day. The only question you ever needed to answer was if it was enough to alter the results of the election. It was not, so shut the fuck up you sore losers.

So you're going with, "LOL SUCKERS!". Pathetic.

I said from the beginning the same exact thing I said throughout and to the end. People kept accusing others of a moving standard but my standard was extremely consistent. There was only ever one question, "But for the argument you are making, would Biden still have won?"

That's it. It was the only question which ever mattered. The rest was a distraction. If fraud happened, but not enough to change the result, then that's not a topic about a stolen election (though it is an argument to make some changes to our elections system to prevent future fraud).

Everyone failed to prove the election was stolen. They argue about fraud here and there, but never in anything close to sufficient quantities to steal the election.  Which from day one was the only question I ever challenged people with.

So now they're defaulting to, "But some fraud happened and..." to which I answer "And that means the election was not stolen."
Great. Here's a fistful of $20 bills.

Some of them are fake, but not enough to matter.

Pat
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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #863 on: March 05, 2021, 07:47:09 PM »
I said from the beginning the same exact thing I said throughout and to the end. People kept accusing others of a moving standard but my standard was extremely consistent. There was only ever one question, "But for the argument you are making, would Biden still have won?"

That's it. It was the only question which ever mattered. The rest was a distraction. If fraud happened, but not enough to change the result, then that's not a topic about a stolen election (though it is an argument to make some changes to our elections system to prevent future fraud).
As someone who voted for None of the Above, I think the only question that mattered is that the allegations of impropriety (fraud is an irrelevant smokescreen) were taken seriously by both parties, thoroughly investigated, people were punished for misbehavior, and any problems were addressed to ensure they won't happen in the next election. In other words, I care about the integrity of the system, fairness, transparency, and the public's trust.

Unfortunately....

Elfdart

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #864 on: March 05, 2021, 09:14:14 PM »
ANTIFA is funded by the Democrats, why wouldn't their charges be dropped?

Evidence please.
Jesus Fucking Christ, is this guy honestly that goddamned stupid? He can't understand the plot of a Star Wars film? We're not talking about "Rashomon" here, for fuck's sake. The plot is as linear as they come. If anything, the film tries too hard to fill in all the gaps. This guy must be a flaming retard.  --Mike Wong on Red Letter Moron's review of The Phantom Menace

Elfdart

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #865 on: March 05, 2021, 10:20:39 PM »
Elfdart also conveniently forgets that the Democrats and the left attempted to overturn the 2016 election.

Some House members tried to do that, but not only did Joe Biden rule each challenge out of order, but not a single senator would agree to endorse any of the challenges. Clearly you're too fucktarded to tell the difference between a handful of congressmen making symbolic and pointless gestures where no one was injured, let alone killed; and sending a mob to physically attack people and threaten to lynch the Speaker and Vice President -and causing the deaths of five people.
Jesus Fucking Christ, is this guy honestly that goddamned stupid? He can't understand the plot of a Star Wars film? We're not talking about "Rashomon" here, for fuck's sake. The plot is as linear as they come. If anything, the film tries too hard to fill in all the gaps. This guy must be a flaming retard.  --Mike Wong on Red Letter Moron's review of The Phantom Menace

Mistwell

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #866 on: March 06, 2021, 12:01:17 AM »
It's the same standard I set on election day. The only question you ever needed to answer was if it was enough to alter the results of the election. It was not, so shut the fuck up you sore losers.

So you're going with, "LOL SUCKERS!". Pathetic.

I said from the beginning the same exact thing I said throughout and to the end. People kept accusing others of a moving standard but my standard was extremely consistent. There was only ever one question, "But for the argument you are making, would Biden still have won?"

That's it. It was the only question which ever mattered. The rest was a distraction. If fraud happened, but not enough to change the result, then that's not a topic about a stolen election (though it is an argument to make some changes to our elections system to prevent future fraud).

Everyone failed to prove the election was stolen. They argue about fraud here and there, but never in anything close to sufficient quantities to steal the election.  Which from day one was the only question I ever challenged people with.

So now they're defaulting to, "But some fraud happened and..." to which I answer "And that means the election was not stolen."
Great. Here's a fistful of $20 bills.

Some of them are fake, but not enough to matter.

If you're buying something that costs $20 and you hand me $60 in 20s and at least $20 of them is real, then yes, that's all that matters.

You cannot say the election was stolen, if you're guy didn't actually win and the other guy really did win. That's always been the bottom line. The rest is just relatively minor advocacy for some election reform changes. Which you can do in any year for any election. So go on and keep advocating for it - but it's not really germane to the topic of "Trump won' if he didn't.

Kyle Aaron

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #867 on: March 06, 2021, 12:46:11 AM »
If you're buying something that costs $20 and you hand me $60 in 20s and at least $20 of them is real, then yes, that's all that matters.
You would still be legally obliged to report him for trying to pass counterfeit bills, and the police would still be obliged to investigate.

So in your analogy, you are demonstrating the need for an independent electoral commission in the US along the lines of the AEC.

As a comparison, in a recent federal election, the AEC in Western Australia lost some 1,700 Senate votes - so the High Court sitting as the court of disputed returns, ordered them to hold the entire Senate election again. The numbers lost weren't enough to substantially change the result of the election, but it's considered that it's not enough that the process be honest, it must be seen to be honest. The process must be above reproach and beyond reasonable doubt.

As the second link notes, "About 90% of [survey] respondents have indicated “a great deal” or “a fair amount” of faith in the organisation." Would anyone say that about 90% of Americans have a great deal or fair amount of faith in the many and various organisations running US elections?

An independent electoral commission would help in this. What the US Secret Service does for the US currency, a USEC could do for elections.
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KingCheops

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #868 on: March 07, 2021, 12:17:08 PM »
Don't go passing out fake 20's while high on fentanyl.  You might become a saint.

Ghostmaker

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Re: LIVE COVERAGE of Rally for President Trump in DC! 01/06/2021
« Reply #869 on: March 07, 2021, 06:45:07 PM »
Don't go passing out fake 20's while high on fentanyl.  You might become a saint.
Only if you're the right skin tone.

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