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Author Topic: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?  (Read 23077 times)

Eirikrautha

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #615 on: May 07, 2022, 10:39:55 PM »

That's really unfair. You act like women go on and get pregnant and have abortions like their trading pokemon cards. Like women get abortions to score points like in video games.

You have no idea and you have no empathy.

Well no empathy, sure, but your kind aren't deserving of empathy, and neither are the women who use abortion as contraception, nor the ones doing all the irrational shrieking right now, over the vague prospect that the federal government *might* no longer be able to enforce a decree that exists just to affirm some bizarre notion that you aren't all evil monsters.

As for the idea, it's this, my fag:

HEY HEY, HO HO, ROE V WADE HAS GOT TO GO!

Do you like that idea? There's a fair chance that you might have to start getting used to it.

Hey yancy, you're a shitty human being.
He's not the one supporting infanticide simply for convenience.  Pretty sure that establishes exactly how little your judgment of anyone's character is worth...

yancy

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #616 on: May 07, 2022, 10:40:25 PM »
Hey yancy, you're a shitty human being.

I'd be disappointed if a garbage can masquerading as a hominid like you didn't feel that way, so thanks. However, I still feel obligated to point out that


HEY HEY, HO HO, ROE V WADE HAS GOT TO GO!
Quote from: Rhedyn
if you are against this, I assume you are racist.

jeff37923

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #617 on: May 07, 2022, 10:40:35 PM »


Republican or right winger? Those terms are not interchangeable. Except to a liar.



I'm curious... where is your distinction?

For me... I consider Adam Kinzinger, Mitt Romney, the sorely missed John McCain to be Republican. I consider trump and greene, boberts, McConnell and gaetz to be right wingers.

I mean, they're all Republicans in their own way, and they're all right of center. I agree with you that the first three you mention are my kind of Republican and the later three you mention are not my kind of Republican. But, they're all part of the party in some fashion.

For the woke cheerleaders, squishy RINO Republicans are in and Republicans who care about the USA and its citizens are out. We got it. Idiots vote in idiots because they have been propagandized to hate their own nation. Goo goo goo good job!
"I do not want to create a story, I want to create a stage. The player characters will perform on that stage and interact with the setting. When the players talk to their friends about what their characters did, then there will be a story."

jeff37923

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #618 on: May 07, 2022, 10:42:15 PM »
The core issue, to my thinking, is that we need a federal decision on what the legal status of a fetus is. Roe v Wade sidestepped this, and that's what led to it's inevitable challenging by the SCOTUS.
Sadly, the core issue has nothing to do with when human life begins.  It's about whether or not people are expected to live with the consequences of their own actions.  One does not randomly become pregnant.  And there is a large population of so-called "civilized" people (both male and female) who are willing to kill their own children in the womb to escape the consequences of sex.  At that point, there's very little hope that those people will ever seek understanding or compromise...

While I agree that their core issue is to evade the responsability of their own actions the point at where it's alive is relevant since they love to argue it's not life or a human life.

Problem: Unwanted pregnancy.

Solutions:
1.- Don't have sex (alternatively anal/oral sex doesn't get you pregnant)
2.- Contraceptives
3.- Plan B
4.- Give it in adoption.
5.- Put on your big girl panties and pay the piper
That's really unfair. You act like women go on and get pregnant and have abortions like their trading pokemon cards. Like women get abortions to score points like in video games.

You have no idea and you have no empathy.

98.5% of abortions are elective, ergo yes, they do take it like sports, they engage in an activity that risks certain outcomes and fail to take the adecuate precautions.

Condomns + the pill or gel or ovules or foam makes it more likely to get hit by lightning than getting pregnant.

240,000 people are struck by lightening every year.

The Pill has a 4% failure rate and condoms have a 3% failure rate (though misuse makes that number higher in reality - that's using it perfectly). So run the odds, and then multiply that by what, 50 times a year?

Birth control fails man. Even if you use it reasonably and take precautions it fails. And not a miniscule number of times - not when you factor the number of people having sex and how often they have sex. Abortion really isn't being used as birth control here - it's being used when birth control fails.

Why should the reader believe anything you say?
Got any proof to back up your numbers?
"I do not want to create a story, I want to create a stage. The player characters will perform on that stage and interact with the setting. When the players talk to their friends about what their characters did, then there will be a story."

GeekyBugle

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #619 on: May 08, 2022, 01:35:21 AM »
The core issue, to my thinking, is that we need a federal decision on what the legal status of a fetus is. Roe v Wade sidestepped this, and that's what led to it's inevitable challenging by the SCOTUS.
Sadly, the core issue has nothing to do with when human life begins.  It's about whether or not people are expected to live with the consequences of their own actions.  One does not randomly become pregnant.  And there is a large population of so-called "civilized" people (both male and female) who are willing to kill their own children in the womb to escape the consequences of sex.  At that point, there's very little hope that those people will ever seek understanding or compromise...

While I agree that their core issue is to evade the responsability of their own actions the point at where it's alive is relevant since they love to argue it's not life or a human life.

Problem: Unwanted pregnancy.

Solutions:
1.- Don't have sex (alternatively anal/oral sex doesn't get you pregnant)
2.- Contraceptives
3.- Plan B
4.- Give it in adoption.
5.- Put on your big girl panties and pay the piper
That's really unfair. You act like women go on and get pregnant and have abortions like their trading pokemon cards. Like women get abortions to score points like in video games.

You have no idea and you have no empathy.

98.5% of abortions are elective, ergo yes, they do take it like sports, they engage in an activity that risks certain outcomes and fail to take the adecuate precautions.

Condomns + the pill or gel or ovules or foam makes it more likely to get hit by lightning than getting pregnant. but the only way to make the risk zero is to not fuck.

You get on a plain put on a parachute and jump out at 3,000 feet. Both the main and the back up fail... Unintended and unexpected consecuences of your actions nobody else is to blame.

You have the right to close your legs
You have the right to use contraceptives
You have the right to get fixed
You have the right to give the baby for adoption
You have the right to become a parent
You don't have the right to murder a baby because you were careless.
Let’s turn this around and aim it at men:

You have the right to keep it in your pants
You have the right to wear a condom or use spermicide or other male-use contraceptives
You have the right to get a vasectomy
You have the right to fight for custody of your baby
You have the right to make that hoe you impregnated an honest woman
You don’t have the right to dump your baby on a hoe because you were careless or because your contraceptives were in the ineffective percentage

Do you agree or disagree? Why?

Lets take it by the numbers shall we?

You have the right to keep it in your pants Agreed 100%
You have the right to wear a condom or use spermicide or other male-use contraceptives Yep, so?
You have the right to get a vasectomy Of course
You have the right to fight for custody of your baby LOL, yes you have but the courts are stacked against you.
You have the right to make that hoe you impregnated an honest woman No, You have the OBLIGATION to make her an honest woman.
You don’t have the right to dump your baby on a hoe because you were careless or because your contraceptives were in the ineffective percentage YES.

You thought this only went one way?

The post is written like that because you don't see men (unless you consider male feminists men, I don't) clamoring for the "right" to kill babies.

But I find it interesting that you gave the men ZERO outs, while I recognize that giving the baby in adoption is a solution.

Could it be because you, like all society consider men SHOULD be responsible of their actions and face the consecuences? I do.

I also think that women aren't children and should be responsible of their actions and face the consecuences.

I'm an egalitarian.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

Mistwell

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #620 on: May 08, 2022, 01:47:09 AM »
The post is written like that because you don't see men (unless you consider male feminists men, I don't) clamoring for the "right" to kill babies.



GeekyBugle

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #621 on: May 08, 2022, 01:52:20 AM »
The core issue, to my thinking, is that we need a federal decision on what the legal status of a fetus is. Roe v Wade sidestepped this, and that's what led to it's inevitable challenging by the SCOTUS.
Sadly, the core issue has nothing to do with when human life begins.  It's about whether or not people are expected to live with the consequences of their own actions.  One does not randomly become pregnant.  And there is a large population of so-called "civilized" people (both male and female) who are willing to kill their own children in the womb to escape the consequences of sex.  At that point, there's very little hope that those people will ever seek understanding or compromise...

While I agree that their core issue is to evade the responsability of their own actions the point at where it's alive is relevant since they love to argue it's not life or a human life.

Problem: Unwanted pregnancy.

Solutions:
1.- Don't have sex (alternatively anal/oral sex doesn't get you pregnant)
2.- Contraceptives
3.- Plan B
4.- Give it in adoption.
5.- Put on your big girl panties and pay the piper
That's really unfair. You act like women go on and get pregnant and have abortions like their trading pokemon cards. Like women get abortions to score points like in video games.

You have no idea and you have no empathy.

98.5% of abortions are elective, ergo yes, they do take it like sports, they engage in an activity that risks certain outcomes and fail to take the adecuate precautions.

Condomns + the pill or gel or ovules or foam makes it more likely to get hit by lightning than getting pregnant.

240,000 people are struck by lightening every year.

The Pill has a 4% failure rate and condoms have a 3% failure rate (though misuse makes that number higher in reality - that's using it perfectly). So run the odds, and then multiply that by what, 50 times a year? That's .4 x .3 = .06% chance of failure using both a condom and The Pill at the same time. So .06% x sex slightly less than once a week is 3% chance of failure every year. So for every 100 people having sex once a week, 3 of them will end up pregnant while using both The Pill and a condom.

Now look at the abortion rates, which are actually rather low these days. You can pretty easily see a large portion of them are from that failure rate.

Birth control fails man. Even if you use it reasonably and take precautions it fails. And not a miniscule number of times - not when you factor the number of people having sex and how often they have sex. Abortion really isn't being used as birth control here - it's being used when birth control fails.

And as soon as you say, "so don't have sex" you're moralizing in a way that you simply wouldn't accept if someone tried to apply their morality to you like that. I mean, the entire anti-woke movement is based on rejecting the moralization of others.

Lets see IF your claims hold water shall we?

People struck by lightning per year... The science says: https://www.statista.com/statistics/203715/injuries-and-fatalities-caused-by-lightning-in-the-us/
https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-odds
Mistwell swings aaaaaaand it's a strike!

Anticonceptive pill Effectiveness : https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/how-effective-contraception/
Mistwell swings again and it's strike number two!

Condom effectiveness: https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/male-condoms/
Strike three and you're out!

As for your other calculations those are numbers you pulled out of your ass.

Yes, I'm moralizing, just like you're pretending to moralize women into being children incapable of being responsible and facing the consecuences of their actions.

By engaging in sex, you take the risks, those risks may be minimized but the only way to make them zero is to not engage in the activity.

I'll never die due to jumping from a plane for sport and my parachutes failing. Wanna know how I can be sure? I would never jump from a plane for fun.

But for those who do? The risk is always there.

Likewise with sex, the risk is always there unless you're sterile, or fixed. If you're not ready to cafe the consecuences of your actions don't jump from the fucking plane for fun!
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

GeekyBugle

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #622 on: May 08, 2022, 01:55:15 AM »
The post is written like that because you don't see men (unless you consider male feminists men, I don't) clamoring for the "right" to kill babies.



More missleading numbers?

Mixed, neither and no option not shown.

What age? What political party? Where? Size of the sample? What was the exact question?

There's lies, damn lies and statistics.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

GeekyBugle

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #623 on: May 08, 2022, 02:02:52 AM »
The core issue, to my thinking, is that we need a federal decision on what the legal status of a fetus is. Roe v Wade sidestepped this, and that's what led to it's inevitable challenging by the SCOTUS.
Sadly, the core issue has nothing to do with when human life begins.  It's about whether or not people are expected to live with the consequences of their own actions.  One does not randomly become pregnant.  And there is a large population of so-called "civilized" people (both male and female) who are willing to kill their own children in the womb to escape the consequences of sex.  At that point, there's very little hope that those people will ever seek understanding or compromise...

While I agree that their core issue is to evade the responsability of their own actions the point at where it's alive is relevant since they love to argue it's not life or a human life.

Problem: Unwanted pregnancy.

Solutions:
1.- Don't have sex (alternatively anal/oral sex doesn't get you pregnant)
2.- Contraceptives
3.- Plan B
4.- Give it in adoption.
5.- Put on your big girl panties and pay the piper
That's really unfair. You act like women go on and get pregnant and have abortions like their trading pokemon cards. Like women get abortions to score points like in video games.

You have no idea and you have no empathy.

98.5% of abortions are elective, ergo yes, they do take it like sports, they engage in an activity that risks certain outcomes and fail to take the adecuate precautions.

Condomns + the pill or gel or ovules or foam makes it more likely to get hit by lightning than getting pregnant. but the only way to make the risk zero is to not fuck.

You get on a plain put on a parachute and jump out at 3,000 feet. Both the main and the back up fail... Unintended and unexpected consecuences of your actions nobody else is to blame.

You have the right to close your legs
You have the right to use contraceptives
You have the right to get fixed
You have the right to give the baby for adoption
You have the right to become a parent
You don't have the right to murder a baby because you were careless.
Let’s turn this around and aim it at men:

You have the right to keep it in your pants
You have the right to wear a condom or use spermicide or other male-use contraceptives
You have the right to get a vasectomy
You have the right to fight for custody of your baby
You have the right to make that hoe you impregnated an honest woman
You don’t have the right to dump your baby on a hoe because you were careless or because your contraceptives were in the ineffective percentage

Do you agree or disagree? Why?

Of course men should be doing these things.  But it's not just one person - both people need to be responsible.  How do you address cases where the father isn't even informed that his partner is pregnant so that an informed discussion can occur?

They don't. If she wants the baby and you don't you're fucked, if she doesn't want the baby and you do you're fucked if she doesn't inform you she's pregnant "her body her choice" and it's violence to ask her, if she decides to burden you with the baby of lebron down the street you're fucked.

If she wants a divorce you're fucked and good luck getting some visitation rights even if she's a POS.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

Mistwell

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #624 on: May 08, 2022, 02:09:31 AM »
Lets see IF your claims hold water shall we?

People struck by lightning per year... The science says: https://www.statista.com/statistics/203715/injuries-and-fatalities-caused-by-lightning-in-the-us/
https://www.weather.gov/safety/lightning-odds
Mistwell swings aaaaaaand it's a strike!

BUZZ! Wrong. I didn't say U.S.. I am surprised you, of all people, would make such an obvious error. Here you go.

Quote
Anticonceptive pill Effectiveness : https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/how-effective-contraception/
Mistwell swings again and it's strike number two!

Oh NOW you quote UK stats, with the last one U.S. stats? Shift much? Here you go. I was actually giving you the more conservative number.

Quote
Condom effectiveness: https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/male-condoms/
Strike three and you're out!

Back to the UK again? Wrong again. Here you go.

Quote
As for your other calculations those are numbers you pulled out of your ass.

Oh how embarrassing for you that you didn't consider I was pulling from links with those quotes.

Quote
Yes, I'm moralizing

Well I am glad we agree on something. But you failed to respond to the rest. You wouldn't accept me, or anyone else you disagreed with, moralizing like that for you. So get your moralizing out of here you puritan.

Mistwell

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #625 on: May 08, 2022, 02:14:22 AM »
The post is written like that because you don't see men (unless you consider male feminists men, I don't) clamoring for the "right" to kill babies.



More missleading numbers?

Mixed, neither and no option not shown.

What age? What political party? Where? Size of the sample? What was the exact question?

There's lies, damn lies and statistics.

Here you go.

Large numbers of men identify as pro-choice. There is no way to spin that fact as anything more plain and truthful than that. We can quibble about the exact percentage, but ultimately it comes down to simply that a large and meaningful number of men identify as pro-choice, whether you like it or not, whether you know them or not, whether you ever escape your personal bubble of people or not.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2022, 02:22:59 AM by Mistwell »

yancy

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #626 on: May 08, 2022, 02:22:04 AM »
Here you go.

Sure, sure man, you're right, whatever you say. I don't want anything bad happening to my wife :(
Quote from: Rhedyn
if you are against this, I assume you are racist.

jhkim

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #627 on: May 08, 2022, 06:39:18 AM »
Condomns + the pill or gel or ovules or foam makes it more likely to get hit by lightning than getting pregnant.

The Pill has a 4% failure rate and condoms have a 3% failure rate (though misuse makes that number higher in reality - that's using it perfectly). So run the odds, and then multiply that by what, 50 times a year? That's .4 x .3 = .06% chance of failure using both a condom and The Pill at the same time. So .06% x sex slightly less than once a week is 3% chance of failure every year. So for every 100 people having sex once a week, 3 of them will end up pregnant while using both The Pill and a condom.

Anticonceptive pill Effectiveness : https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/how-effective-contraception/
Mistwell swings again and it's strike number two!

Condom effectiveness: https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/contraception/male-condoms/
Strike three and you're out!

According to your own links:

Quote
Combined contraceptive pill

Perfect use: more than 99% effective. Fewer than 1 in 100 women will get pregnant in a year when using the combined pill correctly.
Typical use: around 91% effective. Around 9 in 100 women using the combined pill will get pregnant in a year.

Quote
Male condoms

Perfect use: 98% effective. This means that 2 in 100 women whose partners use a condom will get pregnant in a year.
Typical use: around 82% effective. This means around 18 in 100 women will get pregnant in a year.

These are different than Mistwell's numbers for perfect use - but it's still a significant chance and especially, it emphasizes that typical use has much higher failure rates. From your own source for typical couples using both the condom and the pill, the combined failure rate is around 1.6% (9% * 18% = 1.6%).
« Last Edit: May 08, 2022, 06:59:17 AM by jhkim »

oggsmash

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #628 on: May 08, 2022, 07:05:52 AM »
  I have no doubts plenty of men in the USA are just as pro abortion as the women.  I also would not be surprised if there were more than women that are pro abortion.  What guy would want to be tied to a woman who makes such bad decisions, especially when you are a man who makes bad decisions.  I just rather they all cop to what they are really doing (killing a kid), ensure NO public funds finance or subsidize it, and go ahead and embrace that democracy we all cherish so much and let the legislatures decide it, not judicial activism.

   Failure rates of contraception are largely tied to "user error".   I think if you are going to engage in a very adult activity, might be best to take the time as an adult to learn how the contraception works.
« Last Edit: May 08, 2022, 07:07:58 AM by oggsmash »

BoxCrayonTales

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Re: It's time for the USA to balkanize. How can that happen peacefully?
« Reply #629 on: May 08, 2022, 08:50:05 AM »
I support abortion access because we live in an imperfect world. Shit happens.

I believe that every male should be legally compelled to bank their sperm and get a vasectomy. But obviously that’s not gonna happen even though it would reduce the abortion rate to near zero.

The best we can do is do what other countries have done. Make it easier to get contraception, social safety nets for single mothers, etc… and the abortion rate will go down.