This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.
The RPGPundit's Own Forum Rules
This part of the site is controlled by the RPGPundit. This is where he discusses topics that he finds interesting. You may post here, but understand that there are limits. The RPGPundit can shut down any thread, topic of discussion, or user in a thread at his pleasure. This part of the site is essentially his house, so keep that in mind. Note that this is the only part of the site where political discussion is permitted, but is regulated by the RPGPundit.

Author Topic: Here's your Mask Protocol  (Read 71481 times)

jhkim

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11746
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #240 on: May 05, 2021, 02:49:32 PM »
And yeah, sometimes non-violent protestors get tased.
So you're saying that last summer should have been the Summer of the Taser?

I think there's a problem of people looking only at the news headlines of their chosen politics, and get differently-biased views of policing.

To liberal people watching only liberal media, then there are dozens of cases of police abuse or killing of non-white people and peaceful protesters -- and white conservatives acting violent and are arrested peacefully or even let go.

To conservative people watching only conservative media, then there are dozens of cases of police abuse of white people acting peacefully -- and non-white people acting violent and being arrested peacefully or even let go.

I think judging from the generality of police behavior from a handful of cases isn't accurate. The police aren't one-sidedly either stereotype, and it's difficult to judge the spectrum of their behavior - but I also don't think it's necessary. One can say that it's wrong for the police to abuse and offer violence to people peacefully breaking the law regardless of their politics. We can talk about how police use of force independent of political side.

Ghostmaker

  • Chlorine trifluoride
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4013
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #241 on: May 05, 2021, 05:57:37 PM »
It's very simple. Pull out your copy of the Constitution. Go to Amendment One.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

That last part is the relevant bit. Peaceably assemble. PEACEABLY.

Hence why I was pissed as hell at the 1/6 mess. Although I'm even more pissed that the feds are holding persons without bail or trial while letting BLM and Antifa fucktards walk free, despite certainly being far more dangerous than the guy who stole Nancy Pelosi's podium.

(Also, the FBI is a pack of morons. They managed to kick in the door of a couple who were at the rally but didn't go anywhere near the Capitol buildings, based on a blurry picture that showed a woman in a  similar jacket. Holy fuck, and people thought the J. Edgar Hoover days were bad.)

Pat
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • ?
  • Posts: 5252
  • Rats do 0 damage
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #242 on: May 05, 2021, 07:24:10 PM »
i get why people have fun pointing out supposed hypocrisy but consider: we are now an openly politically tribal sociey, so yes it is indeed okay when it hurts them and not us, because it's them and not us.
I throw bricks at both sides. And if the second amendment allowed, I'd be throwing nukes. I'm mostly peaceful like that.

it does allow they're just real heavy and hard to throw and it doesn't have any language about planes or launch silos.

that's how Big Nuke gets ya, you buy the war
head and learn you can't get a silo
12th century technology to the rescue!
https://youtu.be/cs8gamnMIS0?t=50

Zelen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 861
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #243 on: May 05, 2021, 07:27:48 PM »
It's been pretty well known for over a year that risk of transmission outdoors, as long as you're not right up on top of other people, is so miniscule that there's no rational reason to argue for restriction on outdoor activities. People ought to be encouraged to go outdoors because getting sunlight and physical activity is way more beneficial to your overall health (& specific defense against the-deadliest-virus-ever) than the risks you face by not locking yourself in and cowering.

moonsweeper

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 944
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #244 on: May 05, 2021, 07:29:18 PM »
i get why people have fun pointing out supposed hypocrisy but consider: we are now an openly politically tribal sociey, so yes it is indeed okay when it hurts them and not us, because it's them and not us.
I throw bricks at both sides. And if the second amendment allowed, I'd be throwing nukes. I'm mostly peaceful like that.

it does allow they're just real heavy and hard to throw and it doesn't have any language about planes or launch silos.

that's how Big Nuke gets ya, you buy the war
head and learn you can't get a silo
12th century technology to the rescue!
https://youtu.be/cs8gamnMIS0?t=50

Remember...close counts with horseshoes, hand grenades, and thermonuclear weapons!
"I have a very hard time taking seriously someone who has the time and resources to protest capitalism, while walking around in Nike shoes and drinking Starbucks, while filming it on their iPhone."  --  Alderaan Crumbs

"Just, can you make it The Ramones at least? I only listen to Abba when I want to fuck a stripper." -- Jeff37923

"Government is the only entity that relies on its failures to justify the expansion of its powers." -- David Freiheit (Viva Frei)

Pat
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • ?
  • Posts: 5252
  • Rats do 0 damage
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #245 on: May 05, 2021, 07:43:10 PM »
And yeah, sometimes non-violent protestors get tased.
So you're saying that last summer should have been the Summer of the Taser?

I think there's a problem of people looking only at the news headlines of their chosen politics, and get differently-biased views of policing.

To liberal people watching only liberal media, then there are dozens of cases of police abuse or killing of non-white people and peaceful protesters -- and white conservatives acting violent and are arrested peacefully or even let go.

To conservative people watching only conservative media, then there are dozens of cases of police abuse of white people acting peacefully -- and non-white people acting violent and being arrested peacefully or even let go.

I think judging from the generality of police behavior from a handful of cases isn't accurate. The police aren't one-sidedly either stereotype, and it's difficult to judge the spectrum of their behavior - but I also don't think it's necessary. One can say that it's wrong for the police to abuse and offer violence to people peacefully breaking the law regardless of their politics. We can talk about how police use of force independent of political side.
There's a massive difference between riots in a hundred cities and towns, 30+ dead, 150 federal buildings burned, and billions of dollars of damage. And prosecutors are dropping most of the felony charges, including violence against cops that was caught on camera.

Versus an "insurrection" where the cops pulled aside the barricades and invited people in, who stayed behind the ropes, and didn't smash the statues. And yes, a small contingent broke down some doors, took pictures of themselves muddying the desks of important nobles, and maybe swiped some stuff like laptops. And 1 got shot by a cop (the other 4 deaths are now known to be just unfortunate medical emergencies). And who are now being hunted down like terrorists.

You're making a false equivalence. Yes, there have been bad actors on both sides, but one side has been far worse, yet it's the other side who are being demonized by the press and hounded by the law out of proportion to their actions. Mostly, because of partisan politics. But significantly, because the protest was against the people in power, at their seat of power, and the reaction of the power-elite was a clear-fuck-no-we-can't-allow-this, based on a sense of noble privilege, and expressed as outrage at these common plebs who dared to intrude on their sacred place and defile their precious property with grubby hands.

The latter in particular pisses me off. Fuck partisanship and bias, sure. They suck. But the Capitol is not the palace of the oligarchy. It's supposed to be the place where the voice of all people are heard. If we are going to protect the right to protest anywhere, it should be there. But the response of the entitled on both sides, like Schumer and McConnell, shows they think they're the kings and queens and how dare we.

Pat
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • ?
  • Posts: 5252
  • Rats do 0 damage
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #246 on: May 05, 2021, 07:45:15 PM »
i get why people have fun pointing out supposed hypocrisy but consider: we are now an openly politically tribal sociey, so yes it is indeed okay when it hurts them and not us, because it's them and not us.
I throw bricks at both sides. And if the second amendment allowed, I'd be throwing nukes. I'm mostly peaceful like that.

it does allow they're just real heavy and hard to throw and it doesn't have any language about planes or launch silos.

that's how Big Nuke gets ya, you buy the war
head and learn you can't get a silo
12th century technology to the rescue!
https://youtu.be/cs8gamnMIS0?t=50

Remember...close counts with horseshoes, hand grenades, and thermonuclear weapons!
And anthrax!

moonsweeper

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 944
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #247 on: May 05, 2021, 07:53:37 PM »
i get why people have fun pointing out supposed hypocrisy but consider: we are now an openly politically tribal sociey, so yes it is indeed okay when it hurts them and not us, because it's them and not us.
I throw bricks at both sides. And if the second amendment allowed, I'd be throwing nukes. I'm mostly peaceful like that.

it does allow they're just real heavy and hard to throw and it doesn't have any language about planes or launch silos.

that's how Big Nuke gets ya, you buy the war
head and learn you can't get a silo
12th century technology to the rescue!
https://youtu.be/cs8gamnMIS0?t=50

Remember...close counts with horseshoes, hand grenades, and thermonuclear weapons!
And anthrax!
Doesn't that depend on how far the trebuchet can throw the sheep?
"I have a very hard time taking seriously someone who has the time and resources to protest capitalism, while walking around in Nike shoes and drinking Starbucks, while filming it on their iPhone."  --  Alderaan Crumbs

"Just, can you make it The Ramones at least? I only listen to Abba when I want to fuck a stripper." -- Jeff37923

"Government is the only entity that relies on its failures to justify the expansion of its powers." -- David Freiheit (Viva Frei)

SHARK

  • The Great Shark Hope
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5040
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #248 on: May 05, 2021, 08:04:50 PM »
And yeah, sometimes non-violent protestors get tased.
So you're saying that last summer should have been the Summer of the Taser?

I think there's a problem of people looking only at the news headlines of their chosen politics, and get differently-biased views of policing.

To liberal people watching only liberal media, then there are dozens of cases of police abuse or killing of non-white people and peaceful protesters -- and white conservatives acting violent and are arrested peacefully or even let go.

To conservative people watching only conservative media, then there are dozens of cases of police abuse of white people acting peacefully -- and non-white people acting violent and being arrested peacefully or even let go.

I think judging from the generality of police behavior from a handful of cases isn't accurate. The police aren't one-sidedly either stereotype, and it's difficult to judge the spectrum of their behavior - but I also don't think it's necessary. One can say that it's wrong for the police to abuse and offer violence to people peacefully breaking the law regardless of their politics. We can talk about how police use of force independent of political side.
There's a massive difference between riots in a hundred cities and towns, 30+ dead, 150 federal buildings burned, and billions of dollars of damage. And prosecutors are dropping most of the felony charges, including violence against cops that was caught on camera.

Versus an "insurrection" where the cops pulled aside the barricades and invited people in, who stayed behind the ropes, and didn't smash the statues. And yes, a small contingent broke down some doors, took pictures of themselves muddying the desks of important nobles, and maybe swiped some stuff like laptops. And 1 got shot by a cop (the other 4 deaths are now known to be just unfortunate medical emergencies). And who are now being hunted down like terrorists.

You're making a false equivalence. Yes, there have been bad actors on both sides, but one side has been far worse, yet it's the other side who are being demonized by the press and hounded by the law out of proportion to their actions. Mostly, because of partisan politics. But significantly, because the protest was against the people in power, at their seat of power, and the reaction of the power-elite was a clear-fuck-no-we-can't-allow-this, based on a sense of noble privilege, and expressed as outrage at these common plebs who dared to intrude on their sacred place and defile their precious property with grubby hands.

The latter in particular pisses me off. Fuck partisanship and bias, sure. They suck. But the Capitol is not the palace of the oligarchy. It's supposed to be the place where the voice of all people are heard. If we are going to protect the right to protest anywhere, it should be there. But the response of the entitled on both sides, like Schumer and McConnell, shows they think they're the kings and queens and how dare we.

Greetings!

Exactly, Pat! Very well said. ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

jhkim

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11746
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #249 on: May 05, 2021, 08:50:31 PM »
I think judging from the generality of police behavior from a handful of cases isn't accurate. The police aren't one-sidedly either stereotype, and it's difficult to judge the spectrum of their behavior - but I also don't think it's necessary. One can say that it's wrong for the police to abuse and offer violence to people peacefully breaking the law regardless of their politics. We can talk about how police use of force independent of political side.

There's a massive difference between riots in a hundred cities and towns, 30+ dead, 150 federal buildings burned, and billions of dollars of damage. And prosecutors are dropping most of the felony charges, including violence against cops that was caught on camera.

Versus an "insurrection" where the cops pulled aside the barricades and invited people in, who stayed behind the ropes, and didn't smash the statues. And yes, a small contingent broke down some doors, took pictures of themselves muddying the desks of important nobles, and maybe swiped some stuff like laptops. And 1 got shot by a cop (the other 4 deaths are now known to be just unfortunate medical emergencies). And who are now being hunted down like terrorists.

You're making a false equivalence.

Pat - you're talking about Black Lives Matter versus the Capitol riot -- but political protest hasn't been the subject of the thread, and I certainly never mentioned them. We had been talking about covid, and most recently about police enforcement of masks. Zelen characterized this as the government sending out "stormtroopers with guns to physically and psychologically terrorize innocent people" - and we noted the Logan Ohio tasing incident.

This is a bait and switch - claiming that I'm drawing an equivalence between BLM and the Capitol riot when I never mentioned either, or about political protests at all in this thread.

This Guy
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • ?
  • Posts: 642
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #250 on: May 05, 2021, 08:55:26 PM »
i get why people have fun pointing out supposed hypocrisy but consider: we are now an openly politically tribal sociey, so yes it is indeed okay when it hurts them and not us, because it's them and not us.
I throw bricks at both sides. And if the second amendment allowed, I'd be throwing nukes. I'm mostly peaceful like that.

it does allow they're just real heavy and hard to throw and it doesn't have any language about planes or launch silos.

that's how Big Nuke gets ya, you buy the war
head and learn you can't get a silo
12th century technology to the rescue!
https://youtu.be/cs8gamnMIS0?t=50

feel like that's gonna end real bad for anything bigger'n a Davy Crockett but maybe if you got like a remote control on the trebuchet.
I don't want to play with you.

Pat
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • ?
  • Posts: 5252
  • Rats do 0 damage
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #251 on: May 05, 2021, 09:33:57 PM »
Pat - you're talking about Black Lives Matter versus the Capitol riot -- but political protest hasn't been the subject of the thread, and I certainly never mentioned them. We had been talking about covid, and most recently about police enforcement of masks. Zelen characterized this as the government sending out "stormtroopers with guns to physically and psychologically terrorize innocent people" - and we noted the Logan Ohio tasing incident.

This is a bait and switch - claiming that I'm drawing an equivalence between BLM and the Capitol riot when I never mentioned either, or about political protests at all in this thread.
It's not a bait and switch. You were talking about police killing protestors, and people on the other side doing the same and being let go; and vice versa. I did bring in new elements, but you had already broadened the discussion beyond masks.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 09:37:49 PM by Pat »

Mistwell

  • Smarter than Arduin
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5289
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #252 on: May 05, 2021, 09:41:33 PM »
And yeah, sometimes non-violent protestors get tased.
So you're saying that last summer should have been the Summer of the Taser?

No, no, no Pat...

Last summer was ok because it supported the correct overall political objective. 
It is only a problem when it opposes your political objective.

Fuck that. Some of what happened in Portland definitely could have used some tasing. And not one of you fuckers would have objected to it either. Look, you want to protest on your own property, cool. You want to protest of public property without interfering with others, also cool. But you don't get to protest on someone else's property like the Logan Stadium, trespass and refuse to leave, without consequences. Getting your ass tased is one of those possible consequences. I know you all get that, when it's not some cause you agree with. This wasn't the sidewalk or some public square this was a ticketed event at Logan Stadium and she refused to follow the stadium rules and refused to leave. So yeah, she go her ass tased. Every one of you would have been fine if this were some BLM protestor at Logan Stadium.
« Last Edit: May 05, 2021, 09:45:30 PM by Mistwell »

Pat
BANNED

  • BANNED
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • ?
  • Posts: 5252
  • Rats do 0 damage
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #253 on: May 05, 2021, 09:48:37 PM »
Fuck that. Some of what happened in Portland definitely could have used some tasing. And not one of you fuckers would have objected to it either. Look, you want to protest on your own property, cool. You want to protest of public property without interfering with others, also cool. But you don't get to protest on someone else's private property, trespass and refuse to leave, without consequences. Getting your ass tased is one of those possible consequences. I know you all get that, when it's not some cause you agree with.
<tases Mistwell>

Ratman_tf

  • Alt-Reich Shitlord
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8330
Re: Here's your Mask Protocol
« Reply #254 on: May 05, 2021, 10:47:14 PM »
It's been pretty well known for over a year that risk of transmission outdoors, as long as you're not right up on top of other people, is so miniscule that there's no rational reason to argue for restriction on outdoor activities. People ought to be encouraged to go outdoors because getting sunlight and physical activity is way more beneficial to your overall health (& specific defense against the-deadliest-virus-ever) than the risks you face by not locking yourself in and cowering.

The irony of Covid is that people locking down helped increase the spread of the virus in places like nursing homes, which held people in the higher risk categories.

The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung