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Author Topic: Dark Albion: the Origin Thread  (Read 31028 times)

Mathias

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #15 on: July 01, 2011, 02:32:50 PM »
Great stuff! I'll certainly be making use of it.

Are the inhabitants of Frogland allusions to Warhammer's Fimir, or did you have something else in mind? Just curious here, I'd be inclined to spin them as Fimir.
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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2011, 02:51:40 PM »
Quote from: RPGPundit;466291
I don't see why.  Frankly, its far more useful to have Scotland as the ultimate "savage frontier".  And I mean, there can be all kinds of little kingdoms from one clan or another there, but the main gist of it is that once you're north of Hadrian's Wall, there's no safety-net of civilization, however illusory, that you get when you're in, say, Salisbury.

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To each their own, but that doesn't really fit in with Dialling up the Historical Reality to 11 though. Anyway, you already have Ireland is the Savage Fronter, which makes duplicating it in Scotland rather redundant.

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2011, 02:59:33 PM »
Bit hard for it to serve the frontier role when it's over one of the most treacherous stretches of sea in the world :S

I think most people respect Scotland as a cultured and civilised country we just prefer to think of them represented by Glasgow on a Saturday Night.
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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #18 on: July 01, 2011, 03:42:19 PM »
Quote from: Aporon;466298
Great stuff! I'll certainly be making use of it.

Are the inhabitants of Frogland allusions to Warhammer's Fimir, or did you have something else in mind? Just curious here, I'd be inclined to spin them as Fimir.


I was thinking of them along the lines of Blackmoor's "Temple of the Frog". But you'd be of course welcome to think of them however you like.

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #19 on: July 01, 2011, 03:45:54 PM »
Quote from: jadrax;466306
Anyway, you already have Ireland is the Savage Fronter, which makes duplicating it in Scotland rather redundant.

Plus, the plantations in Ulster, leading to many of today's troubles, didn't start until the middle of the 16th century.
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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #20 on: July 01, 2011, 03:54:05 PM »
Anyways, the main thing is that I fail to see what would be gained from having a civilized Scotland.  How would that improve the campaign?  Especially compared with the alternative, where you can have the Scots be dangerous clever barbarians if need be?

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #21 on: July 01, 2011, 04:01:37 PM »
Well you could have Scotland and Ireland as the last bastions of art, culture, and civilisation, while everyone in Albion is terrified of the watery-eyed lunatics orfing everyone's 'ead as the offcolour neurons in their heads fire out of sequence. Sort of like the Return of the Jedi. I believe Michael Moorcock wrote something along those lines, although the title escapes me.
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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #22 on: July 01, 2011, 04:03:17 PM »
Guard 1: "I say what's that large orange hedge moving towards us"

Guard 2: "That's not a hedge that's the Scotts"
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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #23 on: July 01, 2011, 04:18:28 PM »
Quote from: RPGPundit;466315
Anyways, the main thing is that I fail to see what would be gained from having a civilized Scotland.  How would that improve the campaign?  Especially compared with the alternative, where you can have the Scots be dangerous clever barbarians if need be?

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Depends on the campaign, but a political enemy to the north that is stronger, faster, more developed and pretty much better across the board strikes me as a far more interesting situation than a bunch of barbarians. They are the great foes that might just wipe England of the map if people aren't careful. Which gives a lot of scope for politicking. Especially when the Scottish Crown is worn by James II, whose love artillery led him to attempt to invade the Isle of Man (of course he died when a cannon he was testing blew up, but if anything that's even more awesome). On the anti Monarch side a more historical version of Scotland also gets you 'Black Douglas' and his league of nefariously named Scottish gentlemen into the bargain. (Honestly, nothing can make a campaign better than 'Black Douglas' dispatching 'Alexander "Tiger" Lindsay' from his highland castle to deal with the PCs!)

In WFRP terms, Scotland is the Middenland to England's Riekland (Or even possibly the other way round when it comes to artillery).

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #24 on: July 01, 2011, 04:29:39 PM »
How about a mysterious isolationist kingdom that the Albioners percieve as a savage wasteland but is in fact about a century ahead of them.

The "Savages" they see are just the footsoldiers/workforce
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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #25 on: July 02, 2011, 01:30:28 AM »
Funny you posted this! Lots of good ideas. I have been playing around with a dark medieval fantasy OD&D retrowhatever and I went with the idea of 987 with the overwhelmingly corrupt Church promising the return of the Lord in 1000. I wanted to go with the king slain, war of nobles, church collapsing under corruption, rise of witches and warlocks and Britannica being the only nation not yet conquered by the Devil. In addition to dungeons, there would be actual entrances to the Underworld whose lower caverns would lead to Hell.

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #26 on: July 02, 2011, 02:13:25 AM »
Quote from: The Traveller;466317
Well you could have Scotland and Ireland as the last bastions of art, culture, and civilisation, while everyone in Albion is terrified of the watery-eyed lunatics orfing everyone's 'ead as the offcolour neurons in their heads fire out of sequence. Sort of like the Return of the Jedi. I believe Michael Moorcock wrote something along those lines, although the title escapes me.


I basically reject the idea that Scotland at this time was more advanced.  Certainly it was (very briefly) in a state of superior stability to England, but that's about it.

As for what others have mentioned, re. the invasion of the Isle of Man, Black Douglas, etc, can still end up being used in this campaign; all you have to assume is that some regions of Scots Land are relatively stable and have relatively advanced culture or have strong relations with enemies of Albion (ie. the Frogmen).

Anyways, people can obviously do what they will, but I think I'm sticking to the whole Scots-as-relative-barbarians concept.  Maybe closer to Dwarves in some ways, ie. fairly advanced in certain areas but with a culture that is more restricted in what it cares about.  Whereas the Picts are just basically evil savages.

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #27 on: July 02, 2011, 02:14:20 AM »
Quote from: Spinachcat;466355
Funny you posted this! Lots of good ideas. I have been playing around with a dark medieval fantasy OD&D retrowhatever and I went with the idea of 987 with the overwhelmingly corrupt Church promising the return of the Lord in 1000. I wanted to go with the king slain, war of nobles, church collapsing under corruption, rise of witches and warlocks and Britannica being the only nation not yet conquered by the Devil. In addition to dungeons, there would be actual entrances to the Underworld whose lower caverns would lead to Hell.


Well, that sounds nice too, though far  more over-the-top than my setting.

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #28 on: July 03, 2011, 05:50:02 PM »
Scotland would be interesting as a barbarian kingdom. It could be a dangerous military adversary of England, when the King manages to unite all the clans, and at the same time a lawless adventuring ground. There is a long tradition of such descriptions - eg Walter Scott.

You have outright primitive Celtic barbarians - Highland Clans, half-civilized treacherous bandits - Border Clans, and in the middle most civilised Lowland Scots - the source of the power of the king - but the rural areas are still ruled by mostly lawless lords and knights. In cities there is a certain tendency to heresy, religious enthusiasm and witch-burning. Highland Clans are nearly Pagan.

Pics should be based on Machen and Robert Howard (Worms of the Earth). They used to be a barbarian tribe worshipping Chaos gods (as in Howard's Conan stories), but the sorcery and Chaos worship caused them to degenerate. They are now soulless creatures of Chaos; when they emerge on the surface, they assume a mostly human, if degenarated shape, but underground and even above ground at night they tend to change, sometimes subtly, sometimes quite obviously. They can became mostly animal-like. When the influence of Chaos grows, esp during ceremonies, sacrifices, their hands and legs can fuse together and they can become snake-like. During the greatest ceremonies with human sacrifices, whole tribes can fuse together into one ooze-like creature.

Picts like to abduct women and children, for use in sacrifices, but primarily to keep their genetic stock from degenerating so far they become permanently an ooze. Their chiefs are most human of them - they marry exclusively abducted women.

Picts can be threatened into cooperation, but cannot be converted from Chaos-worship. Any attempt is meaningless, since they think exclusively in Chaos-categories, and cannot even understand what it means not to worship Chaos. This applies mostly to chiefs and sorcerers, because other Picts speak only in their own language, which to all non-Picts seems to consists only of animal-like screeches and is unintelligible.

Consequently, Picts have very primitive technology - and cannot be taught anything higher - but powerful magic.

Kings of Scotland have some kind of pact with them and occasionally use them in war, but try not to do this too often or to be too obvious about it - Chaos worship is not that popular amongst their (other) subject, esp. the witch-burners of cities.
 

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Dark Albion: the Origin Thread
« Reply #29 on: July 03, 2011, 06:22:13 PM »
Is there a reason for having Ulster rather than Dublin region as the centre of Albion settlement in Ireland?  Historically Ulster was a centre of resistance to English expansion, which is why the English/British sent the lowland Scots and other planters in there in the 17th century, to replace a particularly bloody minded bunch of Irishmen with closely related but Protestant settlers.  If you look at a map of the British Isles, Ulster is not an obvious place for England to *start* colonisation of Ireland.