Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.

[Garry G]

I don't have any sons.  I have three daughters.  If I had sons, yes, they would get the HPV vaccine, too.

You'd be right. My boys will be getting the HPV vaccine.

[Pat]

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-restrictions-update-regional-lockdown-extended-changing-restrictions-everything-to-know-explainer/a74df2ef-f025-4a98-b4ab-fce6dc2fddb2

1 hour of exercise per day, no more. Only emergency services and healthcare workers can leave. If you live alone, you're allowed to nominate one and only one visitor, and they must be registered with the government. Masks everywhere outside the home, except when exercising.

Entertainingly, this main thrust of the article is that Australians are being given "new freedoms". (If you can demonstrate proof of vax, you're allowed to spend 2 hours exercising, and can even visit a park!)

Good thing the fascists already took away everyone's guns.

[Mistwell]

And you're being a douchebag.

HA! No I was being serious but you took it as sarcasm.

Only you would take me saying I admire you as douchebaggery.

You quoted HappyDaze saying I used weasel words to support my bullshit, agreeing with and saying I was good at it. There's no sarcasm there, just a flat-out insult.

It really wasn't. I said the lawyer in me recognized it and I said I admired your skill. Everyone spins things sometimes Pat, and you're no stranger to spin. Being skilled at spin IS a meaningful skill. But hey, you want to be offended, go right ahead. I didn't mean it offensively.

[Mistwell]

The critical operator in your statement about not having covid is "as far as you know". Because the chances are pretty high that you have had it.

You just talk out of both sides of your mouth as a matter of routine. Earlier you said having Covid provided better immunity than the vaccine. And now you're saying the chances are "pretty high" any random stranger has had Covid. So...where the fuck are all these thousands and thousands of cases coming from? Why are hospitalization rates REALLY FUCKING HIGH right now? Why are death rates increasing right now so much? Where is all this coming from if almost everyone has had it and having it makes you immune? Why are case rates the highest on average in states with the lowest rates of vaccinations right now? Why are hospitalization rates the highest right now in states with the lowest rates of vaccinations right now?

[SHARK]

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-restrictions-update-regional-lockdown-extended-changing-restrictions-everything-to-know-explainer/a74df2ef-f025-4a98-b4ab-fce6dc2fddb2

1 hour of exercise per day, no more. Only emergency services and healthcare workers can leave. If you live alone, you're allowed to nominate one and only one visitor, and they must be registered with the government. Masks everywhere outside the home, except when exercising.

Entertainingly, this main thrust of the article is that Australians are being given "new freedoms". (If you can demonstrate proof of vax, you're allowed to spend 2 hours exercising, and can even visit a park!)

Good thing the fascists already took away everyone's guns.

Greetings!

I would like to think if the government tried to pull that tyrannical BS here, people would rise up and crush these people. String them the fuck up, without mercy!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Pat]

And you're being a douchebag.

HA! No I was being serious but you took it as sarcasm.

Only you would take me saying I admire you as douchebaggery.

You quoted HappyDaze saying I used weasel words to support my bullshit, agreeing with and saying I was good at it. There's no sarcasm there, just a flat-out insult.

It really wasn't. I said the lawyer in me recognized it and I said I admired your skill. Everyone spins things sometimes Pat, and you're no stranger to spin. Being skilled at spin IS a meaningful skill. But hey, you want to be offended, go right ahead. I didn't mean it offensively.

If you didn't mean it to be offensive, then I won't consider it an insult. But I do reject the basic idea. I don't try to use weasel words, or spin anything. My goal is never to win, but to explain my position clearly. Which can require some effort, because my positions are often orthogonal to the usual political axes, and rarely distill themselves nicely into soundbites. But thank you for the intent behind the attempted compliment, even if my response is heavily qualified.

[Pat]

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-restrictions-update-regional-lockdown-extended-changing-restrictions-everything-to-know-explainer/a74df2ef-f025-4a98-b4ab-fce6dc2fddb2

1 hour of exercise per day, no more. Only emergency services and healthcare workers can leave. If you live alone, you're allowed to nominate one and only one visitor, and they must be registered with the government. Masks everywhere outside the home, except when exercising.

Entertainingly, this main thrust of the article is that Australians are being given "new freedoms". (If you can demonstrate proof of vax, you're allowed to spend 2 hours exercising, and can even visit a park!)

Good thing the fascists already took away everyone's guns.

Greetings!

I would like to think if the government tried to pull that tyrannical BS here, people would rise up and crush these people. String them the fuck up, without mercy!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

<points to the 18 months of lockdowns and mask mandates in the US>

[FelixGamingX1]

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-restrictions-update-regional-lockdown-extended-changing-restrictions-everything-to-know-explainer/a74df2ef-f025-4a98-b4ab-fce6dc2fddb2

1 hour of exercise per day, no more. Only emergency services and healthcare workers can leave. If you live alone, you're allowed to nominate one and only one visitor, and they must be registered with the government. Masks everywhere outside the home, except when exercising.

Entertainingly, this main thrust of the article is that Australians are being given "new freedoms". (If you can demonstrate proof of vax, you're allowed to spend 2 hours exercising, and can even visit a park!)

Good thing the fascists already took away everyone's guns.

That's hilarious! Given they only had a few thousand cases. Guess they should have invested in checks and balances.

[SHARK]

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-restrictions-update-regional-lockdown-extended-changing-restrictions-everything-to-know-explainer/a74df2ef-f025-4a98-b4ab-fce6dc2fddb2

1 hour of exercise per day, no more. Only emergency services and healthcare workers can leave. If you live alone, you're allowed to nominate one and only one visitor, and they must be registered with the government. Masks everywhere outside the home, except when exercising.

Entertainingly, this main thrust of the article is that Australians are being given "new freedoms". (If you can demonstrate proof of vax, you're allowed to spend 2 hours exercising, and can even visit a park!)

Good thing the fascists already took away everyone's guns.

Greetings!

I would like to think if the government tried to pull that tyrannical BS here, people would rise up and crush these people. String them the fuck up, without mercy!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

<points to the 18 months of lockdowns and mask mandates in the US>

Greetings!

*Laughing* Sadly, very true, Pat. However, over the last 18 months, we have also witnessed growing resistance--and not with just a gathered handful, but thousands of people. Increasingly, such resistance is also becoming more violent, whether from lone nutjobs just going crazy on a mask-tyrant employer, or riots in opposition to such government sponsored policies. I admit I don't have a whole lot of confidence concerning most of the country being submissive sheep, but there seems to be some glimmers of hope!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

[Mistwell]

https://www.9news.com.au/national/coronavirus-nsw-restrictions-update-regional-lockdown-extended-changing-restrictions-everything-to-know-explainer/a74df2ef-f025-4a98-b4ab-fce6dc2fddb2

1 hour of exercise per day, no more. Only emergency services and healthcare workers can leave. If you live alone, you're allowed to nominate one and only one visitor, and they must be registered with the government. Masks everywhere outside the home, except when exercising.

Entertainingly, this main thrust of the article is that Australians are being given "new freedoms". (If you can demonstrate proof of vax, you're allowed to spend 2 hours exercising, and can even visit a park!)

Good thing the fascists already took away everyone's guns.

Greetings!

I would like to think if the government tried to pull that tyrannical BS here, people would rise up and crush these people. String them the fuck up, without mercy!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

<points to the 18 months of lockdowns and mask mandates in the US>

What we call a "lockdown" here is often "eat outdoors for restaurants" or "reduce store capacity". Our measures pale in comparison to what they're doing right now.

[oggsmash]

I don't have any sons.  I have three daughters.  If I had sons, yes, they would get the HPV vaccine, too.

You'd be right. My boys will be getting the HPV vaccine.

  Likely a good idea, as rectal cancer is MUCH higher probability from HPV than cervical cancer.

[Pat]

What we call a "lockdown" here is often "eat outdoors for restaurants" or "reduce store capacity". Our measures pale in comparison to what they're doing right now.

They were closer to the Australian rules toward the start of the pandemic. The main difference seems to be checks at state borders never got off the ground in the US, and the Australians are really going overboard with enforcement.

[Kiero]

You just talk out of both sides of your mouth as a matter of routine. Earlier you said having Covid provided better immunity than the vaccine. And now you're saying the chances are "pretty high" any random stranger has had Covid. So...where the fuck are all these thousands and thousands of cases coming from? Why are hospitalization rates REALLY FUCKING HIGH right now? Why are death rates increasing right now so much? Where is all this coming from if almost everyone has had it and having it makes you immune? Why are case rates the highest on average in states with the lowest rates of vaccinations right now? Why are hospitalization rates the highest right now in states with the lowest rates of vaccinations right now?

No, you've bought into the testing con, so you're not getting it. "Cases" are not infections. In the UK we test more than anywhere on the entire fucking planet, more than every country in mainland Europe combined. Most of it is routine, multiple times a week, asymptomatic testing of healthcare staff, students and others. Combined with running PCR tests at a cycle threshold of 40-45 (anything over 25 is basically meaningless) creating a casedemic of false positive results. "Cases" are utter bullshit, easily manipulated by instructing the labs to turn the CT up or down (though they never turn it down).

It's funny, all those things you observe at the end, high cases, high hospitalisations, spiking deaths, are being observed in all the countries with the highest rates of vaccination, not just Israel, but Iceland and the UK. Along with Malta, Gibraltar and Cyprus.

And pre-vaccination we weren't getting this in the summer, when the virus traditionally recedes. Thanks to the jabs for that.

[Mistwell]

You just talk out of both sides of your mouth as a matter of routine. Earlier you said having Covid provided better immunity than the vaccine. And now you're saying the chances are "pretty high" any random stranger has had Covid. So...where the fuck are all these thousands and thousands of cases coming from? Why are hospitalization rates REALLY FUCKING HIGH right now? Why are death rates increasing right now so much? Where is all this coming from if almost everyone has had it and having it makes you immune? Why are case rates the highest on average in states with the lowest rates of vaccinations right now? Why are hospitalization rates the highest right now in states with the lowest rates of vaccinations right now?

No, you've bought into the testing con, so you're not getting it. "Cases" are not infections. In the UK we test more than anywhere on the entire fucking planet, more than every country in mainland Europe combined. Most of it is routine, multiple times a week, asymptomatic testing of healthcare staff, students and others. Combined with running PCR tests at a cycle threshold of 40-45 (anything over 25 is basically meaningless) creating a casedemic of false positive results. "Cases" are utter bullshit, easily manipulated by instructing the labs to turn the CT up or down (though they never turn it down).

It's funny, all those things you observe at the end, high cases, high hospitalisations, spiking deaths, are being observed in all the countries with the highest rates of vaccination, not just Israel, but Iceland and the UK. Along with Malta, Gibraltar and Cyprus.

And pre-vaccination we weren't getting this in the summer, when the virus traditionally recedes. Thanks to the jabs for that.

The states with the lowest vaccination rates have the highest hospitalization and death rates right now. Why?

For example, the two states with the lowest vaccination rates are Alabama (36.79%) and Mississippi (37.25%). They also have the highest hospitalizations at 60 per 100,000 and 56 per 100,000. Meanwhile the states with the highest vaccination rates are Vermont (67.54%) and Massachusetts (65.47%). They also have the lowest hospitalizations at 4 per 100,000 and 7 per 100,000. This data holds up for death rates as well. Alabama has a current daily Covid death rate of 0.37 per 100,000, and Mississippi has a current daily Covid death rate of 1.27 per 100,000. Compare that to Vermont at 0.09 per 100,000 and Massachusetts at 0.07 per 100,000.

Why would that be, if what you believe were true?

[Zelen]

High levels of testing are definitely being used to foster fear, where none would exist without it. That being said, massive testing isn't the only problem. I have no doubt there's a real spike of infections, the question is why there's such a spike of cases in countries where vaccination rates among the vulnerable 65+ population are in the 80-90% range, and probably around 60% or more overall. Vaccination doesn't seem to produce a meaningful impact on case numbers


Hospitalization numbers are also subject to reporting biases.
It's impossible to provide a non-local estimate, but I have seen sources suggesting ~25% of "hospitalizations" are patients who have been admitted for reasons other than SarsCov-2 infection.
I've also seen it suggested that ~25% of hospitalized cases are nosocomial infections, e.g. acquired during hospitalization. This makes sense since it's virtually impossible to prevent the spread of SarsCov-2 indoors. This is even more true with increased infectivity of Delta strain. If Covid patients are kept physically separated in different wings if they are on the same ventilation & AC system, the virus can easily be transmitted.

Deaths are the metric that's probably least amenable to manipulation, but we do see increases in death numbers. In the US at least, there's a big reservoir of deeply unhealthy morbidly obese people, so I feel like that plays a significant role. It's hard to pin it down really, because countries like Israel are seeing their highest ever deaths despite major vaccination. Meanwhile Sweden with much lower vaccination and seems to have basically reached herd immunity and zero deaths.