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Author Topic: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.  (Read 341702 times)

Garry G

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1590 on: March 04, 2021, 09:40:58 AM »
It's hard to even begin to address this nonsense because it's nonsense. We could try facts like the excess mortality rates but you don't deal with facts cos you're a mental.

I always like your NHS workers are lazy spiel cos that's possibly the most pathetic conspiracy theory of all time. I figure you're some sort of well paid IT guy who goldbricks the system to milk as much as he can out of it whilst doing as little as possible. You can't imagine that people may be passionate about they're jobs and not just leeches who don't want to work.

"Excess mortality" that isn't exceptional in the last 5 years, and even less so in the last 20. Equivalent to a bad flu year.

30-60% of NHS staff are "off sick", "isolating" or "shielding" from the reports given by trusts. Or taking the piss as it's commonly known. Encouraged by this ridiculous system whereby if you have the sniffles, you're supposed to be off for 10 days.

I don't milk the system, because I don't even fucking use it. I just have the privilege of paying for it.

Mibbe you should consider accessing the NHS. Mental health problems aren't the stigma they used to be.

Kiero

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1591 on: March 04, 2021, 10:29:13 AM »
Mibbe you should consider accessing the NHS. Mental health problems aren't the stigma they used to be.

I'm not the one happily engaged in an abusive relationship with the government.
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Garry G

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1592 on: March 04, 2021, 10:38:20 AM »
Mibbe you should consider accessing the NHS. Mental health problems aren't the stigma they used to be.

I'm not the one happily engaged in an abusive relationship with the government.

No, you're the one who thinks there's a worldwide conspiracy out to get him.

Ghostmaker

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1593 on: March 04, 2021, 11:02:40 AM »
Mibbe you should consider accessing the NHS. Mental health problems aren't the stigma they used to be.

I'm not the one happily engaged in an abusive relationship with the government.

No, you're the one who thinks there's a worldwide conspiracy out to get him.
What makes you think he's the only target?

Don't think of it as a grave. It's the future you chose.

Garry G

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1594 on: March 04, 2021, 11:11:11 AM »
Mibbe you should consider accessing the NHS. Mental health problems aren't the stigma they used to be.

I'm not the one happily engaged in an abusive relationship with the government.

No, you're the one who thinks there's a worldwide conspiracy out to get him.
What makes you think he's the only target?

Don't think of it as a grave. It's the future you chose.

They probably have a list.

jhkim

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1595 on: March 04, 2021, 01:53:42 PM »
Here's the excess mortality data that I see for 2020.


Source: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/excess-mortality-raw-death-count?tab=chart&stackMode=absolute&region=World

What source is saying that excess mortality isn't exceptional?

I'm not talking about the US, I'm talking about the UK. With the exception of a spike in March/April last year, our pattern of deaths is normal.

Your original statement from Reply #1529 was:

People still buying into this incredible hoax? That last spring's nasty seasonal bug justified destroying the world economy and inflicting misery on millions of perfectly healthy people?

I don't see how restricting to the UK data only fits with this. Are you arguing that yes, covid-19 exists for the U.S. and has caused hundreds of thousands of deaths, but it's a hoax that covid-19 could do the same in the UK? What about the rest of the world?

Mistwell

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1596 on: March 04, 2021, 03:21:19 PM »
Brad insults
Brad, third and last chance. Name one business which has gone under because of mask mandates.

We both know you cannot. Because it was a bullshit claim which you and others were trying to pretend meant "lockdowns" even though under no even vague definition of that phrase could it mean lockdowns. You DON'T wear masks when locked down because you're at home. Mask mandates are for when you're NOT LOCKED DOWN and just out in society at large. It's OK that you're a piece of shit liar who wanted to pretend black meant white, but now that you're called on it just calling me stupid while being unable to answer the simple question of "Who?" to your claim that businesses have gone under because of mask mandates doesn't make you look to bright there, porn boy.

Oh the irony...wtf does "porn boy" mean, exactly?

Remember when you chose a porn image as your avatar here?

Quote
RE: mask mandates, I know of a bunch of places that NO LONGER ARE IN BUSINESS directly because of the mask requirements. You literally are trying to claim that requiring masks has zero effect on a business, when the reality is it indeed does.

No you fucking don't you liar. Because it was lockdowns which harmed businesses, not masks.

Quote
If you want a specific example, there was a small feed store close by that was fined multiple times for refusing to enforce an unenforceable order and thus went out of business because they didn't have the means to go to court. There were cops handing out citations to people in a fucking parking lot at a place that rents tubes here for no masks and they had to eventually just shut down because people didn't want to be harassed anymore about it. A parking lot where the closest you'd be is maybe 20-30 feet from other people. I don't know if that guy is going to make it, honestly.

Links. Would love to see proof that it was the mask mandate and not something else which caused this. Bet you it was something else. Like the people working there refusing to wear masks, or the people working there putting up sign saying no masks allowed, or something inane like that.

Kiero

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1597 on: March 05, 2021, 06:45:42 AM »
I don't see how restricting to the UK data only fits with this. Are you arguing that yes, covid-19 exists for the U.S. and has caused hundreds of thousands of deaths, but it's a hoax that covid-19 could do the same in the UK? What about the rest of the world?

I didn't say it doesn't exist, I said it was nothing more than last spring's seasonal bug. A nasty one, like the 2017/18 winter flu season was.

The hoax is the hysterical and draconian government response to it. And frankly all the data is suspect given the mysterious way everyone decided to change how they classify deaths to this nonsense measure of "within 28 days of a positive test". I note your CDC recently reclassified all of last year's deaths.
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jhkim

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1598 on: March 05, 2021, 12:28:41 PM »
Here's the excess mortality data that I see for 2020.


Source: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/excess-mortality-raw-death-count?tab=chart&stackMode=absolute&region=World

What source is saying that excess mortality isn't exceptional?
I don't see how restricting to the UK data only fits with this. Are you arguing that yes, covid-19 exists for the U.S. and has caused hundreds of thousands of deaths, but it's a hoax that covid-19 could do the same in the UK? What about the rest of the world?

I didn't say it doesn't exist, I said it was nothing more than last spring's seasonal bug. A nasty one, like the 2017/18 winter flu season was.

The hoax is the hysterical and draconian government response to it. And frankly all the data is suspect given the mysterious way everyone decided to change how they classify deaths to this nonsense measure of "within 28 days of a positive test". I note your CDC recently reclassified all of last year's deaths.

The U.S. mortality graph above has nothing to do with classifying deaths as covid or not. That's just counting the total number of deaths by year. You can look at the grey lines below 2020 in red for prior years to see the effect of the nasty 2017/2018 winter flu season. There is a huge increase in total deaths in 2020, totally unlike the regular variation of previous years including seasonal flu.

From the source link I gave, you can look at the mortality graphs for dozens of smaller countries, where we can also see prominent spikes around when they encountered covid-19 outbreaks. And again, if this is a hoax, it means that governments, doctors, and researchers from all these dozens of countries are cooperating - from Israel to Italy to Spain to Brazil, despite radically different politics.

oggsmash

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1599 on: March 06, 2021, 01:52:14 PM »
Oh, I see you think that the Chinese Government is lying with no evidence but at the same time the other Governments are telling the truth even with documented evidence of them over counting Wuhan Flu deaths.

Well I guess that is how science works now.

Imagine posting this and then expecting to be taken seriously. Won’t even bother to address Comrade Kim except to say he seems like a really lousy scientist.

He is a neocon traitor that sold out to China like the Judas bitch he is.  What do you expect?

At first, I was confused by this - but on reflection, I take it that "neocon traitor" is referring to Mistwell, not me. Right, Snowman0147? Otherwise that seems weird.

The China claim seems weird, though, since Shasarak is openly saying to trust the Chinese government and don't believe the governments of other countries. To clarify, I haven't accused the Chinese government of any specific lie here -- but I don't consider them a reliable source of truth, since I consider them untrustworthy and perfectly willing to lie for their purposes. As far as overcounting covid-19 deaths, there is evidence of Western governments both overcounting and undercounting covid-19 deaths. Undercounting happened especially earlier in the pandemic as people died without being tested for covid-19. cf.

https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2020/07/about-30-covid-deaths-may-not-be-classified-such

There are multiple checks for the overall death rates being consistent -- such as overall excess deaths as well as consistent distribution of ages and geography of deaths. I'm not claiming that the counts of every country are perfectly accurate, but I don't buy that dozens of countries have secretly colluded to intentionally fake millions of deaths, such as Kiero's claim that covid-19 is all a big hoax.

Yes I am the "Neocon Traitor" apparently. Because I believe in free markets and globalism. Nevermind that socialists like Bernie Sanders are against the free-market and globalism, and conservatives like Dole, Bush, Bush, McCain, Romney, and pretty much everyone who ran as a Republican for the last 30 years besides Trump believed in free markets and globalism. But, I am the "traitor" here.

  conservative is an odd word to use for that list of names.  Maybe if more people had dual citizenship they would be more open to the ideas of globalism?  That way if the free markets and globalism lead to their primary home being full of people who used to be middle class forced to compete with overseas slave wages and the place collapses, they have some other place to fall back to.   Bernie is a mess, but listing out a bunch of dudes with divided loyalties regarding corporations with many foreign entanglements and little concern for a rank and file USA citizen doesnt really make the point I think you want to make.

Ghostmaker

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1600 on: March 07, 2021, 11:40:28 AM »
The problem with globalism is that it presumes a commonality of culture that straight up does not fucking exist.

Period. End of line. Do not tell me about how 'oh they're just like us', because no sir, some of those cultures outside the U.S. (and for that matter, the Western societies) are NOT particularly compatible.

And when you have major cultural clashes, eventually things get very, very ugly.

Mistwell

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1601 on: March 08, 2021, 11:14:00 PM »
The problem with globalism is that it presumes a commonality of culture that straight up does not fucking exist.

Period. End of line. Do not tell me about how 'oh they're just like us', because no sir, some of those cultures outside the U.S. (and for that matter, the Western societies) are NOT particularly compatible.

And when you have major cultural clashes, eventually things get very, very ugly.

With globalism, we export our culture. And let's be fucking straight - we absolute have been. Our movies, our television, or music, our art, our games, it's all been penetrating undemocratic nations for generations. It helped bring down the Soviet Union, it created a middle class in China, it's transforming Viet Nam now. People see comforts we have, and they want those comforts and ask the questions about why they don't have them.

Ghostmaker

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1602 on: March 09, 2021, 10:18:35 AM »
The problem with globalism is that it presumes a commonality of culture that straight up does not fucking exist.

Period. End of line. Do not tell me about how 'oh they're just like us', because no sir, some of those cultures outside the U.S. (and for that matter, the Western societies) are NOT particularly compatible.

And when you have major cultural clashes, eventually things get very, very ugly.

With globalism, we export our culture. And let's be fucking straight - we absolute have been. Our movies, our television, or music, our art, our games, it's all been penetrating undemocratic nations for generations. It helped bring down the Soviet Union, it created a middle class in China, it's transforming Viet Nam now. People see comforts we have, and they want those comforts and ask the questions about why they don't have them.
Man, we can't even agree on our own internal culture. Yeah, we've been exporting our culture, and at the same time we have deranged academics screeching about how we need to respect African tribal science, Muslim attitudes versus women, and that guns are the cause of all violent crime. A good turn of phrase for this might be 'schizophrenic'.

It's nice that you think movies and TV are going to bring everyone together to sing kum-ba-ya, but you're higher than an SR-71 in cruise mode if you think it's going to magically convince the CCP to give up power and shift to a republic or democratic mode of governance.

SHARK

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1603 on: March 09, 2021, 10:55:57 AM »
Greetings!

Many people around the world--as well as many governments--view American "Culture" as being an anti-Christian, corrosive, corrupt, and immoral trainwreck full of shit, and reject American culture thoroughly. Feminism, divorce, celebrating and promoting homosexuality, trans rainbow-ism, abortion, and a culture which is obsessed with race, identity politics, and consumed in trivia and materialism. A culture that is essentially perpetually selfish, narcissistic, petulant, vindictive, emotionally hysterical, and juvenile. A culture that is arrogant and smug, self-righteous, and hostile, dismissive, and antagonistic towards anyone and everywhere that refuses to consent or embrace American culture.

Millions of traditional Muslims and traditional Hindus also seem to agree with such a view on American culture.

There was a time--now long since past--when many people respected and admired American culture.

So sad that American culture has become such a terrible sewer.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
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oggsmash

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Re: Covid, the "lockdowns" etc.
« Reply #1604 on: March 09, 2021, 11:54:58 AM »
The problem with globalism is that it presumes a commonality of culture that straight up does not fucking exist.

Period. End of line. Do not tell me about how 'oh they're just like us', because no sir, some of those cultures outside the U.S. (and for that matter, the Western societies) are NOT particularly compatible.

And when you have major cultural clashes, eventually things get very, very ugly.

With globalism, we export our culture. And let's be fucking straight - we absolute have been. Our movies, our television, or music, our art, our games, it's all been penetrating undemocratic nations for generations. It helped bring down the Soviet Union, it created a middle class in China, it's transforming Viet Nam now. People see comforts we have, and they want those comforts and ask the questions about why they don't have them.

  You mean we export the hollywood version of our culture, which is to say a corrupt, amoral, shitshow.  It did not transform China, China realized they could take on our farmed out labor at slave wages and create a "middle class", but in a nation where the poverty line is around 700 USD per year, exactly what does middle class mean?  China realized they could use greed as a powerful tool and operate much like a fascist nation now.  Freedom wise, what exactly has China changed?  They just do not have to disappear or lock as many people into concentration camps these days thanks to a quite compliant society.    China also seems to be taking more and more control of that hollywood propaganda machine...I am sure it will not be to export more american culture.  The Soviet Union was brought down for a lot of reasons, Balkanism, being an empire (with too many different cultures under one rule), and wild spending on the military at the cost of care of citizens (sound familiar?), the Soviet Union didnt collapse because of blue jeans and rock and roll.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2021, 11:57:03 AM by oggsmash »