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Author Topic: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!  (Read 14108 times)

HappyDaze

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2021, 12:09:48 PM »
Honestly....I don't care if it was biden or whomever. I don't feel right using this as a 'OWN' against the dems. I feel thouroughly ashamed and terrible for the collaborators that will die for trying to help the USA.
I don't think Trumps plan would have been all that better to be honest. It would have broken down in a month instead of a week.

I don't feel great that we have been playing hot potato with this mess between administrations. I feel like...We really need to look inside and get our shit together before we do anything again on the world stage.
*laughs in 'deplorable'*

Yeah, I don't think so. I've just spent years being called racist, deplorable, etc, etc for the high crime of not being down with the progtard narrative.

Don't expect me to lift a finger, except for the middle one.

Oh yeah. And we left thousands of actual Americans in Afghanistan, too, per the Pentagon Press Sec.
https://www.newsweek.com/pentagon-spokesperson-john-kirby-says-there-are-thousands-americans-still-afghanistan-1620144

But then, this is what the left wanted, right?
I don't think this is what anyone really wanted, but there are certainly opportunists that want to rush to weaponize the outcome for their political narrative. Try not to be one of those while people are still in harms way, ok?

Reckall

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2021, 12:15:00 PM »
It was never going to end any other way. Honestly, this isn't even Biden's fault. It was a forever war, or this happening. No matter when it happened, it was going to. The Neoconservative fantasy is responsible for this.

I agree that Biden was the guy left without a chair when the music stopped. And I agree that no one can be singled out for a mess 20 years in the making. This is not a situation where you can point one finger.

How the pull out was handled, however, is appalling. The Italian Press Agency reported these exact words from Abdul Ghani Baradar, one of the Taliban head honchos: "We won an unexpected victory, and we won so fast and through such unexpected ways that now we all must show humility in front of Allah".

I mean... the Talibans were got flat footed by the way the US pulled out. :o How much deeper one wants to dig?

And yet Biden managed to dig even deeper. First he assured that the Afghan Army was the bestest ever seen this side of the II SS Division Das Reich, then he pointed his finger at them because "they folded".

What? YOU assured the World that it was a strong army. It was trained and armed by YOU. Someone, somewhere, wrote an evaluation about the Afghan Army that YOU accepted and proclaimed as truth. And now you point fingers? Where, in your career, Mr. Biden, you missed the memo "It's the Job of the Leader to Accept Responsibility"?

Same with "The Stability of the Afghan Government".

"No evacuation via helicopters like in Saigon" ---> Immediate evacuation via helicopters like in Saigon.

"We were not there to build a nation". So you spent trillions in landscaping I guess. But actually this declaration is so nonsensical that it borders the farcical by itself - no need to comment.

I never liked Trump and I don't like the current batch of Republicans (not their majority at least) but what just happened in Afghanistan is indefensible. Some images from this debacle are already forever burned in the collective conscious.

Even worse, I feel that both the US and the West should now take a breath and say "How we messed up so badly in two wars across 20 years"? And it should be a bipartisan soul searching. Instead, we will have a finger pointing storm mostly based on the last 20 days.
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Shrieking Banshee

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2021, 12:24:58 PM »
*laughs in 'deplorable'*

I got called all those things as well. But Im still not being shot or put on a execution list.

People in Afghanistan are. I feel bad that through whatever  USA crap, they are dying for it.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2021, 12:33:51 PM by Shrieking Banshee »

Rob Necronomicon

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2021, 12:48:57 PM »
As Pundit said this was never going to end well no matter who was in charge.

Desert Storm was legit at least. However, not finishing the job was stupid. But the Afghan invasion was a terrible decision (Bush was even advised not to go in as it would end up being a 'quagmire'). Twenty years later and it has achieved very little except stoking up more hatred of the west. I also think that American and British intervention in places like Syria, Libya, Iraq, etc. have proliferated Islam in Europe (given the refugees that spilled over into our countries).

If I was the Americans now, I'd definitely keep the troops out of these places (as they really don't want or like westerners) and spend that two trillion dollars on homeland security. Of course you've still got options for spec ops and drone sticks on strategic terrorist leaders or training camps.


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Pat

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2021, 01:04:32 PM »
CNN is reporting on the ground in Kabul that "they're chanting death to America, but they seem friendly at the same time."

I'm having flashbacks to "fiery but mostly peaceful protests."

jhkim

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2021, 01:14:51 PM »
Now, Trump rolls into office, upsetting rice bowls left and right. He looks at Afghanistan and says, 'OK, enough is enough. Time to bring our boys home.' He makes a diplomatic overture to the Taliban, secures an exit date of May 1st, 2021, and informs the Afghani government that it's time they put their big boy pants on and stop fucking around.

Unfortunately, the PTB don't LIKE that, and Trump 'loses' the election. Biden rolls in, and because the derp state/proggy narrative is to NEVER EVER let Trump have a point in the win column, Biden's handlers opt to alter the deal. Except they're not Darth fuckin' Vader.

So if Trump was in charge, he would have handed the keys over to the Taliban three months sooner and in a more orderly fashion. I get how that is better than a disorderly withdrawal later, but I don't think that huge a difference as implied by the original post. The Taliban would still be in charge and millions of Afghans terrified.


I don’t know too much about this but I have a question: US troops have stayed “forever” in Germany and elsewhere. Why couldn’t troops be withdrawn from less dangerous countries and stay in Afghanistan?

I think it's much more expensive to stay in Afghanistan because of the danger, as it was a low-level active war zone rather than peacetime deployment. We had roughly 10 to 20 service members killed per year over the last five years, plus many more wounded. Further, my impression was that the conflict was likely to re-escalate if we hadn't withdrawn.

Still, I'm tend to agree with the principle. It makes more sense to stay in Afghanistan where troops are needed than staying in Germany and other allied countries that are stable and have their own armed forces. We should never have made promises to nation-build in Afghanistan, but given that we did, we have some obligation to those Afghans who acted based on our promises of support.

Going back to original mistakes, our troops should be for defending ourselves and our allies, not pushing through political goals. We needed to act after 9/11, and I think after the initial push to punish those responsible (Al Qaeda), we should have worked more moderate Islamists in Afghanistan to form a coalition government rather than trying to completely reform the country.

Ghostmaker

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2021, 01:18:33 PM »
*laughs in 'deplorable'*

I got called all those things as well. But Im still not being shot or put on a execution list.

People in Afghanistan are. I feel bad that through whatever  USA crap, they are dying for it.
https://www.dhs.gov/ntas/advisory/national-terrorism-advisory-system-bulletin-august-13-2021

Oh, I grant the Afghanis are fucked. They were always going to be fucked. If a huge majority of your 'official' military fucks off and doesn't even try to fight, you're done.

But don't call for any kind of 'bipartisan' 'oh we all share the blame' bullshit. Not interested.

Pat

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2021, 01:20:36 PM »
I'm sure this moved up China's plans to invade Taiwan by a few years.
Yup.

https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202108/1231745.shtml

If I lived in Taiwan I'd be looking for an exit strategy, or figuring out how to welcome my future CCP overlords.

China is being pretty blunt:

https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202108/1231636.shtml
Quote from: CCP Propaganda in the guise of a newspaper editorial
The situation in Afghanistan suddenly saw a radical change after the country was abandoned by the US. And Washington just left despite the worsening situation in Kabul. Is this some kind of omen of Taiwan's future fate?

At least the premier of Taiwan is pushing back:

https://www.reuters.com/article/afghanistan-conflict-taiwan/taiwan-would-not-collapse-like-afghanistan-premier-says-idUSL4N2PO0VG
Quote from: Premier Su Tseng-chang
We also tell foreign forces who want to invade and grab Taiwan - don’t be deluded.

Pat

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #23 on: August 17, 2021, 01:23:06 PM »
So if Trump was in charge, he would have handed the keys over to the Taliban three months sooner and in a more orderly fashion. I get how that is better than a disorderly withdrawal later, but I don't think that huge a difference as implied by the original post. The Taliban would still be in charge and millions of Afghans terrified.
There are an estimated 20,000 Afghans who helped the US during the occupation, and are still in Afghanistan.

Getting them out would have been a huge difference.

Ghostmaker

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #24 on: August 17, 2021, 01:24:20 PM »
Now, Trump rolls into office, upsetting rice bowls left and right. He looks at Afghanistan and says, 'OK, enough is enough. Time to bring our boys home.' He makes a diplomatic overture to the Taliban, secures an exit date of May 1st, 2021, and informs the Afghani government that it's time they put their big boy pants on and stop fucking around.

Unfortunately, the PTB don't LIKE that, and Trump 'loses' the election. Biden rolls in, and because the derp state/proggy narrative is to NEVER EVER let Trump have a point in the win column, Biden's handlers opt to alter the deal. Except they're not Darth fuckin' Vader.

So if Trump was in charge, he would have handed the keys over to the Taliban three months sooner and in a more orderly fashion. I get how that is better than a disorderly withdrawal later, but I don't think that huge a difference as implied by the original post. The Taliban would still be in charge and millions of Afghans terrified.
Again, refer to my above post. The Afghanis were going to be fucked regardless of what happened.

But we spent twenty fucking years there. If they can't figure out that dealing with the Taliban was a bad deal in 20 years, then we can do nothing for them. It's polishing the turd. It's trying to 'save' a drug addict who hasn't hit his rock bottom yet.

My educated guess is that Trump would've pulled us out and left the keys. Taking with us any 'undesirables' (read: Afghani allies, interpreters, or women who didn't feel like putting on the burka again), as well as our equipment.

But this is clearly what you wanted, right? A confused mad dash for the doors, because our airlift capacity is being used to ferry illegals across the U.S. instead of being used to move ACTUAL allies and equipment that MY GOD DAMN TAX DOLLARS PAID FOR.

So FUCK your snotty little 'oh so it would've been different'. There's thousands of actual AMERICANS marooned there now because of this incompetent pack of retards.  Thanks so much for your vote. I hope you're proud of it.

HappyDaze

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #25 on: August 17, 2021, 01:42:11 PM »
Now, Trump rolls into office, upsetting rice bowls left and right. He looks at Afghanistan and says, 'OK, enough is enough. Time to bring our boys home.' He makes a diplomatic overture to the Taliban, secures an exit date of May 1st, 2021, and informs the Afghani government that it's time they put their big boy pants on and stop fucking around.

Unfortunately, the PTB don't LIKE that, and Trump 'loses' the election. Biden rolls in, and because the derp state/proggy narrative is to NEVER EVER let Trump have a point in the win column, Biden's handlers opt to alter the deal. Except they're not Darth fuckin' Vader.

So if Trump was in charge, he would have handed the keys over to the Taliban three months sooner and in a more orderly fashion. I get how that is better than a disorderly withdrawal later, but I don't think that huge a difference as implied by the original post. The Taliban would still be in charge and millions of Afghans terrified.
Again, refer to my above post. The Afghanis were going to be fucked regardless of what happened.

But we spent twenty fucking years there. If they can't figure out that dealing with the Taliban was a bad deal in 20 years, then we can do nothing for them. It's polishing the turd. It's trying to 'save' a drug addict who hasn't hit his rock bottom yet.

My educated guess is that Trump would've pulled us out and left the keys. Taking with us any 'undesirables' (read: Afghani allies, interpreters, or women who didn't feel like putting on the burka again), as well as our equipment.

But this is clearly what you wanted, right? A confused mad dash for the doors, because our airlift capacity is being used to ferry illegals across the U.S. instead of being used to move ACTUAL allies and equipment that MY GOD DAMN TAX DOLLARS PAID FOR.

So FUCK your snotty little 'oh so it would've been different'. There's thousands of actual AMERICANS marooned there now because of this incompetent pack of retards.  Thanks so much for your vote. I hope you're proud of it.
Just keep sharing your delusions by lashing out at everybody that has stated they don't like what's happening just because you want to believe differently to support your narrative.

Ghostmaker

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #26 on: August 17, 2021, 02:17:50 PM »
Now, Trump rolls into office, upsetting rice bowls left and right. He looks at Afghanistan and says, 'OK, enough is enough. Time to bring our boys home.' He makes a diplomatic overture to the Taliban, secures an exit date of May 1st, 2021, and informs the Afghani government that it's time they put their big boy pants on and stop fucking around.

Unfortunately, the PTB don't LIKE that, and Trump 'loses' the election. Biden rolls in, and because the derp state/proggy narrative is to NEVER EVER let Trump have a point in the win column, Biden's handlers opt to alter the deal. Except they're not Darth fuckin' Vader.

So if Trump was in charge, he would have handed the keys over to the Taliban three months sooner and in a more orderly fashion. I get how that is better than a disorderly withdrawal later, but I don't think that huge a difference as implied by the original post. The Taliban would still be in charge and millions of Afghans terrified.
Again, refer to my above post. The Afghanis were going to be fucked regardless of what happened.

But we spent twenty fucking years there. If they can't figure out that dealing with the Taliban was a bad deal in 20 years, then we can do nothing for them. It's polishing the turd. It's trying to 'save' a drug addict who hasn't hit his rock bottom yet.

My educated guess is that Trump would've pulled us out and left the keys. Taking with us any 'undesirables' (read: Afghani allies, interpreters, or women who didn't feel like putting on the burka again), as well as our equipment.

But this is clearly what you wanted, right? A confused mad dash for the doors, because our airlift capacity is being used to ferry illegals across the U.S. instead of being used to move ACTUAL allies and equipment that MY GOD DAMN TAX DOLLARS PAID FOR.

So FUCK your snotty little 'oh so it would've been different'. There's thousands of actual AMERICANS marooned there now because of this incompetent pack of retards.  Thanks so much for your vote. I hope you're proud of it.
Just keep sharing your delusions by lashing out at everybody that has stated they don't like what's happening just because you want to believe differently to support your narrative.
Someone got a little tingle from watching Afghanis fall off the plane, I see.

Not really surprising though. You probably deluded yourself into believing Sleepy Joe's rambling incoherent speech (before he raced back off to hide) was 'stunning and brave'.

HappyDaze

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #27 on: August 17, 2021, 02:21:45 PM »
Now, Trump rolls into office, upsetting rice bowls left and right. He looks at Afghanistan and says, 'OK, enough is enough. Time to bring our boys home.' He makes a diplomatic overture to the Taliban, secures an exit date of May 1st, 2021, and informs the Afghani government that it's time they put their big boy pants on and stop fucking around.

Unfortunately, the PTB don't LIKE that, and Trump 'loses' the election. Biden rolls in, and because the derp state/proggy narrative is to NEVER EVER let Trump have a point in the win column, Biden's handlers opt to alter the deal. Except they're not Darth fuckin' Vader.

So if Trump was in charge, he would have handed the keys over to the Taliban three months sooner and in a more orderly fashion. I get how that is better than a disorderly withdrawal later, but I don't think that huge a difference as implied by the original post. The Taliban would still be in charge and millions of Afghans terrified.
Again, refer to my above post. The Afghanis were going to be fucked regardless of what happened.

But we spent twenty fucking years there. If they can't figure out that dealing with the Taliban was a bad deal in 20 years, then we can do nothing for them. It's polishing the turd. It's trying to 'save' a drug addict who hasn't hit his rock bottom yet.

My educated guess is that Trump would've pulled us out and left the keys. Taking with us any 'undesirables' (read: Afghani allies, interpreters, or women who didn't feel like putting on the burka again), as well as our equipment.

But this is clearly what you wanted, right? A confused mad dash for the doors, because our airlift capacity is being used to ferry illegals across the U.S. instead of being used to move ACTUAL allies and equipment that MY GOD DAMN TAX DOLLARS PAID FOR.

So FUCK your snotty little 'oh so it would've been different'. There's thousands of actual AMERICANS marooned there now because of this incompetent pack of retards.  Thanks so much for your vote. I hope you're proud of it.
Just keep sharing your delusions by lashing out at everybody that has stated they don't like what's happening just because you want to believe differently to support your narrative.
Someone got a little tingle from watching Afghanis fall off the plane, I see.

Not really surprising though. You probably deluded yourself into believing Sleepy Joe's rambling incoherent speech (before he raced back off to hide) was 'stunning and brave'.
Look more of your nonsense where you erroneously suggest what others believe.  You really are a worthless piece of shit and bad at guessing too.

SonTodoGato

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #28 on: August 17, 2021, 02:22:38 PM »
Surely the US won't have to do much work; only 3% of the population is fully vaxxed in Afghanistan. Covid must be ravaging the whole country; especially with the new variant.


Jokes aside, what is the formal explanation as to why America is in Afghanistan in the first place? I'm a bit out of the loop

Reckall

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Re: Biden's Presidency, all hail the Taliban!
« Reply #29 on: August 17, 2021, 02:27:57 PM »
At least the premier of Taiwan is pushing back:

https://www.reuters.com/article/afghanistan-conflict-taiwan/taiwan-would-not-collapse-like-afghanistan-premier-says-idUSL4N2PO0VG
Quote from: Premier Su Tseng-chang
We also tell foreign forces who want to invade and grab Taiwan - don’t be deluded.

The key point, here, is merely technical: China hasn't the amphibious capability to invade Taiwan. Even if they build it (and I guess that they are improving, but honestly dunno) the U.S. Navy is pretty capable to engage and sink the Chinese Navy in the Strait of Taiwan. There isn't much that you can do against four aircraft carriers, and the US Navy conducted exercises aimed to show that they can deploy exactly that in the area. The message was clear.

The remaining question is "What happens if the war turns nuclear?" Rather worryingly, China is pursuing a nuclear buildup. It appears that they aim to reach parity with the US and Russia.

But a war for Taiwan will be an air and naval one. No troops on the ground (some could be deployed along the coast as deterrence). Of course the US and their allies could still fuck-up big time and one day wake up after China is already in Taiwan. It that case there will be nothing to do.
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