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Author Topic: 2020 Election Commentary  (Read 184977 times)

EOTB

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1185 on: November 20, 2020, 02:56:43 AM »
This 3rd summation is also, for the record, false; I don’t expect it to be all that persuasive as the words still exist to be read.  But it is your credibility to spend as you wish.  I’m not the one who constructed a persona at least partially around fair reading and interpretive ability.

You set the requirement of one example to refute your statement, not I.  Perhaps they haven’t done a study.  Or perhaps a study missed the examples provided in the thread.  I’m sure if these examples had been in a study you would be familiar - but I’m not responsible for constructing your arguments.

My replies to you were never about trans people, jhkim.  They were statements on rhetorical tactics you choose to employ and continue to demonstrate when the subject (any subject) is one you are emotionally invested in to the point that there is only one acceptable opinion, in your opinion.  Then the typical nasty tactics of the left come out to play; the same BS used by TBP mods confronted by opinions they want marginalized: falsely paraphrase, moral high ground, isolate.  But you can put it on and take it off like a suit. 

It catches people by surprise because it’s deployed only seldom.  It shouldn’t.

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jhkim

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1186 on: November 20, 2020, 03:18:40 AM »
You set the requirement of one example to refute your statement, not I. Perhaps they haven’t done a study.  Or perhaps a study missed the examples provided in the thread.  I’m sure if these examples had been in a study you would be familiar - but I’m not responsible for constructing your arguments.

EOTB -- What I said was "I have yet to read about *any* case of someone posing as trans to assult a cis girl or woman in a bathroom." And I still haven't, given that your example wasn't in a bathroom and didn't involve assault.

What I *have* read about is dozens of cases of trans people being assaulted.


My replies to you were never about trans people, jhkim.  They were statements on rhetorical tactics you choose to employ and continue to demonstrate when the subject (any subject) is one you are emotionally invested in to the point that there is only one acceptable opinion, in your opinion.  Then the typical nasty tactics of the left come out to play; the same BS used by TBP mods confronted by opinions they want marginalized: falsely paraphrase, moral high ground, isolate.

Yes, I'm usually pretty calm in discussion - but I'm not a fucking robot. Yes, SHARK's statement got me damn angry, and I'm expressing that anger. He flat out said that he would assault trans people just for going to a women's restroom. I'm not falsely paraphrasing him there - that's literally what he said. These are people I love and care about.

I'm not a mod here. I'm not hiding behind any red text, and I'm trying to respond to what you and SHARK, and anyone else has to say. I'm not disappearing or silencing him.

SHARK can be a cool and reasonable guy sometimes, but in this case, he's majorly wrong.

SHARK

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1187 on: November 20, 2020, 04:05:17 AM »
You set the requirement of one example to refute your statement, not I. Perhaps they haven’t done a study.  Or perhaps a study missed the examples provided in the thread.  I’m sure if these examples had been in a study you would be familiar - but I’m not responsible for constructing your arguments.

EOTB -- What I said was "I have yet to read about *any* case of someone posing as trans to assult a cis girl or woman in a bathroom." And I still haven't, given that your example wasn't in a bathroom and didn't involve assault.

What I *have* read about is dozens of cases of trans people being assaulted.


My replies to you were never about trans people, jhkim.  They were statements on rhetorical tactics you choose to employ and continue to demonstrate when the subject (any subject) is one you are emotionally invested in to the point that there is only one acceptable opinion, in your opinion.  Then the typical nasty tactics of the left come out to play; the same BS used by TBP mods confronted by opinions they want marginalized: falsely paraphrase, moral high ground, isolate.

Yes, I'm usually pretty calm in discussion - but I'm not a fucking robot. Yes, SHARK's statement got me damn angry, and I'm expressing that anger. He flat out said that he would assault trans people just for going to a women's restroom. I'm not falsely paraphrasing him there - that's literally what he said. These are people I love and care about.

I'm not a mod here. I'm not hiding behind any red text, and I'm trying to respond to what you and SHARK, and anyone else has to say. I'm not disappearing or silencing him.

SHARK can be a cool and reasonable guy sometimes, but in this case, he's majorly wrong.

Greetings!

In this case, I'm majorly wrong?

No, Jhkim, I'm not wrong, majorly or otherwise.

I do not feel that it is right for a fucking man dressed up as a woman to be going into a woman's bathroom. Fucking gender-fluid trans freaks. Fuck no. And yeah, most normal people have a problem with it, as well, so it isn't like I just came up with the idea all by myself.

YOU might fucking love it and be fine with it--good for you. Merely because YOU are fine with it and approve of it, doesn't make ME WRONG.

Got it now?

In many places, even a man going into a woman's bathroom is going to potentially be problematic. Whenever on the occasion I have had to go into a woman's bathroom--I have *always* enlisted my wife/girlfriend/some other woman--to guard the doorway and vouch for me--because I have not wanted to cause any offense or alarm to anyone. And yeah, Jhkim, people get concerned when men go into a woman's bathroom, most especially when young girls are present. Doing so without precautions puts yourself at risk for a ass whoopin' real fast.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

EOTB

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1188 on: November 20, 2020, 04:13:14 AM »
Jhkim, you are being pedantic as the lack of toilet is not material, and you know that.  This is where your ability to contextualize waxes and wanes with its immediate convenience. You also apparently are overlooking other directly relevant examples provided by another poster. 

You can’t convince me otherwise, and if I were consulting for you my advice at this point would be to stop trying to convince anyone else. The first step is to stop digging.

But you’ve convinced yourself; and that is what’s important.  My suggestion would be to get back to the election. 

Edit - but for the record, that is the 4th false paraphrase.  You left out the presence of his daughter in the bathroom, generalizing it to make the paraphrase a more common occurrence.  Perhaps stating it accurately is difficult because you think that statement would receive more silent agreement than you’re comfortable with?  I’m trying to think of other reasons to explain why the disingenuity is so persistent, but that is a guess on my part

Edit 2 - I encourage you to go on to a woman’s forum and explain to them that a stranger taking photographs of them while undressed isn’t a form of assault.  Photos they have no control over, and could persist on the Internet for the rest of their lives.  Good luck with that. 
« Last Edit: November 20, 2020, 04:39:01 AM by EOTB »
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SHARK

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1189 on: November 20, 2020, 05:02:26 AM »
Greetings!

A message from renowned actor, John Voight.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

HappyDaze

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1190 on: November 20, 2020, 06:21:19 AM »
You set the requirement of one example to refute your statement, not I. Perhaps they haven’t done a study.  Or perhaps a study missed the examples provided in the thread.  I’m sure if these examples had been in a study you would be familiar - but I’m not responsible for constructing your arguments.

EOTB -- What I said was "I have yet to read about *any* case of someone posing as trans to assult a cis girl or woman in a bathroom." And I still haven't, given that your example wasn't in a bathroom and didn't involve assault.

What I *have* read about is dozens of cases of trans people being assaulted.


My replies to you were never about trans people, jhkim.  They were statements on rhetorical tactics you choose to employ and continue to demonstrate when the subject (any subject) is one you are emotionally invested in to the point that there is only one acceptable opinion, in your opinion.  Then the typical nasty tactics of the left come out to play; the same BS used by TBP mods confronted by opinions they want marginalized: falsely paraphrase, moral high ground, isolate.

Yes, I'm usually pretty calm in discussion - but I'm not a fucking robot. Yes, SHARK's statement got me damn angry, and I'm expressing that anger. He flat out said that he would assault trans people just for going to a women's restroom. I'm not falsely paraphrasing him there - that's literally what he said. These are people I love and care about.

I'm not a mod here. I'm not hiding behind any red text, and I'm trying to respond to what you and SHARK, and anyone else has to say. I'm not disappearing or silencing him.

SHARK can be a cool and reasonable guy sometimes, but in this case, he's majorly wrong.

Greetings!

In this case, I'm majorly wrong?

No, Jhkim, I'm not wrong, majorly or otherwise.

I do not feel that it is right for a fucking man dressed up as a woman to be going into a woman's bathroom. Fucking gender-fluid trans freaks. Fuck no. And yeah, most normal people have a problem with it, as well, so it isn't like I just came up with the idea all by myself.

YOU might fucking love it and be fine with it--good for you. Merely because YOU are fine with it and approve of it, doesn't make ME WRONG.

Got it now?

In many places, even a man going into a woman's bathroom is going to potentially be problematic. Whenever on the occasion I have had to go into a woman's bathroom--I have *always* enlisted my wife/girlfriend/some other woman--to guard the doorway and vouch for me--because I have not wanted to cause any offense or alarm to anyone. And yeah, Jhkim, people get concerned when men go into a woman's bathroom, most especially when young girls are present. Doing so without precautions puts yourself at risk for a ass whoopin' real fast.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
You're transphobic, we can all get that. You have strong feelings about the issue, and while they aren't very empathetic, there's nothing wrong with having feelings. However, when you allow those feelings to push you towards taking violent actions (or, as is most common on message boards, talking shit about taking violent actions) towards other people, then your feelings stop mattering because they don't justify violence, and that's when you become the bad guy.

SHARK

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1191 on: November 20, 2020, 06:37:33 AM »
Greetings!

Transphobic? *Laughing* Reee! Reee! Reee! No, I just think they are delusional.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
"It is the Marine Corps that will strip away the façade so easily confused with self. It is the Corps that will offer the pain needed to buy the truth. And at last, each will own the privilege of looking inside himself  to discover what truly resides there. Comfort is an illusion. A false security b

HappyDaze

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1192 on: November 20, 2020, 06:52:49 AM »
Reee! Reee! Reee!
Your fears really have been pushing you to make that sound a lot lately. Perhaps you should seek professional help.

Kyle Aaron

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1193 on: November 20, 2020, 08:05:13 AM »
You have strong feelings about the issue, and while they aren't very empathetic, there's nothing wrong with having feelings.
My son says, "If you have some feelings, you should write them in your diary." He's nine.

This "trans perverts leap into women's bathrooms to assault them!" thing seems a lot like the "AD&D1e will lead to satan worship and child sacrifice" thing back in the 1980s. Much talk and drama, but it just doesn't happen.

I have never seen a man dressed as a woman entering a woman's public toilet. Which means either that they're so far along in their transition that they're very definitely no longer a prospect as a male predator (suppressed testosterone doesn't make for a high level of aggression), or that there just aren't that many transwomen out there.

In the most recent census in Australia about 1,200 people nationally identified as trans, which is less than half as many people we have who were born in Albania. So I think that despite the leftie media making such a big noise about their rights, and for all the emotional moments some people are having at the thought of the people wandering into women's bathrooms, there just aren't that many. We can, I think, calm the fuck down.

The Right really is just as sensitive and butthurt and getting hysterical over non-events as the Left. Everyone is looking for, as the rpg.net petitioners put it, an Emotionally Safe Environment. Really they all need to harden the fuck up.
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Ratman_tf

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1194 on: November 20, 2020, 09:41:17 AM »
I have never seen a man dressed as a woman entering a woman's public toilet. Which means either that they're so far along in their transition that they're very definitely no longer a prospect as a male predator (suppressed testosterone doesn't make for a high level of aggression), or that there just aren't that many transwomen out there.

Ok. Considering the number of women who are aggressive and abusive, I don't think someone changing their testosterone levels justifies the idea that they're "very definitely" no longer a prospect for sexual predation.
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Ratman_tf

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1195 on: November 20, 2020, 09:43:47 AM »
You're transphobic, we can all get that.

No. I think the armchair psychoanalysis of "phobia" has been one of the dumbest things to come down the pike.
I think Shark's reactions are more in line with disgust than fear. (To paraphrase Johnathan Haidt)
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
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HappyDaze

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1196 on: November 20, 2020, 09:53:14 AM »
You're transphobic, we can all get that.

No. I think the armchair psychoanalysis of "phobia" has been one of the dumbest things to come down the pike.
I think Shark's reactions are more in line with disgust than fear. (To paraphrase Johnathan Haidt)
In some models, disgust stems from fear. In many others, there is a relationship. But, beyond either of those, the common use definition of transphobic applies here.
« Last Edit: November 20, 2020, 09:54:52 AM by HappyDaze »

Mercurius

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1197 on: November 20, 2020, 10:05:54 AM »

 Fucking gender-fluid trans freaks.

Looks like someone jumped the shark.

HappyDaze

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1198 on: November 20, 2020, 10:07:11 AM »

 Fucking gender-fluid trans freaks.

Looks like someone jumped the shark.
In a women's bathroom, with a candlestick...

Ratman_tf

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Re: 2020 Election Commentary
« Reply #1199 on: November 20, 2020, 11:30:59 AM »
You're transphobic, we can all get that.

No. I think the armchair psychoanalysis of "phobia" has been one of the dumbest things to come down the pike.
I think Shark's reactions are more in line with disgust than fear. (To paraphrase Johnathan Haidt)
In some models, disgust stems from fear. In many others, there is a relationship. But, beyond either of those, the common use definition of transphobic applies here.

I disagree with the "common use" of the definition of transphobic. Unless you mean a term that sounds like some kind of psychological diagnosis in order for the user to assume an air of authority on the subject.
The notion of an exclusionary and hostile RPG community is a fever dream of zealots who view all social dynamics through a narrow keyhole of structural oppression.
-Haffrung