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Author Topic: Traveller 5  (Read 18674 times)

atpollard

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Traveller 5
« Reply #45 on: November 13, 2013, 11:32:32 AM »
Greetings,

At the risk of derailing the discussion of 'profit margins and production costs' :)
I thought that I would share some opinions on T5.

First Opinion:
$75 is too darn expensive, but $35 for the T5 CD is much better.
This has nothing to do with 'fair market value' or any allegation of gouging - I am just cheap (err, I meant frugal).

Seriously, if you bundled every Mongoose Traveller Book in print and sold it as one giant tome for $75, it would be a great value compared to purchasing all those books separately, but $75 would still be too high an initial investment to try a new game and see if you like it. Perhaps the rumored 'T5 Player's Book' will address that issue.


Second Opinion:
Setting aside all of the criticism about layout and spelling and indexes and organization, I don't like the rules themselves. I play Classic Traveller (CT), MegaTraveller (MT), Mongoose Traveller (MgT) and dabble with Traveller The New Era (TNE). What I like about all of my favorite versions is the basic simplicity of the "Roll 8+ on 2D6" mechanic that is the core of all those versions. My criticism of the "Roll low on a fistful of dice" mechanic is not the counter-intuitive nature of rolling low, it is the quirks inherent in how the mechanics works ... the issues with critical success being more likely for harder tasks being a typical example of a variable dice issue.

In contrast, 2D6 generates an easy to understand probability curve that is relatively intuitive. The great 'weakness' of a 2D6 system is that it is easily broken by too many modifiers. A simple +/-1 is a big deal, +/-2 is huge and +/-3 is close to an automatic success or failure. This has traditionally been viewed as a weakness, since players love their splat books of new modifiers waiting to be min/maxed. I view it as the core strength of the 2D6 system. It makes 2D6 my system of choice for an "I don't want to get bogged down in long lists of sub-skills and circumstantial modifiers, I want to throw a quick dice and get on with the role playing" type of game.

So even if the T5 book cost $10 and was perfect in every way (from a publishing perspective), I would still pass on it.


Third Opinion:
There are two broad schools of thought for what a the rules used to design stuff should be like.

At one extreme in the Traveller world is Fire, Fusion and Steel (TNE) which begins the rules for designing a gun with creating a bullet and calculating its ideal muzzle energy. Let's call this the 'Simulation Approach' - when it comes to detail, too much is not enough. The down side is that the Simulation Approach takes lots of time and, unless you really like math, isn't much fun (an under appreciated down side is that as the number of steps and complexity increases, so does the chance of making an error). The advantage of the Simulation Approach is that you can create real world items and extrapolate an almost infinite number of variations.

I personally find the Simulation Approach useful when I want to design something that is fairly out of the box in nature. For example, I can use some of the Laser Design Rules to create a short range pulse laser that will fit into the handle of a knife, and the Blade Design Rules to create a Combat Knife with a slot down the center of the blade, and combine the two into a 'Space Marine Laser Combat Knife'. I find it a benefit to design stuff in real world units ... cm, kg, joules.

At the other extreme in the Traveller world is the revised Vehicles book for MgT and the T5 Makers, where the focus is on the final game mechanics and to heck with the extraneous details. For a gun, this would mean starting with a generic type (like a pistol) and adding adjectives that alter the final game mechanics (large, advanced) to create a Large, Advanced Pistol with X/Y/Z game stats. The advantage is that it is a fast system to use. The disadvantage is the loss of lots of chrome ... I no longer have a "44 magnum revolver, the most powerful handgun in the world" (Dirty Harry quote), I just have a Revolver, Large.

I suspect that the Maker's will appeal to many, but not to a gearhead like me.


Conclusion:
I wish T5 well, but like GURPS Traveller and T20 Traveller, it is not the rules set for me.
If you disagree with all of my opinions, then T5 may be the game of your dreams. ;)
« Last Edit: November 13, 2013, 11:39:44 AM by atpollard »
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Brad

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« Reply #46 on: November 18, 2013, 08:39:37 AM »
Probably not the place for this question, but posting it here anyway.

Are there any plans for a REAL 5th edition slated to be released anytime soon? I spent $80 on my copy after shipping costs and sort of feel like I got gyped. Given the print quality and content, this should have been a $40 book, if that. Not complaining anymore, just would like something that didn't feel like a half-assed effort.
It takes considerable knowledge just to realize the extent of your own ignorance.

jeff37923

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Traveller 5
« Reply #47 on: November 18, 2013, 01:57:18 PM »
Quote from: Brad;709389
Probably not the place for this question, but posting it here anyway.

Are there any plans for a REAL 5th edition slated to be released anytime soon? I spent $80 on my copy after shipping costs and sort of feel like I got gyped. Given the print quality and content, this should have been a $40 book, if that. Not complaining anymore, just would like something that didn't feel like a half-assed effort.


AFAIK, no there aren't any plans.
"Meh."

Arduin
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« Reply #48 on: November 20, 2013, 12:06:09 PM »
Quote from: jeff37923;709498
AFAIK, no there aren't any plans.

Correct.  "Take the money & run" seems to have been the modus operandi rather than let's make a nice product people will want.

jeff37923

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« Reply #49 on: November 22, 2013, 02:41:55 AM »
Quote from: Arduin;710179
Correct.  "Take the money & run" seems to have been the modus operandi rather than let's make a nice product people will want.


Shine on, you crazy diamond.
"Meh."

dragoner
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« Reply #50 on: November 22, 2013, 02:58:21 PM »
Quote from: jeff37923;710781
Shine on, you crazy diamond.


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jeff37923

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Traveller 5
« Reply #51 on: June 08, 2015, 12:51:31 AM »
A follow up to my review of Traveller 5, the first pass at corrections is out now. It is not perfect, but it is much much better than the initial offering. It is a free download to all of the Kickstarter backers as well.

Traveller 5.09.
"Meh."