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Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Six Cultures of Play
« Last post by Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 08:01:41 PM »
I will write more about my thoughts in the morning.
I think clearly bias towards Classic and OSR is seen, and it may weaken other descriptions a bit, but I think you're making mistake equating Classic and OSR strictly with D&D. There is underlying philosophy that can be used in more wide approach.

And of course there is big chance lots and lots of gamers played... outside cultures.
Also let's note Trad playstyle according to this leaked into D&D and D&D for some time was Tradist, and Classic mores become less prevalent.
23
The RPGPundit's Own Forum / Re: Turning the corner on "woke"?
« Last post by 3catcircus on November 29, 2021, 07:59:58 PM »
Quote
Feel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.

While not condoning him, I think that having his wife and unborn kid stabulated by a bunch of cultist psychos probably helped along Polanski's baser urges, which seems a bit different than the  "Wut? Wut's the problem?!?!" way in which the current crop of pedos are trying to normalize criminally deviant behavior.
24
Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Six Cultures of Play
« Last post by jhkim on November 29, 2021, 07:53:44 PM »
So what do you think about this division of RPG community into specific sub-cultures? Would you add any? Merge some of those proposed together?

So the division suggested is:

1) "Classic" - starting with Basic Set / AD&D1 style and similar
2) "Trad" - starting with Call of Cthulhu along with Dragonlance and similar
3) "Nordic Larp"
4) "Story Games" - starting with The Forge and into Powered by the Apocalypse
5) "OSR" - starting with Labyrinth Lord and others
6) "OC/Neo-trad" - starting with D&D3 organized play

I feel like the essay slices very thinly to distinguish between "classic" and "OSR" -- while at the same time lumping together nearly all non-D&D play under "trad", which it broadly characterizes as "the Dungeon Master creating an elaborate, emotionally-satisfying narrative". This ​comes across to me as "If you're not playing D&D, then you're just acting out the GM's story." This is emphasized further by how it describes the OSR as "The goal is a game where PC decision-making, especially diegetic decision-making, is the driver of play."

That seems very dismissive to me. Yes, there have been plenty of railroaded, GM-story games in non-D&D systems -- but there have also been lots of railroaded games within D&D in every era. There have been plenty of non-D&D, non-OSR games where PC decision-making is important - from Traveller to GURPS to lots of others.

There is variation within games and within sub-communities. There were a number of modules that were more linear - like Dragonlance or later Ravenloft modules, plus some other games like Deadlands and Torg. But there have always been GMs and groups that emphasized PC decision-making.
25
Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Make your own cons
« Last post by 3catcircus on November 29, 2021, 07:53:37 PM »

If I had a dollar for every loudmouth in a bar who threatened grievous bodily harm or death, before, during or after a fight, I'd have as much money as the guy who wrote Zweihander.

I wouldn't consider Daniel Fox to be wealthy.
It says a lot that he considers Fox to be wealthy, doesn't it?

I thought it was a slap down on Zweiguy in a look at his tens of dollars kind of way
Nah, he's trying to show off his tough guy cred. 'Look, I've been threatened so many times! You guys are just wussy for taking threats seriously!'.

I think I'll steal a page from a friend of mine: if you're gonna bang on about how 'everyone gets a beating', I think you need to present your bona fides and show us you can take one. Preferably three or four on one. Just so you can impress us.

Which gang is jumping him in?
26
Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Six Cultures of Play
« Last post by Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 06:52:57 PM »
Interestingly enough D&D 3 and 4, which are very gamist (well 3 trying to bow a bit to simulationism) seems in this equation to be more classic and Gygaxian if anything.
Sure they went from rules-light to rules-heavy but there is clear assumption of certaint social contract of proper challenges and rise in power to take new challenges, more than OSR-ian sandbox approach. Otherwise they don't fit anything else - sure you can apply Trad mode to them - but TBH Trad culture as described by Retired Adventurer is probably most system neutral attitude of all presented - all you need are players willing to be railroaded by GM, and any RPG with GM (ergo 99,9% of them) would suit, even those vehemently denying such posibility, even very narrative ones like PBTA, all can be hijacked for Trad Culture.

I'd also notice, that if we take those two ideals of Classic and OSR, then definitely Classic still live within OSR, because while many GM's here had specifically very sandbox-simulator approach (tenbones and SHARK came to mind) there are also others who go very strong to Challenge mode and "you have no name till you finish first dungeon", and that seems Classic.

Simmilarily if I compare Games - Dungeon Crawls Classic seems to be designed with Classic in thought, while I think Pundit's games with their strong setting centred approach fits within simulationist zeitgeist. I think I could take any of his settings and play it with BRP rules for instance, and still keep spirit, this old D&D mechanics seems to be easy to replace.
Meanwhile DCC - somehow I cannot see it, it's very much gaming experience.
27
Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Six Cultures of Play
« Last post by caldrail on November 29, 2021, 06:45:19 PM »
What's my style? Well, on a certain other site I was lambasted for being 'arbitrary' because I mentioned that I wasn't a slave to the rules. I don't think I am. I prefer to create an interactive game with every opportunity for improvisational dialogue. Sure sometimes I have to make decisions on the fly - welcome to the world of game mastering - but I want players to feel they have a say in how the game progresses. I remember one infamous character who ran a game and virtually controlled our characters for us. It wasn't fun.
28
Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Make your own cons
« Last post by Ghostmaker on November 29, 2021, 06:41:38 PM »

If I had a dollar for every loudmouth in a bar who threatened grievous bodily harm or death, before, during or after a fight, I'd have as much money as the guy who wrote Zweihander.

I wouldn't consider Daniel Fox to be wealthy.
It says a lot that he considers Fox to be wealthy, doesn't it?

I thought it was a slap down on Zweiguy in a look at his tens of dollars kind of way
Nah, he's trying to show off his tough guy cred. 'Look, I've been threatened so many times! You guys are just wussy for taking threats seriously!'.

I think I'll steal a page from a friend of mine: if you're gonna bang on about how 'everyone gets a beating', I think you need to present your bona fides and show us you can take one. Preferably three or four on one. Just so you can impress us.
29
Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Re: Six Cultures of Play
« Last post by S'mon on November 29, 2021, 06:08:58 PM »
Makes a lot of sense. Really helped me understand what those young whippersnappers are on about with their "OC" games and their pastel-coloured Tiefling hermaphrodite PCs.  ;D

I guess my style is mostly somewhere between Classic & OSR, I definitely think of the 1e AD&D DMG as my default reference for what RPGing is supposed to be. I tend to like PCs & NPCs with more inner life than you tend to see in those styles when done 'pure' though, so I'm pretty compatible with moderate OC gamers. The ones who don't mind *too* much when their lovely PCs die.  ;D
30
The RPGPundit's Own Forum / Re: Turning the corner on "woke"?
« Last post by Wrath of God on November 29, 2021, 05:07:29 PM »
Quote
Feel free to trawl through the usual leftist echo chambers and review how they talk about Joseph Rosenbaum.

Or contemplate how they continue to idolize Roman Polanski.

From my experience Woke SJW commies were for Polanski blood. It was older progressive liberals/moderate socialdemocrates with highly elitist streat that were defending him.
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