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#11
Quote from: yosemitemike on May 12, 2024, 11:09:06 AMThis reminds me of an odd sort of conversation I have seen and been involved in many time over the years.  I have seen it it in every venue I have been a part of where ttrpgs are discussed but it as most common at TBP and usually involved whatever the current darling was.

Someone will post and ask for a system to do some specific thing.  What's a good system for gritty, low-powered fantasy.

Several people would pop up to suggest the current darling no matter how poorly suited it was to what the person wanted to do.  "Have you considered Exalted?" as a suggestion for everything was so common that it became a meme.  I want to do a gritty spy thriller set during the Col War.  Have you considered Exalted?  That was a real suggestion.

Someone with an ounce of sense chimes in to say that the darling isn't really made to do what the OP wants and suggest something else.  Maybe WFRP for that gritty fantasy game or maybe an OSR title.

People start defending the nonsensical suggestion.  Exalted can totally do low-powered fantasy/gritty cold war spies/fucking everything.  Usually, what they say if self-evidentially true.  That's not what Exalted is written to do.  It says so right in the fucking book. 

After a bit of discussion, it comes out that the person saying that X game can totally do Y thing is either ignoring great chunks of the game or has house ruled it to the point where it is only nominally the same game.  Exalted works for low-powered fantasy if you take the basic resolution mechanic and the scant rules for playing mortals and discard the entire rest of the game.  In other words, if you don't actually play Exalted.  People seem to think that this is actually a sensible suggestion instead of using a system that was actually made to do that.  Every time I mention this, someone will pop up to make a case for why suggesting Exalted for a gritty cold war spy thriller totally makes sense and isn't an incredibly idiotic suggestion.  I could use the core resolution mechanic and build my own spy game around it.  On the other hand, I could not be an idiot and stupidly waste my time doing that when there are several games designed to do what I want to do. 



So no one can play gurps?
#12
Yes, clerics are one of my favorite classes.  I've also seen them played as very dull characters; most players don't seem to like them and have no idea how to play them right.  I really like your tables -- I plan on using them, in fact.

One thing I really liked about Harn is that most, if not all, of the religions had fighting orders associated with them (sort of like crusading orders for Catholics).  Do you ever use such?  It would be an easy idea to import D&D style games.
#13
Greetings!

I think that Cleric Characters are very interesting, and really provide a dynamic frame for a player or NPC to embrace a very interesting and intriguing lifestyle, for example, during the adventurer's "Down Time" between adventures, and so on. With any snippet of time, say a week or more, the Cleric Character is very busy! Such characters have plenty to do and be involved with outside of dungeon crawling. The Cleric Character's normal interests, intellectual pursuits, and work, open up *hundreds* of adventure hooks, plot elements, alliances, enemies, and all kinds of cool events not just involving the Cleric Character, but also the Cleric Characters adventuring companions.

I've seen some players play Cleric Characters like a dull box of cardboard, filled with sand. Just boring, and not much there. I think that is a shame, and a great waste of potential. Cleric Characters in the adventuring group can bring so much fun and drama, as well as the "Cool Factor" to the campaign!

What do you all think, my friends?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

The Cleric Activities and Work Table can be rolled randomly as deemed appropriate, or in the case of the Player Ceric, let them select one activity per episode as desired. However, it is also very beneficial and appropriate to randomly roll, even for Player Characters, to represent the Chruch r Temple bureaucracy providing guidance and assigning the Cleric Character to various activities. The GM can always later on customarily, or periodically, allow the Character to select. Doing either has great advantages.

Cleric Activities and Work Table
Roll 1D100 Percentile Dice
01-05% Primary Social Services (Marriage Services, Baptismal Services, and Funeral Services)

06-10%: Labouring In The Fields (Farming, Ranching, Orchard Work, Dockyard Work, Fishing Crew)

11-15%: Wandering Preacher (Traveling the Roads, Visiting Taverns and Inns, Organizing Tent Revival Meetings)

16-20%: Hospital Services (Visiting standard hospitals, and also Insane Asylums, Mausoleums, Cemeteries and Graveyards, as appropriate).

21-25%: Orphanage Services (The Cleric Character visits various Orphanages, providing instruction, counseling, and administrative support to such organizations. Of course, the Cleric Character also ensures their priority of preaching the faith to both the children living there, as well as the orphanage staff and management).

26-30%: Community Outreach (Brothels, Prisons, Leper Colonies, Reviled Sub-groups)

31-35%: Pulpit Preaching (The Cleric preaches at the primary home church or temple, and also may be invited to guest preach at some other church or temple, as appropriate).

36-40%: Theological Debate (The Cleric Character participates in public theological debates, either facing off against fellow religious colleagues, or religious scholars and figures from different religions, schisms, or denominations. Such participants are generally drawn from at least friendly religious communities. Heretics and enemies of the faith are not usually debated with, but promptly attacked and killed). Theological debates are customarily organized and held at large churches, temples, great academies and universities, as well as in prominent civic squares and popular taverns and inns.

41-45%: Political Activism; The Cleric Character embraces study and training in politics, political activism, and hobnobbing amongst the political elites as well as the bureaucratic class. Public speaking, political knowledge, dynastic and family lineages, heraldry, court intrigue, rhetoric, demagoguery, and more are all essential skill sets for the Cleric Character that is involved with political activism.

46-50%: Scholarship (The Cleric Character is involved with reading, studying various manuscripts, scrolls, and books, usually at prominent libraries, but also in private study. The Cleric Character is often engaged in research, editing, and writing academic-minded books and pamphlets. In addition, the Cleric Character may also be engaged with copying ancient texts, translating ancient works, and doing manuscript analysis and commentary).

51-55%: Academic Pursuits (The Cleric Character is involved with the academic instruction at various schools, academies, universities, as well as giving lectures at such locations that are open to students as well as the public).

56-60%: Missionary Work; The Cleric Character embraces study and training in performing missionary work. Missionary work is generally an officially sanctioned effort by a church or temple to reach out to some particular foreign community or nation. Such a foreign community or nation may be some strange humans, or a non-human race. Some kind of humanoid race that needs to be preached the truth, and brought into the faith. Skills typically embraced by such a calling are often focused on survival, traveling skills, riding, as well as various language skills, medicinal skills, and herbalism. Possessing skills in animal handling and animal lore are always a great benefit to the missionary.

61-65%: Street Preaching; The Cleric Character embraces the calling of doing work as a street preacher. The Street Preacher moves amongst the roads, alleys, market-places, courtyards, and plazas of the urban environment, publicly promoting the glory of the faith. Preaching to bystanders and others passing by or gathered, entering into debates, providing encouragement for fellow believers, and defending the faith from critics, or hostile rival religions. Such activities bring the Cleric Character into contact with people and members of society from every social level and class, from the aristocrat to the workman, to the peasant, the commoner, and the slave. Street preachers may also experience challenges from enemy cultists, as well as ruffians and the unwashed criminal classes. Despite the criminal element's more standard resistance and opposition to Street Preachers, Street Preachers also often seemingly miraculously attract powerful criminal allies and guardians, seeking the street preacher's wisdom, approval, and guidance. It is not unheard of for immensely powerful criminal organizations to seek to become a kind of unofficial patron to the street preacher. Woe betides the criminal ruffians that seek to harass or threaten the street preacher then! Various Law Enforcement agencies and agents of the crown are also known to provide special favour to street preachers. Incidents of street preachers being brutally beaten or killed in the market square does not reflect well on the state authorities, at every level. Such occurrences can inspire violent, crazed riots, and huge amounts of negative public scrutiny and outrage. Such realities serve to make it very much the state authorities' business that street preachers are safe and well-cared for, generally speaking.

66-70%: Blessed Vocational Work (Reference the Blessed Vocation Sub Table, Below)

71-75%: Inspired Art (Reference the Inspired Art Sub Table, Below).

76-80%: Ecclesiastic Administration ((The Cleric Character is involved with the bureaucratic administration of a church, temple, shrine, or monastery).

81-85%: Astronomy (The Cleric Character is involved with the study of Astronomy, deciphering the movement and placement of stars and planets, the sun, the moon, and various astrological phenomena). Such Astronomical studies are typically performed at various schools, universities, observatories, special places of knowledge and learning).

86-90%: Festival Organization; The Cleric Character is a member of a local religious committee involved with the supervision, administration, and organization of various seasonal celebrations and special religious festivals and celebrations. Such include all manner of religious and cultural icons, messaging, storytelling, memorials, dancing, singing, performances, and celebrations.

91-95%: Military Outreach Services; The Cleric Character is engaged in visiting various military fortresses, outposts, armouries and garrisons, either as a lone visiting Cleric, or as a member of a church or temple sponsored team. The visitations involve working with established authorities to promote the faith, provide instruction, counseling, prayers, and encouragement in the warrior's duties, patriotism, and service to the state and nation.

96-00%: Special Duties (Spiritual Warfare, Exorcism Work, Occult Research, Witch Hunting). The Cleric or Priest Character participates in the study of special subjects involving the faith, as well as history, and public records and testimony. The Cleric Character enjoys training and instruction in resisting, defeating, and hunting down all kinds of heretics, witches, cultists, Undead, demonologists, evil sorcerers, and various supernatural and magical enemies and dangers to the faith and the community. Besides honing their survival skills, combat skills, and academic research skills, the Cleric Character becomes familiar with public speaking, interviewing witnesses, interrogation, torture skills, as well as special disciplines in prayer and spiritual warfare.

Blessed Vocation Sub Table
Roll D100 Percentile Dice
01-10%: Specific Cultural Professions (Local Specialization, Special Tribal Talent, Tattoo and Body Piercing Artistry, or other appropriate profession)
11-15%: Alchemy
16-20%: Herbalism
21-25%: Animal Husbandry (Working with animals, Beekeeping, Veterinary Work)
26-30%: Chandler
31-35%: Tailor
36-40%: Brewer
41-45%: Vinter
46-50%: Icon Crafting
51-55%: Tobacconist (Crafting Pipe Tobacco, Rolling and Crafting Cigars, Crafting Cigarettes, Tobacco Mixing Techniques, Tobacco Farming)
56-60%: Scribe (Writing, Copying, Illumination)
61-65%: Bookbinding
66-70%: Incense Crafting
71-75%: Textile Work (Sewing, Dyeing, Embroidery, Furrier)
76-78%: Leatherworking
79-81%: Carpentry
82-84%: Blacksmithing
85-87%: Stone Working
88-90%: Archaeology
91-00%: Linguistics

Inspired Art Sub Table
Roll D100 Percentile Dice
01-10%: Musicianship
11-20%: Singing
21-30%: Dancing
31-40%: Choir Organization
41-50%: Dance Choreohraphy
51-60%: Painting
61-70%: Sculpting
71-80%: Crafting Musical Instruments
81-90%: Poetry
91-00%: Costume Crafting
#14
A flashback system was also essential to Fireborn, only there the flashbacks were to an ancient time where the PCs play dragons. I've long thought about trying to do a Fireborn game using a different system, but I've just never found the time. It's an intriguing game but the combo mechanics used for combat are way too involved for most of the people I play with.
#15
Quote from: Aglondir on May 12, 2024, 07:14:20 PMAmazed by the part where he says: If you don't like the Woke agenda, you are untrustworthy, since you agreed to it when you signed up here.

  Strange, as 'woke' wasn't even a thing when I registered in 2002 ... ;)
#16
Other Games / Re: The woke infiltration of B...
Last post by Zelen - May 12, 2024, 09:36:39 PM
Battletech seems like a really easy IP to spin-off. Ctrl+F Steiner -> Replace with -> SomeOtherName, rinse and repeat.

Joking obviously, but realistically, bitching & moaning about Battletech being owned by a shite company doesn't do much and the simplest and easiest solution is just for fans to rally around an IP made by a fan, taking the best elements and adding some innovation and freshness on top. (I always disliked the Clans, so I would probably downplay & give them more interesting twist in a spinoff, for example).
#17
Quote from: Anon Adderlan on May 12, 2024, 06:40:08 PM
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on May 12, 2024, 09:45:32 AMYou could introduce a flashback mechanic where characters remember living through various historical eras a la Highlander: The Series, allowing you to invent pretentious lore and make it personally relevant to the PCs.
Honestly surprised this hasn't already happened.
There's an obscure dead French ttrpg that did it a couple decades ago. It didn't get any traction because this hobby is dominated by an obscene first mover advantage.

I am so exasperated with the sheer fucking stupidity of this hobby.

Quote from: Steven Mitchell on May 12, 2024, 06:58:08 PM
Quote from: yosemitemike on May 12, 2024, 11:09:06 AMAfter a bit of discussion, it comes out that the person saying that X game can totally do Y thing is either ignoring great chunks of the game or has house ruled it to the point where it is only nominally the same game.  Exalted works for low-powered fantasy if you take the basic resolution mechanic and the scant rules for playing mortals and discard the entire rest of the game.  In other words, if you don't actually play Exalted.  People seem to think that this is actually a sensible suggestion instead of using a system that was actually made to do that.  Every time I mention this, someone will pop up to make a case for why suggesting Exalted for a gritty cold war spy thriller totally makes sense and isn't an incredibly idiotic suggestion.  I could use the core resolution mechanic and build my own spy game around it.  On the other hand, I could not be an idiot and stupidly waste my time doing that when there are several games designed to do what I want to do. 

If you dig a little deeper, what inevitably emerges is that the person claiming X can do Y is already ignoring many of the rules and actively fudging the ones used.  Of course if you do that, you can use almost any system to run almost anything.  I mean, Paranoia for a Three Musketeers game probably doesn't work, because the fluff is too disjointed.  But as long as the fluff is remotely in the vicinity and can be twisted all out of recognition, then you can do it.  Because you aren't really playing X, but some patina of X.

This trend is part of what I mean when I sometimes mention that I'd run Star Wars as a parody game using Toon rules.  Because it's the same kind of disjointed nonsense, while at the same time as a parody I could certainly do it. (And most of why I couldn't run it as a serious game is that I can no longer take anything in the Star Wars universe even remotely in the spirit intended, not because of any deficit in the Toon rules for pulling off that gambit.)

Not coincidentally, this is also why some game "designers" aren't.  Not in the sense of Gygax avoiding the AD&D rules, but in the sense of the so called designer not even using the rules they are purportedly running, whatever those might be.
This explains so much of the stupidity in this hobby and is a key reason why I keep giving up on my ideas to make my own. If most "gamers" ignore the rules anyway or buy the books to read shitty microfiction instead of playing, then why should I spend any effort to write functional games or coherent settings? They're brand loyalty cultists who won't buy my work anyway.

#18
Quote from: Anon Adderlan on May 12, 2024, 08:27:36 PMThe trick is these are all blind boosters so they're not going to measure how well this particular sculpt sells but how successful the line in general is, and then brag about how this decision was justified.

Which brings up my disdain for blind boosters for minis. We'll see how the mini sells on the 3rd party singles market. My bet is it winds up a sub $1.00 that chogs up shelf space.
#20
Quote from: Aglondir on May 12, 2024, 07:11:43 PMIs that a quote from G-troll? (starting with "I was looking...")

Yes.  It's from a topic he started on TBP.