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Messages - Eldritch_Knight

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Quote from: Groom of the Stool;1127218
As per suggestion in the thread about Chaosium and their so called OGL I start a new topic for people who love all things horror and horror rpgs especially. In that thread I made references to an imagined rpg based on older horror from the 70s and 80s, in my mind the golden era of horror. The horror I grew up with, love and collect to this day.

Since what I'm aiming for is very hard to put into words, unless you are a hardcore horror fan yourself, I will begin by using a few images to discuss the points of ambience, layout, etc. A new rpg based on older horror would obviously need to have the visuals to even begin to challenge something as deeply rooted as Chaosium's Call of Cthulhu.

Is the hypothetical horror RPG solely based around d100?

One game that was passed onto me, that I ended up enjoying was Slasher Flick. Never seemed to have caught on, and the scope was purely slasher films (as the name obviously implies). But there were a few things that stood out to me.

1. The players create not only their main characters, but also a group of secondary characters (which they play during kill scenes and act as backup characters). Characters are designed to emulate the genre, and players are rewarded for doing the stupid things that characters in horror movies shouldn't be doing (like saying "I'll be right back" or running upstairs instead of out the back door). The game master also creates NPC's.

2. The Killer has no stats. It is a force to be reckon with and the players have no chance of killing him off for good until the climax.

3. Scenes with the Killer are resolved with a Survival rating that rises and falls as actions are attempted. If it falls below a certain number, you die. If it goes above a set number, you escape. It has good tension there, and helps emulate the genre beyond the normal attack rolls and hit points of mainstream games.

4. Characters do not improve. Makes sense, as games are meant to be one-offs. Rules exist to bring back surviving characters, as well as the Killer.

The game itself is more story-based than most of the horror games out there. I rarely play story games. The characters actually have stats and skills in this, so it's at least a plus for me. While it may not be everyone's cup of tea, Slasher Flick at least captures the feel of a horror movie. I have thought about using it to run some Lovecraftian horror, as the lack of in-depth combat rules (and its one shot set up) seems to make it feel more ideal for the kinds of violent, bloody horror movies I grew up with, and fits the writings of Lovecraft's uncaring universe more than a setting that allows you to blow the piss out of the monsters and increase your skills.

Okay, I'll get off my soapbox now...

Design, Development, and Gameplay / Hacking the Storyteller System
« on: April 24, 2020, 07:05:47 AM »
I don't know much about the World of Darkness, but have heard that their settings can be rather limited. I think having a focused setting concept can be great (players understand exactly what the game is about) but also can lead to boredom (all scenarios are ONLY about said game concept).

Do you plan to have a specific campaign concept or are you looking for a variety of campaign styles?

A few things off the top of my head (disregard if they do not fit your game concept):

1. Blood Omen: Legacy of Kain for PS1 followed a man that becomes a vampire and gets trapped within a war between sinister gods.

2. Dracorouge (a Japanese TRPG) deals with vampires that have to resist their urges or turn into Night Beasts (a monstrous killing machine); has a similar feeling to the concepts of Bushido and Samurai.

3. Having an ominous threat in the background, where Vampires are bad, but there is something much worse...

Again, I don't know what specific types of stories you want to tell with your game. I have more fleshed out ideas, and explanations with what I am going for with the above, but figured I would save you time reading if none of this was where you were taking your game. Personally, I like campaign worlds that are layered. Where there are different levels of overall story types and challenges based on what the GM/group want to get into.

Hope this helps in any way.

Design, Development, and Gameplay / Hacking the Storyteller System
« on: April 16, 2020, 08:47:50 PM »
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales;1127091
I think the type of dice can be changed depending on the group's proclivities. There is nothing about dice pools that requires a specific type of die.

Anyway, we are both coming at this with different goals in mind.

You want a martial arts game. Fair enough.

I want an urban fantasy game because I don't like how WW games are designed and I don't like their focus on single monolithic campaign settings.

I want vampires with shadow powers who feed on color, causing their victims to become colorless and eventually shatter like glass. I want werewolves who gain their powers from sentient enchanted wolf pelts symbiotically fused to their bodies. I want mages who aren't forced to fight in that stupid Ascension War. I want ghosts who can fly and teleport and control fire with their minds.

WW holds a monopoly on the market, preventing more creatives takes on the genre from flourishing. WitchCraft and Everlasting tried to be different, and they died.

Yes. Different goals.

I like the concept for your game. I can see how you are attempting to make the game your own. Same with me. I want to take the base game design and tweak it to fit my own design goals, some of which are inspired by other systems. Mostly I want to strip off a little bit of complexity of combat from the Street Fighter game, to allow it to run faster. It seems to me that most martial arts games come in 2 types. Narrative only or super crunchy stuff. The Street Fighter game required a Hex board and each player had 9-15 martial arts technique to start.

What I want to do is take inspiration from Weapons of the Gods/Legends of the Wulin, specifically how they do martial arts style. The special techniques would be lessened, because instead of having cards for every type of punch, kick, etc, this would be done through player description. Instead of only knowing one martial arts style the entire game, you could go on to learn others, and eventually have a whole suite of techniques. I also wanted to eliminate the Hex board requirement. I will probably still use one, but I want the opportunity to do Theater of the Mind for smaller fights. I am already working on some basic probability and number crunching and getting my thoughts on paper as I do through and dissect the original game. Much of this is by referring to other games/systems/editions within the White Wolf line.

Its still early with the design. Mostly, I just don't want my players to stall because there are so many choices within the first session of the game.

What I want to do is develop a world that models the absurd settings of late 80's/early 90's martial arts movies and games. Bloodsport, Street Fighter, Big Trouble in Little China, Mortal Kombat, and many more. Played straight. This dark world where warriors with powers enter secret tournaments held by evil sorcerers. Or fight against powerful triads in Chinatown. Rival ninja clans wage secret wars. A megalomaniac whose failed state in the Himalayan mountains attempts to secure ancient martial arts techniques. And demons and servants attempt to release their Demon King so he can unleash Hell on Earth. It would be these various layers of story ideas that the players can go off and do.

Again, like you said, we have different goals in mind. But both are attempting to retro clone a specific genre filtered through our own ideas. And I have been greatly enjoying all the discussion of tearing apart the system and understand everything of how it works, and the probability of it.

Design, Development, and Gameplay / Hacking the Storyteller System
« on: April 16, 2020, 06:06:18 PM »
Quote from: Chris24601;1127078
Here's my attempt from a number of years back.

I really appreciate that. Thank you.

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales;1127083
Guess work. Even then, WW has never been good at game design so it's a mess anyway.

Opening the Dark was written around 2007 by Malcolm Sheppard as a tentative part of the OSR movement. It is more a proof of concept than anything else, as he retracted it shortly after release.

Right now I'm just spitballing. I'd like to create a full-blown clone someday, but I'm not sure it would be worth the effort. Right now I'm more focused on video games and prose fiction.

I've probably already gone over some ideas earlier in this thread, but I'll reiterate some of my basic ideas for a WoD retroclone/heartbreaker in a later post because right now I'm strapped for time. Sorry!

Thank you.

To be quite open, I want to create a specific retro clone eventually, which is why I am asking questions. I would like to create a retro clone of the Street Fighter game that White Wolf did, but with my own setting and rules adjustments. Sure, maybe a better way to do it, but I like the basic framework. I guess I am stubborn. But I read plenty of great reviews for it, so it sounds viable. I just want to revise the combat system to streamline it and make it faster. I had a few other ideas as well to build onto the system; some ideas from other systems. All this is a long ways off. For now I am just trying to get a framework of a game for my homebrew and build everything from there.

There was a well received system for martial arts years ago called CHAMPS, that helped to create martial arts techniques. Unfortunately, even the Wayback Machine can't grab the file, so it is lost. Not that I need it for what I want to do, but it would have been good to get a basic idea for what I want to try with my campaign.

One other thing. I thought I had seen on the first or second page of this thread, you talked about using D6's and had calculations compared to D10's. Were you working on having the game use D6 as well, or did I just misread everything?

I will read back through all your posts. I think everyone was making good points about stuff. I understand the system enough to run it, but it will take some time for me to begin reverse engineering the system to make any attempt at retrocloning (which is why I said any clone I make would be a long ways off).

Thank you.

Design, Development, and Gameplay / Hacking the Storyteller System
« on: April 16, 2020, 04:27:52 PM »
Quote from: BoxCrayonTales;1127075
Opening the Dark already provides some of that. It has task resolution, character traits, a magic system, and limited superpowers. I have been writing a bunch of house rules in a google doc, such as adding equivalents for other rules in the ST games like aggravated damage and fixed difficulties.

IMO, working out the rules is probably the easy part. Working out campaign settings is probably the hard part. I want to provide a plurality of campaign settings, or a kitchen sink setting a la American Vampire and What We Do In The Shadows, or at least provide guides to tweaking the various paranormal stuff to suit the tastes of groups.

So if I understand you, Opening the Dark is the retro clone you are using, and you are only devising alternate methods of rules and campaign settings for OtD? Or are you combining everything together into a full OGL-type game? Just trying to get the full picture.

Is there rules ANYWHERE in the World of Darkness for creating powers? Or is it mostly just guess work?
What about minion-type rules?

I will check out Opening the Dark a while. Thanks.

Design, Development, and Gameplay / Hacking the Storyteller System
« on: April 16, 2020, 07:23:29 AM »
I am greatly interested in a retro clone of the Storyteller system, for my own needs. Especially one that streamlines some issues.

Pen and Paper Roleplaying Games (RPGs) Discussion / Enjoy.
« on: April 10, 2020, 03:12:15 PM »
Quote from: Godfather Punk;1126376
Was part of the suit that Paul Matijevic had to post the apology on specific sites? And if those sites remove the apology, is Ettin then in default?

This was the case with the lawsuit that The Quartering brought against the Antifa dude that assaulted him. Though it was ordered that BOTH parties submit public apologies. The Quartering receieved an undisclosed amount of money as well.

I am on the side that there should not be an adventure in a core book. All I think about is how the content takes up pages that could have been used for other content or help keep the book smaller. I like the idea of having an adventure or two be available as PDF on a website. What I thought really worked, however, was WOTC's mini-setting Nentir Vale in the 4th edition DMG. Basically, give a fully fleshed out town with NPC's, provide plot hooks to inspire the DM, and then provide a quick gazetteer of the surrounding area with more adventure ideas. Had Threats to Nentir Vale been released on Day 1, it could have worked great in conjunction with the slim campaign setting. It might not work well for D&D, but that idea of having a slim setting, starting town, and monsters connected into the setting and providing plot hooks works better for me than a pre-made adventure.

My only complaint with a pre-made adventure is that once you run it, then its useless unless playing with a new group, which ties into my statement above about it taking up space.

Quote from: Gagarth;1125965
You obviously haven't read any of the Call of Cthulhu products since Chaosium was possessed by NuChaosium.

You will have to be more specific on what in their products you are referring to. I backed their Kickstarter (so I have all the products released through that), picked up Pulp Cthulhu, and I also have the GenCon 2015 release of Cthulhu Dark Ages. (I also have a variety of older products) I haven't used the books much since they arrived 4 years ago.

Quote from: sureshot;1125249
If they put as much effort as they do in being SJWs as they would learning copyright law they would come across less as complete and utter idiots.

Okay, I know I have been out of the loop for a while, but what did Chaosium do that made them SJW's? This isn't an attack on your belief or denial of any facts, I am honestly asking. I never thought their company could ever be ALLOWED to be brought into the Liberal fold, as many of their historical settings are played straight. They don't seem too focused on changing history. Now I haven't seen the final print of Cthulhu Dark Ages 3rd Edition, but the 2015 GenCon copy I have makes it clear that having female investigators is no where near the norm (but they did provide examples of a few women that were warriors or had power).

I seemed to have missed something. This may also affect whether I ever use their license (doubtful I will at this point based on the wording), but still good to know.

Quote from: Simlasa;1125326
I wouldn't be interested in a 'clone' of CoC7 anyway, but if someone were to take GORE and flesh it out into a fuller Lovecraftian game... starting from HPL's stories for names and descriptions... what could nuChaosium rightfully grumble about? They don't own the system in GORE or HPL's works... so 'Nuts!' to them.

That is essentially Open Cthulhu, isn't it?

Quote from: tenbones;1124039
What's to grok? Sinbad! Ali-Baba and the 40 Thieves! Sherezade! all the classic Ray Harryhausen movies! Then toss in some D&D-style Vancian magic and conceits.

Now you got ME interested in the setting...

Quote from: Vile;1125145
It looks like an attempt at damage control over the recent proliferation of D100 systems

I can agree with that. In fact, that was my initial thought. That the wave of products using OpenQuest as well as OpenCthulhu and Raiders of Rleyh (which from the rumblings on forums, seems Chaosium was rather pissed about). After reading the announcement, I thought about how all these products must have forced their hand after having a topic called "Just a Reminder: BRP is not Open Gaming Content."

I am not sure how I feel about Chaosium (what's this 'NuChaosium' thing?). I mean, after the Kickstarter disaster, they seemed to have brought the company into the modern age, with a steady stream of products (I think they are out-producting WOTC with amount of content released), their own 'Adventurer League' type system, their own version of the DMGuild, and have even gotten live streams of gameplay. While it feels like the company is healthier than ever, I cannot feel like it is becoming more corporate. More like WOTC. And this OGL they released seems like a half-measure.

I'm still interested in using it for any potential future products, but until there is clarification in the contract, anything I create is going to remain personal use.

I find even the nine default Alignments almost comical. Like something you would find the works of Forgotten Realms in-setting book of some scholar as he attempts to find order among the universe. I think Alignment (or the lack thereof) is really a personal thing that should fluctuate from table to table. That being said, I cannot even fathom how to understand that diagram from the original post. Like, are you suppose to just act based on the combinations of "status"? And essentially be a cardboard, one-dimensional character?It feels that way. But it almost feels like parody. I almost expect it to be something from the Knights of the Dinner Table comic strips.

Personally I use the Law/Neutral/Chaos scheme. Simple yet elegant. It has a strong foundation in older fantasy works. And to be quite honest, I loved Matt Colville's explanation of Law vs Chaos.

Yeah, I was really confused by how they set it up.

I'm not here to tell them how to run their company. But if they were seriously worried about people combining X + Y + Z together to retro clone one of their IP's, then maybe they should instead just release the entire Big Golden Book, and then just have in their license that you can create anything you want, but one thing must be missing. Like, if you want to do a Lovecraftian game, then you can't have the current settings/time periods or use the title 'Call of Cthulhu' or the actual entities (maybe you want to use the CoC rules to create that Victorian-set Dracula game that feels more like the Hammer films). Or, you can use the Pendragon rules, but it must be an original setting (no Arthur or Charlemagne). Or maybe you can use the Runequest rules, minus the Runes, stuff that is original IP, etc.

That, I think, would allow more freedom to TPP's, as well as give Chaosium more peace of mind. Maybe its a little more complex. I don't know. But I feel like there could be a more 'open' way of doing things without so many restrictions that seem vague at best.

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