TheRPGSite

CURRENT PLAYERS
Stormbringer - Sgt Llewellyn (Link (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=598981&postcount=159))
Sir Wulf - Lady Jastian (Link (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=465890))
Opaopajr - Cudberct (Link (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=598070&postcount=104))
Josh - Winthrop Porter (Link (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466140))
Tom - Gileus Darfin (Lady Jastian's Cohort) (Link (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466344))

FOLLOWERS (1st level)
Fenyx4 - Aminda Scroppings (Link (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=602931&postcount=226))
Tanthius - Hasor Turrell (Link (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=598161&postcount=115))
Greyknight - Certh the Baker (Link (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=597974&postcount=91))
Warclam - Haddon Bania (Link (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=599023&postcount=160))

WAITING LIST

INCOMMUNICADO / DROPPED
Foxtrot
jibbajibba
Castellan
DonEsteban


MARCHING ORDER (5 ft. between ranks)
RANK 1: Lady Jastian - Sgt Llewellyn
RANK 2: Haddon - Ashur
RANK 3: Winthrop - Certh
RANK 4: Gileus - Hasor
RANK 5: Cudberct - Aminda

WATCH LIST (4 hours per watch)
Watch 1: Cudberct - Lady Jastian
Watch 2: Winthrop - Gileus
Watch 3: Hasor - Sgt. Llewellyn
Watch 4: Ashur/Haddon - Aminda

POST FREQUENCY: Players should check the IC and OOC threads at least once every 48 hours (preferably once ever 24 hours) and post something (an action, a line of dialogue, a silent reaction, a question, whatever).


WAGON (2 Light Horses - Maximum Capacity 3,000 lbs.)
Rations (144 days) - 144 lbs.
Perishable Food (55 days) - 55 lbs.
Horse Feed (22 days) - 220 lbs.
Saddlebags (3) - 24 lbs.
Tower Shield - 45 lbs.
Shortspear (3) - 9 lbs.
10' Pole - 8 lbs.
Torches (20) - 20 lbs.
Bucket - 16 lbs.
Oil (8) - 8 lbs.
Water Skins (4) - 32 lbs.
Barrel of Water - 290 lbs.
Barrel of Wine - 290 lbs.
Bedroll (4) - 20 lbs.
Backpack* - 5.5 lbs. + 9.5 lbs.
Locked Chest** - 25 lbs. + 88.5 lbs.
Climbing Sack*** - 0.5 lbs. + 34 lbs.
Basket**** - 1 lb. + 17 lbs.
Wand of Cure Light Wounds

* Bedroll (5 lbs.), Lamp (1 lb.), Chalk (x2), Soap (1 lb.), Signal Whistle, Mirror (0.5 lbs.), Peasant Pajamas (2 lb.)

** Banded Mail (35 lbs.), Heavy Wooden Shield (10 lbs.), Longsword (4 lbs.), Morningstar (6 lbs.), Dagger (x4, 4 lbs.), Shovel (8 lbs.), Hammer (2 lbs.), Pick (10 lbs.), Whetstone (1 lb.), Arrows (x50, 7.5 lbs.), Lock (1 lb.)

*** Climber's Kit (x2, 20 lbs.), Grappling Hook (4 lbs.), Hemp Rope (50', 10 lbs.)

**** Iron Pot (10 lbs.), Flour (x5, 5 lbs.), Sacks (x4, 2 lbs.)

PATITA (Guard Dog (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/dogRiding.htm))

WARHORSE, LIGHT - GILEUS
Saddle military - 30 lbs.
Bit & Bridle - 1 lb.
Waterskin - 4 lbs.

WARHORSE, LIGHT - CERTH
Saddle military - 30 lbs.
Bit & Bridle - 1 lb.
Waterskin - 4 lbs.

WARHORSE, LIGHT - CUDBERCT (Buñuelo)
Saddle military - 30 lbs.
Short Spear (3) - 9 lbs.
Leather Barding - 15 lbs.
Bit & Bridle - 1 lb.
Waterskin - 4 lbs.

HORSE, LIGHT - HASOR (Notos)


What are we doing? Mr. GC has claimed that "basketweavers" -- i.e., non-optimized characters -- cannot play D&D. The opposing contention is that it is absolutely trivial for a group of non-optimized characters to play D&D, particularly if they're adventuring in an open sandbox that allows them to select the challenges they want to face at any given moment.

In order to simulate that scenario, we'll be using Mr. GC's character guidelines for creating a party of "basketweavers". This particular party of "basketweavers" has selected as their adventure The Sunless Citadel.

Here's the character creation rules, as set forth by Mr. GC:

Party of 4.
Level 7, 32 Point Buy, 19000 gp.
PCs are restricted to the following classes: Adept, Aristocrat, Barbarian, CA Ninja, Commoner, CW Samurai, Expert, Fighter (dungeoncrasher or not), Healer, Hexblade, Knight, Marshal, Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue, Scout, Soulknife, Spellthief, Swashbuckler, Warlock, Warmage, Warrior.

Sources are restricted to 3.5 books that are non-campaign specific and non-weather based.

The version of The Sunless Citadel I'll be using is slightly modified from the original, but not in any way that would reduce the challenge.

"Win" Conditions:

(1) Completing four encounters in a row without resting overnight.
(2) Completing the adventure.
(3) Having fun.

The PCs win if any of these conditions are met during play.

Stormbringer has already voiced interest in running the PCs. If others are interested in jumping onboard, he'll relinquish whichever number of seats is necessary.

I'll let this sit for a couple days for recruitment purposes (answering any questions people might have), then we'll post characters and get started. It's been a long, long time since I did any forum or PBeM gaming, so we'll see how this goes. ;)

Quote from: Justin Alexander;596771Level 7, 32 Point Buy, 19000 gp.
PCs are restricted to the following classes: Adept, Aristocrat, Barbarian, CA Ninja, Commoner, CW Samurai, Expert, Fighter (dungeoncrasher or not), Healer, Hexblade, Knight, Marshal, Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue, Scout, Soulknife, Spellthief, Swashbuckler, Warlock, Warmage, Warrior.

Did you mean to exclude the use of prestige classes?

I'd like to play - does "forum-based" mean all game communications will be through a forum like this one?

F

I'm in!  Most of that stuff up there has little to no meaning for me, though.  I will puzzle some stuff out and see if anyone can look things over for me before we start.  What better way to create a 'useless' party than someone with very little 3.x experience?  :)

In order to avoid accusations of bias when the characters are posted, I think it would be best to have a non-involved party critique them, then Mr Alexander can accept or reject any particular character.  Of course, if no one objects, I would more than welcome Mr Alexander's input.  I believe the characters Bloody Stupid Johnson made on the predecessor thread were acceptable on the first pass?  If so, I can start with those and build forward from there.

I am also very interested in joining.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;596941I am also very interested in joining.

Welcome to theRPGsite!  I would be glad to have you in this doomed expedition!  :)

Quote from: Justin Alexander;596771What are we doing? Mr. GC has claimed that "basketweavers" -- i.e., non-optimized characters -- cannot play D&D. The opposing contention is that it is absolutely trivial for a group of non-optimized characters to play D&D, particularly if they're adventuring in an open sandbox that allows them to select the challenges they want to face at any given moment.

In order to simulate that scenario, we'll be using Mr. GC's character guidelines for creating a party of "basketweavers". This particular party of "basketweavers" has selected as their adventure The Sunless Citadel.

Here's the character creation rules, as set forth by Mr. GC:

Party of 4.
Level 7, 32 Point Buy, 19000 gp.
PCs are restricted to the following classes: Adept, Aristocrat, Barbarian, CA Ninja, Commoner, CW Samurai, Expert, Fighter (dungeoncrasher or not), Healer, Hexblade, Knight, Marshal, Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue, Scout, Soulknife, Spellthief, Swashbuckler, Warlock, Warmage, Warrior.

Sources are restricted to 3.5 books that are non-campaign specific and non-weather based.

The version of The Sunless Citadel I'll be using is slightly modified from the original, but not in any way that would reduce the challenge.

"Win" Conditions:

(1) Completing four encounters in a row without resting overnight.
(2) Completing the adventure.
(3) Having fun.

The PCs win if any of these conditions are met during play.

Stormbringer has already voiced interest in running the PCs. If others are interested in jumping onboard, he'll relinquish whichever number of seats is necessary.

I'll let this sit for a couple days for recruitment purposes (answering any questions people might have), then we'll post characters and get started. It's been a long, long time since I did any forum or PBeM gaming, so we'll see how this goes. ;)

I'm not familiar enough with 3.5 to play, but I'll follow this thread. Good idea.

Quote from: Imperator;596954I'm not familiar enough with 3.5 to play, but I'll follow this thread. Good idea.

I think that is a good reason to join in!  :)

I don't understand how this is proving anything.

Sunless citadel was the first 3.0 adventure. Why wouldn't any basic group be able to complete it?

You most certainly don't need a wizard, sorcerer, cleric or druid to make it through 4 encounters.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;596923Did you mean to exclude the use of prestige classes?

Yup. That's a straight-up copy-paste from Mr. GC's guidelines.

Quote from: Foxtrot;596929I'd like to play - does "forum-based" mean all game communications will be through a forum like this one?

Yup. Whole thing will play out in this thread. (You can also use PMs if you need to communicate privately for some reason, but I don't anticipate that coming up in this scenario.)

Looks like the current player roster stands at: Foxtrot, Sir Wulf, and StormBringer.

Quote from: ValisI don't understand how this is proving anything.

Sunless citadel was the first 3.0 adventure. Why wouldn't any basic group be able to complete it?

GC returned to the original thread, stating (in his subtle fashion) that the chosen adventure wouldn't pose an appropriate challenge to 7th level characters.

I relish the challenge of showing that challenges can be overcome through skill and determination instead of obsessive optimization, but I would appreciate more information about Justin's plan for the game.

EDIT:  After I posted this, I saw Justin's comments in the other thread...  (what timing...)

Quote from: Sir Wulf;596963GC returned to the original thread, stating (in his subtle fashion) that the chosen adventure wouldn't pose an appropriate challenge to 7th level characters.

Well, of course he does. He thinks the only way to play D&D is to face an endless sequence of encounters against solo monsters with an EL 1 higher than the party's APL that are somehow miraculously getting an extra +15 to +20 bonus to hit above what the stat blocks in the Monster Manual say. In the land of spherical cows (http://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/2434/roleplaying-games/on-the-importance-of-spherical-cows), this guy is a circle.

In actual practice, I think this "test" has all the relevance of disproving somebody who thinks you can't walk down a street during daylight hours because the only way to really walk down the street is in the moonlight. The claim is so wacky that it doesn't really need to be disproved and the guy making the claim is so delusional that watching someone walk down the street in sunlight isn't going to dissuade him from the claim that it's impossible.

But I do think it'll be an interesting and different way of experiencing D&D. And I think it'll be fun.

StormBringer joked in the other thread about building an entire party of commoners. I think that could be really interesting. Or maybe a party of warrior, expert, commoner, and healer (from the Miniatures Handbook) -- just a group of concerned locals who volunteer to try to solve the problem. Or maybe commoners and experts who have signed up with an itinerant paladin who's leading them to clear out the local den on iniquity. Or an entire party of monks who are seeking the ancient wisdom of the monastic dragons. Or a party of swashbucklers and spellthiefs who were crewing a pirate ship when the entire ship was teleported to the town square of Oakhurst during a battle with a magi-kraken. Or whatever.

I don't think you should intentionally create a party to fail, but I do think you should embrace the opportunity to play something really unusual and see what happens.

I had a few character concepts I was considering...

Lady Jastian Wyverntongue (Human Marshal 7)
- Confident Aristocrat

Raptor (Wood Elf Fighter 4/Ranger 3)
- Reclusive Archer

Bjork Drakarhelm (Dwarven Rogue 7)
- Merciless Tomb Raider

Tain Takhol (Tiefling rogue 3/healer 3)
- Melancholy Outcast

Do any of these four appeal to you guys?

Quote from: Justin Alexander;596970StormBringer joked in the other thread about building an entire party of commoners. I think that could be really interesting. Or maybe a party of warrior, expert, commoner, and healer (from the Miniatures Handbook) -- just a group of concerned locals who volunteer to try to solve the problem. Or maybe commoners and experts who have signed up with an itinerant paladin who's leading them to clear out the local den on iniquity. Or an entire party of monks who are seeking the ancient wisdom of the monastic dragons. Or a party of swashbucklers and spellthiefs who were crewing a pirate ship when the entire ship was teleported to the town square of Oakhurst during a battle with a magi-kraken. Or whatever.

I was only half-joking; I find the idea of regular folk taking on these challenges interesting as well.  I wasn't sure if the idea would be popular enough to garner interest, though, and so would be more than happy to take on all or most of the 'NPCs', if others want to play the Paladin, Wizard, or whatever.  Otherwise, I will work on six commoner types; probably two or maybe three warriors, several straight commoners, an expert and a healer.  I will need some assistance with the healer, my access to 3.x supplements is quite severely limited.

QuoteI don't think you should intentionally create a party to fail, but I do think you should embrace the opportunity to play something really unusual and see what happens.

Absolutely.  I don't want to play a comedy of errors, but something a bit more gritty, something closer to ground level would be enjoyable.

Although it is obvious from his argumentation style that Mr. GC will reject any and all evidence by some bullshit excuse ("those spherical cows weren't perfectly spherical", or "they moooed, had horns and produced milk, but they sure weren't cows"), it's an interesting experiment. Let's see it!

Um, isn't Sunless Citadel a 1st-level module?  So you're going to run a bunch of 7th level PCs through a 1st-level adventure that was designed to introduce new players to the elements of the game...

Quote from: Internet Death;597001Um, isn't Sunless Citadel a 1st-level module?  So you're going to run a bunch of 7th level PCs through a 1st-level adventure that was designed to introduce new players to the elements of the game...

Yup. Mr. GC says it's impossible. I disagree. Looks like you agree with me. Let's see who's right.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;597004Yup. Mr. GC says it's impossible. I disagree. Looks like you agree with me. Let's see who's right.

I thought Mr. GC said it was impossible for those PCs to succeed against an encounter of appropriate difficulty.  I don't think steamrolling a 1st-level dungeon with a band of PCs 6 levels higher qualifies as a valid experiment.

Unless I have it wrong, and Mr. GC is saying that the classes are so gimped they couldn't even survive a low-level scenario.

Shouldn't you guys be hanging out in a liquor store parking lot trying to get someone to go inside and buy you something?

Quote from: Gib;597009Shouldn't you guys be hanging out in a liquor store parking lot trying to get someone to go inside and buy you something?

Fuck. Is it Friday already?

Why is this discussion still going?  In a new thread to boot.


It wasn't that long ago when 3e came out.  It is obvious that hundreds of thousands of players were able to play the game with fighters, rogues, etc just fine, otherwise I suspect we would have heard an explosion of nerdrage about how no one was living past their first adventure.  Since we all know that that did not happen, GC is full of shit.

So why are we still having this conversation as if to prove him wrong?  No one here needs to prove him wrong.  History and the thousands of gamers who played and still play 3.x already do that just by the fact that they exist.

For the love of the gods, just ignore him from now on.  I gave up a long time ago that he would ever show me a half dozen CR 10 monsters with a BAB of +35, and until he does so, it's better just to ignore him.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;597013Why is this discussion still going?

The world wonders.

I like making characters. Can I use 3d6 straight down instead? Or 4d6 take the lowest?

I'm interested in playing, but I haven't played via forum before, so I've got a few questions.  Like, how are we going to handle dice rolling?  Are we going to use the combat grid?  Any houserules we'll be using?  Any restrictions on races or magic items?

Yes, yes, all these brand new accounts registered in the past week are itching to play this.


Not dubious at all...

I'm not sure if you're full up by now or not. If there is still space, I would love to join in. I've always been interested in trying a forum-based game, and building characters with restrictions is always fun.

Socks belong on feet, or in sealed biohazard bags.

As luck would have it, I'm currently running Sunless Citadel with characters made via the Pathfinder starter set...these characters are MUCH weaker than "twinked out" characters from all the PF books (one guy shows up sometimes with his level 1 character, 2 attacks a round, high initiative bonus, multiple high skill, draconic-speaking fighter, and everyone looks at him strange when he pulls yet another odd ability out of an orifice).

No real risk of death so far, but lots of fun...Meepo and, well that thing he's seeking kinda bit it last week, I'm kinda curious what the group will do next.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;597017Yes, yes, all these brand new accounts registered in the past week are itching to play this.


Not dubious at all...

When Justin posted in his blog that he would run a game online, I wanted to sign up.  I had never bothered to register here before, as I generally prefer sites whose regulars indulge in fewer cusswords and insults.

Pleased to meetcha!

I'm in if there's still space available.

Okay, that's seven people who have expressed interest:

Stormbringer
Sir Wulf
Foxtrot
Opaopajr
Tom
Josh
Castellan

Glad to have brought some new people to the forums from my blog. Try not to let the trolls bite you. (In the game or otherwise.)

Anybody in the first four interested in taking a Leadership feat so that Tom, Josh, and/or Castellan could play cohorts? Otherwise, they'll have to be alternates in case somebody drops out.

StormBringer, Sir Wulf, Foxtrot, and Opaopajr: Roll up your characters and post 'em here for comment and review by, let's say, Monday morning. Sir Wulf and StormBringer have already posted some opening salvos in a discussion about what your group concept/relationship can be, so I encourage that conversation to continue.

Quote from: Opaopajr;597015I like making characters. Can I use 3d6 straight down instead? Or 4d6 take the lowest?

We're buying attributes with a 32 point buy. You can use a Point Buy Calculator (http://1d8.blogspot.com/2011/02/d-35-point-buy-calculator.html) or check pg. 169 of the DMG.

With that being said: If you wanted to roll 3d6 straight down, go for it. The only proviso is that, in the spirit of the exercise, I can't accept any character that would cost more than 32 points to buy. (If it ends up being less, that just makes you more of a "basketweaver", right?)

Quote from: Tom;597016I'm interested in playing, but I haven't played via forum before, so I've got a few questions.  Like, how are we going to handle dice rolling?  Are we going to use the combat grid?  Any houserules we'll be using?  Any restrictions on races or magic items?

It's been a long time since I ran any online gaming. I know there's newfangled things like dice rollers and the like, but I used to just roll all the dice and would probably do that again unless one of the players had a serious objection to it.

For combat, my plan is to get a declaration of intentions at the beginning of each round. Then I will resolve rounds in their entirety unless the situation changes to such a degree that a PC's stated intention can't be resolved on their turn. (If that happens, I'll resolve up to their turn and then collect a fresh set of intentions.) I wouldn't do this at the table, but it speeds up forum-based resolution considerably in my experience.

No houserules. Strictly by-the-book.

For races and magic items, see the first post: Any 3.5 sourcebook that's non-campaign specific and non-weather based. (So everything except stuff like Forgotten Realms: Champions of Ruin and Sandstorm.)

I'd love to play if space becomes available. I didn't bring any troll food, though.

Wow, that was some recruitment drive Justin.

Welcome to therpgsite guys. I hope you enjoy it. This section of the forum is for design, game logs, and scenarios like this one. if you feel like talking about RPGs, settings or the RPG industry feel free to check out the main forum: http://www.therpgsite.com/forumdisplay.php?f=2

I'll take Leadership.  Guys, post your character concepts ASAP so we can make this party come together.  We'll need to make sure we have a bit of healing, so we're going to want a paladin or healer (or two PCs with some healing if we mutt out the characters).

I am using PCGen to cause the least amount of problems whipping this guy up, but here is the preliminary; I still have some tweaking to do, and the sheet is barely usable, but that is the output from the software.
EDIT
Took a couple tries to get the output readable.
Exactly average hit points, still have some money to spend and shift some things around, and he has a heavy warhorse I am still putting together.
/EDIT

Name:       Sgt Llewellyn
Race:       Human
Player:     StormBringer
Classes:    Warrior7
Hit Points: 45
Experience: 21000 / 28000
Alignment:  Chaotic Good
Vision:    
Speed:      Walk 30 ft.
Languages:  Common
Stat    Score   Mod
STR      17      (+3)
DEX      12      (+1)
CON      14      (+2)
INT      11      (+0)
WIS      11      (+0)
CHA      14      (+2)
-------------------------- Skills --------------------------
Skill                   Total   Rnk     Stat    Msc
Climb                    8        5.0      3        0
Gather Information       7        3.0      2        2
Intimidate               7        3.0      2        2
Jump                     7        4.0      3        0
Ride                     10       9.0      1        0
Swim                     6        3.0      3        0
Appraise                 0        0.0      0        0
Balance                  1        0.0      1        0
Bluff                    4        0.0      2        2
Concentration            2        0.0      2        0
Craft (Untrained)        0        0.0      0        0
Diplomacy                2        0.0      2        0
Disguise                 2        0.0      2        0
Escape Artist            1        0.0      1        0
Forgery                  0        0.0      0        0
Heal                     0        0.0      0        0
Hide                     1        0.0      1        0
Listen                   0        0.0      0        0
Move Silently            1        0.0      1        0
Search                   2        0.0      0        2
Sense Motive             0        0.0      0        0
Spot                     0        0.0      0        0
Survival                 0        0.0      0        0
Swim              10       3.0      3        4
Use Rope                 1        0.0      1        0
                                                   
-------------------------- Feats ---------------------------
Endurance
Improved Initiative
Investigator
Persuasive

Armor Proficiency (Heavy)
Armor Proficiency (Light)
Armor Proficiency (Medium)
Martial Weapon Proficiency
Shield Proficiency
Simple Weapon Proficiency
Tower Shield Proficiency

-------------------------- Combat --------------------------
    Total / Touch / Flat Footed
AC: 13    / 13    / 12
Initiative:   +5
BAB:          +7/+2
Melee tohit:  +10/+5
Ranged tohit: +8/+3
Fortitude:    +7
Reflex:       +3
Will:         +2

Unarmed attack:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d3+3
critical:     20/x2

Axe, Throwing:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d6+3
critical:     20/x2

Axe, Throwing (Thrown):
to hit:       +8/+3
damage:       1d6
critical:     20/x2
range:        10 ft.

Dagger:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d4+3
critical:     19-20/x2

Dagger (Thrown):
to hit:       +8/+3
damage:       1d4
critical:     19-20/x2
range:        10 ft.

Handaxe:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d6+3
critical:     20/x3

Shortspear:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d6+3
critical:     20/x3

Shortspear (Thrown):
to hit:       +8/+3
damage:       1d6
critical:     20/x3
range:        20 ft.

------------------------- Equipment ------------------------
Name                                            QTY    LBS
Axe (Throwing)                                   4    8lbs
Short Sword +2 (Adamantine)
Handaxe
Dagger
Shortspear

Helmet                                     1    5lbs
Mithral Heavy Shield                             1    7lbs    Special: 30hp/inch and 15 hardness
Masterwork Chain Shirt

Outfit (Explorer's)                              1    8lbs
Potion (Cure Light Wounds)                       2    0lbs
Potion (Cure Moderate Wounds)                    1    0lbs
Potion (Neutralize Poison)                       1    0lbs
Total weight carried:
Current load:         Light
Encumbrance
Light:  86  
Medium: 173  
Heavy:  260

--------------------------- Notes --------------------------
Carries Shortspear and shield
Masterwork chain shirt and mithril shield are mark of position
Adamantine short sword is family heirloom, unaware of +2 magic
Hand axe is primary melee weapon
Heavy mace for subduing (criminals)

------------------------ Description -----------------------
Height: 5'8"            Weight: 212 lbs.                Gender: Male    


Outfit (Explorer's)
Axe (Throwing)
Handaxe
Dagger
Mithral Heavy Shield
Potion (Neutralize Poison)
Potion (Cure Light Wounds)
Potion (Cure Moderate Wounds)
Helmet
Shortspear
Masterwork Chain Shirt
Short Sword +2 (Adamantine)
Backpack
Holy Symbol (Wooden)
Pouch (Belt)
Trail Rations (6 Days)
Rope (Silk/50 Ft.)
Warhorse (Heavy)
Mace (Heavy)
Saddle (Military)
Saddlebags
4857 gp


Quote from: Sir Wulf;597165I'll take Leadership.  Guys, post your character concepts ASAP so we can make this party come together.  We'll need to make sure we have a bit of healing, so we're going to want a paladin or healer (or two PCs with some healing if we mutt out the characters).

I would prefer the Healer 'NPC' class Justin mentioned previously.  I assume that the new lot signing up here are fans of Justin's blogs to a man, so I am confident of this group's ability to play well.  I am sure we can handle any challenges with a 'half-class' party, although I would not be averse to one normal classed PC, maybe two, if that is agreeable with the participants.

Quote from: StormBringer;597176I would prefer the Healer 'NPC' class Justin mentioned previously.  I assume that the new lot signing up here are fans of Justin's blogs to a man, so I am confident of this group's ability to play well.  I am sure we can handle any challenges with a 'half-class' party, although I would not be averse to one normal classed PC, maybe two, if that is agreeable with the participants.

Excellent!  This means that so far we have a line fighter with strong investigative skills and we will have a support healer (I'd mutt out the healer a level or two.  How would you feel about taking up archery?).  We could use a blasty caster, a range fighter, or a sneak.

Does anyone else want to take up Leadership?  (Sgt. Llwewellyn would make a fine leader.)  I'm also curious what the "cohorts" would like to play.

Yeah, welcome to theRPGsite, dudes! Have a good game.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Sir Wulf;597190Excellent!  This means that so far we have a line fighter with strong investigative skills and we will have a support healer (I'd mutt out the healer a level or two.  How would you feel about taking up archery?).  We could use a blasty caster, a range fighter, or a sneak.

I would say we can roll up the archer and the sneak into one package if someone wants to make a Thief.  Alternately, another Warrior can take over the ranged combat role while protecting the rear, and the Thief can concentrate on a stealthier scout role.  We can fill the healer and combat caster with an Adept, that would seem appropriate.  Depending on the other players, I could definitely drop the throwing axes and work things around to use a bow instead.

Okay, I just spent too much time thinking about Imperator's open table Vampire campaign (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?t=24591), so I've only had a chance to skim the replies since yesterday. I'll try to give them a proper review and reply late tonight (I've got a play that's closing and then a closing night party).

But since access to the Miniatures Handbook is limited, here are the pertinent details for the Healer class people have expressed some interest in:

Hit Die: d8
Alignment: Any good
BAB +3
Fort +5, Ref +2, Will +5
Skill Points: (4 + Int modifier) * 10

Class Skills: Concentration, Craft, Diplomacy, Handle Animal, Heal, Knowledge (nature), Knowledge (religion), Profession, Sense Motive, Spellcraft, Survival

Weapon Proficiencies: Simple
Armor Proficiencies: Light; wearing metal armor or using a metal shield would violate the Healer's oaths. Any healer using prohibited armor is unable to cast healer spells or use any supernatural or spell-like class features while doing so and for 24 hours after the armor is taken off.

Healing Hands: Add Charisma bonus to the amount of damage healed from any spell that cures hit point damage. (Applies only to spells cast as a Healer, not from other classes.)

Skill Focus (Heal): Bonus feat at 2nd level.

Cleanse Paralysis / Disease / Fear/ Poison: Gain the ability to cast remove paralysis, remove disease, remove fear, and neutralize poison each once per day as a supernatural ability (due to intimate familiarity with curing these conditions).

Effortless Healing: Can cast spells of the healing subschool without provoking attacks of opportunity. (Applies only to spells cast as a Healer, not from other classes.)

Spells: Must be prepared in advance. Must choose a time of the day to spend 1 hour each day in meditation. Time spent resting is not relevant.

Spells Per Day: 6 0th-level, 5 1st-level, 5 2nd-level, 4 3rd-level, 3 4th-level

0th Level Spells: create water, cure minor wounds, deathwatch, detect match, detect poison, light, mending, purify food and drink, read magic

1st Level Spells: bless water, cure light wounds, goodberry, protection from evil, remove fear, remove paralysis, sanctuary, speak with animals

2nd Level Spells: calm emotions, cure moderate wounds, delay poison, gentle repose, remove blindness/deafness, remove disease, lesser restoration

3rd Level Spells: close wounds*, create food and water, cure serious wounds, neutralize poison, remove curse, restoration, status

4th Level Spells: cure critical wounds, death ward, freedom of movement, mass cure light wounds, panacea*

* Spells from the Miniatures Handbook. I'll post 'em if we go with this class.

The Healer is interesting, but I would lean towards the Adept for versatility, if a choice is to be made.  We could go with one of each as well, it looks like we have enough players to cover that.  The Healer class abilities are a strong point in favour of including one, however, freeing up an Adept to concentrate on offensive magic and backup healing.

Much like many others, I wandered over here from Justin's blog. I've only been playing low level pathfinder recently, but if there's need for another cohort or if anyone drops out I'd love to join in the fun.

Either way, I think this will definitely be fun to watch.

Hmm, it took me a while to get some good low scores, I had to throw out a few 17s and 18s. Total comes up to 21 on 3.5 Point Buy Calc:

Str 11   Con 16   Dex 8   Int 6   Wis 10   Cha 15

I'm thinking of a hardy, charming person with lots of HP. I'm leaning towards Commoner, 'cuz it sounds cool, but I don't know anything about new 3.5 classes. I guess I could take a range fighter position, one that can step to the front if necessary.

Here's the classes I'm thinking would be appropriate (but have no idea about current mechanics): Aristocrat, Commoner, basic sword 'n board Fighter (with a ranged weapon of course), Marshal, or Warrior

I need to download PCGen between now and tomorrow.

I'm thinking of using a bit of my gold to invest in a homestead, possibly near a village close to a Sunless Citadel embarkation point. It'd save quite a bit of funds for rest and storage. That and I could raise my own pack mules and have connections to local hirelings. And think of the drama when they all get slaughtered when we open the portals to hell! :)

I'm happy to take leadership.

It seems to me that trying to min-max - even within the limitations for character creation - runs somewhat against the spirit of the exercise. Therefore, I'll avoid the temptation to optimize my character.

I was thinking about playing an artisocrat, but I think an expert works better as a cohort.  So that'd be at most 5th level right?  Still 32-point buy?  How much gold?

Quote from: Foxtrot;597264It seems to me that trying to min-max - even within the limitations for character creation - runs somewhat against the spirit of the exercise. Therefore, I'll avoid the temptation to optimize my character.

I have to agree.  I will also suppress my optimization instinct.

I'm leaning toward a Warmage, since that seems to be appropriate as a cohort (assuming that works out ok). Otherwise, I'm open to playing anything and might even serve the goals of this experiment better if someone else dictated to me what I should play, thus removing any chance that I could do any pre-optimizing.

Any thoughts? If not, then now that my weekend's D&D game session is out of the way I can focus on generating this guy.

-- Castellan

I'm a bit torn.  I'd like to min/max a bit, but I'll pass on using the strongest cheese in my arsenal.  I'll play a haughty human marshal, armed with a polearm and Improved Trip...

I'd love to have a warmage cohort.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;597281I'm a bit torn.  I'd like to min/max a bit, but I'll pass on using the strongest cheese in my arsenal.  I'll play a haughty human marshal, armed with a polearm and Improved Trip...

I'd love to have a warmage cohort.

Warmage it is then, sir! I'm looking at a frost shortspear +1.

I'm avoiding too much optimization, too, but I'm going for a few.

Justin, I'm assuming that per your directive, it's ok to take a Reserve Feat from Complete Mage? I'm looking at "Fiery Burst" to get a once-per-round 5-foot-radius fireball. Is that OK?

I just have to say, if all these new folks are truly from Justin's blog and enjoy playing 3e, I am extremely glad to see them here.  Even though 3e is not my preferred edition, it will be nice to see 3e fans here who aren't....well...like the other crop who migrated here a couple months ago.

I like TSR era D&D so I fit here well, but it would be nice to see other folks' opinions on other editions that are reasonable.  It can only help this site, I think.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;597286Even though 3e is not my preferred edition, it will be nice to see 3e fans here who aren't....well...like the other crop who migrated here a couple months ago.

I've never been accused of being like any other "crop"... I hope that's a good thing.  

Quote from: Sacrosanct;597286I like TSR era D&D so I fit here well, but it would be nice to see other folks' opinions on other editions that are reasonable.  It can only help this site, I think.

Pathfinder is my system of choice these days, but I first played D&D in 1977, when I was a mere lad.  I came late to 3rd edition, as I was perfectly satisfied with my old AD&D rules (which had some 2nd Edition mixed in).

I'm afraid that I haven't much love for 4e (If they flat-out TRIED to make a system that wasn't for me, they couldn't have done worse), but I recognize that some of my frustration with that system was due to the folks with whom I played it.

There is no set of rules so perfect that a group of chowderheads can't make it a chore to play.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;597290Pathfinder is my system of choice these days, but I first played D&D in 1977, when I was a mere lad.  .

That was when I started playing too. I still remember staying up late, struggling with the Blue Box rules, Dad asking what I was working so hard on.

I did a decent enough job of it, the only thing I messed up was reading the starting gold as 3d6 x 100.

Well, since Foxtrot is taking leadership as well, I believe that means I'm in as a cohort? Unless I missed something, the range/sneak type role is still open. I'm thinking of doing some sort of scout or ranger - my mighty leader's reliable tracker.  If that fits with the party, I'll roll something up tomorrow.  

Whose cohort would I be? I thin I was second on the cohort list, and foxtrot was second to say he'd take leadership, so would that make me his cohort? I want to make sure my personality somewhat meshes with his.

Lady Jastian Wyvernstongue, haughty defender of the established order, and her spirited dapple-grey charger, "Paladin"...

Lady Jastian (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=465890)

(She was built assuming that her cohort's gear wasn't coming out of her budget.  If it is, her equipment will be much humbler.  Of course, she'll be more arrogant than ever...)

Winthrop Porter: Butler, Guide, and Gentleman

My character sheet, thus far, can be found http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466140

I went with a scout, so that I can have lots of skill points, and because I wanted a ranged character.  But a scout with a bow is so dull and normal.  My scout throws axes at things!  I took Far Shot (and thus point blank shot) so that I'm not constantly taking range increment penalties, because the throwing axe is actually quite terrible.

The main skills I took were Survival (because he's a hunter/wilderness guide), hide/move silently (the image of the invisible butler popping out of nowhere) and listen (a good skill for any servant to have).  I also saw that Speak Language is apparently a class skill for the scout, which seemed fun.  Spending 6 points there, plus his intelligence, lets him know all the major racial languages, plus draconic.  He is fluent in over 8 forms of communication!

For feats, I took two "shot" feats, plus tracking of course.  For my fourth feat, I really wanted to take Brachiation (Move through wooded areas at normal speed by swinging from tree to tree) because it's hilarious, and also terrible.  However, I really don't think it fits with the reserved, butler type character I had envisioned.  I currently have taken Stealthy instead, but if the thought of Brachiation amuses me enough, or someone can come up with a good justification for me having it, I may switch back to it.

I am curious how wealth works for cohorts as well.  If I'm just using wbl for a level 5, I'd have 9000g.  Which is enough to afford that shiny +1 returning throwing axe I've had my eyes on (seriously, I think it's hard to be less optimized than throwing weapons).  If my gear has to come out of my employer's pocket, however, I'll just buy a bunch of normal throwing axes and collect them after the battles.

Sorry for the late response. I was up partying until 4 AM last night. (I regret nothing.)

First, important character creation information: Cohorts and followers use the standard elite array for ability scores (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8) and the NPC Gear Value table (DMG, pg. 127).

Quote from: Sir Wulf;597165I'll take Leadership.

Tom: That's you playing Sir Wulf's cohort. Sir Wulf's Leadership score will be 10 or 11, which means a 7th level cohort.

Quote from: Foxtrot;597264I'm happy to take leadership.

Josh: That gives you a slot as Foxtrot's cohort.

Quote from: castellan;597284Justin, I'm assuming that per your directive, it's ok to take a Reserve Feat from Complete Mage? I'm looking at "Fiery Burst" to get a once-per-round 5-foot-radius fireball. Is that OK?

That would be fine. Although, please note, that proceeding in the order of sign-up I don't actually have a cohort slot for you yet. (I'm fine swapping who's cohort for whom, of course.)

Quote from: Tanthius;597226Much like many others, I wandered over here from Justin's blog. I've only been playing low level pathfinder recently, but if there's need for another cohort or if anyone drops out I'd love to join in the fun.

I'm adding a list of current players and a waiting list to the first post in this thread.

Quote from: StormBringer;597174I am using PCGen to cause the least amount of problems whipping this guy up, but here is the preliminary; I still have some tweaking to do, and the sheet is barely usable, but that is the output from the software.

Looks good. Am I reading the PCGen output correctly that you have 4857 gp in unspent cash?

Quote from: Sir Wulf;597311Lady Jastian (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=465890)

There's something wrong with your ability scores.  Unless I'm missing something, right now you've got an initial array of 16/14/14/14/6/15 (which is 34 points) and then the +1 adjustment at 4th level. I think you need to drop it to 15/14/14/14/6/15 and then apply the +1 adjustment.

Everything else looks good under my quick eyeballing.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;597311(She was built assuming that her cohort's gear wasn't coming out of her budget.  If it is, her equipment will be much humbler.  Of course, she'll be more arrogant than ever...)

That's correct. Cohort gear is on a separate budget.

Quote from: Josh;597366Winthrop Porter: Butler, Guide, and Gentleman

My character sheet, thus far, can be found http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466140

As you've probably already guessed, I'll need you to revise around the standard elite array to keep your cohort by-the-book. (Remember to do the +1 ability adjustment for 4th level, though.)

You may also be adding a couple levels, depending on what Foxtrot's Leadership score ends up being.

Those still on the waiting list: I'm temporarily holding off on the decision whether or not to include 1st level followers. I'm going to see what things look like once we firm up all the PCs and cohorts and then make a judgment call based on the logistics of a forum-based campaign.

Quote from: Doom;597300I did a decent enough job of it, the only thing I messed up was reading the starting gold as 3d6 x 100.

My favorite blooper as a new player was reading the "Ability Score Bonuses and Penalties" table to mean that you supposed to adjust the actual ability score. So, for example, that table listed a +3 adjustment for a score of 18. And I interpreted that as "if you roll 18, you add +3 and get a score of 21". So all of the munchkin PCs I "rolled" in 5th grade had ability scores maxed out at 21 instead of 18.

Quote from: Sacrosanct;597286I just have to say, if all these new folks are truly from Justin's blog and enjoy playing 3e, I am extremely glad to see them here.  Even though 3e is not my preferred edition, it will be nice to see 3e fans here who aren't....well...like the other crop who migrated here a couple months ago.

I like TSR era D&D so I fit here well, but it would be nice to see other folks' opinions on other editions that are reasonable.  It can only help this site, I think.

Word to that! Welcome everyone here, and I hope you enjoy your stay :)

Winthrop is updated with the standard array and appropriate wealth.  I spent most of his money on a bag of holding - being able to lug his employer's stuff around seems useful.  It's actually pretty hard to stay within a light load (needed for my skirmish) when you're hauling a half dozen weapons around with you.  If he actually carries the bag of holding, he's within 2 lbs of a medium load - pick up a lantern and he's officially encumbered.  Like many I seldom bother with encumbrance rules, but since we're trying to stay by the book I figured it's best to track it.  

I took an assortment of axes, masterwork, cold iron, and silvered.  A good butler must always be prepared!

Doesn't the leadership feat state that a cohort can never be higher than 2 levels below his leader?  In that case, we'd be stuck at 5th level.  We could theoretically be lower, if our master has a bad charisma (please don't have a terrible charisma, Foxtrot).

Quote from: Josh;597454Doesn't the leadership feat state that a cohort can never be higher than 2 levels below his leader?  In that case, we'd be stuck at 5th level.

You are correct.

Eyeballing of Winthrop looks good. I'd recommend picking some miscellaneous mundane stuff to represent the eclectic collection that usually happens with actual PCs and/or the "always be prepared" motto. But whatever works for you.

Here's Gileus Darfin, 5th level Expert: character sheet (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466344)

He is essentially Giles or Daniel Jackson.  He seeks out new knowledge and discoveries.  He is full of helpful information and advice, probably more than needed.

I kinda wish we were higher level, so he could be a caddie to the inevitable golf bag of weapons.  "Salamanders, my lady.  Resistant to fire.  Very nasty.  Might I recommend the +2 frost glaive?"

I had spent some gold stuffing my Bag with all manner of adventuring gear, but apparently those changes didn't save.  Praise be to google chrome for recovering them.  I agree that my character needs basically any adventuring gear you could wish for, including a ladder, 10 foot pole, and a spade.  Just in case.

Quote from: Tom;597499Here's Gileus Darfin, 5th level Expert: character sheet (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466344)

I think I just discovered that I've been handling Speak Languages wrong for 13 years by not properly tracking it a a cross-class skill. ;)

The eyballin' inspection looks good to me.

QuoteI kinda wish we were higher level, so he could be a caddie to the inevitable golf bag of weapons.  "Salamanders, my lady.  Resistant to fire.  Very nasty.  Might I recommend the +2 frost glaive?"

Lovin' it.

Ugh, this takes crazy long, and without a 3e PHB I don't know what so many magic items do. PCGen probably makes things easier, but chargen is still cumbersome.

Anyway, this is a draft for a City Gear Set. This shows Skills w/o armor penalty. I also have a dog follower and a horse mount, but I don't know if I have to buy them in Inventory>Gear or Inventory>Resources NPCs. As NPCs, both of them have strong Listen & Spot skills.

I have 11k+ of gold I have no idea what to do with. I want a homestead, perhaps a flock or herd of livestock, a family, etc. Outside of buying some land, building a home, a herd, etc., I have no idea what enchanted gear to bother with in 3.5e. If anyone has recommendations I'm all ears.

I also have no idea what languages are nearby where we start so I only have Common. What should I need to know about the setting and locale before play?

Cudberct
Male Human; Medium Humanoid ( Human )
Fighter lvl 7
Hit Dice:  (7d10)+21
Hit Points:  70
Initiative:  +0
Speed:  Walk 20 ft.
AC:  12 (touch 10, flatfooted 12)
Attacks:  *Dagger +8; *Dagger (Thrown) +7/+2;
Damage: *Dagger 1d4; *Dagger (Thrown) 1d4;
Vision:  
Face / Reach:  5 ft. / 5 ft.
Special Qualities:  

Saves:  
Fortitude: +8, Reflex: +2, Will: +2

Abilities:  
STR*12*(+1), DEX*10*(+0), CON*16*(+3), INT*6*(-2), WIS*10*(+0), CHA*15*(+2)

Skills:  
Appraise: -2; Balance: 0; Bluff: 4; Climb: 7; Concentration: 3; Craft (Untrained): -2; Diplomacy: 2; Disguise: 2; Escape Artist: 0; Forgery: -2; Gather Information: 2; Handle Animal: 7; Heal: 0; Hide: 0; Intimidate: 7; Jump: 4; Listen: 0; Move Silently: 0; Ride: 5; Search: -2; Sense Motive: 0; Spot: 0; Survival: 0; Swim: 7; Use Rope: 0;

Feats:  
Animal Affinity, Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Athletic, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Persuasive, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Quick Draw, Run, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Tower Shield Proficiency

Challenge Rating:  7

Alignment:  Lawful Good

Possessions:  Bracers of Armor +1; Dagger; Gloves of Dexterity +2; Leather; Traveler's Outfit; Ring of Feather Falling; Sack; Signet Ring;



Buñuelo
CR 1
Male Warhorse, Light  
TN Large Animal  
Init +1; Senses Low-light; Listen +4, Spot +4  
Languages —  

AC 14, touch 10, flat-footed 13
* * (-1 size, +1 Dex, +4 natural)
hp 30 (3 HD)    
Fort +6, Ref +4, Will +2  

Speed 60 ft. (12 squares)
Melee Hoof +4/+4 (1d4+3) and Bite -1 (1d3+1)  
Space 10 ft.; Reach 5 ft.
Base Atk +2; Grp +9                      

Abilities STR*16, DEX*12, CON*16, INT*2, WIS*12, CHA*6  
Feats Endurance, Run  
Skills Jump +15, Listen +4, Spot +4, Swim (Avoid taking nonlethal fatigue damage) +7


Patita
CR 1/3
Male Dog  
TN Small Animal  
Init +3; Senses Low-light; Listen +5, Spot +7  
Languages —  

AC 15, touch 14, flat-footed 12
* * (+1 size, +3 Dex, +1 natural)
hp 10 (1 HD)    
Fort +4, Ref +5, Will +2  

Speed 40 ft. (8 squares)
Melee Bite +1 (1d4)  
Base Atk +0; Grp -4                      

Abilities STR*10, DEX*16, CON*14, INT*2, WIS*14, CHA*6  
Feats Alertness, Track  
Skills Hide +7, Jump +8, Listen +5, Spot +7

Quote from: Opaopajr;597523I have 11k+ of gold I have no idea what to do with. I want a homestead, perhaps a flock or herd of livestock, a family, etc. Outside of buying some land, building a home, a herd, etc., I have no idea what enchanted gear to bother with in 3.5e. If anyone has recommendations I'm all ears.

I'll let the other players chime in with specific suggestions, but you can also check out all the magic items from the DMG (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/magicItems.htm) if you want to browse specifics.

QuoteSpeed: Walk 20 ft.

I'm not seeing what's knocking your speed from 30 ft. down to 20 ft. (Heavier armor would do it, but you appear to only be wearing leather.)

QuoteDamage: *Dagger 1d4; *Dagger (Thrown) 1d4;

Your Strength bonus should be added to the damage of melee and thrown weapons, so these should be 1d4+1.

QuotePossessions: Bracers of Armor +1; Dagger; Gloves of Dexterity +2; Leather; Traveler's Outfit; Ring of Feather Falling; Sack; Signet Ring;

Having both leather armor and bracers of armor +1 seems like an odd choice (they don't stack). You might want to swap it out for at least a ring of protection +1: It costs 2,000 gp instead of 1,000 gp, but it will stack with your leather armor.

QuoteI also have a dog follower and a horse mount, but I don't know if I have to buy them in Inventory>Gear or Inventory>Resources NPCs.

Light warhorse is 150 gp. Guard dog is 25 gp.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;597551I'll let the other players chime in with specific suggestions, but you can also check out all the magic items from the DMG (http://www.d20srd.org/indexes/magicItems.htm) if you want to browse specifics.

Oh dear god, info overload. *sigh* no time like the present...

Yeah, the 20' is for when I wear scale armor, but that was me not posting right between various equipped gear kits. Scale armor and tower/large shield is for dangerous situations expecting combat. I always hated the idea of people walking around in their armor never taking it off.

About the ring v. bracers, how can you tell when it does and doesn't stack? I might just forgo it, any more "always worn" rings and I might as well call myself the Mandarin.

Quote from: Opaopajr;597566About the ring v. bracers, how can you tell when it does and doesn't stack? I might just forgo it, any more "always worn" rings and I might as well call myself the Mandarin.

Bonuses have names, and things with the same name don't stack.  Armor gives us an armor bonus to AC; bracers of armor give you an armor bonus to AC, so they don't stack.  Ring of protection gives a deflection bonus, and an amulet of natural protection gives a natural armor bonus, so those do stack with regular armor, and each other.

The exception is that dodge and circumstance bonuses stack.

Quote from: Opaopajr;597566I also have no idea what languages are nearby where we start so I only have Common. What should I need to know about the setting and locale before play?

Unless you're putting points into the speak language skill, with an intelligence of 6 you'll only have one language.

Quote from: Opaopajr;597566I have no idea what enchanted gear to bother with in 3.5e. If anyone has recommendations I'm all ears.

I don't think it will matter too much.  The straightforward things are enchanted weapon/armor, ability score boosters (e.g. gloves of dexterity), AC boosters (rings of protection/amulets of natural armor), and saves boosters (cloak of resistance).  A couple potions never hurts.

Looks like all the slots are filled, but if anything opens up I would love to play the local baker.  Fear the wrath of my +1 rolling pin!

(PS: I will bring delicious cake for everybody)

Quote from: Justin Alexander;597434Looks good. Am I reading the PCGen output correctly that you have 4857 gp in unspent cash?

Right now, that is correct.  I may move some things around and see if there is other equipment that looks interesting.  Once that is largely settled, I will send the list and make sure the costs are accurate.

Quote from: Internet Death;597008I thought Mr. GC said it was impossible for those PCs to succeed against an encounter of appropriate difficulty.  I don't think steamrolling a 1st-level dungeon with a band of PCs 6 levels higher qualifies as a valid experiment.

Unless I have it wrong, and Mr. GC is saying that the classes are so gimped they couldn't even survive a low-level scenario.

Yeah, this.

But looks fun anyways.

Best of luck to the players.

Lady Jastian Wyvernstongue has been revised to a 34 point build (If I understand correctly, she had to be 34 points after, not before, the level 4 bump).  She's a bit wiser, but not as nimble or hardy as she once was...

Lady Jastian (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=465890)

Quote from: Opaopajr;597566About the ring v. bracers, how can you tell when it does and doesn't stack? I might just forgo it, any more "always worn" rings and I might as well call myself the Mandarin.

Bonuses with the same type don't stack (with the exception of circumstance and dodge bonuses). Worn armor (like leather, scale, etc.) provides an armor bonus to AC and so do bracers of natural armor, so they don't stack. A ring of protection adds a deflection bonus to AC, so it would stack with the armor bonus.

Also note that you can only wear two magical rings at the same time. The slot limits for magical items are:

1 head
1 face/eyes
1 neck
1 shoulders
1 armor/robes
1 waist
1 arm/wrist (matched pair)
1 hands (matched pair)
2 rings
1 feet (matched pair)

You can wield as many magical shields/weapons as you can physically wield.

QuoteI have no idea what enchanted gear to bother with in 3.5e. If anyone has recommendations I'm all ears.

Honestly, for the purposes of this exercise, I'd just look for anything with a name that leaps out at you as being potentially interesting.

Alternatively, you could just use an automated treasure generator (http://www.myth-weavers.com/generate_treasure.php) to generate random items for you until your budget has been exhausted and see what you get.

Quote from: Internet Death;597008I thought Mr. GC said it was impossible for those PCs to succeed against an encounter of appropriate difficulty.

And that, furthermore, this is the only way you can play D&D.

In the original basketweaver thread, he said (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=587815&postcount=7): "Because the basket weaver stance is inherently inconsistent, incoherent, and often contradictory (as the basket weaver still wants to succeed and win D&D, despite having no actual ability to do so) the only way of dealing with them is to just ignore them. Play the game, do not lower the difficulty in the slightest (and if your non basket weaver players want it raised, do so immediately)."

And in the Team Gimp thread he made it explicit that you can't play D&D any other way. For example (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=591443&postcount=91): "Playing D&D means not playing pretend. And almost the exact instant you start playing D&D, the gimps start dying."

Within the next couple of days we're going to start playing D&D in this thread. We'll see if the "gimps" start dying. (And if you think that's really unlikely to happen, you're only proving my point.)

Look, if you agree with Mr. GC that you can't even "start playing D&D" until every single encounter involves a save-vs-death for every single PC on every single round because that's the "nature of the game (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=595369&postcount=254)" and that having fun while playing a roleplaying game is "entirely irrelevant ... at any time ever (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?p=596862#post596862")" then nothing in this thread is likely to change your mind.

This thread is about sticking your tongue out at people so obsessed with fetishizing balance (http://thealexandrian.net/wordpress/2055/roleplaying-games/fetishizing-balance) that they are no longer capable of thinking of D&D as anything except a competitive wargame.

As for Mr. GC? He's the sad sort who's obsessed with the competitive wargame but can't even get the rules right. He puts all of his focus on the "standard adventuring day", but he can't get the encounter balance right (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=596962&postcount=204). He's obsessed with getting the math right on level appropriate encounters, but he claims that level 10 characters need AC 35 (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=595750&postcount=299) and yet will still get hit 95% of the time by level appropriate encounters (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=595583&postcount=290), which would require an impossibly high attack bonus (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=595851&postcount=320) from a CR 10 opponent.

That's pretty much all I'm going to say on the subject here because the board mods have made it clear that the only place they're willing to tolerate discussion of Mr. GC's inanity is on his Team Gimp thread (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?t=24282). But feel free to continue the discussion there if you feel compelled.

GROUP BUSINESS[/u]

(1) FOXTROT this is a FINAL CALL for your character sheet. If you haven't posted by midnight tonight, I'll have to drop you.

(2) TOM and JOSH: If Foxtrot ends up dropping out, I'll need to promote someone into the party. Would you prefer to keep the cohort you've been working on, level the cohort up into a full PC, or create a completely new PC?

Tom gets first refusal on the slot, then Josh. If both refuse the full slot, then Castellan would get it. (Otherwise one of them would move into the full slot and Castellan would be a cohort.)

Whoever takes the full PC slot will need to take the Leadership feat. I don't want to eliminate active slots at this point regardless of scenario.

(3) FOLLOWERS: Lady Jastian's Leadership score is high enough to have six 1st level followers. How do the currently active players feel about including them in the party? If so, we could let the entire waiting list generate 1st level characters and join in.

I've gotta run out the door at the moment, but I'll be posting some general background info later this evening so that we can start tossing around some more specific background ideas.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;597671(3) FOLLOWERS: Lady Jastian's Leadership score is high enough to have six 1st level followers. How do the currently active players feel about including them in the party? If so, we could let the entire waiting list generate 1st level characters and join in.

I am completely in favour of this idea; the more the merrier.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;596771Here's the character creation rules, as set forth by Mr. GC:

Party of 4.
Level 7, 32 Point Buy, 19000 gp.
PCs are restricted to the following classes: Adept, Aristocrat, Barbarian, CA Ninja, Commoner, CW Samurai, Expert, Fighter (dungeoncrasher or not), Healer, Hexblade, Knight, Marshal, Monk, Paladin, Ranger, Rogue, Scout, Soulknife, Spellthief, Swashbuckler, Warlock, Warmage, Warrior.

L7 for an L1 adventure?  32 points?  19,000gp??

One player with those stats could complete The Sunless Citadel by himself.

Well, I'm wholly flush with cash to hire untrained hirelings, so anyone interested in jumping the bandwagon let me know.

I haven't the foggiest what to spend 11k GP on. Outside a mega-stack of CLW potions and hirelings in the "Bollywood cast of thousands!" numbers I sorta don't care what I get. (However I must say the random item generator is pretty hoss.) But I still really want property, Justin. However, that might fuck up your campaign. So it's all up to you.

But first, the pitch!: Perhaps instead of the infamous generic tavern meet-up, I'll run an adventurer's inn/tavern with wife and kids. I can take on any straggler newcomers like say, greyknight as a pastry chef, famed baker of "delicious cakes," and they can run DCC lvl 0-1 adventures while we're away. And whenever one of us fall, they might be able to substitute, changing up their roster lineup. The big problems I immediately see are: a) it might make you more work, and b) it might fulfill the "Fun!" win condition too early.

Meanwhile I'll be generating random items for something cool... ooh, a LG empathic shortspear of bluffing!

WEAPON
  SpearShort +1 (3,301 gp)
    Int: 11 (0)
    Wis: 14 (2)
    Cha: 7 (-2)
    Ego: 4
    Communication: empathy
    Alignment: lawful good
    Skills:
      bluff +10
-------------------
TOTAL VALUE: 3,301 gp

Yeah... this might not end well.

Hi,

I haven't played as long as some here, but at least I started with AD&D. I prefer 3.5 now, but there's still a place in my heart for the olde days. ;-)

Magic items
Well, what would you want, really? Magic weapon, armor, something that makes you faster, or more stealthy, or...?

You could just get a cool weapon. (You really want daggers?) A magical weapon is 2000gp for +1, 8000gp for +2 (on top of 3xxgp for masterwork weapon). Flaming (Frost, Shock) sword is also 8000gp.

Armor? Ordinary +2 armor is 4000gp (on top of the costs for masterwork armor). +2 shield is 4000gp.
Something more fancy? A +1 blinding shield (blinds everyone in 20ft. for 1d4 rounds like a flash grenade) is also 4000gp. Or maybe a lion's shield (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicArmor.htm#lionsShield) that bites your foes. It doesn't get cooler than that.

Something completely different?
Maybe a pair of Sending Stones to keep in touch with your loved ones. (1400gp, Sending as the spell 1/day, MIC p.184)
An Immovable Rod?
A Necklace of Fireballs?
One of my favorites: Nolzur's marvelous pigments: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#marvelousPigments

Quote from: Justin Alexander;597671GROUP BUSINESS[/u]
(2) TOM and JOSH: If Foxtrot ends up dropping out, I'll need to promote someone into the party. Would you prefer to keep the cohort you've been working on, level the cohort up into a full PC, or create a completely new PC?

I am fine doing a full character in this scenario, if Tom doesn't want to.  That said, Winthrop "feels" like a cohort to me, so I'd probably tweak his character somewhat.  I would still fulfill the range/sneak roll, though.  

This is all hypothetical of course, depending on Foxtrot and Tom.

I'm fine staying as a cohort.

Quote from: DonEsteban;597742Maybe a pair of Sending Stones to keep in touch with your loved ones. (1400gp, Sending as the spell 1/day, MIC p.184)

Whoa! I can be nagged from afar? Sold!

"Almost eaten by an alligator today fording the river. Thankfully I listened to your warnings to leave the heavy armor off while wading in water. I love you dearest, as being here away from you tests my resolve nightly."

"Did you know what your son did today?! Well I'll tell you. And you know it's all because you won't listen to me on how to make him mind, I can tell you that..."

Edit: the daggers are for equipped City gear Set. I have other gear like regular ol' armor & weapons like Morning Star, Long Sword, Long Bow, Tower/Heavy wood/Light wood Shields, Splint Mail (dunno if it's setting appropriate), splurged on a Chain Shirt, etc.

Also got my 10' pole, ladder, oil flasks, oil lamp, chalk, sacks of flour, hemp rope, donkey, cart, 3-weeks of rations, untrained hirelings as guards & porters, etc. Y'know, the usual.

SOME BACKGROUND INFO[/u]


Oakhurst is a pleasant little village, with about 40 permanent residents and a greater population in the surrounding farmlands (mostly to the east) of 900 or so. It's way out on the edge of things and there are no other major communities within easy traveling distance.

Folks in town:

Kerowyn Hucrele is part of the bloodsworn Hucrele clan. The bloodsworns run long distance trade through most of the known world and the Hucreles have this swath of territory pretty much under their thumb. Kerowyn's store is in the village square and deals in foreign exotics and commissioned trading.

Dern Nacre is the local healer and a follower of the Old Ways. She tends the dragon circles around town and her face bears the green draconic tattoos of the Faith. She speaks the dragon tongue (Draconic) and quite a few folks back up in the hills speak the same.

The town's luck to have a dwarf, Rurik Lutgehr, as a blacksmith. Gives it the air of civilization, if you know what I mean. He seems to appreciate the quiet tasks of the local farmers, but he's had a few nicer weapons hanging on his walls for as long as anyone can remember.

The local geography:

Oakhurst itself is surrounded by a large dragon circle of standing stones. They're said to protect the town, although what they protect against no one can rightly say.

An avenue of stones cuts away from the circle due west, ending just shy of the nearest edge of the Ashen Plain. This vast, gray expanse of dead earth is a bleak and barren no man's land.

The Old Road runs off to the southwest and smack dab into a ravine. Dern Nacre warns the locals away from that crevasse, although they usually don't need encouraging because everyone knows there's a tribe of runty goblins that live down in those deeps. Beyond that ravine is the further expanse of the Ashen Plain.

Local legends says that the Ashen Plain was burned to gray dust by the red dragon Ashardalon. The demon-winged Ashardalon features in a host of local legends, though, and they can't all be true.

CONCEPTS

Okay, I think that should be enough to orient ourselves. Sounds like Opaopajr wants to run the local inn. What about the rest of ya? Locals or out of towners?

Post your thoughts and we'll see how we can get 'em to hook up.

For the local inn: I'm going to call that equivalent to a "grand house", which would require 5,000 gp.

Hmm, if I can get a reliable bridge built over the ravine, I might be able to break the Hucrele monopoly. Naturally I'll suggest it's in the name of connecting to other rich lands beyond, but soon, soon I could have competing suppliers...

Who owns this domain? I wonder if we can create the bridge, man a toll booth (to pay for bridge upkeep) and justify an increase in the local militia. Then we can slaughter -- or employ! -- the goblins! Yes, goblins make good cheap, disposable labor, (shit, I'm Lawful Good) ... and maybe the free hand of the market can uplift their condition into adopting mankind's civilizing ways. Yeah, that's the ticket!

Quote from: Opaopajr;597778Hmm, if I can get a reliable bridge built over the ravine, I might be able to break the Hucrele monopoly. Naturally I'll suggest it's in the name of connecting to other rich lands beyond, but soon, soon I could have competing suppliers...

Who owns this domain? I wonder if we can create the bridge, man a toll booth (to pay for bridge upkeep) and justify an increase in the local militia. Then we can slaughter -- or employ! -- the goblins! Yes, goblins make good cheap, disposable labor, (shit, I'm Lawful Good) ... and maybe the free hand of the market can uplift their condition into adopting mankind's civilizing ways. Yeah, that's the ticket!

And thus begins the oldest tradition in gaming - completely ignoring the designated plot in favor of wild and grandiose schemes.

As for Winthrop, it will depend on whether he ends up being a cohort or pc.  If a cohort, he will likely be the life-long manservant of his leader's family, perhaps recently having his service pass from his leader's parents into the hands of his leader.  

If a PC, Winthrop is a local.  He's a familiar face around the town, as he comes in from now and then to restock, replace a lost axe, and tell tall tales in Cudberct's tavern.  The rest of the time he spends in his home in the hills, hunting, drinking tea, and reading.  It's well known that he knows the area around Oakhurst as well as any, and he's willing to lead exploratory expeditions, so long as his charges don't mind the danger, and the occasional lively literary discourse.  Like many of the hill-folk, he speaks draconic, and has an off-handed interest in dragon lore.  Whenever in town, he takes the opportunity to look up Dern, and see if he can lend her a hand.  He also frequent's Rurik's weapon shoppe exclusively, and when there makes sure to brush up on his dwarven.

I'll run with whatever Sir Wulf wants to do, but I figure Gileus is Lady Jastian's advisor and pack mule.

The Wyverntongues are a distant aristocratic house, its mighty founders famed in legend and heroic chansons.  Unfortunately for Lady Jastian, these ancient tales are not her family's only traditions:  A malediction supposedly haunts their line.  

According to an old folk tale, the Wyverntongue Curse dates back to the days of the house's famed founders.  The story claims that when a Lady of the Wyverntongues stands as the line's sole heir, she is doomed to wed a living nightmare, a depraved monster as foul within as he seems fair without.

When her elder brother lay upon his deathbed, Lady Jastian foresaw the curse's dark clutches settling upon her soul.  Gathering what items she could, the veteran warrior rode into the night, hoping to find clues about the curse's origins or how it could manifest.  Keeping her purpose secret to all but her most trusted associates, she instead claimed to quest after long-forgotten treasures of her ancestors, items that might reverse the family's declining fortunes.  

Only a scant handful of gold coins remains from the wealth Jastian carried upon her departure.  She must secure more soon, lest she be forced to humiliate herself by accepting employment as a mere sellsword or caravan guard.

Bloody hell... how do you show all the possessions you have that are not equipped? I have pack animals, carts, wagons, combat sets for different situations, camping gear, spare gear for hirelings, etc. and I can't get PCGen to display a character sheet with all of it! Most distressing.

Still have over 10k GP left over, btw. It's fine, I'm going to need funds to run the Boar's Inn anyway.

I fancy creating a commoner that runs the local basket shop. Maybe does a bit of thatching in the side....

Quote from: Opaopajr;597867Bloody hell... how do you show all the possessions you have that are not equipped? I have pack animals, carts, wagons, combat sets for different situations, camping gear, spare gear for hirelings, etc. and I can't get PCGen to display a character sheet with all of it! Most distressing.

You can add stuff to an equip set as "not carried". It will show up on the sheet, but not add to your weight carried, for instance.

Consider getting the development version ("RC1") of  6.0.0. It's faster, bigger, better. (But the alpha may have a few glitches.)

I have updated Winthrop to be a level 7 PC.  He is stronger, skillier, and poorer.

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=466140

As a PC, his personality is that which I mentioned earlier, the local guide, hunter, and storyteller.  He is fascinated with old lore, books, and exploration.  His prized possession, besides his warhorse Barnaby and his boomerang axe, is his Folding Boat, gifted to him by his father, cabin boy on the first ship to cross the .  He carries it with him wherever he goes, in hopes that he may have the opportunity to follow in his father's footsteps, and himself be the first to cross an unknown body of water.  Unfortunately, he has chosen to live in the middle of a barren plain, seemingly leagues from any sizeable pond.  He has also never sailed before, and the grand total of his skills (1 rank) come out of a somewhat fanciful book on pirates he owns.  And he's deathly afraid of swimming.

He has leadership, and his score is enough to give him a level 5 cohort, but no followers.  I'm not really sure what makes the most sense as his cohort, since I'm not sure if he'd be the type to have servants (being almost a servant himself).  I had two thoughts on this, depending on what Castellan (or whoever ends up being my cohort) would prefer:

1) My "cohort" could actually be my employer.  He would be a local of some degree of wealth or influence, who employs me, the more talented, skilled hunter, to lead him on his adventures.

2) My cohort is a relative, possibly a son or nephew.  I know Castellan was interested in playing a warmage, which would work fine, Winthrop finds magic fascinating and would fully support a relative participating in such scholarship.  Perhaps his nephew was thrown out of his home, or otherwise chose to live on the frontier with his uncle.

I'm open to any sort of suggestion, though.

Two quick questions:

How much would a small hut in the hills cost?  I only have 11g remaining, but could probably pawn some of my axes or armor.  Otherwise, I guess he lives under a tree.

Also, this is more theoretical, but is the bard actually considered to be one of the "powerful" classes?  It's not in the list of classes, which I only noticed when considering multiclassing to up my storytelling side.  I'm not concerned, just surprised, but I'm not a power builder at all (my most op build was a mediocre charging barbarian).  Just curious.

Quote from: Josh;597921Two quick questions:

How much would a small hut in the hills cost?  I only have 11g remaining, but could probably pawn some of my axes or armor.  Otherwise, I guess he lives under a tree.

Also, this is more theoretical, but is the bard actually considered to be one of the "powerful" classes?  It's not in the list of classes, which I only noticed when considering multiclassing to up my storytelling side.  I'm not concerned, just surprised, but I'm not a power builder at all (my most op build was a mediocre charging barbarian).  Just curious.

I'll tell thee what master Winthrop I will weave thee a small hut for 3 gold. It won't be fancy but will keep worst of the weather out and you can peg her down any place thee likes. For an extra 2 gold I will throw in a brace o' sheepkins and a oiled tarp and you'll be as dry as a bone an' snug.

Quote from: jibbajibba;597923I'll tell thee what master Winthrop I will weave thee a small hut for 3 gold. It won't be fancy but will keep worst of the weather out and you can peg her down any place thee likes. For an extra 2 gold I will throw in a brace o' sheepkins and a oiled tarp and you'll be as dry as a bone an' snug.

But will it keep my books dry? It's a very important collection. Most extensive collection of works this side of the , I believe.

As an aside, Tom, I hope that it is all right that our characters are somewhat similar, seekers of knowledge and all that. I see them as somewhat of kindred spirits. I expect that Winthrop and Gileus will be good friends.

Well, if there are followers involved, I propose this guy.  Now we just need a butcher and a candlestick-maker. ;-)

EDIT: stats are now the elite array, starting gold adjusted to 900gp.  Upgraded his holy symbol and gave some magic items.  Also added two feats and an extra 4 skill points for being human.

Certh the baker, son of Dened

Certh is Oakhurst's village baker, a stout fellow who makes a brisk trade in delicious baked goods.  He is devoutly religious and is reliable in character.  He trains with the village "militia" (such as it is), although he's never seen any combat more involved than scaring off the odd wandering goblin.

Male Human Commoner 1
HD: 1d4+2+3 (9 hp)
Init: -1
Speed: 30ft
Str: 15 (+2)
Dex:  8 (-1)
Con: 14 (+2)
Int: 13 (+1)
Wis: 10 (+0)
Cha: 12 (+1)

Skills:
+8/+10 Craft (delicious baked goods) [Int 1 + ranks 4 + feat 3; also +2 rolling-pin]
+4 Profession (baker) [Wis 0 + ranks 4]
+2 Spot [Wis 0 + ranks 2]
+2 Listen [Wis 0 + ranks 2]
+1 Use Rope [Dex -1 + ranks 2]
+3 Use Magic Device [Cha 1 + ranks 2]

Feats:
* Skill Focus: Craft(baking)
* Toughness

Proficiencies: Clubs.  No armours.  No shields.
Languages: Common, Celestial

BAB: +0 (melee +2, ranged -1)
Saves: [+2/-1/+0]  (attr [2/-1/0] + Commoner [0/0/0])
AC: 10 (Dex -1, armour +1)

Equipment: (631.17gp, 21.5lb)
* Padded armour (AC +1, 5gp, 10lb): nonproficient
* Cudgel (melee 1d6+2, 3lb)
* Rolling-pin (as club: melee 1d6+2, 400gp, 3lb): magically provides +2 competence with Craft(baking) checks
* Towel of purification (200gp): once per day this kitchen towel can be draped over some contaminated food/water to make it suitable for eating and drinking.
* Potions: 2*cure light wounds, shillelagh oil, shield of faith
* Silver holy symbol (25gp)
* Basket of fresh-baked cakes, baker's dozen (2lb?)
* sack (1sp, 0.5lb)
* 5 torches (5cp, 5lb)
* flint and steel (1gp)
* bag of flour (2cp, 1lb)
Cash:
* 68.83gp

Load: 0--66lb light, 67--133lb medium

Jady Jastian sat in the common room of the Old Boar Inn, a melancholy spirit flickering in her eyes.  Somewhat in her cups, the foreign aristocrat regaled onlookers with tales of distant lands and the warlike poems of ancient heroes.  Between tales, she sipped delicately from a goblet of the inn's cheapest wine, her teeth gritted against the inferior drink's silty dregs.

"Oh, for a few stout companions, such as were seen in the days of yore!  Alas, folk of true mettle are not to be met with in this benighted age.  The mighty champions and learned wizards of the sagas are naught but dreams, legends of a better time."  She paused for another sip of the inn's vinegary vintage.  "A band of such puissance would surely rout the innumerable evils that plague this land!”

Quote from: jibbajibba;597868I fancy creating a commoner that runs the local basket shop. Maybe does a bit of thatching in the side....

I'm picturing a heroic man of mystery...
"The Basketeer, Mysterious Master of Wickerwork"

I've never played this module before, is it feasible for the followers to get isolated from the main group? Seeing as we're XL1 and all, get the full experience :-D I don't see where the "XL7 group vs level 1 challenge" bit is from, but sure I will help out either way.

EDIT: oh, I see, it's the context we're embedded in. In a sandbox environment the party can choose any objective as their next one. Here we assume an XL7 party has chosen to raid the Sunless Citadel, which is at least as valid as them choosing the deathtrap dungeon from the other thread. Actually I might make a character for that game too, double the entertainment.

Castellan should feel empowered to step up with a cohort.

DonEsteban, Tanthius, Greyknight, jibbajibba should all whip up 1st level followers.

Let's aim for a deadline of Wednesday at 8 pm CST for those. Once that's done, I'll do a thorough/final auditing pass on all character sheets and we can firm up all the character backgrounds. The rough objective I'm eyeballing is to launch into actual gameplay over the weekend, but we'll see how it goes.

Quote from: Josh;597921I have updated Winthrop to be a level 7 PC.  He is stronger, skillier, and poorer.

Looks good for the eyeballin'.

QuoteHow much would a small hut in the hills cost?  I only have 11g remaining, but could probably pawn some of my axes or armor.  Otherwise, I guess he lives under a tree.

Using Cityscape, I've determined that a hut in the hills would cost 100 gp. A nice cottage in town will run you 1,000 gp.

QuoteAlso, this is more theoretical, but is the bard actually considered to be one of the "powerful" classes?

Not AFAIK.

Sea your father crossed: The Krakenwake.

Mountain range: Ashardalon's Teeth.

Quote from: greyknight;598000I've never played this module before, is it feasible for the followers to get isolated from the main group? Seeing as we're XL1 and all, get the full experience :-D I don't see where the "XL7 group vs level 1 challenge" bit is from, but sure I will help out either way.

Splitting the party is always sound strategy.

As Lady Jastian's complaints die out, a man stands up from where he had been sitting at the bar, nursing a mug of the inn's cheapest ale.  He is verging on middle aged, rugged and plain-faced.  He leaves his bulging haversack and belt full of axes by his stool and crosses the inn to the lady's table.

"Not so, milady.  This is a rough and dangerous land, to be sure, but there are heroes aplenty.  Buy me a glass of that delightful wine and I will tell you the tale of the time I lead a band of heroes to battle the dragoncult kobolds of the Ashen Plain."

Justin: Hopefully I'm not jumping the gun here, if you'd rather wait until all the characters are firmed up, I can wait until the weekend.  In my defense, Sir Wulf started it.

Also, I have no idea if there are dragoncult kobolds in the Ashen Plain.  If there are, maybe Winthrop actually did battle them.  If not, I guess that's why it's a story.

I may have jumped the gun a bit, but I figure that a chat in the local inn is mandatory for such dauntless adventurers.  (Lady Jastian heard a rumor that an adept of some skill dwells somewhere near the village, but she is starting to suspect that the information was false.)

Winthrop now owns a hut in the hills.  The only things of interest are a few furs and his ratty book collection.

Barnaby is now just a regular ol' horse, instead of a warhorse.  I wanted him to be a pony, but apparently those are for little people only.  I thought about a mule, but felt that having a mount with a slower base speed than his rider was possibly silly.

Go for it.

Quote from: Justin AlexanderDonEsteban, Tanthius, Greyknight, jibbajibba should all whip up 1st level followers.

Will do. Happily. What's the budget? Standard starting gold by class?

Quote from: Josh;597921Also, this is more theoretical, but is the bard actually considered to be one of the "powerful" classes?  It's not in the list of classes, which I only noticed when considering multiclassing to up my storytelling side.  I'm not concerned, just surprised, but I'm not a power builder at all (my most op build was a mediocre charging barbarian).  Just curious.

Not as powerful as full casters, but versatile. A bard can be a diplomat, a buffer, deal damage, provide utility spells and be a secondary healer even. And it got a lot of love in splat books giving the class lots and lots of options. That's why it's considered to be in a higher tier than, say, fighter or rogue.

Quote from: Sir WulfI may have jumped the gun a bit, but I figure that a chat in the local inn is mandatory for such dauntless adventurers.

Jumping or not, shouldn't we get an in character and an out of character thread at least? It makes pbp gaming so much more enjoyable. IMHO!

Quote from: DonEsteban;598042Jumping or not, shouldn't we get an in character and an out of character thread at least? It makes pbp gaming so much more enjoyable. IMHO!

I was thinking of proposing the same thing.

Pardon me if the ship has sailed (perfectly understandable), but I did not notice the ruling about followers until just now. Have you any use for another follower, Lady Jastian?

I believe that the gamemaster has given his blessings to adding another follower or two.  Lady Jastian would never deny the heroic desires of a prospective companion.

CUDBERCT
CR 7
Male Human fighter 7
LG medium humanoid (human)
Init +0; Senses Listen +0, Spot +0,  
Languages*Common

AC*18,*touch*10,*flat-footed*18  
hp*70*(7HD)
Fort*+8,*Ref*+2,*Will*+2

Speed*20 ft.*(4*squares)  

Melee*dagger*+8/+3*(1d4+1/19-20)
Ranged*dagger (thrown)*+7/+2*(1d4+1/19-20),*within*30*ft.*+8/+3*(1d4+2)
Melee*dagger*+8/+3*(1d4+1/19-20)
Ranged*dagger (thrown)*+7/+2*(1d4+1/19-20),*within*30*ft.*+8/+3*(1d4+2)
Ranged*composite longbow str*+7/+2*(1d8/x3),*within*30*ft.*+8/+3*(1d8+1)
Melee*longsword*+8/+3*(1d8+1/19-20)
Melee*morningstar*+8/+3*(1d8+1)
Melee*pick, heavy*+8/+3*(1d6+1/x4)
Melee*shortspear*+8/+3*(1d6+1/x3)
Ranged*shortspear (thrown)*+7/+2*(1d6+1/x3),*within*30*ft.*+8/+3*(1d6+2)
Melee*sword, short*+8/+3*(1d6+1/19-20)  

Face 5 ft. Reach 5 ft.
Base*Atk*+7;*Grp+8  

ATK OPTIONS  Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot,                

ABILITIES  Str 12, Dex 10, Con 16, Int 6, Wis 10, Cha 15

FEATS  Animal Affinity, Armor Proficiency (Heavy), Armor Proficiency (Light), Armor Proficiency (Medium), Athletic, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Mounted Combat, Persuasive, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Quick Draw, Run, Shield Proficiency, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Tower Shield Proficiency

NO ARMOR PENALTY:  Appraise -2, Bluff +4, Climb +7, Concentration +3, Craft (Untrained) -2, Diplomacy +2, Disguise +2, Forgery -2, Gather Information +2, Handle Animal +7, Intimidate +7, Jump +4, Ride +5, Search -2, Swim +7,

WITHOUT TOWER SHIELD: Appraise -2, Balance -6, Bluff +4, Climb -2, Concentration +3, Craft (untrained) -2, Diplomacy +2, Disguise +2, Escape Artist -6, Forgery -2, Gather Information +2, Handle Animal +7, Hide -6, Intimidate +7, Jump -5, Move Silently -6, Ride +5, Search -2, Swim -3

WITH TOWER SHIELD: Appraise -2, Balance -10, Bluff +4, Climb -6, Concentration +3, Craft (untrained) -2, Diplomacy +2, Disguise +2, Escape Artist -10, Forgery -2, Gather Information +2, Handle Animal +7, Hide -10, Intimidate +7, Jump -9, Move Silently -10, Ride +5, Search -2, Swim -7

POSSESSIONS  alchemist's fire (flask) (x5);  arrows (20);  arrows (50);  banded mail;  barding (leather);  bedroll (x2);  bit and bridle (x6);  blanket (winter);  buckler;  chalk (1 piece) (x5);  climber's kit;  crowbar;  dagger (x10);  firewood (per day) (x5); flint & steel; flour (per lb.) (x9);  gloves of dexterity +2;  grappling hook;  hammer;  ladder (10 ft.);  lamp (common) (x2);  lantern (hooded);  leather;  lock (good) (x3);  longsword;  mirror (small/steel);  morningstar;  oil (1 pt. flask) (x10);  boots (x2); cold weather outfit;  explorer's outfit;  peasant's outfit (x5);  traveler's outfit (x2); pick, heavy;  pick (miner's);  pole (10 ft.) (x2);  potion of cure light wounds (x2);  rations (trail/per day) (x20);  ring of feather falling;  rope (hempen/50 ft.) (x2);  saddle (military) (x3);  saddle (riding) (x3);  scale (merchant's);  sealing wax;  shield, heavy;  shield, tower;  shortspear (x6);  signal whistle;  signet ring;  soap (per lb.) (x2);  spade or shovel;  sword, short;  tent (x2);  thunderstone (x4);  torch (x23);  waterskin (filled) (x5);  whetstone (x2);  Backpack ; Basket ; Basket ; Bucket ; Cart ; Cart ; Chest ; Chest ; Chest ; Dog (Guard) ; Dog (Guard) ; Donkey ; Donkey ; Composite Longbow STR ; Pot (Iron) ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Sack ; Saddle (Pack) ; Saddle (Pack) ; Saddle (Pack) ; Saddlebags ; Wagon ; Warhorse (Light) ; Warhorse (Light) ; Warhorse (Light)

Ol' Boar Inn "Grand House" 5,000 GP

Money/Wealth: 5,838 GP remaining (can a portion of it be in script and favors to people around town and the like? sitting on a dragon horde of cash seems silly.) (Caravan Supplies = -16.2gp. Current Total= 5821.8 GP.)

Gear in Caravan

Cudberct  36 lb
Explorer Outfit 8 lb, Leather Armor 15 lb, Buckler 5 lb, Longbow + 20 arrows (quivered) 3+3 lb, Dagger x2 (belted) 2lb, Signet Ring, Ring Feather Fall, Glove of Dex+2.

Dog guard (Patita)

Warhorse, light (Buñuelo) 59 lb
Saddle military 30 lb, Short Spear x3 (assume military saddle has spear basket) 9 lb, Barding leather 15 lb, Bit & Bridle 1lb, Waterskin 4 lb,

Warhorse light (Certh's?)  35 lb
Saddle military 30 lb, Bit & Bridle 1lb, Waterskin 4 lb

Warhorse light spare (Mika? Maggie?)  35 lb
Saddle military 30 lb, Bit & Bridle 1 lb, Waterskin 4 lb

Cart + 2 Donkeys  (*= in cart)
(106 + 16 + 5.5 + 580 + 112.5 + 19 + 70 + 77 + 17 = 1003 lb carried)

*Miscellanea loose  106 lb
Saddlebags x3 24 lb, Shield tower 45 lb, Shortspear x3 9 lb, 10' Pole  8 lb, Torches x20  20 lb

*Bucket (so liquid accidents don't get everywhere...) 16 lb
Oil x8  8 lb, Waterskin x2  8 lb

*Backpack 5.5 lb
Bedroll 5 lb, Lamp 1 lb, Chalk x2, Soap 1 lb, Signal Whistle, Mirror 0.5 lb, Peasant Outfit (pajamas) 2 lb,

*Barrel x2  580 lb (30lb barrel + 260 lb wgt (US 32.5 gal barrel, 8lb per gal = 260lb))
1 Water, 1 small beer (2%)

*Weapon/Armor/Tool Chest  112.5 lb (25lb chest + 86.5lb contents)
Banded Mail 35 lb, Shield heavy wood 10 lb, Longsword 4 lb, Morningstar 6 lb, Dagger x4 4 lb, Shovel 8 lb, Hammer 2 lb, Pick 10 lb, Whetstone 1 lb, Arrows (50) 7.5 lb, Lock 1 lb (lock attached, chest open)

*Sack climbing 19 lb
Climber's Kit 5 lb, Grappling Hook 4 lb, Rope 50' hemp 10 lb,

*Sack dry rations 70 lb   (only buy 50, as I already have 20. 50 rations x 5sp = 25gp)
Dry Rations x70 70lb (covers 14 days for 5 people: Cudberct, Certh, Hasor, Mika, & Maggie)

*Sack x2  perishable meals  77 lb    (2sp x 11 people x 7 days = 15.4gp)
Common meals/day x77  77 lb?

*Basket 17 lb
Pot iron 10 lb, Flour x5  5 lb, Sack x4  2 lb


-------------------------

And I can definitely use servants-cum-hirelings.
Likely Employed = Chambermaids x2, Errand Boy, Cook/Baker (greyknight, if he wants it), Stablehand, Night Manager.
Naturally room and board factors into pay, explaining why hirelings earn only 1 silver daily untrained, or 3 silver daily trained, so you'll have a place to stay and food to eat if you work the Old Boar's Inn.

My wife, Ermengilda, and I will float between all those positions like any good manager. During slower times we get to staff the bar and wait on guests, listening to their stories. The little boy is too young to work, around 6, and the girl is just younger at 4; both old enough for us parents to have *some* sleep, but now more able to get into bigger trouble.

/whisper "Ermengilda, if the noble-looking lady buys that guy approaching her table there a glass of our cheap house wine, accept the order but break out a glass of fine wine for them both." *sigh* "Perhaps they've both seen better days than this."

Okay, Certh is gainfully employed at the Old Boar Inn!

A burly, ruddy-faced fellow in a white apron and puffy baker's hat emerges from the kitchen carrying a small plate, which he sets before Lady Jastian. "Here's your dessert, madam: I hope it meets your expectations." On the plate is a scrumptious cream-filled pastry with a spot of jam and a fresh strawberry. Certh produces a little fork and places it on the table before addressing Winthrop. "Anything for yourself, sir?"

Just checked in. I'll have my cohort soon.

"I thank thee for thy pains, my good baker.  My mouth waters!  Might I then trouble thee for a pot of mulled wine and two fair cups?"  Lady Jastian thoughtfully eyed the muscular serving man:  He seemed as though he had the might to wield an axe or greatsword, if he could be persuaded to venture forth from the village's safe confines.  She wondered whether the baker could be swayed to her cause:  Even if he proved to lack the stomach for battle, at least his companions would eat well.  

Ending her reverie, Jastian turned to examine the newly-arrived woodsman.  He seemed a friendly sort, comfortable among the rough-hewn peasant farmers and laborers crowding the common room.  "So, 'twas your band that slew the head priest of those wicked reptiles!  I heard your tale ere I arrived in this place!  Please, sit and warm yourself with some mulled wine, for I have long sought such a man for a venture I'd propose.  Tell me, know you aught of a cursed ruin some name the Sunless Citadel?"

A couple quick clarifications for the followers:

1) Stats are the standard elite array, correct? Justin said that about cohorts and followers earlier, but I want to double check our basket weaver-ness.

2) Followers are 1st level, from the same class list as the others. Is starting gold taken at the PC or NPC level?

3) Lady Jastain has the high leadership, so should all the followers be somehow associated with her? Or are we using those mechanics to justify our positions in the party by RAW, and can hook ourselves into the group through whatever in-game method we'd like (for example, an adventurous employee of Cudberct)?

/whisper to chambermaid 1 "Our lady is getting more talkative with her cups. Have you seen that she has eaten beforehand, I hope? Go make sure her chamber is ready -- and supply an extra night jar within the night stand for her comfort."

/whisper to Ermengilda "Suggest to the new gents our drink special today: a gallon pitcher of ale gets you a complimentary side order of fried boar chips & potato chips. I want them to eat so as to keep the place clean. I'm going to check with the stablehand before locking it up for tonight."

edit: I need to go look up 3.5e food prices now, yay! Damn, they make meat expensive! Good thing the boar's just small meat chips, skin, and trimmings deep fried to yumminess. Mmm, chicharrones, papas, y cerveza.

Tanthius:

1) and 2): from post #55 on page 6: "Cohorts and followers use the standard elite array for ability scores (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8) and the NPC Gear Value table (DMG, pg. 127)."

3) Interesting question, I wonder that as well.

I was going for Sgt Llewellyn as something like an NCO in the city guard, are we setting up the background stuff for now, then moving to an IC thread?

(I will third the motion for an IC thread, it would make this a little easier to follow)

Turning to the portly baker, Winthrop smiles broadly.  "Ah, Certh, good to see you again.  How's the training coming along?  Slain any bandits yet?"  He pauses, surreptitiously jingling the coin pouch at his belt. "I think I'll pass on the desert today, thank you."

Bowing to Lady Jastian, Winthrop takes a seat opposite her.  "I am pleased that you've heard of my exploits, although truth be told, I merely lead the brave adventurers through the plains, they did most of the work.  I am interested in this venture you mention, however.  I have of course heard of the Citadel, to the south, near the ravine.  I've travelled that way before, although never ventured too close.  There's an eerie feeling about the whole area, not to mention the goblins."

"Say, if you're looking for men for your venture, you could do worse than our good barkeep over there.  He's a sturdy warrior and a fighting man of some skill, no doubt from all the bickering with his wife."

"Don't tell her I said that.  She scares me."

Quote from: DonEsteban;598042Will do. Happily. What's the budget? Standard starting gold by class?

Yup. Sorry, should have been more specific about this.

Use the standard elite array for abiltiy scores and 900 gp for equipment.

QuoteJumping or not, shouldn't we get an in character and an out of character thread at least? It makes pbp gaming so much more enjoyable. IMHO!

An in character thread has been created. (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?p=598154#post598154)

Quote from: Warclam;598049Pardon me if the ship has sailed (perfectly understandable), but I did not notice the ruling about followers until just now. Have you any use for another follower, Lady Jastian?

Warclam, you're officially in.

Quote from: Tanthius;5981083) Lady Jastain has the high leadership, so should all the followers be somehow associated with her? Or are we using those mechanics to justify our positions in the party by RAW, and can hook ourselves into the group through whatever in-game method we'd like (for example, an adventurous employee of Cudberct)?

I'm going to leave this question to Sir Wulf. I'd be fine going either way on it.

Hasor Turell, human Adept.

A young follower of Fharlanghn (the god of travel), Hasor dreams of traveling the world someday, witnessing for himself the great natural beauties and helping the common man. He longs to bring his childhood love with him, but Keria has spurned all his advances on account of his extreme cowardice and puny physique. Hoping to win her heart through bold adventure, Hasor joined with the Lady Jastian, and waits anxiously for his chance to prove his mettle.

Stats:

Spoiler

Male Human Adept 1
HD: 1d6+1 (7 hp)
Init: +1
Speed: 30ft (typically 20ft under medium load)
Alignment: NG
God: Fharlanghn

str:   8   (-1)
dex:   12   (+1)
con:   13   (+1)
int:   14   (+2)
wis:   15   (+2)
cha:   10   (+0)

Skills: Heal +6, Survival +6, Concentration +3, Animal Handling +4, Knowledge (nature) +3, Knowledge (geography) +4, Spellcraft +6, Ride +3
Feats: open minded (+5 skill ranks), communicator (1/day as spell-like ability: arcane mark, comprehend languages, message)

Proficiencies: Simple weapons
Languages: Common, Sylvan, Elven

BAB: +0 (-1 melee, +1 ranged)
Saves: +1 fort, +1 dex, +4 will
AC: 11 (no armor)

Spells: 3 cantrips, 2 1st level (per day)
typical cantrips: mending, light, cure minor wounds
typical 1st level: obscuring mist, cure light wounds

Equipment: (53.55 gp, 36.6 lb/105 lb on horse)
quarterstaff, dagger x2, sling, bullets x20, traveller's outfit, wooden holy symbol of Fharlanghn
backpack, healer's kit (10 uses), spell component pouch, antitoxin x2, smokestick, belt pouch x2, torch x3, waterskin, potions (cure moderate wounds, cure light wounds x3, hide from animals x2)
tindertwig x3, sunrod, flint and steel, sewing needle, whetstone
light horse: bit and bridle, riding saddle, saddlebags, feed x2 days, bedroll, trail rations x20 days, rope 50ft, sack x2, bullets x30

load: <=26 light, >=54 heavy (for horse: <= 150, >= 301)
(default is medium load: -3 check penalty, 20ft speed)

I've still got some gold lying around, if anyone has a recommendation for a particularly handy 1st level potion. Otherwise I'll probably just hang on to it for any last minute purchases.

Quote from: Tanthius;598108Lady Jastian has the high leadership, so should all the followers be somehow associated with her? Or are we using those mechanics to justify our positions in the party by RAW, and can hook ourselves into the group through whatever in-game method we'd like (for example, an adventurous employee of Cudberct)?

Go with what works for your character and leave any rules obsessions to less creative minds.

Oh, elite array, I will redo. How much is starting gold for a level 1 Commoner anyway? 2d4 * 10 silver pieces? :-) I suppose I may give Certh a "proper" cudgel to start off, for appearances' sake, then find an excuse to have him lose it and wield the rolling pin for the remainder. (I say "proper club" as if they aren't all just heavy bits of wood in the first place!)

Greyknight, technically all of us followers get 1st level NPC starting gold, which is 900 gp. It can definitely be hard to spend that while still feeling like a commoner, but it can help if you sink a lot into some interesting magical item. Maybe some kind of magical baking flour?

Question: since warforged scouts appear only in MM3, never in any Eberron books, are they fair game? Or the regular warforged, also in MM3, for that matter? I had an idea for an intelligent item symbiosis character, but intelligent items are too expensive. A warforged could be written up as some kind of Blue Beetle-type thing, is my thought.

EDIT: Or alternatively, I could do something not silly. Let's go with that.

Maybe I'll get some potions and mix them into the dough.  Nothing like a jam doughnut of cure light wounds when the going gets tough.  Maybe someday I can delve into the mysteries of doilymancy (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0033.html)....

EDIT: done (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=597974&postcount=91), a magic rolling-pin and magic towel ate up 600gp, I threw in some potions and an upgraded holy symbol to round things off.  I also added feats (which I'd forgotten about), and 4 skill points for being human (ditto).  That brings me up to a +10 bonus on Craft(baking), we are gonna eat well on this expedition. :-D

Quote from: Justin Alexander;598157An in character thread has been created. (http://www.therpgsite.com/showthread.php?p=598154#post598154)

Awesome!  Are we gathered at the inn?  I guess I missed the lead up, I will go back and follow the threads above.

I think I will leave Sgt Llewellyn as is, with the 5000gp in reserve as a sort of 'requisition fund' in case the party needs anything from the militia/city guard, if that's ok.  His short sword is a family heirloom that no one bothered to have checked for magic, everyone just knows it never loses its edge and remains spotless after several generations.  The mithril shield and masterwork chain shirt are symbols of his rank in the city guard, and his weapons are similarly provisioned.  He also has a warhorse I haven't included in the equipment yet, as I am polishing that up first.  The destrier's name is Justice, as befits his rank and responsibilities.

I think Justin already said the points and abilities are correct, so if there are any further updates, I can fix those, otherwise I will make the sheet a bit more readable or post it on the website the others have been using.

Quote from: StormBringer;598287Awesome!  Are we gathered at the inn?  I guess I missed the lead up, I will go back and follow the threads above.

If I count correctly four PCs are present at the inn currently, two of whom work there!

Quote from: greyknight;598323If I count correctly four PCs are present at the inn currently, two of whom work there!

Excellent!  Free ale on the house!  :)

Aminda Scroppings, midwife, nanny, herbalist. She has been old ever since Lady Jastian knew her, which is all her life. She would do everything to protect the Lady and would never accept being very far from her. She can be quite insistent in this respect.

Spoiler

Aminda Scroppins; CR 1; Female Human Healer1; CN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init -2; Senses: Listen +3, Spot +3, Languages Common, Draconic, Sylvan
AC 8, touch 8, flat-footed 8 (-2 Dex)
hp 8 (1 HD)    
Fort +2, Ref -2, Will +5  
Speed 30 ft. (6 squares)
Melee Dagger -3 (1d4-3/19-20) or
Ranged Dagger (Thrown) -2 (1d4-3/19-20)  
Base Atk +0; Grp  -3
Healer Spells Prepared (CL 1st)
* * 1st—Cure Light Wounds (2), Protection from Evil, Sanctuary (DC 13)
* * 0th—Cure Minor Wounds (2), Deathwatch, Mending                  
Abilities STR 5, DEX 7, CON 11, INT 14, WIS 17, CHA 15 (includes "old" age modifiers)
Feats Armor Proficiency (Light), Scribe Scroll, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Skill Focus (Heal)  
Skills Concentration +4, Craft (Herbalism) +6, Craft (Needlework) +6, Diplomacy +4, Heal +12, Hide -2, Sense Motive +5, Spellcraft +6  
Possessions Dagger, Outfit (Peasant's), Healer's Kit, Rod of the Servant, Walking Stick, Spell Component Pouch, Talisman, Backpack, Scroll (Remove Fear), Scroll (Restoration, Lesser), Scroll (Cure Light Wounds) (2), Scroll (Sanctuary), Antitoxin (Vial), Holly and Mistletoe, Potion of Cure Light Wounds, Lantern (Bullseye), Oil (1 Pt. Flask), Tindertwig (10), Flint and Steel, Sunrod (2), Waterskin, Donkey, Saddle (Riding), Saddlebags, Rope (Silk/50 Ft.), Artisan's Tools (Leatherworking), Sewing Kit, Bedroll, Rations (Trail/Per Day) (2), 18gp.

She has a custom magic item that she got from a thankful wizard after she helped with his son's delivery. Unseen servant 1 hour/day (spell level 1 x caster level 1 x 1800gp / (5/1 charge per day) = 359gp rounded up to 400gp. She's too old to handle the daily chores all by herself. If that's not okay, she'll just get some scrolls of Remove Whatnot.

If we were using flaws, she would take Murky-Eyed and maybe Noncombatant to get Skill Focus (Needlework and Herbalism). But that's probably not basketweaverish enough so I may just pass on it.

A little old lady, awesome!

Quote from: DonEsteban;598380If that's not okay, she'll just get some scrolls of Remove Whatnot.

Is it bad that I want that to be an actual spell now?

Quote from: StormBringer;598333Excellent!  Free ale on the house!  :)

;)
I run an inn with a tavern, not a charity. But yes, there'll likely be times where we'll celebrate and our cups shall runneth over.

But we're basketweavers, shhh!... it's impossible for us to win anything, even  beer, remember!
:p

(Edit: I just noticed my character sheet only shows 2 daggers instead of the 10 (8 not-carried + 2 carried) it shows in my inventory. WTF? ... Breathe, it's your first time using PCGen and it's been like, over ten years or something since you've touched 3e, it's OK, these things happen. Technology is there to make our lives easier. Inhale. Exhale. Inhale. Exhale.)

I've added links to your current character sheets to the first post in this thread for easy referencing. If you want me to look somewhere else for your character sheet (now or in the future), let me know.

Still looking for a cohort from Castellan and followers from jibbajibba and Warclam. If they don't materialize this evening, I think we'll just drop them all onto the waiting list and move forward with what we've got.

Quote from: Tanthius;598212Greyknight, technically all of us followers get 1st level NPC starting gold, which is 900 gp. It can definitely be hard to spend that while still feeling like a commoner, but it can help if you sink a lot into some interesting magical item. Maybe some kind of magical baking flour?

Other options would include: Buildings, a large supply of trade goods that are currently in a merchant caravan somewhere and will totally make your fortune if the caravan ever returns to Oakhurst, the dowry you paid for your daughter, shares in the road-paving collective, the large supply of silver-and-garlic your inherited from your grandmother who was deeply suspicious of werewolves, etc.

I'll be starting the final round of comprehensive audits on all of the character sheets later this evening. So if there are any final adjustments you want to make before we shift into final polishing, make 'em now.

Sorry about the delay, I'm rather busy until tomorrow evening. Presenting Haddon the Vagrant, wandering forest gnome shaman, and his faithful elven hound (RotW) Ashur:

Spoiler

Haddon Bania; CR 1; Male Forest Gnome Adept1; True Neutral Small Humanoid (gnome)
Init +2; Senses Listen +4, Spot +2, Languages Common, Elven, Sylvan, forest creature
AC 16, touch 13, flat-footed 14 (+2 Dex)
HP 6 (1 HD)
Fort +2, Ref -3, Will +4
Speed 20 ft. (4 squares)
Melee Dagger +0 (1d3-1/19-20)
Ranged Light Crossbow +3 (1d6/19-20)
Base Atk +0; Grapple -5
Adept Spells Prepared (CL 1st)
* * 1st—Cure Light Wounds, Sleep
* * 0th—Create Water, Cure Minor Wounds (2)
Abilities STR 8, DEX 14, CON 10, INT 12, WIS 15, CHA 13
Feats Point Blank Shot
Skills Concentration 4 (4 ranks), Handle Animal 5 (4 ranks), Heal 4 (2 ranks) Survival 4 (2 ranks)
Possessions Elven Hound (150gp), masterwork medium studded leather barding (200gp), masterwork studded leather armour (175gp), light crossbow (35gp), 3 cases bolts (3gp), 2 daggers (4gp), backpack (2gp), 2 waterskins (2gp), signal whistle (8sp), 1 sacks (1sp), 1 bedroll (1sp), 1 tent (10gp), 1 riding saddle (10gp), saddlebags (4gp), small steel mirror (10gp), 50' silk rope (10gp), bell (1gp), bullseye lantern (12gp), 5 pints oil (5sp), iron pot (5sp); 270gp remaining

Haddon, I think, is not yet a retainer of Lady Jastian. He will be entering town for a rare taste of civilization after being out in the wilderness performing small mercenary jobs (protecting caravans alongside others, perhaps, or more likely controlling unruly wildlife). Hence his oddly large amount of coin carried.

Again, I will have time to pay more attention tomorrow, but I fear this is the most detail I can give until then. I hope it is satisfactory, or at least acceptable. If not, I agree that it is quite reasonable for me to hit the waiting list.

I had hoped to have my cohort ready by now, but recent work commitments have killed my free time this week. It's only fair for me to step aside and allow someone else to take my slot if they want it.

Apologies for that, but I'll be watching this experiment with interest.

Quote from: Opaopajr;598387(Edit: I just noticed my character sheet only shows 2 daggers instead of the 10 (8 not-carried + 2 carried) it shows in my inventory. WTF? ... Breathe, it's your first time using PCGen and it's been like, over ten years or something since you've touched 3e, it's OK, these things happen. Technology is there to make our lives easier. Inhale. Exhale. Inhale. Exhale.)

I cannot count the number of times PCGen pissed me off with the inventory system, and I have used it for less than a couple of hours total!  :)

Quote from: castellan;598403I had hoped to have my cohort ready by now, but recent work commitments have killed my free time this week. It's only fair for me to step aside and allow someone else to take my slot if they want it.

Apologies for that, but I'll be watching this experiment with interest.

If you need a few extra days, I don't think it'll be an issue. Particularly if you can let us know what the general concept is so that people can incorporate you into the background.

I'm trying to keep things moving, but I understand that real life happens.

If not, that's cool, too. If that's the case, then I think what we'll do is simply drop that cohort slot and let Opaopajr replace his Leadership feat with something else.

Quote from: Warclam;598401Haddon Bania; CR 1; Male Forest Gnome Adept1

In the interests of helping...did you notice that Forest Gnomes, unlike regular gnomes, only get Common as a bonus language? Unlike most PC races, its actually not automatic. (I made a forest gnome character myself ages ago for a con game).

Quote from: castellan;598403I had hoped to have my cohort ready by now, but recent work commitments have killed my free time this week. It's only fair for me to step aside and allow someone else to take my slot if they want it.

Apologies for that, but I'll be watching this experiment with interest.

Dude, just roll up a 1st lvl 3d6 in order character and be done with it. Besides, my employees (hirelings) PC or NPC still have time to choose private property later.

I still have several hireling slots, such as Chambermaid or Stablehand, so you'll have food, board, and regular pay (1 sp/day). And it'll make sense when you have to walk away from the game: we'll be off adventuring, you'll be in town keeping Oakhurst safe from goblin raids (or whatever).

/visualizing a squad of Oakhurst women-folk defending the town. Boiling oil/water, frying pans, and spears... *shudder*

edit: I don't have a Leadership feat, btw. So you don't have to be a cohort, though I guess that matters for levels. I'm hiring people outright.
Which I guess also means if you end up on your own adventures in or around town while we're away, you should get your own full share of XP (I have no clue how 3.5e deals w/ hirelings and followers and if there's a difference).

Quote from: Warclam;598401Sorry about the delay, I'm rather busy until tomorrow evening. Presenting Haddon the Vagrant, wandering forest gnome shaman, and his faithful elven hound (RotW) Ashur:

Haddon Bania; CR 1; Male Forest Gnome Adept1; True Neutral

Again, I will have time to pay more attention tomorrow, but I fear this is the most detail I can give until then. I hope it is satisfactory, or at least acceptable. If not, I agree that it is quite reasonable for me to hit the waiting list.

Awesome!  I think the cohort thing is falling by the wayside, maybe boost him up to 7th level?

CHARACTER AUDIT - PART 1[/u]

Haven't done followers yet. Hoping to still get to them this evening, but I need to take a break from staring at numbers because I'm starting to make stupid mistakes.

If you've got your sheet posted in the thread, please make sure the changes are happening at the location linked to in the first post of this thread.

And, of course, I'm not infallible. If I've screwed something up here, let me know.

--LLEWELLYN--
I think your touch AC should be 11, not 13. Am I missing something?

Swim appears on your skill list twice. And, if my math is right, it looks like both entries are required to get you to 33 skill points spent. So I think you need to remove one of those entries and spend 3 skill points somewhere else.

You should be adding your Strength modifier to damage with thrown weapons.

--LADY JASTIAN--
Your BAB has dropped out of your calculated Melee/Ranged attack bonuses. Not a big deal, but FYI.

You don't have Craft (write poetry) listed as a cross-class skill.

You have Survival marked as cross-class, but it is not. (This doesn't make any difference, but FYI.)

Accounting for Craft (write poetry) being a cross-class skill, you've spent 73 skill points if my math is right. You should have 77, so you have 4 more skill points to spend.

You have only selected 3 minor auras, but you should have 4 at 7th level.

You need languages (Common + 2 others). Don't take Draconic unless you really, really wanted it.

--CUDBERCT--
There seems to be something really wrong with your skills. Reverse-engineering, I think you've got the armor penalty from splint mail (which you're not wearing) compounded with Dexterity 8 (because it's not taking into account the +2 from your gloves of Dexterity).

This is what your skill section should look like (please copy-and-replace):

WITHOUT TOWER SHIELD: Appraise -2, Balance -6, Bluff +4, Climb -2, Concentration +3, Craft (untrained) -2, Diplomacy +2, Disguise +2, Escape Artist -6, Forgery -2, Gather Information +2, Handle Animal +7, Hide -6, Intimidate +7, Jump -5, Move Silently -6, Ride +5, Search -2, Swim -3

WITH TOWER SHIELD: Appraise -2, Balance -10, Bluff +4, Climb -6, Concentration +3, Craft (untrained) -2, Diplomacy +2, Disguise +2, Escape Artist -10, Forgery -2, Gather Information +2, Handle Animal +7, Hide -10, Intimidate +7, Jump -9, Move Silently -10, Ride +5, Search -2, Swim -7

Daggers: Your thrown daggers and shortspear should only be getting a +1 to damage within 30 ft. (currently they're listed as +2 in both locations when they should only be +1).

Your composite longbow should be getting an additional +1 to damage from your Strength.

--WINTHROP--

Looks good.

--GILEUS DARFIN--

Looks good.

CHARACTER AUDIT - PART 2[/u]

And here are the notes for the followers.  It's looking like a great collection of characters (in all senses of the word).

In my home campaigns, what I generally do is have players pitch me their concepts (to whatever degree of complexity they like) and then I do a pass on their character backgrounds to take generalities and tie them into the specifics of the campaign world. This is also a time when I'll pitch anything I think might be interesting to add to the character (with, again, the goal being to tie them into the campaign world). Then my players say, "No, dude, that sucks and wasn't what I wanted." And it goes through a couple of revisions.

My plan is to start doing those tomorrow. I've pulled the details you've already posted to the thread here, but if you want to lay down more specifics before I take my first pass on it let me know. (And I know that I'll definitely want more details on Gileus and Haddon before doing a pass on them. Although I'm also fine if they want to wait to see how Lady Jastian's background firms up so that they can figure out how they fit into the picture.)

--AMINDA--

You need to pick 2 additional languages. Make one of them Draconic unless you are virulently opposed to the idea (I'll fill you in later).

--HASOR--

Looks good.

--CERTH--

You're short 4 skill points. I think you forgot to spend the bonus skill points from being human.

You should list languages (Common + 1 other).

Loving the custom magic items.

--HADDON--

You should have "Gnome" listed as a language.

Note Hide +6 (+10 in wooded areas) in your skill list (since you get a racial bonus).

And don't forget the racial bonus to attack rolls and the pass without trace abilities that you specifically get for being a forest gnome instead of a regular gnome.

Hmm, don't thrown weapons get the STR bonus and the Point Blank Shot bonus for thrown under 30'? Perhaps they don't stack and PCGen is wrong, which wouldn't surprise me.

I'm almost sad I don't have 3.5e books, because I think I can do this far faster with pencil and paper...

Quote from: Justin Alexander;598448--CERTH--

You're short 4 skill points. I think you forgot to spend the bonus skill points from being human.

You should list languages (Common + 1 other).

Loving the custom magic items.

Actually, I got those, but forgot about the extra skill points I acquired when moving from 3d6-in-order to the elite array (he was Int 11 before).  Ditto on the languages.  I took Celestial and trained 2 points in Profession(baker) and Use Magic Device.

Yeah, I think there's been a bit of confusion. Opaopjr doesn't have leadership, only Sir Wulf and I do. I believe Sir wulf's leadership gives him a cohort and 5 followers,while mine just gives me a cohort. While some players have been making level one followers, I think so far they're all technically Sir Wulf's, even if they work at the inn.

Castellen, I'm more than happy to leave my leadership feat open so that you can play your cohort. I can't really think of a feat that's more exciting that I'd want anyways.

I added the missing aura and languages and fixed the cross-class craft (misremembered that one...), tweaking the skills a bit.  She actually only gets 70 skill points: (4 +2 Int, +1 Human) x 10 (7th level).

Since...

a) I won't have time today for composing several inspirational recruiting speeches in slightly pompous and archaic English

and...

b) I'm not as charismatic as Lady Jastian anyway...

Please feel free to put words in her mouth when describing how your characters join the party.  She's recruiting a team to plumb the depths of the Sunless Citadel, offering a full share of treasure to veteran adventurers and half a share for less-experienced adventurers (the cohorts).  Inexperienced recruits will be offered rations, leather armor, a new dagger or spear, and funeral expenses (if needed).  Combat bonuses will also be given (but she'll avoid specifying these, since she'll depend on captured loot to afford them).

Hm I think based on Sir Wulf's last IC post that I misinterpreted, the goblins aren't the denizens of the Citadel?  Oh well, I will make sure Certh doesn't get left behind anyway. ;-)

Quote from: Opaopajr;598451Hmm, don't thrown weapons get the STR bonus and the Point Blank Shot bonus for thrown under 30'?

Right. But for example, here:

Ranged*dagger (thrown)*+7/+2*(1d4+2/19-20),*within*30*ft.*+8/+3*(1d4+2)

You've got the same damage listed for both "within 30 ft." and not within 30 ft. Unless I'm missing something, that line should read (emphasis added):

Ranged*dagger (thrown)*+7/+2*(1d4+1/19-20),*within*30*ft.*+8/+3*(1d4+2/19-20)

And there's a couple others like it.

Quote from: Josh;598478Yeah, I think there's been a bit of confusion. Opaopjr doesn't have leadership, only Sir Wulf and I do.

This entire thread of conversation confused the heck out of me until I went back and realized I had typed "Opaopjr" instead of "Josh", for which I have no explanation.

So, yup. Confusion all the way around. ;)

But, yes, if Castellan doesn't decide to go with a cohort it would be your Leadership feat that could be swapped to something else. (Unless you feel really strongly about having a cohort or someone else feels strongly about switching from follower to cohort.)

Quote from: greyknight;598533Hm I think based on Sir Wulf's last IC post that I misinterpreted, the goblins aren't the denizens of the Citadel?  Oh well, I will make sure Certh doesn't get left behind anyway. ;-)

There are some goblins down there. I'll get the additional hooks laid down and thrown out there later today so that people can latch onto 'em or elaborate on 'em or ignore 'em as they see fit. ;)

I would just like to observe that I wish my players jumped on plot hooks as well as we seem to be. Justin hasn't even set a single initial hook and we've all apparently decided that heading to the ravine/citadel is our character's main plan.

I will fix up Sgt Llewellyn tonight, as Opaopajr has noted, PCGen has a few quirks, the major problem of which is that it is written in Java.  :)

Quote from: Josh;598541I would just like to observe that I wish my players jumped on plot hooks as well as we seem to be. Justin hasn't even set a single initial hook and we've all apparently decided that heading to the ravine/citadel is our character's main plan.

I'm a fan of the game Feng Shui, which gives the players great power to make up their own details about the setting.  Part of its ethos is the idea that the GM and players share responsibility for hooking in the PCs.  

I was also under the impression that this adventure is supposed to be a bit "sandboxy", so I expected its hooks to be fairly low key.  As such, I figured I'd push us toward the adventure's "entree".  If Justin prefers to serve an appetizer first, I'm sure that we'll find out soon.

I'd love to turn Haddon from a follower into a cohort if it were offered, but I'd hardly say I'd insist on it. In any case, the other followers would get first pickings at the opportunity, latecomer that I am.

I don't know I managed to notice that forest gnomes speak elven but forgot their own racial language... I'll get those fixes in and shuffle around a few details of equipment and skills (I realized that Haddon would actually be completely unable to train Ashur, given his current bonus in Handle Animal! Whoops.). I made a belated decision that Haddon follows a taboo against possessing or touching iron, so I'll make that shift as well.

I expect to have this completed by this evening, and will then be able to hop into the IC thread to really get the guy going.

Quote from: Josh;598541I would just like to observe that I wish my players jumped on plot hooks as well as we seem to be. Justin hasn't even set a single initial hook and we've all apparently decided that heading to the ravine/citadel is our character's main plan.

To be fair, that particular "plot hook" is right there in the thread subject, so he didn't exactly need to vigorously apply the three-clue-rule or anything. :-P

Quote from: greyknight;598595To be fair, that particular "plot hook" is right there in the thread subject, so he didn't exactly need to vigorously apply the three-clue-rule or anything. :-P

For some reason, I'm reminded of a particularly aggravating player, a friend who inflicted himself on my games in a narcissistic quest to derail everyone else's plans.  If an adventure didn't revolve around his character, he would do his level best to hijack it and lead it into another direction...

"You're running The Midnight Abyss of Crom Dubh?  Heck, no!  My character is a claustrophobic hengeyokai paladin who wants to explore the Distant Peaks!  I refuse to go below ground!"

"But... We decided that we wanted to play The Midnight Abyss of Crom Dubh, a horror scenario set in my homegrown Iron-Age Celtic game world.  Why didn't you make a Celtic-style character?"

"The Irish had legends where wizards changed forms and hengeyokai are shapechangers, so they're appropriate."

"OK. (sigh...) What's his name?"

"DJ Mo Mo, the Mash Master"

He used to deliberately draw the party away from any plot hooks I provided.  Man, that guy used to irritate me.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;598619He used to deliberately draw the party away from any plot hooks I provided.  Man, that guy used to irritate me.

Did you try punching him in the nutsack?  :)

Quote from: StormBringer;598629Did you try punching him in the nutsack?  :)

I was an earnest young lad, innocent in the ways of nutsack-fu.  Now that I'm a wizened elder gamer, few would dare try such a stunt at my table.  Those foolish enough to consider such idiocy would discover that I picked up Skill Focus (Cutting Sarcasm) as a bonus feat when I leveled in the "Game Master" prestige class.

We can certainly live without another cohort, but if Castellan is ready in time that'd be great (or if we want to let warclam upgrade). Either way, just a quick warning that I won't be able to post on friday, but I'll get in on the IC thread once the weekend is here.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;598537realized I had typed "Opaopjr" instead of "Josh", for which I have no explanation.

Common typo.  The keys are like right next to each other.

Heh, I was bequeathed Leadership by the god Typo, for much amuses Him.

This cohort/follower/hireling thing sounds more complicated than I remember. However going through all the little traits, types, and bonuses on items and feats does bring back how niggling the rules were for 3e. I also noticed how generous this was with penalties to combat flying all over the place -- someone better manage my AoO or I'll likely flip the virtual table.  
:p

I can't say I missed these days. But with an enthusiastic group like this, all enemies will fall.
:)

Quote from: Justin Alexander;598448And I know that I'll definitely want more details on Gileus and Haddon before doing a pass on them.

When Lady Jastian set out on her quest to defeat her family's curse, she confided in the scholarly Gileus.  He has accompanied her, and has been studying ancient texts for any information on the curse.  I'm thinking he found some lead that led them to Oakhurst.  I'm open to other ideas though.

Sorry, folks. I ended up not having any of the free time I was expecting to have yesterday. (Well, for me it's still "today" because I'm only just now getting to bed at 5 AM.)

I'll be doing my best to get the character backgrounds out today. Sorry for the delay.

Okay, I'm going to start the character backgrounds with Lady Jastian and her traveling companions. I'm hoping to have stuff for the Oakhurst locals shortly.

Here's the deal: Take a look over what I've written here. Veto whatever you don't like; elaborate on anything you do; and/or simply give the thumb's up to say that it's good to go.

LADY JASTIAN

When she who is last of the Wyverntongue
Shall stand alone, of heirs your only heir,
Her fellows all of breath-spent empty lung,
Their forlorn hope from forth her fingers tear
And leave her barren, clenched with endless doubt.
For she shall know her doom, to wed a mate
As foul within as he seems fair without;
A living nightmare laced with sweetest bait,
'Gainst which all mortal sense should give its care.
Yet from their cursed, conjoined loins shall spring
A thing of shadow's depth and queen's despair,
A blight in lands of blood to rule as king.
     This is the curse from which your fame is born;
     Let all your deeds forevermore be torn.

                    - The Curse of the Wyverntongues

In the distant lands which were their home, the Wyverntongues were a prestigious and honored family: Its mighty founders were famed in legend and heroic chansons. Its heirs rules prosperous and happy lands. But through the long centuries of their glory, the Curse of the Wyverntongues – a tradition passed down from the earliest days of the house – remained a persistent and never-forgotten blight.

When her elder brother lay upon his deathbed, Lady Jastian foresaw the dark clutches of the curse settling upon her soul: As Lady of the Wyverntongues, she was now the line's sole heir.

Rather than waiting for her fate to find her, the veteran warrior gathered whatitems she could and rode into the night, hoping to find clues about the curse's origins or how it could manifest. She kept her purpose secret to all but her most trusted associates, instead claiming to quest after long-forgotten treasures of her ancestors, items that might reverse the family's declining fortunes.

Only a scant handful of gold coins remain from the wealth Lady Jastian carried with her upon her departure. She must secure more soon, lest she be forced to humiliate herself by accepting employment as a mere sellsword or caravan guard.

AMINDA SCROPPINGS

Aminda Scroppings was the oldest servant of the Wyverntongue household: Midwife, nanny, herbalist, and whatever else might be needed. She has been old for all the years that Lady Jastian has known her, which has been all her life. She would do anything to protect the Lady and would never accept being far from her. She can be quite insistent in this respect.

In fact, when Lady Jastian left her ancestral home it was her intention to go alone. But somehow Aminda knew what she was planning and refused to be left behind.

It is perhaps well that she did: During Lady Jastian's many travels and adventures, Aminda has become something akin to the expedition's quartermaster. She arranges supplies, organizes the hiring of local muscle, and the like.

GILEUS

Gileus was a student at the University of Fawnhallow when he first learned of the legendary Living Library of Garth. He spent years dedicated to studying its lore, eventually concluding – on the basis of the strange marginalia found in the Ptaoth Manuscripts – that the Library must still exist. Leaving his studies in Fawnhallow, Garth traveled into the icy wastes of the north which are said to have once been home to a civilization of golden summer.

And there, as he had predicted, he found the Library: A solitary edifice of granite thrust up through a shelf of ice and heated by vast flows of lava deep beneath the glacier. He was somewhat surprised, however, to discover that the Library was still active, tended by librarians maintaining traditions millennia old. Drawn to the vast stores of knowledge they curated, Gileus apprenticed himself to their ranks.

Decision time: The Librarians of Garth use a magical technique to scribe vast volumes of lore onto their bodies as living tattoos that swirl across their skin. If Gileus finished his apprenticeship and had his body tattooed with the lore of Garth, then you can choose one Knowledge skill and gain a permanent +2 bonus to checks using that skill because you literally have a reference library on the back of your hand. But this will inflict a -2 penalty to many Charisma-based checks and a hefty -8 penalty to Disguise checks. Alternatively, Gileus may have still been an apprentice when Lady Jastian arrived.

About a year ago, a beautiful woman named Jastian arrived at the Library. She sought knowledge of ancient draconic rites and lore, particularly as they pertained to prophecy. Following his oaths to the Library, Gileus sought to help her in any way that he could. But over time it became about more than just his oaths: He felt drawn to some deep and immense pain he sensed within the Lady; a pain which seemed inexorably linked to the bodies of lore they were exploring together.

Lady Jastian eventually confessed to Gileus her true purposes: The Curse which haunted her uncertain future and her desperate need to see it broken. He eventually broke his oaths to the Library and swore new oaths of fealty to Lady Jastian, pledging to join her in her journeys until her Curse had been lifted.

Unfortunately, there was nothing within the annals of the Library that Gileus could find that would help Lady Jastian. However, he was able to compile a list of sites which were said to have once been (or continue to be) locus points of draconic activity. Since leaving the Library, they have journeyed to several of these locations, often being met with disappointment. Now they have come to Oakhurst in the hope that the references to a "citadel" will bear some fruit.

Can I just give you a general outline and you fill in the and we leave most motivations nebulous?

I was thinking thus:

Cudberct was born in a land far away called . He worked as a farm boy and in his local militia in (name unimportant). They saw talent, he went to work for , traveled, met and fell in love with Ermengilda in land even further away called . Patron was ousted, Cudberct went back to marry Ermengilda, they moved to "the edge of the civilized world" to enjoy raising a family. He used his army money and Patron's parting proceeds to buy the Inn.

A few war buddies came to visit his little business and wrangle him up for some extra adventuring. Some were successful $$ (hence nice $$ cushion), others were wastes of time. Did a few visits to the ravine, but him and veteran buddies knew when to back off and wait for more help. They left. Cudberct stayed.

A few new adventuring groups came in, he tried to help at times. Many died, even some he liked and joined briefly, too. Sad, he now tries to keep the foolhardy away from the ravine. Runs the Inn, part of the town militia, and tends his home for local farmers to relax and hear the crazy tales of travelers. The End.

Probably a stupid question: does "3.5 books" literally mean books, or is, say, the Wild Cohort (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a) feat on the table?

Ok, this should be correct now.  I don't know what it is doing with the extra Swim listing, but I have 3 ranks of Swim listed at the top.  I deleted the extra line item, are you saying I still have three skill points to spend?

The Touch AC is calculated as you have it in the character screen of PCGen, but it keeps listing it as 13 when I export.  No biggie, it's corrected also.

Latest update:
Name:       Sgt Llewellyn
Race:       Human
Player:     StormBringer
Classes:    Warrior7
Hit Points: 45
Experience: 21000 / 28000
Alignment:  Chaotic Good
Vision:    
Speed:      Walk 30 ft.
Languages:  Common
Stat    Score   Mod
STR      17      (+3)
DEX      12      (+1)
CON      14      (+2)
INT      11      (+0)
WIS      11      (+0)
CHA      14      (+2)
-------------------------- Skills --------------------------
Skill                   Total   Rnk     Stat    Msc
Climb                    8        5.0      3        0
Gather Information       7        3.0      2        2
Intimidate               7        3.0      2        2
Jump                     7        4.0      3        0
Ride                     10       9.0      1        0
Swim                     6        3.0      3        0
Appraise                 0        0.0      0        0
Balance                  1        0.0      1        0
Bluff                    4        0.0      2        2
Concentration            2        0.0      2        0
Craft (Untrained)        0        0.0      0        0
Diplomacy                2        0.0      2        0
Disguise                 2        0.0      2        0
Escape Artist            1        0.0      1        0
Forgery                  0        0.0      0        0
Heal                     0        0.0      0        0
Hide                     1        0.0      1        0
Listen                   0        0.0      0        0
Move Silently            1        0.0      1        0
Search                   2        0.0      0        2
Sense Motive             0        0.0      0        0
Spot                     0        0.0      0        0
Survival                 0        0.0      0        0
Use Rope                 1        0.0      1        0
                                                   
-------------------------- Feats ---------------------------
Endurance
Improved Initiative
Investigator
Persuasive
Armor Proficiency (Heavy)
Armor Proficiency (Light)
Armor Proficiency (Medium)
Martial Weapon Proficiency
Shield Proficiency
Simple Weapon Proficiency
Tower Shield Proficiency

-------------------------- Combat --------------------------
    Total / Touch / Flat Footed
AC: 13    / 11    / 12
Initiative:   +5
BAB:          +7/+2
Melee tohit:  +10/+5
Ranged tohit: +8/+3

Fortitude:    +7
Reflex:       +3
Will:         +2

Unarmed attack:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d3+3
critical:     20/x2

Axe, Throwing:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d6+3
critical:     20/x2

Axe, Throwing (Thrown):
to hit:       +8/+3
damage:       1d6
critical:     20/x2
range:        10 ft.

Dagger:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d4+3
critical:     19-20/x2

Dagger (Thrown):
to hit:       +8/+3
damage:       1d4
critical:     19-20/x2
range:        10 ft.

Handaxe:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d6+3
critical:     20/x3

Shortspear:
to hit:       +10/+5
damage:       1d6+3
critical:     20/x3

Shortspear (Thrown):
to hit:       +8/+3
damage:       1d6
critical:     20/x3
range:        20 ft.

------------------------- Equipment ------------------------
Name                                            QTY    LBS
Axe (Throwing)                                   4    8lbs
Short Sword +2 (Adamantine)
Handaxe
Dagger
Shortspear

Helmet                                          1    5lbs
Mithral Heavy Shield                             1    7lbs    Special: 30hp/inch and 15 hardness
Masterwork Chain Shirt  

--------------------------- Magic --------------------------
Name                                            QTY    LBS
Potion (Cure Light Wounds)                       2    0lbs
Potion (Cure Moderate Wounds)                    1    0lbs
Potion (Neutralize Poison)                       1    0lbs
     
------------------------ Description -----------------------
Height: 5'8"            Weight: 212 lbs.                Gender: Male    


Outfit (Explorer's)
Axe (Throwing)
Handaxe
Dagger
Mithral Heavy Shield
Potion (Neutralize Poison)
Potion (Cure Light Wounds)
Potion (Cure Moderate Wounds)
Helmet
Shortspear
Masterwork Chain Shirt
Short Sword +2 (Adamantine)
Backpack
Holy Symbol (Wooden)
Pouch (Belt)
Trail Rations (6 Days)
Rope (Silk/50 Ft.)
Warhorse (Heavy)
Mace (Heavy)
Saddle (Military)
Saddlebags
4064 gp, 5 sp
EDIT:  I think this is right for the horse:
Name:       Justice
Race:       Warhorse, Heavy
Player:      
Classes:    Animal4
Hit Points: 44
Experience: 0 / 10000
Alignment:  True Neutral
Vision:     Low-light
Speed:      Walk 35 ft.
Languages:  
Stat    Score   Mod
STR      24      (+7)
DEX      16      (+3)
CON      22      (+6)
INT      2       (-4)
WIS      12      (+1)
CHA      6       (-2)
-------------------------- Skills --------------------------
Skill                   Total   Rnk     Stat    Msc
Listen                   6        3.0      1        2
Spot                     7        4.0      1        2
Appraise                 -4       0.0      -4       0
Balance                  -1       0.0      3        -4
Bluff                    -2       0.0      -2       0
Climb                    3        0.0      7        -4
Concentration            6        0.0      6        0
Craft (Untrained)        -4       0.0      -4       0
Diplomacy                -2       0.0      -2       0
Disguise                 -2       0.0      -2       0
Escape Artist            -1       0.0      3        -4
Forgery                  -4       0.0      -4       0
Gather Information       -2       0.0      -2       0
Heal                     1        0.0      1        0
Hide                     -5       0.0      3        -8
Intimidate               -2       0.0      -2       0
Jump                     3        0.0      7        -4
Move Silently            -1       0.0      3        -4
Ride                     3        0.0      3        0
Search                   -4       0.0      -4       0
Sense Motive             1        0.0      1        0
Survival                 1        0.0      1        0
Swim                     -1       0.0      7        -8
Use Rope                 3        0.0      3        0
                                                   
-------------------------- Feats ---------------------------
Alertness
  You get a +2 bonus on all Listen checks and Spot checks.
 
Armor Proficiency (Barding)
-------------------- Special Abilities ---------------------

------------------------ Templates -------------------------

-------------------------- Combat --------------------------
    Total / Touch / Flat Footed
AC: 20    / 12    / 17
Initiative:   +3
BAB:          +3
Melee tohit:  +9
Ranged tohit: +5

Fortitude:    +10
Reflex:       +7
Will:         +2

Unarmed attack:
to hit:       +5
damage:       1d4+7
critical:     20/x2

Hoof:
to hit:       +9/+9
damage:       1d6+7
critical:     20/x2

Bite:
to hit:       +4
damage:       1d4+3
critical:     20/x2
--------------------- Special Abilities --------------------
 
------------------------- Equipment ------------------------
Name                                            QTY    LBS
Barding (Scale Mail)                             1    30lbs
Bit and Bridle                                   1    1lbs
Blanket (Winter)                                 1    3lbs
Total weight carried:
Current load:         Light
Encumbrance
Light:  700  
Medium: 1400  
Heavy:  2100


Haddon the Vagrant, 2.0:

Spoiler

Haddon Bania; CR 1; Male Forest Gnome Adept1; True Neutral Small Humanoid (gnome)
Init +1; Senses Listen +4, Spot +2, Low-light vision; Languages Common, Elven, Gnome, Sylvan, forest animal
AC 14/18 vs. giants, touch 12/16 vs. giants, flat-footed 13
HP 6 (1 HD)
Fort +0, Ref +1, Will +4/+6 vs. illusions
Speed 20 ft. (4 squares)
Melee spear +0 (1d6-1/20x3) or club +0 (1d4-1/20) or silver sickle +0 (1d4-2/19-20)
Ranged light crossbow +2 (1d6/19-20x2) or thrown spear +2 (1d6-1/20x3)
Base Atk +0; Grapple -5
Adept Spells Prepared (CL 1st)
* * 1st—Cure Light Wounds, Sleep
* * 0th—Create Water, Cure Minor Wounds (2)
Abilities STR 8, DEX 13, CON 10, INT 12, WIS 15, CHA 14
Feats Wild Cohort
Skills Concentration 4 (4 ranks), Handle Animal 7/9 with whistle or Ashur/11 with both (4 ranks), Heal 4 (2 ranks), Hide 9/13 wooded area (0 ranks), Ride 3/5 with Ashur (0 ranks), Survival 4 (2 ranks)
Racial Traits Pass without Trace (Su); +1 attack vs. kobolds, goblinoids, orcs, reptilian humanoids; 1/day–dancing lights, ghost sound, prestidigitation
Possessions Carried by Haddon silver beast spirit amulet [holy symbol, +1 competence Handle Animal] (125gp), explorer's outfit (free worn), leather armour with riding straps (210gp), light crossbow (35gp), 3 cases crossbow bolts (3gp), silver sickle (26), spear (2gp), club (free), backpack (2gp), waterskin (1gp), training whistle (+2 Handle Animal tool, 50gp), bell (1gp), 50' roll of twine (1sp), 50' candle wick (2sp), empty sack (1sp), magnifying glass (100gp), 10 tindertwigs (10gp), 20-piece box of chalk (2sp), 8 flour pouches (8sp), 3 empty vials (3 gp), flask of acid (10gp), liquid sunlight bead (20gp)
Remaining Gold 60gp

Stats for Ashur:

Spoiler

Ashur; CR 2; Male Warbeast Wolf
Init +2; Senses Listen +3, Spot +3, Low-light vision, Scent
AC 17, touch 12, flat-footed 15
HP 25 (3 HD)
Fort +7, Ref +5, Will +3
Speed 60 ft. (12 squares)
Melee Bite +6 (1d6+4)
Base Atk +2; Grapple +5
Tricks Attack & attack all, Come, Down, Perform, Track
Abilities STR 16, DEX 15, CON 18, INT 2, WIS 14, CHA 6
Feats Improved Natural Armour, Track, Weapon Focus (bite)
Skills Listen +3 (0 ranks), Spot +3 (0 ranks), Survival +8/12 tracking by scent (6 ranks)
Racial Traits Trip (+3)
Possessions Carried by Ashur self/warbeast template (150gp), leather barding (20gp), riding saddle (10gp), saddlebags (4gp), 3 waterskins (3gp), 4 flasks of acid (40gp), tent (10gp), 5 square yards of canvas (5sp), winter blanket (5sp), 50' silk rope (10gp), bronze grappling hook (1gp), bedroll (1sp), bronze pot (5sp), spare traveler's outfit (1gp)

Here's the updated version of Haddon. Ashur is now a wolf, because I realized that forest gnomes speak to forest animals, which an elven hound is not (seriously, magical beast?), and with the the warbeast template purchased because what else am I going to spend my cash on. Swapped around my skills and weapons a little too based on some character decisions I've made. Should be no iron anywhere, please tell me if I accidentally left some in (I looked it up, crossbows can be made without metal components).

I'll put up Ashur's stats soon, got a bit of stuff to take care of. I'll also finally be able to pop into the IC thread, hooray!

EDIT: Ashur's stats now up.

EDIT 2: Twiddled to reflect some background stuff, and swapped feats for Wild Cohort. Boosted Ashur's Survival skill to be actually useful.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;598943When she who is last of the Wyverntongue
Shall stand alone, of heirs your only heir,
Her fellows all of breath-spent empty lung,
Their forlorn hope from forth her fingers tear
And leave her barren, clenched with endless doubt.
For she shall know her doom, to wed a mate
As foul within as he seems fair without;
A living nightmare laced with sweetest bait,
'Gainst which all mortal sense should give its care.
Yet from their cursed, conjoined loins shall spring
A thing of shadow's depth and queen's despair,
A blight in lands of blood to rule as king.
This is the curse from which your fame is born;
Let all your deeds forevermore be torn.

                    - The Curse of the Wyverntongues

A sonnet in Iambic Pentameter! Now THAT'S a quality curse!

That really made my day!

Still working on character backgrounds. I've got a wedding to attend this afternoon, but I'm really, really hoping I can find the time to wrap these up before the day is done.

Quote from: Warclam;598980Probably a stupid question: does "3.5 books" literally mean books, or is, say, the Wild Cohort (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a) feat on the table?

Wild Cohort works for me if you want to play with that.

Your background still lists the elven hound: I'm fine with either allowing you to speak to your elven hound with speak with animal (either because it should be an animal or because magical beasts are "similar to animals" and the spell doesn't seem to be using the word "animal" as a term of art) or simply referring to your wolf as an elven hound.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;599052A sonnet in Iambic Pentameter! Now THAT'S a quality curse!

That really made my day!

I was hoping you'd get a kick out of it.

Character backgrounds coming up as soon as I copy-and-paste them into my next message.

And some more background info for the locals:

THE GOBLIN APPLES

Each midsummer, a small group of goblins arrives in Oakhurst. Everyone assumes they must belong to the tribe that lives in the ravine off to the west, but they're not seeking trouble: They're seeking trade. Each year they bring with them a perfect, ruby-red apple that grants vigor, health, and life. It cures the ill and rejuvenates the injured. Over time, the people of Oakhurt have come to prize these fruits and are willing to enter fierce bidding wars to win the rights to it. In recent years, Mayor Vurnor and Kerowyn Hucrele have quashed the more violent squabbles by offering a very high price and then apportioning the fruit according to need.

Attempts have been made to cultivate more of the fruit by planting the seeds, but the goblins are apparently jealous of their monopoly: Although the seeds germinate in their proper season and produce a twiggy mass of twisted sapling stems, the goblins always manage to steal into town and steal the saplings.

EVERYBODY: I recommend reading through everybody's backgrounds. Most of you have been entangled to each other in one way or another.

DON ESTEBAN: I sent you a PM regarding Aminda. Check it out and PM me back, please.

TOM: Haven't heard back from you regarding the decision on Gileus' tattoos. Hit us up.

CUDBERCT

Cudberct was born in a small village within the Garland Emerald, a vast swath of rich, independent duchies loosely aligned far to the east. He escaped his life as a farm boy by joining the Amaranthine Legion and was fortunate enough to garner the favor and respect of the local septenant. He was recommended and accepted into the entourage of the duchy's general, allowing him to leave the vale which had been his home all of his life. He traveled, he served, and in a corner of the Garland Emerald he had never even heard of only a year earlier he met and fell in love with a girl named Ermengilda.

But then the Doppelganger Wars reignited. This time, the doppels had suborned the entirety of the Karth Valley before they were detected. The fighting was fierce and dirty and bloody, even before it reached the cities. Paranoia was rampant.

By the time the war ended, Cudberct's general had been slain. Cudberct resigned his commission, took his pension, and married Ermengilda. They left the Garland Emerald and traveled to the edge of the civilized world. When they came to Oakhurst, they knew they had gone far enough: Cudberct spent much of his remaining coin on the Ol' Boar's Inn and he and Ermengilda settled down to the joys of raising a family.

... for the most part. A few years back, some of Cudberct's buddies from the Doppelganger Wars passed through town. They wrangled him up for some extra adventuring and they journeyed into the Ashen Plains and up into the Bone Hills and even poked around in the Witch's Hallow down to the south. Some of these ventures were successful; others were busts. Eventually, Cudberct's buddies grew tired of Oakhurst and moved on to "bigger and better things". Cudberct stayed: He'd found the best things and he felt no wanderlust. He settled down to run the inn, serve as frequent deputy to Sgt. Llewellyn, and keep an open hearth and an open door the local farmers to feast their fill on food, drink, and old tales. During this time, Cudberct also became the head of the town's militia, such as it is.

A few years later, though, some youngsters came to town: They'd heard about Cudberct's exploits and wanted to "learn from the best". He taught 'em what he could, but they went out into the Ashen Plains against his best advice. And most of them died.

The sadness of that is a burden indeed. Cudberct does his best to turn the foolhardy away from such follies now. He was mightily distressed a few weeks back when a prideful knight named Sir Braford rode into town with his companion Karakas. They talked big. Got the youth of the town stirred up. And when they heard about the goblin apples they got excited, too. Braford and Karakas talked the Hucrele kids – Talgen and Sharwyn – into signing up to head out to the old ravine where the goblins were thought to live.

They haven't been heard from since. And Cudberct has a sinking feeling about that.

EMPLOYEES AT THE INN
Stablehand: Hasor Turrell
Baker: Certh
Chambermaid: ???
Errand Boy: ???
Night Manager: ???

Query: Do you and Ermengilda have kids? How many? How old are they?

SGT. LLEWELLYN[/u]

There have been Llewellyns in Oakhurst for as long as anyone can remember or the stacks of tombstones in the church basement can attest. And more than a few of them have been charged with the protection of the little village and the surrounding farms. But now there's only one: Sgt. Llewellyn.

(It's said that there are a few Llewellyns working as weavers in Southcourt, of course. But Sgt. Llewellyn has never paid much heed to the city and its paid little heed to him.)

Over the years, Sgt. Llwellyn has faced a fair share of troubles: The winterfire skeletons that rose from the old cemetery (which is why the tombstones are stacked in the church basement now and the town doesn't keep a cemetery any more). The dark Entmoot that chanted its way through Witch's Hallow. A nip of lycanthropy out on the east farms. But he's always found a way to rally the people around to make a stand against that sort of thing when a standings been necessary.

He's a comfortable sight for the folk of Oakhurst: He makes his thrice daily walk-abouts 'round the village and rides out through the farms at least twice a week. He carries carrots and lets the kids feed his warhorse Justice. Everyone knows his mithril shield and shirt of chain (both signs of the sergeant's office; the title "sergeant" in these parts being used by any chief lawman for reasons of history that no one gives much thought to). The sword he keeps strapped to his side is his, though: A family heirloom that everyone knows will never lose its edge and remains spotless after several generations. Just like the spotless Sgt. Llewellyn never loses his edge.

Cudberct, the local innkeep, works as a frequent deputy for Sgt. Llewellyn. Llewellyn's learned to trust his expertise, although there's a number of other young lads who work deputy duty as the need arises.

Llewellyn's also got a good working relationship with Mayor Vurnor. They both take great pride in making Oakhurst the best little village it can be.

Decision Time: Do you want Sgt. Llewellyn to be involved in the Old Ways. Or are the Old Ways just some strange hillfolk beliefs that you tolerate / hate?

WINTHROP PORTER[/u]

Winthrop owns a small hut in the hills several miles outside of town, where he stores a collection of books he believes to be the finest this side of Ashardalon's Teeth.

He's a familiar face around the town, as he comes in from now and then to restock, replace a lost axe, and tell tall tales in Cudberct's tavern. The rest of the time he spends in his home in the hills, hunting, drinking tea, and reading. It's well known that he knows the area around Oakhurst as well as any, and he's willing to lead exploratory expeditions, so long as his charges don't mind the danger, and the occasional lively literary discourse. Like many of the hill-folk, he speaks draconic, and has an off-handed interest in dragon lore. Whenever in town, he takes the opportunity to look up Dern, and see if he can lend her a hand. He also frequent's Rurik's weapon shoppe exclusively, and when there makes sure to brush up on his dwarven.

He is fascinated with old lore, books, and exploration. His prized possession, besides his warhorse Barnaby and his boomerang axe, is his Folding Boat, gifted to him by his father, cabin boy on the first ship to cross the Krakenwake. He carries it with him wherever he goes, in hopes that he may have the opportunity to follow in his father's footsteps, and himself be the first to cross an unknown body of water. Unfortunately, he has chosen to live in the middle of a barren plain, seemingly leagues from any sizeable pond. He has also never sailed before, and the grand total of his sailing skills come out of a somewhat fanciful book on pirates he owns. And he's deathly afraid of swimming.

HASOR TURELL

As a young boy, Hasor became fascinated by the tales told by Winthrop Porter. Despite the best efforts of his parents, he would frequently sneak off to Porter's hut to hear his tales of far-off lands and enigmatic knowledge. Hasor became particularly enamored of tales concerning the god of travel, Fharlanghn, and the ancient Pearlescent Knights who honored their god by carving out the vast pilgrim tracts across the civilized and uncivilized world.

Hasor eventually came to think of himself as a follower of Fharlanghn and dreams of traveling the world some day, witnessing for himself the great natural beauties and helping the common man. A few years back he became the Cudberct's stablehand at the Ol' Boar's Inn in order to earn some extra coin to fund his future travels.

He longs to bring his childhood love with him on those travels, but Keria has spurned all his advances on account of his extreme cowardice and puny physique. Hoping to win her heart through bold adventure, Hasor has joined with the Lady Jastian, a newcomer to town, and waits anxiously to prove his mettle.

HADDON

Haddon has a very particular set of skills and he's made a life for himself exercising those skills in the only sorts of jobs that seem appropriate for them: Performing small mercenary jobs. Protecting caravans passing through long stretches of wilderness. Hunting down rogue wildlife of the monstrous sort.

He's never really gotten along well with the idea of adhering closely to a chain of command. Or even a link of command. If he did, he might have gotten himself tied up in one of the skirmishing wars between the Feald Duchies. Instead, he's found himself pushed further and further to edges of civilization.

On the other hand, if he was the sort of fellow to take orders without question he wouldn't have gone off-contract three years ago. And if he hadn't gone off contract, that young elven maid would probably be dead. And if that had happened, her father would not have gifted him with his elven hound, Ashur, in that strange ceremony of starlight-brought-to-forest-glade.

And Ashur's the best companion anyone could ask for. So it's probably all worked out for the best.

More recently, Haddon's been working guard contracts for Hucrele caravans. That's been good-paying work. When he saw the last caravan into a squabble of a town named Southcourt, though, the Hucrele representatives gave him new orders: Someone named Kerowyn Hucrele in the town of Oakhurst had sent a plea for help. Her kids had gone missing and she needed someone to help.

CERTH THE BAKER[/u]

Certh is the village baker, a stout fellow who makes a brisk trade in delicious baked goods. Technically, he works for a fellow named Cudberct at the Ol' Boar's Inn, but that's only until he can afford to rebuild his bakery which burned down a few years past in an unexplained fire in the middle of the night. Working for Cudberct gives him access to a decent oven, though, and so he's able to serve both Cudberct's customers and the baking needs of the village at large. (And Cudberct only keeps a fairly reasonable percentage of the latter.)

Certh also trains with the village militia... which is also run by Cudberct. He's never seen any actual combat though. At least, nothing more involved than scaring off the odd wandering goblin. (During the lycanthropy scare three summers back he was charged with watching the town square, but all the excitement happened out on the east farms.)

Question: You described Certh as "devoutly religious"? Do you want that to be in the Old Ways of faith or would you prefer being devout to some newer religion which would generally imply an antagonistic (but not necessarily hostile) relationship with the Old Ways?

Quote from: Justin Alexander;599428CUDBERCT
Query: Do you and Ermengilda have kids? How many? How old are they?

Last sentence of my character sheet post that you linked:

"The little boy is too young to work, around 6, and the girl is just younger at 4; both old enough for us parents to have *some* sleep, but now more able to get into bigger trouble."

So two kids, 6 yr old boy, 4 yr old girl.

You could make Ermengilda pregnant if you want (perhaps early third trimester?). And then my character will soon get absolutely no sleep.
"Death-defying daring-do? Do I get to sleep when we break camp? Sold!"
:p

Gileus was still in his apprenticeship when Lady Jastian arrived, so no tattoos.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;599428SGT. LLEWELLYN

There have been Llewellyns in Oakhurst for as long as anyone can remember or the stacks of tombstones in the church basement can attest. And more than a few of them have been charged with the protection of the little village and the surrounding farms. But now there's only one: Sgt. Llewellyn.

(It's said that there are a few Llewellyns working as weavers in Southcourt, of course. But Sgt. Llewellyn has never paid much heed to the city and its paid little heed to him.)

Over the years, Sgt. Llwellyn has faced a fair share of troubles: The winterfire skeletons that rose from the old cemetery (which is why the tombstones are stacked in the church basement now and the town doesn't keep a cemetery any more). The dark Entmoot that chanted its way through Witch's Hallow. A nip of lycanthropy out on the east farms. But he's always found a way to rally the people around to make a stand against that sort of thing when a standings been necessary.

He's a comfortable sight for the folk of Oakhurst: He makes his thrice daily walk-abouts 'round the village and rides out through the farms at least twice a week. He carries carrots and lets the kids feed his warhorse Justice. Everyone knows his mithril shield and shirt of chain (both signs of the sergeant's office; the title "sergeant" in these parts being used by any chief lawman for reasons of history that no one gives much thought to). The sword he keeps strapped to his side is his, though: A family heirloom that everyone knows will never lose its edge and remains spotless after several generations. Just like the spotless Sgt. Llewellyn never loses his edge.

Cudberct, the local innkeep, works as a frequent deputy for Sgt. Llewellyn. Llewellyn's learned to trust his expertise, although there's a number of other young lads who work deputy duty as the need arises.

Llewellyn's also got a good working relationship with Mayor Vurnor. They both take great pride in making Oakhurst the best little village it can be.

Decision Time: Do you want Sgt. Llewellyn to be involved in the Old Ways. Or are the Old Ways just some strange hillfolk beliefs that you tolerate / hate?

That is awesome.

I am not sure what the 'Old Ways' are, did I miss that in a previous post?  Preliminarily, I would say Llewellyn is familiar with the Old Ways from his family's history in the area, and has learned to respect the beliefs of the hillfolk (and perhaps has some faith in it as well) as it keeps feuds with the village to a minimum, and makes dealings with the hillfolk easier overall.

My background doesn't seem to have changed since I posted it, so it looks good.  I enjoy being a somewhat mentor to Hasor, as well as probably a bad influence.  I encourage the town youngsters to adventure, while Cudberct is trying to dissuade them.

Castellan, I'm going to hold on to my leadership feat until the dice start rolling, at which point I'll drop it (and possibly my Stealthy feat) for something else, so long as that's okay with Justin?

Quote from: Opaopajr;599457Last sentence of my character sheet post that you linked:

Right. Reading. Knew I was forgetting something. ;)

Quote from: StormBringer;599493I am not sure what the 'Old Ways' are, did I miss that in a previous post?  Preliminarily, I would say Llewellyn is familiar with the Old Ways from his family's history in the area, and has learned to respect the beliefs of the hillfolk (and perhaps has some faith in it as well) as it keeps feuds with the village to a minimum, and makes dealings with the hillfolk easier overall.

The exact details of the Old Ways are a little sketchy at the moment, but what we know is that they're draconic in nature: Dern Nacre, the local healer, is a follower of the Old Ways. She tends the dragon circles around town and her face bears the green draconic tattoos of the Faith. She speaks the dragon tongue (Draconic) and quite a few folks back up in the hills speak the same.

I'm figuring it'll end up being old school druidic with a dash of Mythos cultist or vice versa, depending on how things develop. It could even be both depending on which followers of the Faith you're talking about.

Quote from: Josh;599508Castellan, I'm going to hold on to my leadership feat until the dice start rolling, at which point I'll drop it (and possibly my Stealthy feat) for something else, so long as that's okay with Justin?

That sounds fine to me.

I'm adding approved/updated character backgrounds to the opening posts in the IC thread (with additional cross-reference links to character sheets for easy reference).

The IC thread is looking good. I think I've seeded enough ravine-related info that you guys can continue steering you own way towards mounting the expedition; if locals need some lore confirmed, just let me know and I'll fill in the blanks. Warclam: You can either check in with Kerowyn Hucrele before heading to the inn or head directly to the inn; whatever works for you.

We're still waiting for either a thumb's up or "that sucks, change it" on character backgrounds from DonEsteban, Tanthius, Greyknight, and Warclam.

After that we'll have another round or two of prep activity and then we can get a hard frame from the scene at the inn to the adventure site (or whatever works transitionally).

Yeah, I went and did my IC post before the background stuff. Whoops. Normally I'd want to take off the armour and weapons before doing errands about town, but if there's fresh news of the sprats I might need to just head out again. I shall adjust my actions accordingly.

Gah, forgot about that initial post. I'm pretty into the wolf bit now, I think I'll stick with it. I hinted at a few things in the IC post, though a more intelligent person than I might have gone ahead and said them... let's remedy that now.

I see Haddon as being torn between the traditional lifestyle of his kin, adhering to their taboos and customs to an extent, and the allure of settled life. In fact he finds neither, gripped with a wanderlust that takes him away whenever he nears peace. Your description of his habits is excellent.

The wolves he travels with tend to be children of his older companions when they are too weary to keep wandering. Ashur is a youngster, daughter of Haddon's longtime companion Mala. Three years ago Haddon and Mala rescued an elven maid as you describe, and her father's hunting hound and Mala became enamoured with each other. Together they bore a litter of pups, seemingly wolves but for their great size and strength, and the forest green of their eyes.

Haddon stayed among the elves for some months, but eventually he felt compelled to move on. The girl's father gifted him with the eldest and boldest pup, Ashur, as well as an enchanted silver amulet that gilds the wearer's tongue to even the most willful of beasts [silver holy symbol, +1 competence to Handle Animal].

How's that sound?

That looks great Justin. Just a couple quick additions to tie me into other characters:

Two years ago, one of Cudberct's horses became extremely sick. Dern Nacre did what she could, but didn't expect the beast to last the winter. The newly hired Hasor refused to let one of his charges die, and spent nearly every waking hour nursing the horse back to health. Cudberct was touched by his efforts, and told Hasor that the horse's life was in his hands: if it lived, it would be Hasor's forever. When the southern wind heralded a new spring, he named the newly healed horse Notos, and yearns to ride him into the great unknown.

His success in the face of Dern Nacre's grim expectations, combined with his budding religious ideas and general disinterest in the Old Ways, has caused a rift between the older healer and Hasor. He now spends a great deal more time talking with Winthrop than he does learning from Dern.

Warclam/Tanthius: Awesome. Love the tweaks.

I feel that, although he talks big about travelling and adventure, Winthrop is moderately sheltered.  He knows the area within a hundred miles or so of town extremely well, but may have never travelled beyond that.  Compared to Cudberct, the seasoned war veteran, Winthrop seems idealistic and less world-weary.

I'm not entirely sure why he's stayed so close to Oakhurst, when he's a scout that talks of adventure with such reverence.  Partially, he's attached to his books, and his friends in town, and he likes being known as the knowledgable woodsman.  There could also be some sort of unrequitted love with a member of the town - I had mentioned that he likes to call upon Dern when he's in town, that could be because he's just interested in being a gentleman and in dragon lore, but if it fits with the story (and she's of approximately his generation) he could have some sort of one-sided interest in her - yet another thing he can commisserate with Hasor on.

Ultimately, though, I think that Winthrop has an unease about the unknown.  Much like his fear of water has kept him from following his dream of being a sailor, he's more comfortable travelling the areas he knows so well than venturing further out.  That's why he leads an expedition into the Ashen Plain every few years, but has never set foot in the Citadel.  He's expressed a lot of interest so far in battling the goblins, because that's a foe that he's fought before, but nothing but hesitation at mention of the Citadel.

For Winthrop's religion, I put down "Academic Agnostic".  I think that, like most other types of lore, Winthrop is fascinated with religion, new gods and old ways alike.  He knows that magic exists, and that there are powerful beings that grant it, but not being a practitioner himself, he doesn't feel they affect him in any distinguishable way.  

I am going to replace either Leadership or Stealthy with Precise Shot.  I had forgotten about the -4 penalty when firing into melee, plus Precise Shot lets me take Ranged Pin/Disarm later (his BAB wasn't high enough at level 6 to take one).  It's unfortunate that those feats aren't on the Scout's bonus feat list, since they're from a different book, so he would have to wait until level 9 to take them (which we may never reach).  Ah well.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;599607The exact details of the Old Ways are a little sketchy at the moment, but what we know is that they're draconic in nature: Dern Nacre, the local healer, is a follower of the Old Ways. She tends the dragon circles around town and her face bears the green draconic tattoos of the Faith. She speaks the dragon tongue (Draconic) and quite a few folks back up in the hills speak the same.

I'm figuring it'll end up being old school druidic with a dash of Mythos cultist or vice versa, depending on how things develop. It could even be both depending on which followers of the Faith you're talking about.

That sounds cool.  I haven't played a straight Fighter-type in ages, so I think I will go with the original plan of no magic.  Familiarity with common phrases, gestures, and rituals to fit in with their culture, and something of an open mind to their beliefs.

My background looks fine!

Quote from: Justin Alexander;599428CERTH THE BAKER[/u]
Question: You described Certh as "devoutly religious"? Do you want that to be in the Old Ways of faith or would you prefer being devout to some newer religion which would generally imply an antagonistic (but not necessarily hostile) relationship with the Old Ways?

I left it vague until I could get a grip on the religious part of the setting.  I read your info about the "Old Ways", what about the "New Gods"?  Somebody mentioned Fharlanghn I think, are they just the Greyhawk pantheon or should I create something?

He will most likely be following the pantheon (whatever it turns out like), although probably as a whole rather than a specific deity to the exclusion of the others.  I don't expect that he regards the Old Ways as "invalid" as such, just... different.  I can expand on the latter point more clearly if I know more about the pantheon: for one thing, why are they the "new" gods?  Implies that something happened at some point to bring them into power, and that something is likely to be important to such discussions.

Should we set up Macros in case of combat v. scheduling difficulties? Like, a pattern of automated responses according to Locale>Gear>Combat? It'd be a shame for this to collapse due to contact with our first combat.

Even something as simple as "I hit the nearest enemy with my axe! I do this until I die or battle's over," might help.

I was under the impression that we would all give our actions for a round at once, then Justin would do out the rolls and mechanics. I assumed we would give a few conditional options: "I attack the nearest goblin" or "If all the archers are down when my turn comes up, I drink a healing potion. Otherwise, I throw another axe at an archer."

FINAL CALL for DONESTEBAN: Check your PMs and review your background.

Quote from: greyknight;599881I left it vague until I could get a grip on the religious part of the setting.  I read your info about the "Old Ways", what about the "New Gods"?  Somebody mentioned Fharlanghn I think, are they just the Greyhawk pantheon or should I create something?

Greyhawk, Greek, Egyptian. Whatever works for you: The New Gods have a number of "heavenly abodes" scattered here and there around the world -- Mt. Olympus, the Golden Citadel, the Jade Pyramids of Sefa -- but have also been known to walk the world with frequent regularity. Some are aloof; others are familiar demigods ruling from earthly thrones. The only thing that joins them all together is their ability to serve as a conduit/master of divine energy into faithful followers.

They are distinct from the Elder Gods: They are one part Lovecraft's Outer Gods, one part Derleth's Elder Gods, and one part "New Gods from cultures so old their mythology has been broken and then forgotten" (or possibly "they were once New Gods, but now they have ascended to an even higher plane").

The Old Ways kind of lay off to one side of all this "god" business. The dragons -- particularly the Old Dragons -- are something else entirely. (And the modern teachings of the Old Ways are bastardized from that in any case.)

Feel free to extrapolate from this how you like and I'll add it your background info.

DUNGEONCRAWLING PROCEDURES

Next order of business, let's hash out some basic dungeoncrawling procedures. (This will speed up exploration portions of the 'crawl.)

(1) Marching Order. By default I'm assuming two people per rank and 5 feet between ranks unless you tell me otherwise. Who wants to be in which ranks? Generic responses like "in the front", "in the rear", or "in the middle" are also acceptable and we'll work out the details from there.

(2) Watch List. If you end up camping in the dungeon or outside, who's standing watch? Watches are 4 hours long unless you feel strongly about some other organization. I assume 2 watches of activity followed by 4 watches at night. So, effectively, given 4 watches who's on each watch?

(3) Party Caller? Do you want to make one person responsible for navigation decisions during exploratory parts of the adventure? If so, who? (Usually this would be someone in the front rank of the marching order.)

I've got the party's speed marked at 20 feet. Nobody's moving slower than that, right?

And I think that should do it, unless there are any other general "protocols" you want to establish. (For example, you could establish a protocol like "the group always stands 30 feet away from the guy opening a door in case it's trapped". Or "we tie ropes off to each other to prevent people from falling down pits". Or anything else of that nature.)

Quote from: Tanthius;600105I was under the impression that we would all give our actions for a round at once, then Justin would do out the rolls and mechanics. I assumed we would give a few conditional options: "I attack the nearest goblin" or "If all the archers are down when my turn comes up, I drink a healing potion. Otherwise, I throw another axe at an archer."

Yup, that's basically the plan: People send me their current tactical intentions (with greater or lesser degrees of specificity) and then I play out and resolve the combat until I reach a point where it feels like tactical intentions would be or could be changing. To start with, that'll probably default to resolving one full round.

It's been an efficient method for resolving combat for me in the past. If people can commit to checking the thread once per day, most combats can be resolved in under a week.

Marching Order: As one of our trackers, Ashur should be in front I think. When not riding him, Haddon should be behind him with the other squishies. Unless we want the heavily-armoured warrior-types in front?

Watch List: We'll grab last watch, unless anyone else feels strongly about it. Haddon is a morning spell-preparer, so it meshes well.

Party Caller: Winthrop perhaps, as our woodsman?

Winthrop's location would possibly depend on the environment.  In the wilderness, he will almost certainly be out front, as the local and tracker.  He would possibly range ahead of the group, scouting, marking the trail, etc.  Also, with his speed of 40 he should be able to make survival checks at no penalty to provide food for the party if it's an extended overland trip to the ravine.  Of course, if we're riding our horses he moves no faster than anybody else.

Within a "dungeon" I'm not actually sure where he'd be.  It probably makes some sense to put him middlish, as one of the only ranged characters, behind the big meat shields.  But I'd be happy to stick him out front again if that's easier. He would certainly be interested in keeping the level one followers safe.

As the local, with fairly sizable perception and stealth scores, Winthrop would make sense as the navigator. From a story perspective, I could also see the Lady or the Seargent, as both of them are the driving forces behind the expedition. I'm happy with any option.

Regarding watches, Winthrop is happy taking any watch.  He would be most interested in taking watch with someone with whom he can swap stories - Gileus or Jastian perhaps, or maybe his young friend Hasor.

Also, I'm sure Sharwyn will be delighted to know that the entire town thinks she's a boy.  I'm sure that's going to interfere with her dating future!

It depends too much on locale and gear to give an all-purpose default. I can switch from back row horse archer on the plains to front tower shield heavy in the dungeon. At best I'll give a gear and battle macro soon after engaging a new locale.

Oh yes, I'm bringing a cart, camp guard hirelings, and different gear-sets depending on where we plan to go.

I suspect that Lady Jastian isn't quite so impetuous when she's sober, but she seems determined to surprise me.  

So far, Lady Jastian seems an uncompromising sort, someone who boldly speaks harsh truths (as she sees them):  We'll see whether that's true of her when she's sober, or if she was just "in her cups".  

She is capable of being diplomatic when she feels a more gentle approach is needed, but right now she thinks the townsfolk have already waited too long to reconnoiter the area and discover some sign of the goblins' current activities.  

Jastian has apparently had some hostile encounters with goblins, which color her perceptions.  She thinks the townsfolk were foolish to trade with them.  

Warclam:  Yep, Lady Jastian was a bit high-handed.  She'll doubtlessly be more reasonable tomorrow morning.

Quick note, I've made what should be my final pass on Winthrop.  I traded in his magic armor for masterwork, bought a few potions and made his horse a warhorse again, and I dropped Leadership for Precise Shot.

Nah, I think Lady Jastian is the right sort of catalyst to keep things moving. It was an inspired little bit and obviously moved things along. Look how little Justin has to post in IC and yet it merrily carries on, it's like a GM vacation! Healthy fleshed out personalities only make IC decisions easier, and that's a good thing to keep things from stalling out.

Gileus will hang out in the middle of the marching order.  And if there's any sign of combat, he'll hang back and cover the more experienced combatants with his crossbow.

With 4 watches, it seems we should have one of the more combat ready characters (that is, the 7th level ones) on each watch.  Gileus would probably take watch with Lady Jastian or Winthrop.

Quote from: Opaopajr;600454Look how little Justin has to post in IC and yet it merrily carries on, it's like a GM vacation!

I'm loving it. ;)

It's feeling a lot like my home campaign. I'll frequently be able to sit back and just let the players keep the ball rolling. And you're right, it builds stronger relationships between the PCs.

Current MARCHING ORDER:

Rank 1: Ashur
Rank 2: Haddon
Middlish: Winthrop - Gileus

Current WATCH LIST:

Watch 1: ???
Watch 2: ???
Watch 3: ???
Watch 4: Ashur/Haddon

Quote from: Josh;600273Also, I'm sure Sharwyn will be delighted to know that the entire town thinks she's a boy.  I'm sure that's going to interfere with her dating future!

I think we run with it: It's a lesbian relationship and they're planning to get married. Some of the priests of Norse gods murmur imprecations against that sort of thing, but in reality nobody in the 4th century wanted to piss off the priestesses of the Isle of Lesbos and it's been pretty much accepted practice ever since.

EVERYBODY: I'm going to be out of town for a large chunk of tomorrow, so I may not be able to post until Sunday. Keep working on hashing out the dungeon marching order and watch list. Once those are in hand, we should be able to get the adventure rolling.

While tracing the previous party's movement, Lady Jastian will want the party's skilled trackers in front, lest her tracks interfere with their efforts.

At other times, Lady Jastian would prefer to be in the party's front rank.  In open country, she'll often ride her heavy warhorse, Paladin.  This will allow her the best possible view of potential ambushes or other dangers.  

While she respects her fellow adventurers' experience, she regards herself and Sergeant Llewellyn as the party members most likely to survive initial contact with enemies or monsters.  She is certainly going to underestimate Cudberct's abilities until she sees him in action.

If enemies or other threats are believed to be nearby, Jastian will dismount.  She will try to interpose herself between her allies and any foes, using her polearm's reach to keep enemies away from her allies.  With Combat Reflexes and Improved Trip, she hopes to keep foes from even reachng her allies, much less engaging them in battle.

Winthrop can take watch two.  Since Gileus seems amiable to join him, would you care the share it with him?  He would likely spend watch one hunting or storytelling, actively watch for the second watch, and then have a nice sleep.

If he's going to be the party navigator, stick him in row one, otherwise I think let's say row three.

Edit: Just saw Sir Wulf's post.  I nominate him for navigator while inside dungeons, and maybe I'll do it while outside?  In which case rank 3 seems fine by me.

Sir Wulf's Analysis seems much more apt than my own. In-dungeon, Haddon and Ashur should probably stay middle-ish.

Quote from: Josh;600556Edit: Just saw Sir Wulf's post.  I nominate him for navigator while inside dungeons, and maybe I'll do it while outside?  In which case rank 3 seems fine by me.

Makes sense.

Hasor doesn't have any preference for watches, so he'll pair up with whoever wants company. As far as the marching order goes, he's got basically no actual combat skill, and couldn't survive much of a beating either. He'll go in the far back, right in front of any rear guards we have.

QuoteIt soon becomes apparent that he is obviously confusing parts of the story with the epic Tragedy of Darien and Julianne, especially around the point that Kerowyn Hucrele (known by the town to be quite alive) dies from a horrific infection obtained from a werebadger bite.

The HORROR of the WEREBADGER claims another victim...

Quote from: Josh;600556Winthrop can take watch two.  Since Gileus seems amiable to join him, would you care the share it with him?

Sounds good to me.

I'll take watch one. Cudberct would be keeping somewhat regular hours that way. Though he has horrible spot and listen, it'd be a time while his horse and hound would likely be most awake, and they have decent spot and listen.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;600625The HORROR of the WEREBADGER claims another victim...

Werebadgers are serious business. They'll mess you up!

Current MARCHING ORDER:

Rank 1: Lady Jastian
Rank 2: Haddon/Ashur
Rank 3: Winthrop

Middle: Gileus
Tanthius: Second to last rank

Still Need Position: Llewellyn, Aminda, Hasor, Certh, Cudberct

Current WATCH LIST:

Watch 1: Cudberct
Watch 2: Winthrop - Gileus
Watch 3: Hasor
Watch 4: Ashur/Haddon

Not necessarily complete, but there's at least one person on each watch.

You have to give me a terrain or situation so as to determine marching order.

What is this for?: open plains on horses, forest scouting with bows, cave spelunking in light gear, walkable ruin or dungeon in heavy gear, etc.

Having the dude with the highest HP always in the front doesn't always help; situations affects gear which affects tactics which affects order.

We haven't even planned anything about where we're going, how we're traveling, and what should we prepare for.

Eh, I think Justin is just looking for a general in dungeon 2 wide order. I imagine it won't be set in stone and can be adjusted at any point, it's just there to speed things along.

I think it makes sense to have probably Llewelyn in the front with Jastian, since she's more likely to trust his prowess at this point in time. Then having Cudberct as rear guard would make sense, if he's okay with that - he seems the cautious, hang back and make sure nothing goes wrong type.

Quote from: Josh;600860Eh, I think Justin is just looking for a general in dungeon 2 wide order. I imagine it won't be set in stone and can be adjusted at any point, it's just there to speed things along.

This, as described in post 179 (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=600249&postcount=179): Standard dungeon marching order.

It can be trivially changed at any time. But having default procedures for a forum game will speed things up tremendously. As evidenced by the last four days, haggling this stuff out takes time. Doing it every time you want to walk down a hall will kill a forum game pretty quick.

I've recruited a replacement for DonEsteban to play Aminda Scroppings. Normally at such an early juncture I'd just let the character go, but she's ended up getting closely connected to several of you.

Welcome Fenyx4: I understand he'll be making an introductory post shortly.

Now if we can just figure out what happened to StormBringer...

Hiya!

I'm still working my way through the threads. Lookin' forwards to joining you.

Ahh, dungeon hallway, two players wide? OK, I have context, I can work with that.

I have shit for spot and listen without my animals for help. Yet bringing a dog or horse underground doesn't sound as wise as leaving them to help guard the cart. So a rogue or scout at point would be best for such checks.

If the dungeon area is walkable, I'd likely be in heavy armor with a tower shield. That'd make being second rank the better tactic. That way any scouts and rogues on point can get behind Lady Jastian and I before we set up a shield wall.

However, I can play rear guard; I have an extra medium shield. Perhaps Lady Jastian or Sgt Llewellyn would be interested in borrowing my tower shield while holding the front. But we're going to need Sgt Llewellyn soon to see if he's running on NPC autopilot or not.

Ahoy and well met, Fenyx!

Yeah, SB has been gone long enough I had to look at the first page to remember that was Sergeant Llewellyn's player. If contact can't be made, Gileus could maybe be promoted?

Yes, welcome.  

Losing players before you start is always unfortunate, although I'm sure more common in online games such as these.  I'm somewhat an advocate of just starting the adventure, if missing players arrive in a reasonable time then no problem, otherwise retcon some of the other characters up to appropriate levels?

Sorry, everyone!  I am here, got some end of semester chaos to deal with, but I think it is settled.

Marching order:

Rank 1: Lady Jastian/Sgt Llewellyn
Rank 2: Haddon/Ashur
Rank 3: Winthrop

Middle: Gileus
Tanthius: Second to last rank

I can take first rank alongside Lady Jastian to provide front line coverage for missles and magic from the rear.

Watch list:
I will stand with Hasor on third watch.

Watch 1: Cudberct
Watch 2: Winthrop - Gileus
Watch 3: Hasor/Sgt Llewellyn
Watch 4: Ashur/Haddon

Certh would probably go in the front lines.  He's eager to test his mettle!

CURRENT AGENDA[/u]

With Sgt. Llewellyn entering the common room, I'm going to let that play out a bit to get him properly hooked into the adventure.

ON SUNDAY: We'll either be re-framing to a brief sequence on the next morning as you set out (say 72-hours for back-and-forth roleplaying). Or we'll just do a hard re-frame to the Citadel and plunge in. (Depends on how this scene at the inn finishes out with Llewellyn.)

STARTING SUNDAY: Check the threads at least once every 48 hours (preferably every 24 hours) and post something. (If you're still in the inn's common room, start doing this now.)

This shouldn't take you more than 5-10 minutes, but it will keep the game moving forward: Make a witty quip. Take an action. Ask someone a question. Describe your silent reaction to whatever is going on.

If we all do this, then we'll all have something to respond to when we do our daily check-in.

Also: If you click "Thread Tools" at the top of the screen you can click "Subscribe to This Thread" and then select an e-mail notification update. It'll help remind you to drop by and take part. (I've personally been leaving the threads open in my browser so that the first thing I do whenever I hit the internet is check in. But whatever works for you.)

CURRENT MARCHING ORDER[/u] (5 ft. between ranks)

RANK 1: Lady Jastian - Sgt Llewellyn
RANK 2: Haddon - Ashur
RANK 3: Winthrop - Certh
RANK 4: Gileus - Hasor
RANK 5: Cudberct - Aminda

Does anyone have any objections to this?

WATCH LIST (4 hours per watch)

Watch 1: Cudberct
Watch 2: Winthrop - Gileus
Watch 3: Hasor
Watch 4: Ashur/Haddon

Does anyone have any additions/objections to this?

Aminda will join in on last watch near the end of the watch she will begin preparing breakfast (as long as she judges Cudberct to be alert).

Lady Jastian may find herself with an extra cut of meat or an extra scoop of mashed tubers...

And I'm good in the last rank of the marching order.

Lady Jastian will stand the first watch with Cudberct:  Although he is actually a veteran warrior, in her eyes, he's just an innkeeper with a good heart and a bit of local experience.

Aminda / Lady Jastian: Noted and posted to the first post of this thread.

I offered third watch with Hasor,  I wasn't sure if that was missed or not needed.

I was wondering:  Does the game's planet have any unusual astronomical phenomena that potentially impact night vision (extra moons, gaudy nearby planets or nebulae, ominous clouds of darkness, etc.)?  In what phase is the moon?

Quote from: StormBringer;601854I offered third watch with Hasor,  I wasn't sure if that was missed or not needed.

I did miss that. Sorry. It's been added to the Watch List. Thanks!

Quote from: Sir Wulf;601894I was wondering:  Does the game's planet have any unusual astronomical phenomena that potentially impact night vision (extra moons, gaudy nearby planets or nebulae, ominous clouds of darkness, etc.)?  In what phase is the moon?

There are three moons, but they are never in the sky at the same time. Rather they follow each other in sequence, with each appearing as a new moon, waxing to full, and then waning to a lunar senescence before passing from the sky and being replaced by the next. The moons are:

Tiamat (the Chaos Moon)
Abzu (the Ordained Moon)
Hubur (the Mother Moon)

Each is roughly the same size of our world's moon (although Hubur is slightly larger): Tiamat is a dull and ruddy red; Abzu is a silvery-white; and Hubur glows blue (apparently being covered in water). The dark side of Abzu is pinpricked with lights, which are said to be cities. (Although who, exactly, lives in them is disputed.)

It's said that murders and violence spike under the "chaos light" of Tiamat, but women are more fertile under the light of Hubur.

There's a complicated calendrical system which tracks the occasions when multiple moons will appear in the sky at the same time (generally at the end and beginning of their cycles through the sky).

The current moon is Hubur, which is waxing gibbous.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;601921I did miss that. Sorry. It's been added to the Watch List. Thanks!

Awesome.  Everything happens on third watch ( :) ), so I wanted to make sure there was adequate coverage.

QuoteThere are three moons, but they are never in the sky at the same time.

It's three wolf moon (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/three-wolf-moon), not three moon wolf.

Having been to the ravine before (and assuming the Sunless Citadel as well), along with the Ashen Plain, Bone Hills, and Witch's Hallow down south, I should have some idea of the local terrain and distances.

So what's the distance to the ravine through the hills? What would we need to encamp and visit the ravine goblins? If this involves going down the ravine, what sort of gear (donkeys? rappelling gear? elevator?) would be expected?

It's gonna help the IC confab about preparation and tactics.

Quote from: Opaopajr;601985Having been to the ravine before (and assuming the Sunless Citadel as well), along with the Ashen Plain, Bone Hills, and Witch's Hallow down south, I should have some idea of the local terrain and distances.

So what's the distance to the ravine through the hills? What would we need to encamp and visit the ravine goblins? If this involves going down the ravine, what sort of gear (donkeys? rappelling gear? elevator?) would be expected?

It's gonna help the IC confab about preparation and tactics.

Distance to the ravine along the Old Road: 20 miles. The Witch's Hallow is about 12 miles south; the nearest edge of the Ashen Plain is about 8 miles west.

Cudberct may have visited the northern end of the ravine, where it broadens and deepens considerably into a proper canyon that slices at a shallowing northwest angle through the Ashen Plain. But the goblins are thought to inhabit the southern edge of the ravine (at least that's where they've been seen in the greatest concentrations over the years; and the goblins who come bearing the magical apples tend to just come walking up the Old Road).

Off-hand, I think there are a couple of obvious approaches to the ravine: You could either head straight down the Old Road and then probably need to climb down into the ravine (ropes, etc.). Or you could head westerly about 20 miles or so and ride into the shallow, northern end of the canyon and simply ride down the floor of the canyon as it narrows into the ravine.

Re: The Citadel. The "Sunless Citadel" is actually unknown locally. The only reference to a "Citadel" that anyone has is Gileus' research: An ancient map indicating a location which is apparently pretty close to this "ravine" everyone in town keeps talking about; but on Gileus' maps no such ravine or canyon or anything else of that sort is indicated.

In light of this new information, should we recon references to the citadel out of our grandiose plans? For his part Winthrop hasn't really been making plans to go to the citadel, just to the ravine.

Also, as the most knowledgable about the area, I will assume I know everything you mentioned about the ravine. Would a knowledge geography or local reveal any new info?

Lady Jastian would rather leave the cart behind.  She would also prefer to enter the gorge from the open end instead of descending by rope.  While the journey may be longer, this would allow them to bring the horses, which may be needed if the party must evacuate wounded allies or survivors from the first expedition.  She is also uneasy about the group's ability to retreat from the canyon, should they encounter an overwhelming hostile force.  Fleeing on horseback would be preferable to retreating up a set of ropes while taking fire.

She'll ask around while preparing to leave: Are the goblins known to use bows or crossbows?

While on the road, Jastian will coach the other party members to be more alert and cautious (getting them used to her Marshal abilities to improve others' AC and Initiative)

Cudberct would unconsciously slip into military speak when discussing strategy. Referring to the cart's encampment as a "forward operating base" and talking about the suggested parley group as "scouts reconnoitering," he'd see this as any other military maneuver. Sir Braford probably was stupid enough to kick the hornet's nest and piss off the goblins, so even though Cudberct presses for parley first, he's prepping for real battle and casualties.

Further, the cart allows rapid redeployment and reassignment in case plans change while away. There's no time to go back and swap out more appropriate gear in case the goblin lead runs cold. There's two cocky veterans with two 'newbies' out for longer than their sparse prep could sustain in rations/water alone.

He doesn't play around when dealing with raw recruits, as at least two obviously will be (Hasor and Certh). Overkill is his defense against the failings of such an untested group. He will have little patience with niceties for visitors who want to play fast and loose with his town folk (and employees).

Not bringing the cart is not an option.

A lot of the stuff over the past few messages could probably be moved to the IC thread. I'm going to use Sir Wulf as an example, because his message is convenient.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;602668Lady Jastian would rather leave the cart behind. She would also prefer to enter the gorge from the open end instead of descending by rope. While the journey may be longer, this would allow them to bring the horses, which may be needed if the party must evacuate wounded allies or survivors from the first expedition. She is also uneasy about the group's ability to retreat from the canyon, should they encounter an overwhelming hostile force. Fleeing on horseback would be preferable to retreating up a set of ropes while taking fire.

So, for example, all of that could be said IC and hashed out as part of the current sequence. Ditto on Opaopajr's response immediately above.

QuoteShe'll ask around while preparing to leave: Are the goblins known to use bows or crossbows?

ROLLS DICE

Nope. The goblins are mostly blamed for disappearing livestock and the occasional cattle mutilation, but no one in the group has any particular memory of the goblins using bows or crossbows.

I'm going to let you frame this into the IC thread. I'd probably just take it there directly, but I don't want to preempt the group's response to Cudberct's parade rest.

QuoteWhile on the road, Jastian will coach the other party members to be more alert and cautious (getting them used to her Marshal abilities to improve others' AC and Initiative)

This, OTOH, is an OOC heads-up to me of future intention that's not immediately applicable to the current sequence. It could go in the IC thread, but it's also just fine here. I've made a note of it and will be able to weave it into the IC thread at the appropriate moment.

Aminda is recommending everyone has at least 20 days of rations. (as per Justin's previous post I'll also put this in IC). You can read below the line if you are interested in how I came to that number.

Sir Wulf: When Aminda came by to check on Jastian in the morning she would have asked for 20 gold for supplies. Any problems with that?

Justin: Does Aminda have any problems finding 70 days of rations and 8 yards of canvas? (for 35 gp and 8 sp by my calculations)

-------------

20 miles to the ravine entrance.
20 miles down the old road to the ravine.
Going off the map in the IC thread it looks like that may be roughly an equilateral triangle so I'll assume 20 miles between the ravine/old road and the ravine entrance.

Roughly 2 days to the ravine along the old road. (with cart. people with horses and can easily make it in a day. Donkeys in a day if we hustle. Gives us a day+ of parley before the cart arrives.)
8 miles west to the plain so... 1 day.
12 miles across the plain to the ravine entrance. 1 day.
20 miles in the ravine to get back where the boys and friends probably lowered themselves down. Not quite sure what the terrain will be like down there. But erring on the side of caution 3 days with the cart.

Heading back will be a bit shorter. 3 days (ravine) + 1 day (plains) + 1 day (to town)

A week to get there and 5 to get back. so, 12 days of travel. Let's say 5 days doing non-travel related stuff. 2 Companions. 4 addons partway through. And lets tack on an extra 20% for delays, slow travel 'n' such. I'd like more of a buffer but I only got so much gold...

((7+5)*3+5*7)*1.2 = ~85 days of rations... (-15 for the ones my group already has)

I'm still putting this here as IC seems to have been sped up to next morning and way too much was skipped without being discussed. Hey, play by posts delays will do that. We're playing catch-up as fast as we can.

Gold's not a problem. Cudberct in the planning phase would easily cover his crew, and help with Lady Jastian's crew if they're willing to accept the help. Extra adventurers willing to partly cover their own costs in a rescue? He'll take that deal everyday and twice on Saturday. (Besides, any recovery reward should cover such expenses.)

Second, I need hirelings to hire. Give a quick slate of guards at the Hucrele compound and I'll pick from there.

SUPPLIES
The Hucrele general store is well-supplied: Unless it's something exotic, it'll be stocked. We'll assume that at some point during these morning's activities, time will be made to buy supplies. (You can certainly add that to the IC thread, or we can just assume it'll happen in the space after the current onscreen stuff fades to black.)

So, long story short: Subtract the cost from you money supplies and add the pertinent equipment to your sheets. (And, again, make those changes at the locations I've linked for your character sheets. If you do it somewhere else, it never happened.)

LOADING UP THE CART
In addition, it sounds like a large quantity of supplies could be ending up on the cart. (Assuming the cart is going.) If you want something on the cart either pay for it or remove it from your character sheet and then post a message with the resulting list in this thread. I'll start maintaining a CART SUPPLIES list at the top of this thread for common reference.

(Posting this here cuz I can't update DonEsteban's post)

Aminda Scroppings, midwife, nanny, herbalist. She has been old ever since Lady Jastian knew her, which is all her life. She would do everything to protect the Lady and would never accept being very far from her. She can be quite insistent in this respect.

Spoiler

Aminda Scroppins; CR 1; Female Human Healer1; CN Medium Humanoid (Human)
Init -2; Senses: Listen +3, Spot +3, Languages Common, Draconic, Sylvan
AC 8, touch 8, flat-footed 8 (-2 Dex)
hp 8 (1 HD)
Fort +2, Ref -2, Will +5
Speed 30 ft. (6 squares)
Melee Dagger -3 (1d4-3/19-20) or
Ranged Dagger (Thrown) -2 (1d4-3/19-20)
Base Atk +0; Grp -3
Healer Spells Prepared (CL 1st)
* * 1st—Cure Light Wounds (2), Protection from Evil, Sanctuary (DC 13)
* * 0th—Cure Minor Wounds (2), Deathwatch, Mending
Abilities STR 5, DEX 7, CON 11, INT 14, WIS 17, CHA 15 (includes "old" age modifiers)
Feats Armor Proficiency (Light), Scribe Scroll, Simple Weapon Proficiency, Skill Focus (Heal)
Skills Concentration +4, Craft (Herbalism) +6, Craft (Needlework) +6, Diplomacy +4, Heal +12, Hide -2, Sense Motive +5, Spellcraft +6
Possessions Dagger, Outfit (Peasant's), Healer's Kit, Rod of the Servant, Walking Stick, Spell Component Pouch, Talisman, Backpack, Scroll (Remove Fear), Scroll (Restoration, Lesser), Scroll (Cure Light Wounds) (2), Scroll (Sanctuary), Antitoxin (Vial), Holly and Mistletoe, Potion of Cure Light Wounds, Lantern (Bullseye), Oil (1 Pt. Flask), Tindertwig (10), Flint and Steel, Sunrod (2), Waterskin, Donkey, Saddle (Riding), Saddlebags, Rope (Silk/50 Ft.), Artisan's Tools (Leatherworking), Sewing Kit, Bedroll, Rations (Trail/Per Day) (2), 5gp 2sp.

She has a custom magic item that she got from a thankful wizard after she helped with his son's delivery. Unseen servant 1 hour/day (spell level 1 x caster level 1 x 1800gp / (5/1 charge per day) = 359gp rounded up to 400gp. She's too old to handle the daily chores all by herself. If that's not okay, she'll just get some scrolls of Remove Whatnot.

If we were using flaws, she would take Murky-Eyed and maybe Noncombatant to get Skill Focus (Needlework and Herbalism). But that's probably not basketweaverish enough so I may just pass on it.

Links updated for Aminda.

Oh god, supply lists... hope PCGen doesn't explode on me again. :o

What's the 3e carrying capacity for two donkeys driving a cart?

And do I have to purchase barrels? Wouldn't at least two spare barrels be part of owning a large house and running an inn/tavern?

Quote from: Josh;602357In light of this new information, should we retcon references to the citadel out of our grandiose plans? For his part Winthrop hasn't really been making plans to go to the citadel, just to the ravine.

This seems right, although I figure Gileus asked people if they knew anything about a citadel and got no respones.

Also, Gileus didn't have a mount, but then I realized, how did he get to Oakhurst?  So I went and bought one for him.

Quote from: Opaopajr;602937Oh god, supply lists... hope PCGen doesn't explode on me again. :o

Best of luck on that, I think I an done messing with it now that I have the character done.  Aside from maybe making a better version...  ;)

QuoteAnd do I have to purchase barrels? Wouldn't at least two spare barrels be part of owning a large house and running an inn/tavern?

I had about 5000 something gp left over, so I set that up as 'city funds' or whatever for the expedition, I mentioned that in the IC thread if you want to respond to that.  I didn't have a whole lot of other gear to buy, so I figured any last minute supplies wouldn't have to be nickel and dimed out or scrimped on.

Supply purchasing time!

I'm spending Cudberct's money, on the grounds that Hasor wouldn't be financing the expedition on his own (not to mention those 2 extra zeroes in his dragon horde!) Winthrop, Aminda, Certh, and Haddon's mounts now have saddlebags, but Cudberct should add those to his sheet (since that's where the horses are listed). The saddlebags can fit just about everything you could want on your horse (up to 250 pounds). 9 riding mounts get 5 days of feed each stored on the cart, which weighs another 450 pounds: hopefully this won't overload the cart, and it'll keep the horses in good condition before they all have to graze.

Total cost to Cudberct: 18.25 gp

Haddon does have saddlebags, actually, they're listed in Ashur's stat block.

Anyone know of a price listed anywhere for wolf-suitable rations? Jerky or something?

EDIT: Took a look at what actual rations tend to include. Jerky, some kinda hardtack-like thing, maybe cheese packaged in wax, possibly dried fruit or nuts/seeds. So, actually not too bad for a canine.

CURRENT AGENDA

Okay, this is my current understanding of the travel plans:

Parley Group - Jastian, Llewellyn, Haddon, and Winthrop: Riding down the Old Road at the best possible speed of their mounts. I'm assuming they're not heavily encumbered, so let's call that 28 miles in a day x 3/4 for roads in hilly terrain: 21 miles per day

Supply Train - Everyone else + the cart: Also heading down the Old Road, with their speed basically limited by the donkey-hauled cart. That's 16 miles per day (since the donkeys are automatically heavily encumbered by the cart) x 3/4 for roads in hilly terrain: 12 miles per day

So the parley group will arrive late afternoon on the first day. The cart will arrive around mid-afternoon on the second day.

I'll let the current scene play out until tomorrow evening in case someone wants to argue against this plan or haggle out changes to it. Otherwise I'll assume it's what we're going with and go on from there.

If anyone wants to be taking particular actions while on the road, let me know now or forever hold your peace.

OTHER STUFF

CHECK YOUR PMs: I will be feeding you information through PMs. This site isn't always the greatest at notifying you of new private messages, so this is just a head's up to be aware of 'em.

Quote from: Opaopajr;602936OOC: (Naturally, I'm not profiting off myself here. Don't know how you'll class it JA, but perishable good/common meals per day wouldn't be at cost.)

CHECK: ROLL 18 + PROFESSION (INNKEEPER) 0 = 18

Looks like you've been managing your shop well. Take a 40% discount on anything from the Food, Drink, and Lodging (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Food,_Drink,_and_Lodging) table. Post an authoritative list here in the OOC thread of exactly what you're purchasing (and how much you're purchasing) and I'll update the cart list. (Tapping your stock like this will obviously have negative consequences for future profits at the inn.)

Well I ask because I can't find any useful perishable food rates on d20srd.org, outside of "bread, cheese, meat, wine, beer." That's dreadfully low in nutrients.
;)

I don't know why it's worthy of a roll, per se. If it was 2e I'd go all "sacks of flour, potatoes, veggies, eggs, herbs, mutton, etc." on everyone -- which would possibly be overwhelming minutiae and explode PCGen in the process. Yet buying raw ingredients doesn't seem particularly risky, esp. as Certh is the one doing the food shopping.

But, gift horses and mouth looking and all that.

I'm going to be out all day tomorrow. Hopefully I'll get my gear: person + animals + cart, done by Friday night.

Quote from: Opaopajr;603494Well I ask because I can't find any useful perishable food rates on d20srd.org, outside of "bread, cheese, meat, wine, beer." That's dreadfully low in nutrients.
;)

In the table in the link Justin provided "Meals (per day) - Good    5 sp"

Hey look, PM's!  And one from two weeks ago!  You weren't kidding when you said that the site doesn't notify you super well.

Since Winthrop has Flawless Stride, and is thus unhindered by rough terrain, and his movement speed is the same as a heavy warhorse's, I assume he can make better time than the warhorses while on foot?  If that is the case, he will probably leave his horse to follow one of the other riders, and go on foot, leaving trail markers that Cudberct should be able to follow (when we deviate from the road, that is).  I'm not sure if there's going to be any actual navigation checks or anything, but if there are, the idea is to give Cudberct an easier time of them.  At the same time, he'll probably periodically check for tracks of the first party without slowing down (-5 penalty on the track check).  It's a long shot as I'm sure the DC is going to be plenty high after 2 weeks, but worth a roll.

Josh: Ooo, shiny. I'm glad to hear we'll still be trying some tracking.

From IC thread

Quote from: StormBringer"Without the cart, getting even the children back would be nigh impossible, let alone the first rescue party."

Did I miss something while getting caught up? I don't remember a mention of a first rescue party. I scanned through the threads again and still couldn't find it.

If this was a mistake then ignore what I'm about to post in IC. For now I'm gonna assume Llewellyn is privy to IC information which Aminda doesn't have.

As we set out, Lady Jastian will begin using her ability to Motivate Dexterity which gives a +4 to Dex checks, Dex-based skills (like Ride), and Initiative.  She will also Motivate Care, granting a +2 to Armor Class.  

These auras will generally manifest in the form of frequent suggestions and warnings as the party rides:  "Aminda, 'ware that gully!"  "Sergeant, if you adjust your scabbard thusly, I think you'll find it possible to draw more quickly."

I mention this in the hope that you guys will feel free to incorporate Jastian's comments into your posts.  She IS a bit pompous, and as has been noted, "she does go on a bit".  (Unlike me, she can present her suggestions in a charming way:  Were I to attempt such assistance IRL, I'd surely irritate everyone around me.)

Quote from: Fenyx4;603571Did I miss something while getting caught up? I don't remember a mention of a first rescue party. I scanned through the threads again and still couldn't find it.

If this was a mistake then ignore what I'm about to post in IC. For now I'm gonna assume Llewellyn is privy to IC information which Aminda doesn't have.

I swear there was a Sir Benton or something that went out the previous week or somesuch.  I will go back and read up now, it's my responsibility to make sure I'm not babbling after all.  :)

Quote from: StormBringer;603715I swear there was a Sir Benton or something that went out the previous week or somesuch.  I will go back and read up now, it's my responsibility to make sure I'm not babbling after all.  :)

Sir Braford led the missing expedition, not a rescue party.  The two missing youths were part of his group.

Quote from: Josh;603567Since Winthrop has Flawless Stride, and is thus unhindered by rough terrain, and his movement speed is the same as a heavy warhorse's, I assume he can make better time than the warhorses while on foot?

Your speed is actually a little faster than an encumbered warhorse, which I just realized Llewellyn's is. So this is doubly true in both senses of the phrase: You're moving basically twice as fast as them along the road.

I'm fixing the outline of the plan in the post above to reflect the correct speeds.

My current understanding, though, is that BOTH groups are traveling strictly along the road. So navigational markers probably aren't necessary. Let me know if that changes your plans.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;603729Sir Braford led the missing expedition, not a rescue party.  The two missing youths were part of his group.

Carp, I totally mis-read that.  I will edit the dialogue when I get home tonight.

Is bloodsworn just a synonym for the Hucrele family, or is there more to it than that?

Quote from: Justin Alexander;603743My current understanding, though, is that BOTH groups are traveling strictly along the road. So navigational markers probably aren't necessary. Let me know if that changes your plans.

We might still want navigational markers if, say, the first group left the road because they found some tracks that might belong to the missing expedition.

We could say that we only leave markers where the first group deviated from the road, but that would mean if the second group missed the marker they would just keep going down the road with no way to confirm they're still following the first group.

Quote from: Tom;603755Is bloodsworn just a synonym for the Hucrele family, or is there more to it than that?

The bloodsworns run long distance trade through most of the known world and the Hucreles have this swath of territory pretty much under their thumb.

Basically, a large fealty-based organization based around trade monopolies instead of the possession of physical land.

There had been some talk of going via a triangle (ie directly to the end of the gorge) but to be honest taking the road is almost certainly better, since I'm sure the extra distance will be offset by the extra speed on the road. I will still leave simple markers, with more complex ones if we deviate from the road (and leading to the gully).

Since we can get our horses down the gully, I say we take that route. I believe originally the plan was to ride all the way to the end of the gulch, but this will be faster.

And assuming we go along the gulch, I will certainly check for tracks both at the end of the old road and at the gully before we descend.

Josh and Warclam: Winthrop's plan is to literally run out ahead of the group (being able to run faster than the horses). Haddon has also stated a desire to get first lookat stuff, and he's the person who can keep up with him (and, in fact, out-pace him) by riding Ashur (assuming my back-of-the-envelope calculations are correct and Ashur is, in fact, only carrying a light load).

Do you want to head out together? One of you yield to the other? Or get into an argument about it? Hash it out over in IC, if you'd like.

To be honest, Winthrop would probably stay with the party, since he's been contracted as a guide.  I just figured he'd be better able to track and leave trail signs and whatnot while afoot.  

Also, it bothers me that the wolf has as good a survival as I do, even though I'm 5 levels higher.  But that's munchkin talk, let's weave baskets!

Quote from: Fenyx4;603562In the table in the link Justin provided "Meals (per day) - Good    5 sp"

That's 'prepared & sold' meals. That includes labor and profit. I just want ingredients. I already employ the labor and I'm not interested in those profits.

Should be a pretty easy grocer transaction. It was in TSR at least. But that's not important anymore.

Besides, as in the wise words of Rick James, "I'm rich, bitch!"
:cool:

My internet totally cut out last night when I wanted to offer everyone the chance to go as a group for 12 miles the first day, then let the parley party ride out unencumbered to the goblin ravine and back with the comforting light of day the following day.

Oh well! :) Let's hope we all live!

Quote from: Opaopajr;603993That's 'prepared & sold' meals. That includes labor and profit. I just want ingredients. I already employ the labor and I'm not interested in those profits.

Right, which is why Justin did that roll, representing your skill in managing the inn (and in purchasing raw goods) and let you knock 40% off the price of the meals. That was what I understood, anyways.

Out of curiosity, who is in the parley party? I know Winthrop, Llewellyn, Jastian and Haddon are. Just before we left I think Jastian also invited Aminda to come, but Aminda never said if she accepted the offer.

Quote from: Josh;604016Right, which is why Justin did that roll, representing your skill in managing the inn (and in purchasing raw goods) and let you knock 40% off the price of the meals. That was what I understood, anyways.

That's correct.

QuoteOut of curiosity, who is in the parley party? I know Winthrop, Llewellyn, Jastian and Haddon are. Just before we left I think Jastian also invited Aminda to come, but Aminda never said if she accepted the offer.

Aminda is staying with the cart (confirmed through PM). The list you've got there is correct: It's what I posted here (http://www.therpgsite.com/showpost.php?p=603470&postcount=233) as my understanding of the plan and nobody corrected it. So, at this point, anyone wanting to join them is going to have to gallop after them.

Now that the party is split, I'm currently pondering the best way to keep clarity in the IC thread between the two groups. We'll see how it goes.

Adventurer Survival Rule Number 1:  Never Split the Party

Now that we've blown off that one, the others should be easy.

For the record, you're all going to die. :p

Quote from: Justin Alexander;603743Your speed is actually a little faster than an encumbered warhorse, which I just realized Llewellyn's is. So this is doubly true in both senses of the phrase: You're moving basically twice as fast as them along the road.

Lady Jastian's mount ("Paladin") also has moderate encumberance (The weight figure for her gear doesn't include those items listed as on the horse:  Barding, saddle, bedroll, saddlebags, spare clothing).  Together with her weight, everything weighs well over 300 lbs.

Quote from: Justin Alexander(I'm also hoping that the currently-completely-empty-but-possibly-with-two-barrels-no-one-has-paid-for cart will be stocked up so that I can kick both groups down the road.)

Here is Aminda's fill-up-the-cart shopping list!

                                           Quan....Cost.......Weight      
2 days of feed for each horse.........24.......6............240      
17 days of Rations for everyone......144.....72...........144   
3 days of perishable good meals......36......10.8.........36   
Donkeys*2 for Mika&Maggie............2........16...........-      
Riding saddles..............................2........20............-   
water skin...................................4........4.............16   
Bedroll........................................4........0.4...........20
Climber's kit.................................2........160..........20
wand of cure light wounds..............1........750         
...............................................Total....1033.2 gp...476 lbs      

Aminda doesn't have the gold for it. Can someone with the necessary funds sign off on it? Then we can get this show on the road!

Justin: Can the cart carry that? Is there a wand of cure light wounds available?

I'm about to throw my laptop w/ PCGen out the window... Screw this, I'm back to basic text files.

Immediate Transactions.

4.2gp = 7 day wages upfront Mika & Maggie, 3sp/day
4gp = +2 Barrel
8gp = +2 Saddlebag
16.2gp = Total  (I will subtract this immediately from my reserves.)

I already had 5 waterskins (one for each warhorse and donkey), so Maggie & Mika can borrow 2. Cudberct, Hasor, & Certh each have one -- let me know if they bring their own).
--------------------------------

This is my contribution to gear in caravan. I will post this in my PC link at the front, underneath everything else. The less I touch PCGen now the better.

There's plenty of carrying capacity in the cart left. If you are leaving anything to my cart responsibility, please inform ASAP. We should still have much space and weight left for passengers.

Gear in Caravan

Cudberct  36 lb
Explorer Outfit 8 lb, Leather Armor 15 lb, Buckler 5 lb, Longbow + 20 arrows (quivered) 3+3 lb, Dagger x2 (belted) 2lb, Signet Ring, Ring Feather Fall, Glove of Dex+2.

Dog guard (Patita)

Warhorse, light (Buñuelo) 59 lb
Saddle military 30 lb, Short Spear x3 (assume military saddle has spear basket) 9 lb, Barding leather 15 lb, Bit & Bridle 1lb, Waterskin 4 lb,

Warhorse light (Certh's?)  35 lb
Saddle military 30 lb, Bit & Bridle 1lb, Waterskin 4 lb

Warhorse light spare (Mika? Maggie?)  35 lb
Saddle military 30 lb, Bit & Bridle 1 lb, Waterskin 4 lb

Cart + 2 Donkeys  (*= in cart)
(106 + 16 + 5.5 + 580 + 112.5 + 19 + 70 + 77 + 17 = 1003 lb carried)

*Miscellanea loose  106 lb
Saddlebags x3 24 lb, Shield tower 45 lb, Shortspear x3 9 lb, 10' Pole  8 lb, Torches x20  20 lb

*Bucket (so liquid accidents don't get everywhere...) 16 lb
Oil x8  8 lb, Waterskin x2  8 lb

*Backpack 5.5 lb
Bedroll 5 lb, Lamp 1 lb, Chalk x2, Soap 1 lb, Signal Whistle, Mirror 0.5 lb, Peasant Outfit (pajamas) 2 lb,

*Barrel x2  580 lb (30lb barrel + 260 lb wgt (US 32.5 gal barrel, 8lb per gal = 260lb))
1 Water, 1 small beer (2%)

*Weapon/Armor/Tool Chest  112.5 lb (25lb chest + 86.5lb contents)
Banded Mail 35 lb, Shield heavy wood 10 lb, Longsword 4 lb, Morningstar 6 lb, Dagger x4 4 lb, Shovel 8 lb, Hammer 2 lb, Pick 10 lb, Whetstone 1 lb, Arrows (50) 7.5 lb, Lock 1 lb (lock attached, chest unlocked)

*Sack climbing 19 lb
Climber's Kit 5 lb, Grappling Hook 4 lb, Rope 50' hemp 10 lb,

*Sack dry rations 70 lb   (only buy 50, as I already have 20. 50 rations x 5sp = 25gp)
Dry Rations x70 70lb
(covers 14 days for 5 people: Cudberct, Certh, Hasor, Mika, & Maggie)

*Sack x2  perishable meals  77 lb    (2sp x 11 people x 7 days = 15.4gp)
Common meals/day x77  77 lb?

*Basket 17 lb
Pot iron 10 lb, Flour x5  5 lb, Sack x4  2 lb

Quote from: Fenyx4;604208Justin: Can the cart carry that?

The cart is drawn by two donkeys. Each donkey can drag 750 lbs. The cart weighs 200 lbs.

(750 lbs. x 2) - 200 lbs. = 1300 lbs.

Since the current plan is for Mika and Maggie to ride in the cart, that'll subtract another 300 lbs.

So let's give the cart 1,000 lbs. of effective carrying capacity.

QuoteIs there a wand of cure light wounds available?

It's under the town's GP limit, so yes. It's one of the foreign exotics that Hucrele's makes available.

CURRENT SUPPLY LIST: I've conflated the shopping lists to avoid duplication, but the current total weight is 1,347 lbs. If you kick both Maggie and Mika out of the cart, that means you're still 47 lbs. overweight.

So you need to (1) figure out what to leave behind and (2) probably figure out alternative transportation for Mika and Maggie. (It looks like you've currently got one spare horse, so the obvious solution would be buying another.)

The current list is in the first post of this thread.

No one with the money has okayed my list yet so the cart being overweight may be a  moot point.

PCGen SRD 3.5 gives this:

Cart
Type: goods. transportation. container. Wt.: 400 lbs. Size: M Cost: 15 GP
Container: 3120 lbs., Any
Source: Wizards of the Coast - Revised (v.3.5) System Reference Document, Equipment.rtf

and

Wagon
Type: goods. transportation. container. Wt.: 400 lbs. Size: M Cost: 35 GP
Container: 4000 lbs., Any
Source: Wizards of the Coast - Revised (v.3.5) System Reference Document, Equipment.rtf

I own both.

Further previous editions gave similar weight tolerances due to the nature of wheels making the load easier to transport. Drag weight is in reference to a travois.

Not my call, but putting it out there.

Quote from: Fenyx4;604208Here is Aminda's fill-up-the-cart shopping list!

I count eleven people in the party total: Lady Jastian, Gileus, Aminda, Sgt. Llewellyn, Winthrop, Cudberct, Hasor, Haddon, Certh, Mika, & Maggie.

I count ten equine mounts: Justice, Paladin, Barnaby, Aminda's Donkey, Gileus' Donkey, Buñuelo, Cudberct's spare Warhorses light x2, Cudberct's donkeys x2,
I count two canines: Ashur, Patita

                                           Quan....Cost.......Weight      
2 days of feed for each horse.........24.......6............240
The animals can graze but this is a good idea in case of Ashen Plain or arid ravine travel. Depends on JA's judgment call on cart carrying capacity.
      
17 days of Rations for everyone......144.....72...........144
Possibly a bit high, but sure. We're all going to have to OK it with Sgt. Llewellyn's deputy later. I'm calling for 14 days for the 5 people 'm immediately responsible for. You may edit lower or still call for it as reserves
   
3 days of perishable good meals......36......10.8.........36
I still count only 11 people. I chose Good meals for 11 people for 7 days at 40% off. Total comes to 15.4 GP. Trail rations for the same people/days comes to 38.5 GP. We have a professional cook at camp. There's simply no reason to pay more.
   
Donkeys*2 for Mika&Maggie............2........16...........
Riding saddles..............................2........20............-
Unnecessary. There's already a spare Warhorse light, and *should be* plenty of more weight space for the cart.
         
water skin...................................4........4.............16
I already own 5 waterskins. Hasor, Aminda, Haddon, and Lady Jastian already has a waterskin.

For some reason Sgt. Llewellyn, Winthrop, Gileus, and Certh do not.

They are welcome to borrow from my 4 extra. But that leaves 2 necessary for Mika & Maggie to come from town reserves.

We have a mobile basecamp with barrels of water & small beer, each 32.5 gallons of liquid. We should only need 1 waterskin per person.
   
Bedroll........................................4........0.4...........20
Climber's kit.................................2........160..........20
For whom? I don't know. I trust your judgment here, but Mika and Maggie are locals and in the militia -- it would be odd if they didn't have their own bedrolls.

I am already bringing a climber's kit, but it's a nice thought. Do we really need three altogether in the party?

wand of cure light wounds..............1........750
No comment. Sgt. Llewellyn will determine an OK for such an expense.
         
...............................................Total....1033.2 gp...476 lbs      

Aminda doesn't have the gold for it. Can someone with the necessary funds sign off on it? Then we can get this show on the road!

Justin: Can the cart carry that? Is there a wand of cure light wounds available?

I know I can be a pain, but I (and Cudberct, actually) don't mess around with supply caravans (except for D&D 4e, where you could scream yourself back to health!). That and he'd have direct familiarity with supply lines expectations.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633I count eleven people in the party total

Woops. I counted Haddon twice. some how had him in both the parley and the cart party.

Updated list:
Quan....Cost.......Weight
2 days of feed for each horse.........22.......5.5..........240
17 days of Rations for everyone......127.....63...........144
3 days of perishable good meals......33......9.9.........33
Donkey for last person...................1........8...........-
Riding saddles..............................1........10.. ..........-
water skin...................................4........4. ............16
Bedroll........................................4.. ......0.4...........20
Climber's kit.................................2........160.. ........20
wand of cure light wounds..............1........750
...............................................Total....1005.8 gp...436 lbs

Yes the horse feed is for travel across the Ashen Plain.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633The animals can graze but this is a good idea in case of Ashen Plain or arid ravine travel. Depends on JA's judgment call on cart carrying capacity.

Yup, it is for the Ashen Plain. As we don't know about the gully yet we gotta plan for that.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633Possibly a bit high, but sure. We're all going to have to OK it with Sgt. Llewellyn's deputy later. I'm calling for 14 days for the 5 people 'm immediately responsible for. You may edit lower or still call for it as reserves.

*shrugs* I'm just sticking with my earlier calculations.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633Unnecessary. There's already a spare Warhorse light, and *should be* plenty of more weight space for the cart.

I don't see any reason not to get everyone a mount. Let's us retreat at speed if necessary. More storage space. More room for the rescued.

For the waterskins a few extra just in case AND for the people we are rescuing.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633For whom? I don't know. I trust your judgment here, but Mika and Maggie are locals and in the militia -- it would be odd if they didn't have their own bedrolls.

The four people we are rescuing.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633I am already bringing a climber's kit, but it's a nice thought. Do we really need three altogether in the party?

Spares and for the ability to have three people climb at the same time. Seems handy to have in a ravine.

Wand:

Quote from: Opaopajr;604633No comment. Sgt. Llewellyn will determine an OK for such an expense.

I'm sticking this IC text here as what to bring would have been hashed out so long ago. Don't want to interrupt the IC thread with it.

"I fear I only have the strength to ask the gods to mend wounds a few times per day. And most of that is only good for stubbed toes. With such a large group if we get into any serious skirmish we'll be needing more healing."

Quote from: Fenyx4;604897I don't see any reason not to get everyone a mount. Let's us retreat at speed if necessary. More storage space. More room for the rescued.

A donkey still only moves at the speed of a human. Either the lost party has zero mounts and are wounded and cannot run, or they have their mounts and/or can run. Only 1/3 situations makes it worthwhile. And in that situation a donkey is just as slow. Humans can't outrun many natural animals anyways. There's no real reason for it.

Mounts (carrying load)  -- Per Hour  --  Per Day
Donkey or mule        --     3 miles   --  24 miles
Donkey (51-150 lb.)    --   2 miles  --   16 miles
Mule (231-690 lb.)      --   2 miles   --  16 miles

Again, that's an expense for Sgt. Llewellyn to make, since I'm not covering hardly any of these expenditures.

Quote from: Fenyx4;604897For the waterskins a few extra just in case AND for the people we are rescuing.

Unless we're worried about cold sores and hepatitis, or the party scattering to the four winds away from the cart into terra incognita, it doesn't make any sense again. This is a rescue mission, I have no intent to explore beyond returning the lost back to Oakhurst right now.

Quote from: Fenyx4;604897[bedrolls for] The four people we are rescuing.

In that case a tent would be best. Again, they either have their mounts and gear, including bedrolls, or they don't are in dire straits and need to be rushed back. If the latter, I'm sure I and a few others can sleep in the cart or on the dirt for a few days during our return.

Again, it's up to Sgt. Llewellyn to make such a town expenditure.

Quote from: Fenyx4;604897Spares and for the ability to have three people climb at the same time. Seems handy to have in a ravine.

Perhaps, but a third won't do all that much. Racing up and down the ravine will be suicide for most in the party, so extra kits won't get all of us up faster or safer -- and we're not doing coordinated acrobatics. Again, maybe useful, but not my place to decide for expenditure.

Lady Jastian was suggesting that we leave the road about 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 miles short of the gorge, depending on how rough the terrain is and the most likely places for ambush.  If we cut away too soon, we'll spend too much time stomping through the woods, as has been noted in the IC thread.

Aw, man. I go away for a day to celebrate my birthday party and everything turns into an Excel spreadsheet.

Quote from: Opaopajr;604626Cart
Type: goods. transportation. container. Wt.: 400 lbs. Size: M Cost: 15 GP
Container: 3120 lbs., Any
Source: Wizards of the Coast - Revised (v.3.5) System Reference Document, Equipment.rtf

Unfortunately, I have no idea where PCGen is pulling its figures.

(1) The SRD file they're referencing doesn't say anything about how much a cart can carry. It does, however, say that a cart weighs 200 lbs., so PCGen is just flat-out wrong on one stat and appears to be making the other one up.

(2) The 3.5 PHB agrees with those figures: 15 gp, weight 200 lbs.

(3) The 3.0 PHB actually did have a Holds/Carries column, though. It gives a cart a 1/2 ton capacity. (That would be 1,000 lbs.)

(4) Doing a little further research, the Arms & Equipment Guide offers the following formula: Calculate the total weight of a drawn vehicle, then divide by 4 if it's a wheeled vehicle. Divide the resulting pull weight evenly among the dray creatures. But this is limited to the load of the dray creatures, not the amount they can drag.

Reversing that math we can see that:

- 150 lbs. (heavy load for a donkey)
- 150 lbs. x 2 donkeys = 300 lbs. maximum pull weight
- 300 lbs. x 4 = 1,200 lbs. maximum weight
- 1,200 lbs. - 200 lbs (weight of cart) = 1,000 lbs.

Which superficially matches the figure given in the 3.0 PHB, but that's mostly coincidence because the cart in the 3.0 PHB is designed for a single dray donkey.

All right, let me boil all that conflicting information down like this. (I'm giving preference to the 3.0 PHB figures for ease of use, but interpolating some other options for flexibility.) You have three vehicles available to you:

(1) VILLAGE CART - 1 DONKEY - 1,000 LB. CARRYING CAPACITY
(2) CUDBERCT'S CART - 2 DONKEYS - 1,300 LB. CARRYING CAPACITY
(3) CUDBERCT'S WAGON - 2 LIGHT HORSES - 3,000 LB. CARRYING CAPACITY
(4) CUDBERCT'S WAGON - 2 HEAVY HORSES - 4,000 LB. CARRYING CAPACITY

(The advantage of the light horses pulling the wagon will be that you move faster. They can't pull the cart because the hitch is designed for donkeys.)

Under this scenario, Cudberct's cart now costs 25 gp and weighs 300 lbs. (being of non-standard double-wide construction.) If you opt to go with horses, those will need to be paid and accounted for since they haven't been previously purchased. (The donkeys will just have to stay in the stable.)

The good news: If you go with a horse-drawn wagon, your speed will improve if the people currently riding donkeys ditch the donkeys and hitch a ride in the wagon. In fact, you might end up going much faster (as I'll use the A&E figures to determine whether or not the dray creatures are operating under load or not).

CUDBERCT ROLL 3 + HANDLE ANIMAL 7 = 9

The bad news: Cudberct didn't realize that. Which means, as Cudberct and Aminda's voices rise higher and higher, that Hasor, not knowing what the supply plans were,

HASOR ROLL 16 + HANDLE ANIMAL 4 = 20

suddenly realizes with a sickening drop in his stomach that he has readied the wrong vehicle.

Take that to the IC if you like. I'm going to see if I can figure out what's going on with the actual equipment lists.

I'm limiting perishable food to 5 days. If you want to carry more than that, I make no guarantees on how it will keep. FYI.

CUDBERCT'S SUPPLIES

Rations (70 days) - 70 lbs.
Perishable Food (55 days) = 55 lbs.
Saddlebags (3) - 24 lbs.
Tower Shield - 45 lbs.
Shortspear (3) - 9 lbs.
10' Pole - 8 lbs.
Torches (20) - 20 lbs.
Bucket - 16 lbs.
Oil (8) - 8 lbs.
Water Skins (2) - 16 lbs.
Barrel of Water - 290 lbs.
Barrel of Wine - 290 lbs.
Backpack* - 5.5 lbs. + 9.5 lbs.
Locked Chest** - 25 lbs. + 88.5 lbs.
Climbing Sack*** - 0.5 lbs. + 34 lbs.
Basket**** - 1 lb. + 17 lbs.

* Bedroll (5 lbs.), Lamp (1 lb.), Chalk (x2), Soap (1 lb.), Signal Whistle, Mirror (0.5 lbs.), Peasant Pajamas (2 lb.)

** Banded Mail (35 lbs.), Heavy Wooden Shield (10 lbs.), Longsword (4 lbs.), Morningstar (6 lbs.), Dagger (x4, 4 lbs.), Shovel (8 lbs.), Hammer (2 lbs.), Pick (10 lbs.), Whetstone (1 lb.), Arrows (x50, 7.5 lbs.), Lock (1 lb.)

*** Climber's Kit (x2, 20 lbs.), Grappling Hook (4 lbs.), Hemp Rope (50', 10 lbs.)

**** Iron Pot (10 lbs.), Flour (x5, 5 lbs.), Sacks (x4, 2 lbs.)

TOTAL WEIGHT: 1,032 lbs.

AMINDA'S SUPPLEMENTS

Horse Feed (22 days) - 220 lbs.
Rations (74 days) - 74 lbs.
Water Skins (2) - 16 lbs.
Bedroll (4) - 20 lbs.
Wand of Cure Light Wounds

TOTAL ADDITIONAL WEIGHT: 330 lbs.

CONCLUSIONS

(1) If you only haul Cudberct's supplies, he's currently 32 pounds overweight for a single-donkey cart.

(2) If you bring all of these supplies, you're currently 62 pounds overweight for a two-donkey cart.

(3) If you go with either of the wagon options, you're fine-and-dandy. And probably will remain that way even if people abandon their mounts and ride in the wagon.

(4) My understanding is that the plan was to load the people you're going to rescue into the cart/wagon for the trip back. Bear in mind that they also have weight.

(5) Llewellyn signed off on helping out with the cost of supplies. So I don't think cost is an issue.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;605155Lady Jastian was suggesting that we leave the road about 1 1/2 to 2 1/2 miles short of the gorge, depending on how rough the terrain is and the most likely places for ambush.  If we cut away too soon, we'll spend too much time stomping through the woods, as has been noted in the IC thread.

We were stopped at the edge of the forest, so I assumed that was the start of the woods stomping. I don't know exactly how big the forest is, which is why I asked about timeline. But our speed has massively dropped since I think our base speed has gone from 40 to 20 and I'm sure the woods offer all sorts of penalties.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;605186Aw, man. I go away for a day to celebrate my birthday party and everything turns into an Excel spreadsheet.

Happy birthday!

Happy birthday!  It also happens to be my birthday today!

It is my father-in-law's birthday too! (okay that isn't quite as relevant...)

Happy birthday Justin and Tom!

Sorry I didn't post for a while, it was Real Life's fault.  I am reading now and will post IC any second!

Wow, I don't think we need two months worth of supplies, do we?  The canyon is like 20mi from town or something.  Worst case scenario, we run low on food, so we make camp by the gulch while someone runs back to town with the cart.  I guess I didn't notice until the spreadsheet up there was posted how overboard the supplies have gotten.  Maybe two weeks at the absolute most is all we should need.

I've found the supply list a little silly from the get go, but I assumed they were having fun. Heck, taking ten on survival Winthrop can provide supplies as he goes for himself plus six others, while still moving just as fast as the horses. But he's a crazy woodsman and happy to live on venison and rations.

That's positively ludicrous. All you had to do was GM what the carrying capacity of the cart and wagon beforehand and then retroactively let my character know. The rolls are unnecessary, especially as we as a group are not going to let such a glaring error proceed without comment.

If I am planning to bring people back I should know how much weight either cart or wagon can take. If I knew how much both my wagon and cart can take, and having an INT 6 shouldn't factor as I do have eyes and bought the things to transport goods for my business (like barrels, of which my roll was somehow good enough for that) -- and I have Hasor and Ermengilda and others around who would also know the difference between the two weights -- there's absolutely zero reason for the roll.

Since we're running with these weight rules, then obviously I would have selected the wagon. Four wounded people, possibly with armor and gear, would roughly be a ton unto themselves, and supplies would add to that. Just ignore all this silliness and rolls and just say it's a wagon. It was a late GM judgment call and "oops" retcon it to make sense. Hell, I even have all the supplies to swap it out (bought because tragically I anticipated such 3e problems...).

Oh, and happy birthday. :)

Okay, final word on this ludicrous cart situation:

Problem #1: Is the overloading of the cart. This is only a problem because Aminda's additional supplies push the cart over limit. So there's no way Cudberct could have retroactively known Aminda was going to push the cart over its weight limit.

I'm sorry that you relied on a source of information directly contradicted by RAW, but even if we assume that Cudberct "should've known" (although the dice indicate otherwise) it's really irrelevant to the source of the problem here.

Problem #2: Is the fact that Cudberct proposed splitting the party so that he could use a donkey-pulled cart instead of a horse-pulled wagon that would have moved at the same speed the parley group is currently moving at. And that has absolutely nothing to do with the semi-gray area of vehicular encumbrance loads and everything to do with movement rates.

If this had come up earlier, I might have allowed the retcon. But by the time it was actually mentioned the parley group was already gone and a number of distinct actions had been taken based on that reality.

Important lesson here, though: I am not going to be micromanaging your characters. I will not be playing your characters for you. The choices you make are the choices you make. If you choose to use Power Attack even though the math says you shouldn't, that's your choice. If you choose to go through a door without checking it for traps, that's your choice. And if you decide to pull your cart out of the stable instead of your wagon while proposing to split the party because the cart is too slow, that's also your choice.

Problem #3: We're still talking about this. Which, at this point, I can only interpret as a functional impasse in which the characters are unable to resolve their differences.

MOVING FORWARD

The argument between Cudberct and Aminda burns hot and furious for awhile until he drops the announcement that he has a wagon. Then things just get hotter. Aminda, empowered by Llewellyn's chit, buys the supplies she feels the party needs. Hasor retreats to the stables to get the wagon hitched to two light horses.

HELPING WITH THE WAGON: Anyone who wants to help hitch the horses to the wagon can say so between now and whatever time I post tomorrow. I'll assume everyone is pitching in to help load unless someone says otherwise.

LLEWELLYN: Aminda has spent 792 gp, 5 sp of your money. Please note this on your character sheet and post an acknowledgment here.

CUDBERCT: I'm assuming your pulling supplies from your character's possessions list. For all additional supplies not listed there, the total cost is 141 gp, 7 sp (after the established discount, which I also applied to a few other items that it seemed appropriate for). You are also the owner of two additional light horses which pull the wagon, which is an additional 150 gp. Please subtract these totals from your character sheet and post an acknowledgment here.

WAGON PARTY TRAVELING ARRANGEMENTS: Cudberct, Certh, and Gileus are all riding light warhorses belonging to Cudberct. Hasor is riding his light horse. Mika, Maggie, and Aminda are riding in the wagon.

SUPPLY WAGON: The final list of goods in the supply wagon has been posted to the first post in this thread. If anyone wants to ADD anything to it, you've got until tomorrow. (There are still several hundred pounds of encumbrance left over, so you should have plenty of room unless you go completely crazy.)

Quote from: Justin Alexander;606371LLEWELLYN: Aminda has spent 792 gp, 5 sp of your money. Please note this on your character sheet and post an acknowledgment here.

Roger that!

QuoteProblem #1: Is the overloading of the cart. This is only a  problem because Aminda's additional supplies push the cart over limit.  So there's no way Cudberct could have retroactively known Aminda was  going to push the cart over its weight limit.

My bad, I probably shouldn't have brought that up at this point.  I will keep my nose out of it hereafter, sorry about that.

From the IC Thread:

Quote from: Josh;606625Sir Wulf... are you rolling and adjudicating the results of the rolls for yourself?  I didn't think that was how it worked.  Or does Justin have the ability to edit our posts?

I was rolling and posting those rolls myself, figuring that would save time.  I haven't done anything likely to have substantial impact on the game, so I didn't see any reason to delay things.  

If I anticipate that something might be important or contentious, I'll refer it for Justin's adjudication.  If I overreach when posting, Justin can let me know and I'll amend my post.

Quote from: Sir Wulf;606835I was rolling and posting those rolls myself, figuring that would save time.  I haven't done anything likely to have substantial impact on the game, so I didn't see any reason to delay things.  

I had the same first reaction Josh did, but then I saw the actual rolls and followed the same basic thought process you did: The rolls were being used to inform roleplaying and didn't have much function or impact beyond that, so it made sense to just "consult the oracle" directly and roleplay off it.

I don't feel the need to really elaborate specific guidelines beyond that: If you're looking to affect the game world, lemme take it. If you're just trying to figure out how your character is approaching a particular situation, I'm fine with you just doing it. (The old "lemme make an Intelligence check to see if I'm smart enough to figure this out" thing.) When in doubt, default to me handling the check.

EDIT: Just saw the most recent one. That's getting into the gray area for me: Probably fine in this particular circumstance, but let's toss those my direction in the future.

REGARDING THE SUPPLY CARAVAN

With the light horses pulling the wagon, the supply caravan will be traveling 24 miles per day along the road, as opposed to the parley group which is traveling 21 miles per day.

So while the parley group is currently expecting the supply caravan to be a full day behind them, the supply caravan will actually be arriving at the broken bridge about an hour after the parley group.

Uh, remember Justin, outside of d20SRD.org and PCGen, you are my eyes and ears to 3e knowledge. I don't have the books at home, remember.

Further, as GM you are the eyes and ears of my setting knowledge. Let us know beforehand what are hard (non-negotiable) facts and we can avoid most of this.

Though I made the effort for Dern Nacre the healer to come talk to us, and anticipated a longer conversation to supplies planning, you are free as the GM not to engage in such and cut it off short. However when big questions that can only be supplied by GM rulings come up I do expect to be given a heads up. Cutting off the confab session early left several gaping holes in PC information, something anticipation could have helped (especially knowing now PCGen is not reliable).

Basically I don't like playing "guess what I'm thinking" and have it screw up coordination.

So, what's the 141.7 gp breakdown? I already made expense adjustments on my sheet in red; itemized I can avoid double counting.

Also why 150 gp for two extra light horses? And why are the donkeys disappearing (wouldn't their retained inclusion be the least amount of disruption)? Further water and beer weight will be rapidly peed away among eleven people, so dumping everyone in the wagon is still a valid option. Please explain the judgment call here.

(Edit: And as a note the warhorses will be haltered to the wagon. They are the least likely to spook in battle.)

Finally, going with your assumed caravan, what's our current encumbrance out of 3000 lbs. wagon?

Quote from: Sir Wulf;606835From the IC Thread:

I was rolling and posting those rolls myself, figuring that would save time.  I haven't done anything likely to have substantial impact on the game, so I didn't see any reason to delay things.  

If I anticipate that something might be important or contentious, I'll refer it for Justin's adjudication.  If I overreach when posting, Justin can let me know and I'll amend my post.

Yeah, for reference the first time I saw it I assumed that it was just flavor rolling.  The most recent, the role directly contradicted the details that I had gotten in a PM (granted, they were likely false data as the roll was kind of bad).  Also, I totally missed Justin's line when first describing the tracks "Almost as if someone were wearing tiny slippers made from bound twigs or sticks" and so I thought you completely made that up.  Re-reading, I realize that I am silly.

Carry on!

I'm in the middle of the Midwest blizzard and most of today was spent shoveling snow. I'll be checking in tomorrow for a proper update.

I am now the proud owner of two more light horses, for 150 GP. I will deduct them together after itemization.

Still need an itemized breakdown of 141.7gp

Previous items:

Quote from: Opaopajr;604336Immediate Transactions.

4.2gp = 7 day wages upfront Mika & Maggie, 3sp/day
4gp = +2 Barrel
8gp = +2 Saddlebag
16.2gp = Total  (I will subtract this immediately from my reserves.)

I already had 5 waterskins (one for each warhorse and donkey), so Maggie & Mika can borrow 2. Cudberct, Hasor, & Certh each have one -- let me know if they bring their own).
--------------------------------

Small beer is/was usually cheaper than ale (tastes great! less filling!... more peeing!), but d20srd.org & PHB 3.5 only has Ale 2 sp/gal.

A 260 lb barrel divided by 8 lb. gallons = 32.5 gal.
32.5 gal times 0.2 gp/gal (2 silver) = 6.5 gp
Shall I take the 40% (on the house cost) off of 6.5 gp?

Water can come from the town well, as we can see in the town picture (unless it's owned by someone).

141.7 minus 16.2 = 125.5 gp to be itemized.

Hope you get unburied from the snow!

Uh, is Justin OK? Is he still buried under snow?

As far as I know, the midwest has been getting slammed by some nasty winter weather for awhile now. I hope he's ok, but there's not much we can do until he finds time to check in again.

Howdy, folks. I will hopefully be back shortly. I have gotten hammered by work on a business trip and I've only got intermittent internet access.

Hopefully y'all can be patient a little longer until I can get everything straightened out.

Quote from: Justin Alexander;610255Howdy, folks. I will hopefully be back shortly. I have gotten hammered by work on a business trip and I've only got intermittent internet access.

Hopefully y'all can be patient a little longer until I can get everything straightened out.

Cool with me, I was just hoping I wasn't holding up the game.  :)

My character risks death from ennui. Let's see if he lives. I roll to save...
:popcorn:

Howdy, folks.

I'm just dropping a quick line to apologize for letting this game die. Some of you who follow my blog know that things have basically sucked for me, but I know you were all very excited about this and I blew it.

So... apologies for that.

To head off potential inquiries: I'm not going to be trying to re-start things. My life is still basically a chaotic mess right now and there's other things which I'm afraid are more demanding of my attention at the moment.

(If any of you are going to be at GenCon this year, though, you might be able to talk me into running it as a pick-up game. Ping me a PM in July and we'll see what happens.)