Quote from: Brad on March 02, 2021, 03:15:11 PM
How is a known wife beater suing Gencon for not allowing him to attend because he poses a threat to attendees? #believeallwomen

No one, not one single person,  is afraid Zak is going to beat them up in public at Gencon. This "I don't feel safe" bs is just a crybully tactic that people use because they know people in positions of authority  (petty though those positions may be) will act on it.

Quote from: Shasarak on March 02, 2021, 04:42:12 PM
What about real threats like Drump?

Please tell me at least he has been banned.

I would not doubt Gencion banned Trump from attending after the MSM branded him a Nazi rapist. And by not doubt I am not being hyperbolic...they have SJW brownie points to get.

Quote from: Mjollnir on March 02, 2021, 06:28:12 PM
No one, not one single person,  is afraid Zak is going to beat them up in public at Gencon. This "I don't feel safe" bs is just a crybully tactic that people use because they know people in positions of authority  (petty though those positions may be) will act on it.

Yeah, I was just hoping to trigger that jackass because when he was in bed with these retards he had no issue with them doing it to people he hated. Eventually everyone is an enemy of the Marxists. Also, I doubt Zak could actually beat anyone up, anyway, so there's that.

Serious question: does anyone have the number of LEGITIMATE assaults that have ever taken place at Gencon? I mean actual punches thrown, not "creepster looked at me" horseshit. Besides that quartering dude I cannot think of any, and Gencon seemed to support his being assaulted, ironically enough.

This thread made me google "mandy muse's ass". I regret NOTHING!

I'm not a big fan of Zak. Especially after his response to me re. Demon City (considering I'm a backer).

That being said... HELL yeah!

I'm delighted. I hope Gen Con get what they deserve. People need to know that you can't just go around talking shit (that could damage someone's livelihood) and banning them without due process AKA - proof.

As much as I hate what GenCon has become, I'm going to have to throw cold water on this.  Sorry.

Zak's going to lose. He just is. He's not a protected class, therefore under US Law GenCon have every right to bar him from attendance. Furthermore, we do not want to create a precedent where someone can sue their way into a private gathering.  Imagine if Pundit created his own Con and then Anita Sarkeesian bullied her way into getting a panel by threatening a lawsuit.

Don't come at me with headlines about Universities. Those are Publicly funded institutions. GenCon is not.

It's infuriating, but these people have won.  The Wokesters run everything now. The only possible victory is to succeed in spite of them.

Quote from: Torque2100 on March 03, 2021, 09:40:00 AM
Imagine if Pundit created his own Con and then Anita Sarkeesian bullied her way into getting a panel by threatening a lawsuit.

A) she wouldn't have to bully her way in because she'd be allowed to have a panel if she wants one, and
B) she'd never do it because she wouldn't be given the protection she's used to at other cons and would have to hear people say "mean things" to and about her.

Personally I think it'd be highly amusing for a Libertarian minded Con to exist and expect grown ups to have a "sticks and stones" attitude.

Quote from: Torque2100 on March 03, 2021, 09:40:00 AM
As much as I hate what GenCon has become, I'm going to have to throw cold water on this.  Sorry.

But its more then just about access to the venue per se. If it was just on that alone, then it would be very hard to sue a private company I would assume? Like the way drivthru can ban certain people's material, and you can't really do anything about it. Despite them having a near monopoly.

Quote from: Torque2100 on March 03, 2021, 09:40:00 AM
As much as I hate what GenCon has become, I'm going to have to throw cold water on this.  Sorry.

Zak's going to lose. He just is. He's not a protected class, therefore under US Law GenCon have every right to bar him from attendance. Furthermore, we do not want to create a precedent where someone can sue their way into a private gathering.  Imagine if Pundit created his own Con and then Anita Sarkeesian bullied her way into getting a panel by threatening a lawsuit.

Don't come at me with headlines about Universities. Those are Publicly funded institutions. GenCon is not.

It's infuriating, but these people have won.  The Wokesters run everything now. The only possible victory is to succeed in spite of them.

A couple years ago I would've agreed. But Nick Sandmann has already gotten settlements from two of the defendants in his lawsuit (WaPo and CNN). The rest of his lawsuit continues to grind through the courts.

'Protected class' means sweet fuck-all as far as defamation goes. There are really only two ironclad defenses: one is the truth, and the other is basically 'this person's character is so bad that it's impossible to defame them further'. Well, three, but there are limits to how much shit you can talk about public figures.

If GenCon had simply barred him without or at least with minimal comment, they'd have been in the clear. But by chasing woke points and virtue signaling, they've opened themselves up to this.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on March 03, 2021, 10:33:40 AM
If GenCon had simply barred him without or at least with minimal comment, they'd have been in the clear. But by chasing woke points and virtue signaling, they've opened themselves up to this.

Exactly!

Quote from: Torque2100 on March 03, 2021, 09:40:00 AM
As much as I hate what GenCon has become, I'm going to have to throw cold water on this.  Sorry.

Zak's going to lose. He just is. He's not a protected class, therefore under US Law GenCon have every right to bar him from attendance. Furthermore, we do not want to create a precedent where someone can sue their way into a private gathering.  Imagine if Pundit created his own Con and then Anita Sarkeesian bullied her way into getting a panel by threatening a lawsuit.

If you read the complaint, he's suing primarily for the public statements they made around the ban, not the ban itself.  They have the right to bar him from attendance, they do not have the right to libel him on very public platforms to an audience primarily made up of his clients and customers.

Quote from: Mjollnir on March 02, 2021, 06:28:12 PM

Quote from: Brad on March 02, 2021, 03:15:11 PM
How is a known wife beater suing Gencon for not allowing him to attend because he poses a threat to attendees? #believeallwomen

No one, not one single person,  is afraid Zak is going to beat them up in public at Gencon. This "I don't feel safe" bs is just a crybully tactic that people use because they know people in positions of authority  (petty though those positions may be) will act on it.

I agree.

In my very first job, I worked security at a Sears (in the 80s). One of our cash register employees went insane. That's not a phrase I am using lightly - she went nuts. She was complaining to security that we were aiming invisible lasers at her head to read her thoughts, and making her hear voices.

Back then, Sears had no decent HR department to deal with this sort of thing, or at least my location didn't. In security we all wanted her gone because we thought she was gong to say something like that to customers, and was a total lose canon.

But we also knew she was harmless, physically speaking. She wouldn't hurt a fly. She just had a serious mental disease.

So one day she said something which was sexually harassing in nature to me, yelling at me something like "You know you want a piece of this ass. That's why you keep spying on me, because you want a piece of this ass. Well come on! You're a little young for me but I'll fuck you."

It was laughable, and I was not intimidated by it at all. But believe it or not, that alone was STILL probably not enough to get her fired at the time from Sears. Because sexual harassment against a man was not something they knew how to deal with.

But that was the opportunity to get rid of her for the department. So, when I reported it I told HR I felt afraid and was concerned she might attack me or others.

And those were the magic words, the next day she was put on indefinite leave.

Yes. Nobody thinks Zak is going to harm anyone. They just are using it as an excuse to not deal with the other issues they have with him which are not cleanly about any convention rules but are purely about public relations.

Quote from: Torque2100 on March 03, 2021, 09:40:00 AM
As much as I hate what GenCon has become, I'm going to have to throw cold water on this.  Sorry.

Zak's going to lose. He just is. He's not a protected class, therefore under US Law GenCon have every right to bar him from attendance.

I think it will go the same way. But they might lose on lesser counts instead of the main venue denial angle.

Same as the folks making a certain adult RPG could not likely win against BGG for covertly censoring them. But they might win on counts of defamation or something else.

I won't pretend to understand the vagaries of the legal system nor will I speculate on outcome, but I find the situation interesting none the less.

What we are seeing is people getting fed up with WOTCs incessant stupid and starting to fight back. This is now the 3rd lawsuit against them, or involving them in the last year or so that I can recall.

Quote from: Omega on March 04, 2021, 05:21:57 AM
What we are seeing is people getting fed up with WOTCs incessant stupid and starting to fight back. This is now the 3rd lawsuit against them, or involving them in the last year or so that I can recall.

Peter Adkison & Gencon totally separate from WoTC for what, 20 years now?