Try the Norse elves from Poul Anderson's "Broken Sword."

They were just plain motherfuckers.

"Elves are wonderful. They provoke wonder.
Elves are marvellous. They cause marvels.
Elves are fantastic. They create fantasies.
Elves are glamorous. They project glamour.
Elves are enchanting. They weave enchantment.
Elves are terrific. They beget terror.
The thing about words is that meanings can twist just like a snake, and if you want to find snakes look for them behind words that have changed their meaning.
No one ever said elves are nice.
Elves are bad."

-- Terry Pratchett

Quote from: Majus;876151"Elves are bad."

Don't SAY that! Elves are good. Of course they are good. Elves are very good.

As a kid, my formative experience with elves was that they make toys and cookies.  Still have a hard time taking them seriously.  

Maybe it would have helped if elves were in Bulfinch.

Quote from: markfitz;875891Yeah I think Asen does a pretty good demolition job here ... I've just been rereading all of the Conan stories, and while I was mentioning earlier that I find his motivation to be great inspiration for D&D, the ability of the system to actually emulate his antics is very much in doubt. In any case, sometimes I just say D&D around here because it's the lingua franca, but in terms of games I GM, it's all RuneQuest these days.

And really, when it comes to playing Swords & Sorcery, RQ is the way to go. To be honest, class and level just don't cut it when you're trying to emulate Conan. As demonstrated above, Conan as Fighter doesn't really capture his abilities, never mind as Barbarian. I think you'd have to go the multi-class route, and even go so far as something as outré as Barbarian/Arcane Trickster or something to get close, if that were allowed. Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser equally need several classes to cover them, and for my money Fighter/Sorcerer doesn't even do Elric justice. You need pacts, Passions, and the ability to learn spells from different sources, to summon and bind demons, to be an astonishing swordsman as well as a sneaky bastard and speak several ancient and modern languages to boot. May as well go the whole hog and use a system actually designed for this.

Yes. I'd add Savage Worlds and BoL as options for S&S, but RQ6 would be my choice, in all likelyhood:).

Quote from: Christopher Brady;875934Exactly, which means he was never a Thief, nor a Rogue.  Congrats, you figured it out.  He got a great roll on his Stealth check, and did it untrained!

Your entire argument just fell apart.  But stick to your labels.

He keeps getting those rolls during the whole story. And in other stories as well.
I got it, your idea of Conan is "strong Commoner that persistantly gets good rolls while fighting"! It's just not my idea of the character.

Quote from: Omega;876089Keep struggling. This is entertaining to watch the latest addition to the village idiot brigade practicing.

I agree it's entertaining:). Glad the mirror in front of you is showing the new village idiot addition well;).

QuoteAnd since you are so obsessed with Black River

No, it was just easiest to keep pulling examples from it when I opened it.
And no, Conan is closer to a ranger, but he puts on full plate as soon as he can - that is, when a princess provides it, after naming him commander of her army by a god's advice. That's not exactly a ranger.

QuoteAs for moving quietly in chain. So? PCs move quietly in full plate, or at least try to, as a matter of course in D&D. In fact the slow movement rate in a dungeon is because the PCs are all sneaking to one degree or another.

PCs try to...and only manage something close to quiet when there isn't anyone around in the same room. Good luck persuading your GM to allow you sneaking in full plate next to a good forester!
And Picts are born foresters in Conan stories;).

But that discussion is indeed repetitive. So I'm planning to discontinue it.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;876119Try the Norse elves from Poul Anderson's "Broken Sword."

They were just plain motherfuckers.

Well, yeah. Those would be fun.
Also, they'd make great Elric-style additions to an S&S party.

Quote from: Majus;876151"Elves are wonderful. They provoke wonder.
Elves are marvellous. They cause marvels.
Elves are fantastic. They create fantasies.
Elves are glamorous. They project glamour.
Elves are enchanting. They weave enchantment.
Elves are terrific. They beget terror.
The thing about words is that meanings can twist just like a snake, and if you want to find snakes look for them behind words that have changed their meaning.
No one ever said elves are nice.
Elves are bad."

-- Terry Pratchett

Those are my kind of elves, too.
Though they look nice...right until you get to know them;)!

Quote from: Old One Eye;876167As a kid, my formative experience with elves was that they make toys and cookies.  Still have a hard time taking them seriously.  

Maybe it would have helped if elves were in Bulfinch.

They are. Try Project Gutenberg, Chapter XL.

QuoteTHE ELVES

The Edda mentions another class of beings, inferior to the gods, but still possessed of great power; these were called Elves. The white spirits, or Elves of Light, were exceedingly fair, more brilliant than the sun, and clad in garments of a delicate and transparent texture. They loved the light, were kindly disposed to mankind, and generally appeared as fair and lovely children. Their country was called Alfheim, and was the domain of Freyr, the god of the sun, in whose light they were always sporting.

The Black or Night Elves were a different kind of creatures. Ugly, long-nosed dwarfs, of a dirty brown color, they appeared only at night, for they avoided the sun as their most deadly enemy, because whenever his beams fell upon any of them they changed them immediately into stones. Their language was the echo of solitudes, and their dwelling-places subterranean caves and clefts. They were supposed to have come into existence as maggots produced by the decaying flesh of Ymir's body, and were afterwards endowed by the gods with a human form and great understanding. They were particularly distinguished for a knowledge of the mysterious powers of nature, and for the runes which they carved and explained. They were the most skilful artificers of all created beings, and worked in metals and in wood. Among their most noted works were Thor's hammer, and the ship "Skidbladnir," which they gave to Freyr, and which was so large that it could contain all the deities with their war and household implements, but so skillfully was it wrought that when folded together it could be put into a side pocket.

See? You can struggle. Keep practicing.

Quote from: AsenRG;876172I agree it's entertaining:). Glad the mirror in front of you is showing the new village idiot addition well;).


No, it was just easiest to keep pulling examples from it when I opened it.
And no, Conan is closer to a ranger, but he puts on full plate as soon as he can - that is, when a princess provides it, after naming him commander of her army by a god's advice. That's not exactly a ranger.

Funny. I said maps closer to a ranger. I didnt say he maps exactly to a ranger. And the AD&D ranger could wear any type of armour and they can sneak up on people in any type of armour. They do not have the Thief's limitation.

And yet again you miss the point that Conan is NOT D&D. D&D is NOT Conan.

Quote from: Omega;876090Tiefling. Was a planescape race. Half human half demon or devil. A Cambion by any other name. EG: A Half-Demon/devil. This was 2e where TSR was trying to be "non-Satanic" by renaming all the demonic stuff. And probably market branding.

For some reason WOTC likes them alot and keeps adding them as a PC race with some odd background. Descended of a race cursed. Descended of a race that interbred, child of a human and infernal pairing, etc. Much like the Dragonborn have had theire backgrounds redone about every edition. Humans metamorphed, Human and dragon offspring, deformed dragon offspring, blessed dragon offspring, descended from one of the above, and so on.

WOTC probably keeps doing that because fuckloads of D&D players like to play Tiefling characters.

Quote from: Bren;876162Don't SAY that! Elves are good. Of course they are good. Elves are very good.

Here, have a horseshoe.

"Elves making toys?  Nobody'd give an Elf a chisel, unless you want him to carve his initials in your forehead."

-- Hogfather

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;876119Try the Norse elves from Poul Anderson's "Broken Sword."

They were just plain motherfuckers.

Beating and raping a troll in order to beget a changeling and kidnap a human baby...

Sounds like something out of a Swords & Sorcery version of True Detective.

Quote from: Bren;876162Don't SAY that! Elves are good. Of course they are good. Elves are very good.

*Talks to the camera, eyes focused off slightly to one side* Yes, comrade Bren is quite right. I was completely and foolishly mistaken. I wish to apologise for any confusion that I may have created. Elves are entirely fictional and are synonymous with good things, like Father Christmas and nursery rhymes. Ha. Ha. Ha. Please ignore anything else I say.

Just keep in mind that álfar does not = fairies. Term drift be damned!

ahem.

I thought it was bemusing that the Kender have not gotten an entry in the DMG or UAs so far as some expected to see. Whereas the Eladrin and Aasimar got entries in the DMG instead and the Warforged, Shifter and Changelings finally in UA articles and so on.

Quote from: Old One Eye;875641Somewhat odd that some 45% of folks seem fine with a brooding loner.  That is perhaps the worst archetype for a team oriented game, perfectly suited to grind the adventure game to a halt.  There have been times when I've just told the player to have fun sitting there by themselves while everyone else keeps on with the game.

I was OK with brooding loner on the condition that they would brood with a small group of fellow party members; being totally unable to join a party would probably put them closer to the clinically insane person category, which would be a worse archetype for disrupting the game.

So, pretty much Omega's BROODING/Brooding LONER/Loner distinctions.

Quote from: rawma;876288I was OK with brooding loner on the condition that they would brood with a small group of fellow party members; being totally unable to join a party would probably put them closer to the clinically insane person category, which would be a worse archetype for disrupting the game.

So, pretty much Omega's BROODING/Brooding LONER/Loner distinctions.

yah i mean the batman esc arc type can work quite well in an rpg and thats the definition of a brooding loner

Quote from: kosmos1214;876299yah i mean the batman esc arc type can work quite well in an rpg and thats the definition of a brooding loner

Batman, when not written by idiots, tends to actually be fairly not a loner. He works with groups overall fairly well. Especially pre-90s. Its when the writers toss all that out the window and ramp up the brooding and loner part till there is nothing left that things fall apart.

Now if you are playing a system like Mythic or FU solo then the extreme brooding loner works.