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WotC's Legends & Lore Column opening

Started by Benoist, February 19, 2011, 10:16:26 PM

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Settembrini

#30
February 20, 2011, 01:03:29 PM
Right, without 4e, no kumbaya would be needed. We WERE in kumbaya-land until 4e came along.
If there can\'t be a TPK against the will of the players it\'s not an RPG.- Pierce Inverarity

David Johansen

#31
February 20, 2011, 01:19:08 PM
Quote from: estar;441334So where does the owner of the D&D brand go forward from here?

4e based board games evidently...

Personally I think uping the toy value in a box is important in the current market as I've said before.  Dumbing down the rules to a boardgame on the other hand is pathetic.  Especially when the rules used to be simple enough to do that without dumbing down if you want it.  I actually know AD&D fans who still enjoy the random solo dungeon generator from the DMG.

What should they do to heal the rift?  It's really easy, stripped down core with lots of options writen with an eye to interactive compatibility.  Want HP to equal Con?  The option's there.  Want fixed HP per die?  The option's there?  Want 3e style feats?  The option's there.  Want 4e style powers?  The option's there.
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Seanchai

#32
February 20, 2011, 01:27:10 PM
Quote from: RandallS;441305The only thing I can see that WOTC could do that would actually help heal the wounds would be to re-release all the pdfs of pre-4e material (at no higher than the prices they had before being pulled) on the open market...

Just that, huh? You say, "I think 4e is the worst edition of D&D ever published...," but if WotC just released those PDFs, you'd start purchasing their products?

Seanchai
"Thus tens of children were left holding the bag. And it was a bag bereft of both Hellscream and allowance money."

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jeff37923

#33
February 20, 2011, 01:34:52 PM
Quote from: Tetsubo;441333Geezer here. I'm gone. I was disenfranchised by WotC by their release of 4E and the marketing debacle that ensued. I will not discount the possibility that WotC might at some future date create something that interests me. But the probability of that is about as likely as pigs sprouting wings and flying to Capistrano. I've migrated to Pathfinder.

Same here. I'm playing the game that works for me and my fellow Players without supporting the company that is not interested in having me as a customer.
"Meh."

Seanchai

#34
February 20, 2011, 01:34:58 PM
Quote from: Abyssal Maw;441314For anyone that says "I can't run the game I like in 4e" - I can't imagine the boring non-adventure anti-game clusterfuck of a miserable kinda-like D&D experience that you prefer.

Assuming those games are like the one I'm running, they're adventures, games, not a clusterfuck, nor is it miserable - they're also perfectly do-able in 4e.

The secret is this: I don't treat 4e any differently than any other game I've played or run.

Seanchai
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Abyssal Maw

#35
February 20, 2011, 01:45:02 PM
Mike said this in a much nicer way, but what I get out of it is this: The issue is not the edition of the game at all, it's the incessant mewling about "What is my identity if I don't play the current version of D&D?".. and the answer is of course, your identity is the same as it always was. Get over it. It's D&D.

Considering retro clones and Pathfinder: all that means to me is that nobody has any excuse to be whining that they can't buy the edition that they want anymore. Because of course they can.
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JasperAK

#36
February 20, 2011, 01:51:49 PM Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 01:52:38 PM by JasperAK
Quote from: Seanchai;441340Just that, huh? You say, "I think 4e is the worst edition of D&D ever published...," but if WotC just released those PDFs, you'd start purchasing their products?

Seanchai

Yeah Seanchai, if WOTC offered PDFs of material I don't have in my collection, then I would--by definition--purchase their products. What are you fucking stupid? They have a product I want that should not cost them much to host; or fuck, license it, or allow in on RPGnow and let me buy it. They don't have to produce it. Just fucking ALLOW it. All this camaraderie that Mearls talks about, and you're shitting up the place with your bullshit because some people don't have the same preferences you have.

I have no fucking problem with paying them for offering products that contain their IP, copyright, or trademark info. I'd rather pay them for it than d/l it illegally.

jeff37923

#37
February 20, 2011, 01:51:58 PM
Quote from: Abyssal Maw;441345Mike said this in a much nicer way, but what I get out of it is this: The issue is not the edition of the game at all, it's the incessant mewling about "What is my identity if I don't play the current version of D&D?".. and the answer is of course, your identity is the same as it always was. Get over it. It's D&D.

And what people get out of this is that you are an asshole to gamers who do not play Your Favorite Game.

Quote from: Abyssal Maw;441345It's D&D.


Considering retro clones and Pathfinder: all that means to me is that nobody has any excuse to be whining that they can't buy the edition that they want anymore. Because of course they can.

The presence of this column suggests that WotC recognizes that potential customers are turning away from their offered product to one that appeals to them and it bothers WotC enough to try and rectify the situation.
"Meh."

JasperAK

#38
February 20, 2011, 01:56:46 PM
Quote from: Abyssal Maw;441345Mike said this in a much nicer way, but what I get out of it is this: The issue is not the edition of the game at all, it's the incessant mewling about "What is my identity if I don't play the current version of D&D?".. and the answer is of course, your identity is the same as it always was. Get over it. It's ALL D&D.

Considering retro clones and Pathfinder: all that means to me is that nobody has any excuse to be whining that they can't buy the edition that they want anymore. Because of course they can.

FIFY

crkrueger

#39
February 20, 2011, 02:08:08 PM
Quote from: estar;441334They forgot that once opening the open source genie they can't bottle it back up. With the release of 4e they did exactly the right steps to throw away being the market leader a open source market place.  Now Paizo is dogging them every step of the way.

Wizards shutting down of all PDF sales instead of just 4e PDFs effectively created the marketplace for the retro-clones. It is a small marketplace to be sure but the tabletop RPGs market is small to begin with every sales counts so to speak.

So where does the owner of the D&D brand go forward from here?
Basically, they were going by the standard corporate playbook and the guy calling the shots knew fuck-all about RPGs.  They could have stayed the owner of all D&D Editions, but they tried to force a situation where all D&Ders could play 4th Edition only.  Dump the pdfs, change 4th Edition to the GSL, hell even pull the 1e licence from Kenzer.  

Someone over there thought D&D was like Magic, tell the kids what edition is cool, enforce the edition mill through tournaments, and watch the lemmings get in line to play the only edition that matters, the current officially sanctioned one.  Only RPGs aren't like Magic, and they found themselves losing a whole lot of customers.
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Abyssal Maw

#40
February 20, 2011, 02:09:05 PM
Quote from: jeff37923;441349And what people get out of this is that you are an asshole to gamers who do not play Your Favorite Game.

Reading comprehension fault. IT's all my favorite game.


QuoteThe presence of this column suggests that WotC recognizes that potential customers are turning away from their offered product to one that appeals to them and it bothers WotC enough to try and rectify the situation.

This is probably a comforting notion, but I don't think it's the case. I think there's some recognition at this point that there is a certain faction of the former D&D userbase that was actively hostile to new users, embarrassing to deal with, reactionary, a bit on the dull side, big on memorizing lore, but not much on actually playing, and tended to draw all of the wrong kinds of attention.

That's all Paizo's problem now. I personally can't thank WOTC enough.
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Abyssal Maw

#41
February 20, 2011, 02:09:46 PM
Quote from: JasperAK;441351FIFY

You didnt understand that was my meaning in the first place?
Download Secret Santicore! (10MB). I painted the cover :)

jeff37923

#42
February 20, 2011, 02:25:32 PM
Quote from: Abyssal Maw;441354I think there's some recognition at this point that there is a certain faction of the 4th Edition D&D userbase that was actively hostile to non-4E users, embarrassing to deal with, reactionary, a bit on the dull side, big on memorizing lore, but not much on actually playing unless it is through RPGA or WotC sanctioned events, and tending to draw all of the wrong kinds of attention.

That's all WotC's problem now. I personally can't thank WOTC enough.

This time I FIFY.
"Meh."

Windjammer

#43
February 20, 2011, 02:33:35 PM
Quote from: Abyssal Maw;441354I think there's some recognition at this point that there is a certain faction of the former D&D userbase that was actively hostile to new users, embarrassing to deal with, reactionary, a bit on the dull side, big on memorizing lore, but not much on actually playing, and tended to draw all of the wrong kinds of attention.

And you see that in Mearls' editorial? Also...
"Role-playing as a hobby always has been (and probably always will be) the demesne of the idle intellectual, as roleplaying requires several of the traits possesed by those with too much time and too much wasted potential."

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Abyssal Maw

#44
February 20, 2011, 02:41:50 PM
Quote from: jeff37923;441360This time I FIFY.

Nope.
Download Secret Santicore! (10MB). I painted the cover :)
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