WoTC Doesn't Want Fan Sites?

ggroy · November 02, 2009, 09:52:18 AM

In a dictatorship, the "law" is whatever the dictator, king, or emperor says and can enforce.

Osama Bin Laden snorting cocaine with Saddam and Gaddafi.

Mistwell · November 02, 2009, 02:11:01 PM

Quote from: aramis;341717The actual IP law, as explained by the Federal Agencies responsible for registration,

Stop right there.

There is so much more to law than just what the federal register says. It's en entire body of law, made up over hundreds of years through case law and practice. They have an entire bar exam JUST for intellectual property law. Entire sections of state bars devoted to it. Daily bulletins. Weekly bulletins. Monthly bulletins. Quarterly and yearly journals and books.

You CANNOT figure out all aspects of the law you need to simply by reading a statute or a single website. Period. That isn't how it works. It would be like reading a manual on how to change your oil and thinking you can make a car from blocks of metal. It just isn't as simple as that.

Mistwell · November 02, 2009, 02:15:16 PM

Quote from: StormBringer;341726Huh. One might expect a lawyer to be prepared for that kind of thing and have some kind of rebuttal.

At any rate, your opinion is really no better than any other internet lawyer's. Otherwise, feel free to cite relevant bits of whatever law you are referring to that shows you are 100% right about whatever the hell it is you are babbling about.

It might be tricky, though. We are actually talking about semi-open licenses here, not written contracts with signatures and witnesses and all that fun stuff. Whatever you concoct, there are about three dozen other ways to interpret, all with case law to back them up.

So, unless you are Chief Justice Roberts in disguise, thereby getting to have the last word ever on a particular case, shut the fuck up with the hinting around your shitty little law degree. Out of all the people that don't get to be completely right about stuff, you are one of them.

Being a lawyer means two things on the internet: Fuck All, and Nothing. You have no fucking clue how a case would go down in any particular state but your own, and certainly not outside of the US with any degree of reliability. You might be talking to some guy from France, Britain, Chile, or New Zealand who is laughing like a maniac at your stupid ass because you think your reading of the license applies to every fucking location in the world.

Reading your increasingly desperate attempt to claw your way out of the hole you have dug for yourself is painful. Next time you want to spout off like you have every law library from around the world downloaded into your head, don't. Use your head for half a second and realize that you are speaking to an international crowd here, and not whatever high school kids think you are cool because you own a car.

So, unless you are a lawyer in Utah, your opinion of WotC's fan site policy is vaguely interesting, but you have not the smallest idea of how that would play out here. So fuck off with the smug douchebag internet lawyer schtick.

And like I said, it would not matter how I answered your question. Because you didn't want the answer, just a point to launch your rant about.

For example, you just responded to me as if I had said something entirely different from what I did actually say to you. It didn't matter what my answer is. You were going to choose what I said (even if you were going to make it entirely up, like you just did) and then respond anyway.

So yeah, go fuck yourself. When I actually say anything like what you claimed I said, then you can respond that way. Otherwise, have fun debating this fictional guy you have made up and given my name.

ggroy · November 02, 2009, 02:58:07 PM

Quote from: StormBringer;341657So, you are an IP lawyer with years of experience?

If one bothered taking the time to do some searching, one can find there is a Mark Cronan listed on the State Bar of California's web site using the attorney search feature.

http://members.calbar.ca.gov/search/member_detail.aspx?x=180023

Whether this is the same person as Mistwell, I have no idea.

jeff37923 · November 02, 2009, 03:13:22 PM

Quote from: ggroy;341812If one bothered taking the time to do some searching, one can find there is a Mark Cronan listed on the State Bar of California's web site using the attorney search feature.

http://members.calbar.ca.gov/search/member_detail.aspx?x=180023

Whether this is the same person as Mistwell, I have no idea.

For sake of arguement, lets say it is.

This means he can call himself an attorney in the state of California, it does not mean that he has useful knowledge of IP law.

Buceph · November 02, 2009, 03:40:28 PM

Quote from: jeff37923;341814For sake of arguement, lets say it is.

This means he can call himself an attorney in the state of California, it does not mean that he has useful knowledge of IP law.

He's not saying he has a useful knowledge of IP law. He's saying you need to do more than read wikipedia and the statutes to understand the intricacies of IP Law, which seems fairly self-evident. Unless I'm getting him mixed up with someone else.

J Arcane · November 02, 2009, 03:45:07 PM

Quote from: jeff37923;341814For sake of arguement, lets say it is.

This means he can call himself an attorney in the state of California, it does not mean that he has useful knowledge of IP law.

Come now, surely his job experience at Academic Cap & Gown counts for something.

Mistwell · November 02, 2009, 05:14:40 PM

Quote from: jeff37923;341814For sake of arguement, lets say it is.

This means he can call himself an attorney in the state of California, it does not mean that he has useful knowledge of IP law.

Does it matter?

My point is that the field is complicated and not one that can be simply summarized on a message board such as this. Not "Listen to me knowledge of IP law".

I do practice IP law, and have for over a decade. And much of the field is federal law by the way, not state law. Regardless, I don't think any of that matters to my point. You don't need to be a lawyer at all to know that intellectual property as a field of practice is far more complex than it's made out to be on RPG message boards.

Mistwell · November 02, 2009, 05:15:17 PM

Quote from: Buceph;341819He's not saying he has a useful knowledge of IP law. He's saying you need to do more than read wikipedia and the statutes to understand the intricacies of IP Law, which seems fairly self-evident. Unless I'm getting him mixed up with someone else.

No you got the point. The only one to get the point in fact

Mistwell · November 02, 2009, 05:16:22 PM

Quote from: J Arcane;341821Come now, surely his job experience at Academic Cap & Gown counts for something.

Yes lets make this personal to where I get my bar mail. That will surely prove your point - whatever your point is.

StormBringer · November 02, 2009, 06:49:54 PM

Quote from: Mistwell;341845Yes lets make this personal to where I get my bar mail. That will surely prove your point - whatever your point is.

The point is, this isn't the California Bar Association mailing list. This is a bunch of hobbyists throwing around some ideas about how things look like they are turning out. If you have some useful information about IP law in general, or specific to California, drop it on us. Because no one here thinks that our discussion would hold up in a court of law.

Otherwise, jam the condescending attitude up your ass sideways and break it off.

Buceph · November 02, 2009, 07:54:25 PM

Quote from: StormBringer;341867The point is, this isn't the California Bar Association mailing list. This is a bunch of hobbyists throwing around some ideas about how things look like they are turning out. If you have some useful information about IP law in general, or specific to California, drop it on us. Because no one here thinks that our discussion would hold up in a court of law.

Otherwise, jam the condescending attitude up your ass sideways and break it off.

In fairness the guy he said that to was being pretty condescending himself. He did one of those replace the word posts and deliberately misinterpreting thingies that is just some guy dick waggling.

I am studying IP and Copyright law as a tangential to my degree. Mainly focusing on how it affects stuff online. Isn't there a lot of allowances for using something in an educational manner, and in an educational setting. Would there be any way that fansites could get away with a lot of things they wouldn't otherwise if they set it up as a learning tool for the game. Or are the educational exemptions strictly for academic work?

J Arcane · November 02, 2009, 08:04:48 PM

Quote from: Mistwell;341845Yes lets make this personal to where I get my bar mail. That will surely prove your point - whatever your point is.

Dude, I just thought it was funny. Lionel Hutz funny.

David R · November 02, 2009, 08:20:49 PM

Quote from: J Arcane;341892Dude, I just thought it was funny. Lionel Hutz funny.

Goddamn, I keep forgetting what mean fuckers we are

Mistwell, online/real life the consequence of flashing ones credentials and just flashing are the same. You get kicked in the nuts.

Regards,
David R

Buceph · November 02, 2009, 08:26:10 PM

Quote from: David R;341894Goddamn, I keep forgetting what mean fuckers we are

Mistwell, online/real life the consequence of flashing ones credentials and just flashing are the same. You get kicked in the nuts.

Regards,
David R

But he didn't flash his credentials, in fact he did the exact opposite. He said that it'd be twisted no matter what he said, which is exactly what happened. His credentials were found out by some e-stalking.

On a slightly related but tangental note am I backing the wrong horse here? Something tells me the hate is strong for Mistwell.