Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 26, 2022, 07:35:19 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on November 26, 2022, 03:15:20 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on November 24, 2022, 09:55:59 PM
The 5e Player's Handbook is currently ranked #9 on Amazon in the nation for....all books of any kind.

But yeah tell me how it's going broke.

Well sure its doing well, that's the book I mainly worked on.

But the newer books are not doing as well, and when OneDnD comes out, other than the initial Autistic Obsessive Fuck Rush who would buy anything at all just because it has the logo, it's going to do even worse.

Hold on, you worked on the player's handbook for 5th edition? I honestly didn't know that.

Also, I have to agree. I notice that the newer books are not nearly as popular as the older works.

Yup. If you can track down early prints, Pundit and Zak S. are listed as contributors.

That entire section was wiped in later printings.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 27, 2022, 12:28:56 AM

Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 26, 2022, 07:35:19 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on November 26, 2022, 03:15:20 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on November 24, 2022, 09:55:59 PM
The 5e Player's Handbook is currently ranked #9 on Amazon in the nation for....all books of any kind.

But yeah tell me how it's going broke.

Well sure its doing well, that's the book I mainly worked on.

But the newer books are not doing as well, and when OneDnD comes out, other than the initial Autistic Obsessive Fuck Rush who would buy anything at all just because it has the logo, it's going to do even worse.

Hold on, you worked on the player's handbook for 5th edition? I honestly didn't know that.

Also, I have to agree. I notice that the newer books are not nearly as popular as the older works.

Yup. If you can track down early prints, Pundit and Zak S. are listed as contributors.

That entire section was wiped in later printings.

Did they even give a reason why that entire section was wiped?

Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 27, 2022, 04:20:50 AM

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 27, 2022, 12:28:56 AM

Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 26, 2022, 07:35:19 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on November 26, 2022, 03:15:20 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on November 24, 2022, 09:55:59 PM
The 5e Player's Handbook is currently ranked #9 on Amazon in the nation for....all books of any kind.

But yeah tell me how it's going broke.

Well sure its doing well, that's the book I mainly worked on.

But the newer books are not doing as well, and when OneDnD comes out, other than the initial Autistic Obsessive Fuck Rush who would buy anything at all just because it has the logo, it's going to do even worse.

Hold on, you worked on the player's handbook for 5th edition? I honestly didn't know that.

Also, I have to agree. I notice that the newer books are not nearly as popular as the older works.

Yup. If you can track down early prints, Pundit and Zak S. are listed as contributors.

That entire section was wiped in later printings.

Did they even give a reason why that entire section was wiped?

The same reason Stalin had politically inconvenient people erased from photos of him. The Woke, which is to say the foot soldiers of totalitarianism, can't abide the existence of dissenting voices anywhere within their sphere of perception.

Pundit is a dissenting voice, ergo everything he even brushed up against is bad so it was either remove the contributors from the 5e PHB credits so they no longer had to look upon the name of someone "unmutual" or stop selling the 5e PHB entirely.

Ah, figured as much. The sad part is, these people unironically don't see anything wrong with this, because they are narcicistic enough to believe that whatever horrible thing they do is justified since they are "on the right side of history". Believing they are too "educated" and intelligent to be manipulated by propaganda, and don't realize they are essentially part of a cult that functions like a religion. Screaming "hate speech" instead of blasphemy.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on November 27, 2022, 12:28:56 AM

Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 26, 2022, 07:35:19 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on November 26, 2022, 03:15:20 PM

Quote from: Mistwell on November 24, 2022, 09:55:59 PM
The 5e Player's Handbook is currently ranked #9 on Amazon in the nation for....all books of any kind.

But yeah tell me how it's going broke.

Well sure its doing well, that's the book I mainly worked on.

But the newer books are not doing as well, and when OneDnD comes out, other than the initial Autistic Obsessive Fuck Rush who would buy anything at all just because it has the logo, it's going to do even worse.

Hold on, you worked on the player's handbook for 5th edition? I honestly didn't know that.

Also, I have to agree. I notice that the newer books are not nearly as popular as the older works.

Yup. If you can track down early prints, Pundit and Zak S. are listed as contributors.

That entire section was wiped in later printings.

They purged the names of contributors, so that the citizens of Seattle could stop having nightmares and wetting the bed.  It was all done in the name of progress....  A small price to pay for peace.

Quote from: Marchand on November 26, 2022, 11:49:45 PM
Once I learned about the ethically-dubious business model of Magic: the Gathering*, I started to wonder if wokifying D&D is a broader brand management exercise for Wizards/Hasbro. M:tG is much more financially important to them. The editorial line for D&D won't be determined in isolation.

An interesting theory but I don't think the timelines quite add up. D&D descent into wokeness has been slow but continuous and gradual and started before M:TG was in trouble. I'd argue that the first sign of wokeness was when WotC patted themselves on the back for their "Diverse" iconic characters in the third edition Players Handbook.

Once you go down the path of virtue signalling there is only one inevitable end. You can only have your first female paladin once and your first gay ranger once. As the need to continually virtue signalling remains, you're forced to insert ever more bizarre and unlikely characters and esoteric rules changes until you finally reach the point where "Even the dog is disabled!".

Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 28, 2022, 05:43:18 PM

Quote from: Marchand on November 26, 2022, 11:49:45 PM
Once I learned about the ethically-dubious business model of Magic: the Gathering*, I started to wonder if wokifying D&D is a broader brand management exercise for Wizards/Hasbro. M:tG is much more financially important to them. The editorial line for D&D won't be determined in isolation.

An interesting theory but I don't think the timelines quite add up. D&D descent into wokeness has been slow but continuous and gradual and started before M:TG was in trouble. I'd argue that the first sign of wokeness was when WotC patted themselves on the back for their "Diverse" iconic characters in the third edition Players Handbook.

Once you go down the path of virtue signalling there is only one inevitable end. You can only have your first female paladin once and your first gay ranger once. As the need to continually virtue signalling remains, you're forced to insert ever more bizarre and unlikely characters and esoteric rules changes until you finally reach the point where "Even the dog is disabled!".

Wait, third edition player's handbook had diverse characters? You mean the 3rd edition Dungeons & Dragons book right? I recall them being all european, which honestly makes sense for a fantasy setting which is 99% inspired by European folklore.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 28, 2022, 05:43:18 PM
...
An interesting theory but I don't think the timelines quite add up. D&D descent into wokeness has been slow but continuous and gradual and started before M:TG was in trouble. I'd argue that the first sign of wokeness was when WotC patted themselves on the back for their "Diverse" iconic characters in the third edition Players Handbook.

Once you go down the path of virtue signalling there is only one inevitable end. You can only have your first female paladin once and your first gay ranger once. As the need to continually virtue signalling remains, you're forced to insert ever more bizarre and unlikely characters and esoteric rules changes until you finally reach the point where "Even the dog is disabled!".

The pedomouse already beat them to the disabled dog thing in their latest animated movie box-office bomb.

I find the sales of the 5e handbook interesting considering that D&Done is coming in 2024. Everyone and their sister knows that the new hotness totally not a new edition is right around the corner. Best case scenario; "backwards compatibility" will be the same as it was with the 3.0 to 3.5 transition.

Yet people are evidently snapping up the soon to be obsoleted class and subclass write-ups like hotcakes...

Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 28, 2022, 06:04:25 PM
...
Wait, third edition player's handbook had diverse characters? You mean the 3rd edition Dungeons & Dragons book right? I recall them being all european, which honestly makes sense for a fantasy setting which is 99% inspired by European folklore.

WotC made a big point of it.

WotC purchased TSR in 1997

By 1999 "TSR" art was already well on it's way.

"POC" front and center. Death to captain white-bread!

Quote from: Jaeger on November 28, 2022, 07:02:50 PM
I find the sales of the 5e handbook interesting considering that D&Done is coming in 2024.

Okay, I just have to laugh because I just now recognized the pun in reversing OneD&D like that... D&D is Done.

Bravo.

Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 28, 2022, 05:43:18 PM

Quote from: Marchand on November 26, 2022, 11:49:45 PM
Once I learned about the ethically-dubious business model of Magic: the Gathering*, I started to wonder if wokifying D&D is a broader brand management exercise for Wizards/Hasbro. M:tG is much more financially important to them. The editorial line for D&D won't be determined in isolation.

You can only have your first female paladin once and your first gay ranger once.

Are you trying to suggest an argument against female paladins? Deed of Paksenarrion was published in '88-89, and there's an adequate supply of not-literally-D&D-paladin female warriors going back through Appendix N.

Quote from: nielspeterdejong on November 28, 2022, 06:04:25 PM

Quote from: hedgehobbit on November 28, 2022, 05:43:18 PM

Quote from: Marchand on November 26, 2022, 11:49:45 PM
Once I learned about the ethically-dubious business model of Magic: the Gathering*, I started to wonder if wokifying D&D is a broader brand management exercise for Wizards/Hasbro. M:tG is much more financially important to them. The editorial line for D&D won't be determined in isolation.

An interesting theory but I don't think the timelines quite add up. D&D descent into wokeness has been slow but continuous and gradual and started before M:TG was in trouble. I'd argue that the first sign of wokeness was when WotC patted themselves on the back for their "Diverse" iconic characters in the third edition Players Handbook.

Once you go down the path of virtue signalling there is only one inevitable end. You can only have your first female paladin once and your first gay ranger once. As the need to continually virtue signalling remains, you're forced to insert ever more bizarre and unlikely characters and esoteric rules changes until you finally reach the point where "Even the dog is disabled!".

Wait, third edition player's handbook had diverse characters? You mean the 3rd edition Dungeons & Dragons book right? I recall them being all european, which honestly makes sense for a fantasy setting which is 99% inspired by European folklore.

I have absolutely nothing against having non-European folklore and non-European peoples and cultures represented in fantasy RPGs.  However, the mixing of non-European people with European-inspired cultures and settings--as if the Europe of, say, 1000 AD and implying it was as "rich and diverse" as the Europe of 2022 (more accurately, the Western Europe, United States, and Canada) is just weird.  It's as weird as the "cultural appropriation" of some Nordic guy wearing dō-maru armor in a Native American setting.  While the idea that "cultural appropriation" as insulting is eyeroll-inducing, it does appear messed up and ridiculous.  Sure, Role-playing in Ancient Rome or the Ottoman Empire might have more varied cultures (especially in the urban areas), but medieval western Europe?  Please.

This is also a problem I have with too many non-human races mixed together in a mish-mash that assumes very 21st-century ideas of "Multiculturalism".

Quote from: RPGPundit on October 29, 2022, 09:13:43 AM
It's been explicitly stated now that in Nu-D&D, undead and demons can have any alignment.

I'm out of action for a while and this is what I missed. Why even bother with this fucking trash...

Quote from: Brad on November 29, 2022, 05:33:52 PM

Quote from: RPGPundit on October 29, 2022, 09:13:43 AM
It's been explicitly stated now that in Nu-D&D, undead and demons can have any alignment.

I'm out of action for a while and this is what I missed. Why even bother with this fucking trash...

WOTC has decided to make fools of themselves, and to shit upon their revenue stream.

Quote from: Jaeger on October 29, 2022, 05:22:38 PM

Quote from: VisionStorm on October 29, 2022, 05:00:28 PM
...
So the main issue with these changes in D&D is that they're being implemented in a hamfisted and haphazard way, and apparently in the behest of a morally bankrupt ideology, more than the idea that the possibility of non-evil demons is such a ridiculous notion that it has never been considered by the majority of real life cultures and religions.

Wow.  Somebody gets it.

But the problem is this: the woke often hate themselves, the boomers and the privilege they have (not shitting selves in a dumpster is super privileged). So it follows that again, they want to tear down alll that is not a modern creature cantina set in pseudo sort of medieval Star Trek settings.

And here I was hoping for holy swords, Morningstars delivered to my enemies and sacks with gold and gems.  I was off wanting to pretend adventure and forgot this is not about fun!  It's about a statement and changing the world one imaginary fairy at a time.

So disgusted.  So disappointed. 
Well there is the fact that D&D was and is sold to a primarily western English speaking audience. Which has been culturally shaped by 2000 years of Christian morality, religious thought, and philosophy.

So to D&D's primary sales demographic; Yes, the idea of non-evil demons is a completely ridiculous notion based on post-modern retardery.

Quote from: Dapig on November 30, 2022, 09:47:37 AM

Quote from: Jaeger on October 29, 2022, 05:22:38 PM

Quote from: VisionStorm on October 29, 2022, 05:00:28 PM
...
So the main issue with these changes in D&D is that they're being implemented in a hamfisted and haphazard way, and apparently in the behest of a morally bankrupt ideology, more than the idea that the possibility of non-evil demons is such a ridiculous notion that it has never been considered by the majority of real life cultures and religions.

Well there is the fact that D&D was and is sold to a primarily western English speaking audience. Which has been culturally shaped by 2000 years of Christian morality, religious thought, and philosophy.

So to D&D's primary sales demographic; Yes, the idea of non-evil demons is a completely ridiculous notion based on post-modern retardery.

Wow.  Somebody gets it.

But the problem is this: the woke often hate themselves, the boomers and the privilege they have (not shitting selves in a dumpster is super privileged). So it follows that again, they want to tear down all that is not a modern creature cantina set in pseudo sort of medieval Star Trek settings.

And here I was hoping for holy swords, Morningstars delivered to my enemies and sacks with gold and gems.  I was off wanting to pretend adventure and forgot this is not about fun!  It's about a statement and changing the world one imaginary fairy at a time.

So disgusted.  So disappointed. 

Was ^this^ your intended reply?

I think you did a little cut/pate error when parsing the quotes. Which is easy enough to do... The format for quoting here is a very manual and not that good.