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Author Topic: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke  (Read 8732 times)

RPGPundit

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Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« on: October 26, 2022, 07:58:09 PM »
The latest data sure indicates that I've been right all along about the speeding up of D&D sales decline the more woke their garbage products become...
#dnd      #ttrpg  #osr  #dnd5e

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jhkim

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2022, 09:16:22 PM »
Here you admit that Candlekeep Mysteries is "almost nominally a real product" and have nothing specifically negative to say about it, when previously you were deriding it for having the combat wheelchair and making all dungeons wheelchair accessible.

Then you go on to characterize Radiant Citadel as if it is all skill checks, which is ridiculous. In no particular order, adventures include key conflicts of:
  • defeating an elemental intent on destroying the entire region
  • defeating a plague demon that has possessed the offspring of an evil sorcerer
  • retrieve an artifact from the hands of evil abominations
  • destroying an undead monstrosity that makes people into mindless killers
  • destroy an grotesque spirit of desiccation that threatens the world
  • stopping a killer taking revenge on the children of those who wronged them
  • defeating a good magical beast possessed by spirits of madness
  • exposing a scheming killer intent on displacing his rival
  • fight through monsters to retrieve ancient artifact
  • defeat a demon intent on killing an innocent

It's true that there isn't a universal theme of good against evil. Four of the 13 adventures have fighting between rival groups where neither side is purely good or evil, and the PCs have to take sides. Also, two of the adventures involve possession where it's better to save the possessed creature (but the possessing force is clearly evil). Three have an option where the boss fight can be cut short by making a deal with the boss enemy rather than fighting. The one introductory adventure does have some humorous skill challenges like the pepper-eating contest mixed in with fighting troublesome monsters.

Having intrigue, politics, and non-combat challenges mixed into the fighting isn't out of character for D&D. It certainly isn't destroying it.

Omega

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2022, 09:26:37 PM »
Nit fast enough and not as long as they can pull in tertiary finds from any existing IP deals. They wont go broke before ONEe comes out. Hasbro has yet to tighten the dogs leash so unless that happens they will blow whatever their cult says to spend.

And odds are 10000% that they are spindictoring this to claim its the horrible mean wacists! fault as they hate anything non woke, er, white!

Ad nausium.

They must be getting a trickle of funds from the two MMOs and any sales of PC or console games they still have deals with. How is their novel section doing? Looks like Neverwinter Online is about to unveil a new advanture area based on a new Salvatori book so at least he is still doing D&D stuff. Though last I heard WOTC had closed down their publishing arm around same time 5e came out.

But they are probably losing sales if only brcause they announced ONEe and people are bound to hold off buying 5e matrial if a new edition is on the horizon that will make that material obsolete or unplayable with the new edition. Business 101 no one ever fucking learns. Edition treadmills slowly strangle your line. Or sometimes very quickly strangle it.

Omega

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2022, 09:32:39 PM »
Having intrigue, politics, and non-combat challenges mixed into the fighting isn't out of character for D&D. It certainly isn't destroying it.

Exactly.

I think the problem is, as usual, WOTC has pulled stunts a few times too many and at this point people just arent having any of it no matter how mild.

Steven Mitchell

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2022, 09:43:43 PM »
Don't forget, the overall trend on the quality of the products has been on a slow decline since the 5E core books were published.  Sure, there's been some positive spikes in there, but the trend is slowly but surely down. 

People screwing up as badly as WotC have been doing seldom limit themselves to one axis of screw ups.

Jam The MF

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2022, 10:19:23 PM »
Don't forget, the overall trend on the quality of the products has been on a slow decline since the 5E core books were published.  Sure, there's been some positive spikes in there, but the trend is slowly but surely down. 

People screwing up as badly as WotC have been doing seldom limit themselves to one axis of screw ups.

I believe they are simply doubling down on their so called righteous cause.
I was Banned from RPG.net a long time ago, for Having Common Sense.

Omega

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2022, 02:36:24 AM »
The quality of writing has dropped because they are diversity hiring rather than talent hiring.

Art quality had been relatively good. I had a glance at a friends copy of 5e Spelljammer and have to say it at least looks good overall.

FingerRod

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2022, 12:58:49 PM »
I’d recommend people read up on this a little for themselves:

https://investor.hasbro.com/static-files/9146662a-3034-4a38-a526-6ecc9d946daf

D&D was up in the quarter, MAGIC was down due to release timings. YTD WotC is down 2% on revenues. There are a lot of companies/business units that would love to be only down 2% in revenue this year given Biden’s economy.

Capital Allocation Priorities
• Paid $289M in Dividends YTD
• Repurchased $125M in Hasbro common stock YTD
• Purchased D&D Beyond for $146M
• Repaid $73M in long-term debt
• On target to meet debt to adjusted EBITDA target of 2.0 to 2.5X in 2023
• $552M in cash at quarter end

These are not the signs of a company going broke. Hasbro has to be thrilled with WotC. Check out Wizard’s operating profit and margin.

I do agree that their woke nonsense is leaving money on the table. I also believe that both the people they are pissing off and the people they are catering to have one very important thing in common—they are not buying their products. But the hobby itself is so much bigger than these two groups.

If they do not alter course, one day the title of this thread may be true. But it is not true as of today.

jhkim

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #8 on: October 27, 2022, 01:07:58 PM »
Don't forget, the overall trend on the quality of the products has been on a slow decline since the 5E core books were published.  Sure, there's been some positive spikes in there, but the trend is slowly but surely down.

There was some interesting discussion of this later in the Ray Winninger thread.

Most of us were pretty low in our sampling rate, so it was hard to compare trends.

Personally, I liked the 5E core rules, but I hated the initial big adventure modules like Out of the Abyss. I bought that one for material to potentially use since my campaign at the time had gone into the Underdark, but what little I took from it was so heavily adapted that I might as well have just used my own material. The earliest modules are my least favorite. When I ran my first 5E games, I either created my own material or I adapted modules from earlier editions (like I6 Ravenloft and Sunless Citadel) rather than use the 5E modules.

So from my view, I've liked the later modules better.

dungeon crawler

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #9 on: October 27, 2022, 03:02:54 PM »
The sooner WOTC goes broke the better. I have nor purchased any of their tripe for years and will not do so any time soon.

Tubesock Army

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #10 on: October 27, 2022, 03:14:49 PM »
(edited for Doxxing)
« Last Edit: October 27, 2022, 05:58:47 PM by RPGPundit »

FingerRod

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #11 on: October 27, 2022, 03:23:39 PM »
(Edited by mod to remove doxxing)

This is completely off topic. You should be banned. You know the forum rules. Don’t use me in your weak personal campaign, cunt.

Edited: images deleted, tag in bold left behind
« Last Edit: October 27, 2022, 06:00:54 PM by RPGPundit »

Tubesock Army

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #12 on: October 27, 2022, 03:26:13 PM »
Considering that the Pundit is not "woke", but arguably "broke", which runs counter to his claim in the first post (gEt WoKe Go BrOkE!1!), I'd say it's very relevant. But, hey, open your mouth wider, you've almost got the whole boot in there.

World_Warrior

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #13 on: October 27, 2022, 03:46:23 PM »
Considering that the Pundit is not "woke", but arguably "broke", which runs counter to his claim in the first post (gEt WoKe Go BrOkE!1!), I'd say it's very relevant. But, hey, open your mouth wider, you've almost got the whole boot in there.

Imagine how much money you would have if you started charging Pundit, instead of letting him live rent-free in your head.

Tubesock Army

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Re: Woke D&D Is Starting to Go Broke
« Reply #14 on: October 27, 2022, 03:50:33 PM »
Considering that the Pundit is not "woke", but arguably "broke", which runs counter to his claim in the first post (gEt WoKe Go BrOkE!1!), I'd say it's very relevant. But, hey, open your mouth wider, you've almost got the whole boot in there.

Imagine how much money you would have if you started charging Pundit, instead of letting him live rent-free in your head.

Eh, I must not be doing that bad, I can afford to pay for eyeglasses.