Greetings!

Here, we have a video review of "Wild Beyond the Witchlight" game book, by Web DM. The Web DM gang are very positive about the game book, and especially appreciate the format of the social adventure, the large number of NPC's, and describing the book as interesting, fun, and open for DM's to use in their campaign with great flexibility in how the Player Party proceeds into and through the adventure. The book is full of different locations, secrets, relationships, and a distinctly different approach to what can be done using the D&D rules. Web DM appreciates the callbacks to earlier D&D history, like THACO Clown, whom they laugh at with great mirth. They characterize the format of the book as laying out a unique framework for making a social adventure, instead of every adventure merely being a hack and slash fest relying on swords and fireballs. It's a different style of D&D play experience, but it is still D&D, they maintain. Web DM are thoroughly positive on this adventure book, and feel that the book offers a fresh and satisfying style of adventure for a DM's game campaign.

Web DM doesn't critique the game book like others have--with no mention whatsoever of any kind of controversial politics or contentious aspects. It's weird, listening to Web DM they seem to have an entirely different perspective on the game book than Pundit, for example, or other members here. It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

No matter how you rearrange the deck chairs on the Titanic, she's still gonna sink.

I picked up the book for my own game.  Not because I wanted another adventure that starts at level 1.
But for one additional race (The Harengon, whom my younger child wants to play. She like bunnies and she likes playing animal people, like Tabaxi and Aaracokra, so of course) and for hoping that I could pull out the info and ideas on the Feywild for my own purposes.
With 2 races, 2 backgrounds and several "new" monsters (some new, some pulled from 1e), it has some utility other than being just a module.
I'd rate it pretty low, unless you specifically want a carnival adventure or those things.
 

I haven't picked up Witchlight yet, but I experienced something similar with Candlekeep Mysteries. Pundit declared that Candlekeep Mysteries included Sara Thompson's Combat Wheelchair, and further all the dungeons were wheelchair-accessible and it featured wheelchairs in its art.

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 03, 2021, 04:35:00 PM

Quote from: jhkim on September 03, 2021, 10:47:20 AM
If Thompson got her original combat wheelchair added to official D&D, then yes, I would be wrong. Can you give a link or reference that the original combat wheelchair was added to official D&D?

The wheelchair is in Candlekeep, and EVERY dungeon for official D&D from Candlekeep onwards has been wheelchair-accessible. Also, every D&D product from candlekeep onward has featured the wheelchair in art.

I bought Candlekeep Mysteries because I was curious after this - it seemed like a surprising choice. What I found was that there were no wheelchairs of any sort in the module - either in pictures or in text - and the dungeons were not wheelchair-accessible.

Based on this, I am skeptical about claims on WotC modules here.

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Never underestimate the power of soy!

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
...
Web DM doesn't critique the game book like others have--with no mention whatsoever of any kind of controversial politics or contentious aspects. It's weird, listening to Web DM they seem to have an entirely different perspective on the game book than Pundit, for example, or other members here. It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet. ...

Because they are the target audience for this, not you. We are now starting to see official "D&D" adventures made for the new-school player base that has an entirely different idea what "playing D&D" means...

We saw a little bit of this with the changes they made to Nu-Ravenloft, and other "re-imaginings" of classic  D&D modules and settings.

Now with Wild Beyond the Witchlight and the upcoming Strixhaven, we are seeing them take the step to try and sell what I would call: "Disney Story Time D&D"...

Wild Beyond the Witchlight is the Disney Fairytale version of the Feywild, not the Sword and Sorcery Brothers Grimm one...

Even the people on this site that have the Wild Beyond the Witchlight, mention what bits they can use for their kids in the next sentence...

And yet the Wild Beyond the Witchlight is being pushed as major mainstream setting/adventure book for the general D&D fanbase.

The truth is this; If Wild Beyond the Witchlight was released as-is during the TSR era with the same push behind it - this is the D&D fan reaction it would have gotten:



Of course these days if you dare to voice such an opinion; all the WotC D&D team and new school players see is this:

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
Greetings!

Here, we have a video review of "Wild Beyond the Witchlight" game book, by Web DM. The Web DM gang are very positive about the game book, and especially appreciate the format of the social adventure, the large number of NPC's, and describing the book as interesting, fun, and open for DM's to use in their campaign with great flexibility in how the Player Party proceeds into and through the adventure. The book is full of different locations, secrets, relationships, and a distinctly different approach to what can be done using the D&D rules. Web DM appreciates the callbacks to earlier D&D history, like THACO Clown, whom they laugh at with great mirth. They characterize the format of the book as laying out a unique framework for making a social adventure, instead of every adventure merely being a hack and slash fest relying on swords and fireballs. It's a different style of D&D play experience, but it is still D&D, they maintain. Web DM are thoroughly positive on this adventure book, and feel that the book offers a fresh and satisfying style of adventure for a DM's game campaign.

Web DM doesn't critique the game book like others have--with no mention whatsoever of any kind of controversial politics or contentious aspects. It's weird, listening to Web DM they seem to have an entirely different perspective on the game book than Pundit, for example, or other members here. It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

I gave the same kind of review as Web DM.

Noteworthy: Web DM and I own the book and are reading the book. Pundit and most others (but not all, there are a couple of standouts who did actually read the book) here shitting on the book have never owned or read the book. Gee, you think that could have something to do with the differing reactions?

Quote from: jhkim on October 18, 2021, 12:47:15 PM
I haven't picked up Witchlight yet, but I experienced something similar with Candlekeep Mysteries. Pundit declared that Candlekeep Mysteries included Sara Thompson's Combat Wheelchair, and further all the dungeons were wheelchair-accessible and it featured wheelchairs in its art.

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 03, 2021, 04:35:00 PM

Quote from: jhkim on September 03, 2021, 10:47:20 AM
If Thompson got her original combat wheelchair added to official D&D, then yes, I would be wrong. Can you give a link or reference that the original combat wheelchair was added to official D&D?

The wheelchair is in Candlekeep, and EVERY dungeon for official D&D from Candlekeep onwards has been wheelchair-accessible. Also, every D&D product from candlekeep onward has featured the wheelchair in art.

I bought Candlekeep Mysteries because I was curious after this - it seemed like a surprising choice. What I found was that there were no wheelchairs of any sort in the module - either in pictures or in text - and the dungeons were not wheelchair-accessible.

Based on this, I am skeptical about claims on WotC modules here.

Almost like Pundit and others here shat on that book without ever reading it too.

Color me shocked. Shocked I say! Almost like the people who dismiss Pundit's body of work without ever reading it! As if this were purely a cultural battle and the facts are irrelevant to the greater good of the battle itself.

Quote from: Mistwell on October 18, 2021, 03:05:37 PM
Almost like Pundit and others here shat on that book without ever reading it too.

Reading things for oneself is always highly recommended.

Quote from: Jaeger on October 18, 2021, 02:47:01 PM

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
...
Web DM doesn't critique the game book like others have--with no mention whatsoever of any kind of controversial politics or contentious aspects. It's weird, listening to Web DM they seem to have an entirely different perspective on the game book than Pundit, for example, or other members here. It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet. ...

Because they are the target audience for this, not you. We are now starting to see official "D&D" adventures made for the new-school player base that has an entirely different idea what "playing D&D" means...

We saw a little bit of this with the changes they made to Nu-Ravenloft, and other "re-imaginings" of classic  D&D modules and settings.

Now with Wild Beyond the Witchlight and the upcoming Strixhaven, we are seeing them take the step to try and sell what I would call: "Disney Story Time D&D"...

Wild Beyond the Witchlight is the Disney Fairytale version of the Feywild, not the Sword and Sorcery Brothers Grimm one...

Even the people on this site that have the Wild Beyond the Witchlight, mention what bits they can use for their kids in the next sentence...

And yet the Wild Beyond the Witchlight is being pushed as major mainstream setting/adventure book for the general D&D fanbase.

The truth is this; If Wild Beyond the Witchlight was released as-is during the TSR era with the same push behind it - this is the D&D fan reaction it would have gotten:



Of course these days if you dare to voice such an opinion; all the WotC D&D team and new school players see is this:

Some early D&D products were pretty fucking goofy too. This new product isn't all that different from some of those.

Quote from: HappyDaze on October 18, 2021, 03:37:51 PM
Some early D&D products were pretty fucking goofy too. This new product isn't all that different from some of those.

And those goofy TSR products largely comprise the list of the worst classic D&D modules.

The D&D fanbase did go: "WTF is this shit!?"

There are plenty of detailed reviews out there now, and it is obvious at this point what the target audience for Wild Beyond the Witchlight is.

IMHO, Most on this board are not in the target demo...

Quote from: Jaeger on October 18, 2021, 02:47:01 PM

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
...
Web DM doesn't critique the game book like others have--with no mention whatsoever of any kind of controversial politics or contentious aspects. It's weird, listening to Web DM they seem to have an entirely different perspective on the game book than Pundit, for example, or other members here. It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet. ...

Because they are the target audience for this, not you. We are now starting to see official "D&D" adventures made for the new-school player base that has an entirely different idea what "playing D&D" means...

We saw a little bit of this with the changes they made to Nu-Ravenloft, and other "re-imaginings" of classic  D&D modules and settings.

Now with Wild Beyond the Witchlight and the upcoming Strixhaven, we are seeing them take the step to try and sell what I would call: "Disney Story Time D&D"...

Wild Beyond the Witchlight is the Disney Fairytale version of the Feywild, not the Sword and Sorcery Brothers Grimm one...

Even the people on this site that have the Wild Beyond the Witchlight, mention what bits they can use for their kids in the next sentence...

And yet the Wild Beyond the Witchlight is being pushed as major mainstream setting/adventure book for the general D&D fanbase.

The truth is this; If Wild Beyond the Witchlight was released as-is during the TSR era with the same push behind it - this is the D&D fan reaction it would have gotten:



Of course these days if you dare to voice such an opinion; all the WotC D&D team and new school players see is this:

Technically they are not new school guys.  They've played old school games and Warhammer Fantasy is one of their favorite campaigns/games ever.  However, they get their money from the 5e cash cow so they need to like it and they need to cover it.

Quote from: Skullking on October 18, 2021, 01:18:54 PM

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Never underestimate the power of soy!

Greetings!

*Laughing* "The power of Soy!"

Yes, so true! Soy has this weird, feminizing effect on men, strangely.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: KingCheops on October 18, 2021, 03:57:39 PM

Quote from: Jaeger on October 18, 2021, 02:47:01 PM

Quote from: SHARK on October 18, 2021, 07:13:43 AM
...
Web DM doesn't critique the game book like others have--with no mention whatsoever of any kind of controversial politics or contentious aspects. It's weird, listening to Web DM they seem to have an entirely different perspective on the game book than Pundit, for example, or other members here. It's almost like they reviewed an entirely different product--the book has the same name, but their entire approach seems like they are on a different planet. ...

Because they are the target audience for this, not you. We are now starting to see official "D&D" adventures made for the new-school player base that has an entirely different idea what "playing D&D" means...

We saw a little bit of this with the changes they made to Nu-Ravenloft, and other "re-imaginings" of classic  D&D modules and settings.

Now with Wild Beyond the Witchlight and the upcoming Strixhaven, we are seeing them take the step to try and sell what I would call: "Disney Story Time D&D"...

Wild Beyond the Witchlight is the Disney Fairytale version of the Feywild, not the Sword and Sorcery Brothers Grimm one...

Even the people on this site that have the Wild Beyond the Witchlight, mention what bits they can use for their kids in the next sentence...

And yet the Wild Beyond the Witchlight is being pushed as major mainstream setting/adventure book for the general D&D fanbase.

The truth is this; If Wild Beyond the Witchlight was released as-is during the TSR era with the same push behind it - this is the D&D fan reaction it would have gotten:



Of course these days if you dare to voice such an opinion; all the WotC D&D team and new school players see is this:

Technically they are not new school guys.  They've played old school games and Warhammer Fantasy is one of their favorite campaigns/games ever.  However, they get their money from the 5e cash cow so they need to like it and they need to cover it.

Greetings!

Hello, KingCheops! Yes, of course what you say is true. I have watched Web DM videos for geesus, what, several years now. They are usually pretty solid on their assessments of various books and modules. Though, admittedly, I haven't always agreed with them. In addition, their typical topical discussion videos about campaigns, gaming, spells, classes, monsters, adventures and so on are always enjoyable and useful. In general, they don't seem to be particularly ideological or especially Liberal or *Woke*. Still, I do sometimes suspect that like Jaeger mentions, THEY are the target audience for "Wild Beyond the Witchlight"--NOT ME. I think that Web DM may be your typical mass-market gamers, and have been heavily influenced by the Liberal ideology and mind-set even while not necessarily being fully aware of how significantly they have been influenced by such ideology. Then, of course, as you mentioned, they make their money from being generally positive towards everything WOTC 5E. Money can be very persuasive, after all.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quote from: Jaeger on October 18, 2021, 03:54:58 PM

Quote from: HappyDaze on October 18, 2021, 03:37:51 PM
Some early D&D products were pretty fucking goofy too. This new product isn't all that different from some of those.

And those goofy TSR products largely comprise the list of the worst classic D&D modules.

The D&D fanbase did go: "WTF is this shit!?"

There are plenty of detailed reviews out there now, and it is obvious at this point what the target audience for Wild Beyond the Witchlight is.

IMHO, Most on this board are not in the target demo...

I'm not disagreeing with you. I was never a fan of the goofy stuff, but I imagine some people might have been then...and possibly now too. I don't feel that every product needs to be made to the tastes of the same "old guard" fans. There's nothing wrong with them trying different things. I don't intend to buy it, but I'm not opposed to it existing.