Which do you feel is played more, cWoD or nWoD?

Shipyard Locked · December 31, 2015, 09:26:43 AM

Forgive me if this is a totally ignorant question, I'm just really out of the loop on this subject:

From your observations and analysis which line is actually played more, Classic World of Darkness (and derivatives) or New World of Darkness (and derivatives)?

Omega · December 31, 2015, 09:44:06 AM

Classic.

To date I have met no one who liked the new version. They either didnt like some element of the rules. Or more commonly. They HATED the changes to the setting. Especially the Werewolf players.

The Butcher · December 31, 2015, 10:17:07 AM

If I had to guess? cWoD by a large margin.

Big nWoD fan here, BTW.

Michael Gray · December 31, 2015, 10:33:03 AM

I'd say CWoD, simply for the fact that it's been out there longer and had time to build more of a following. I like different parts of both settings so I'm kind of the outlier in my group of gamers, but most of them are diehard CWoD or have never played any version.

Snowman0147 · December 31, 2015, 01:52:36 PM

Of course cWoD is more loved than nWoD. So much so Onyx Path did the v20 series and Paradox demanded nWoD to be called CoD instead. Hell the only reason why CCP and Paradox bought out white wolf was for cWoD alone.

JeremyR · January 01, 2016, 12:56:49 AM

Are either played much anymore? I mean, if you have to do a Kickstarter for your products to get printed, well, it means you don't really have a userbase beyond a niche

Beyond that, I don't think I've seen a goth in probably 10 years. I'm sure they still exist, but it's not a big deal like it was in the '90s (or even late '80s).

OTOH, given how popular urban fantasy/romance novels are (featuring pretty much every supernatural creature in existence, plus aliens and Scottish highlanders), you'd think there would be a big audience

Snowman0147 · January 01, 2016, 01:28:27 AM

I don't think urban fantasy is that popular in all honesty. I honestly think creepy pasta is more popular so if Paradox can touch that they would have a leg to stand on.

Omega · January 01, 2016, 02:20:55 AM

Quote from: JeremyR;871481Are either played much anymore? I mean, if you have to do a Kickstarter for your products to get printed, well, it means you don't really have a userbase beyond a niche

Beyond that, I don't think I've seen a goth in probably 10 years. I'm sure they still exist, but it's not a big deal like it was in the '90s (or even late '80s).

OTOH, given how popular urban fantasy/romance novels are (featuring pretty much every supernatural creature in existence, plus aliens and Scottish highlanders), you'd think there would be a big audience

Still has quite a following. Its just that the following stuck more to the older edition. Its wildly popular as a LARP. One of my players runs the local Vampire sessions with help from one of my other players.

There isnt much of the company left so a KS campaign might have been all they could muster. And some publishers used KS as a sort of pre-order and interest gauge.

Ravenswing · January 01, 2016, 02:32:34 AM

I think our anecdotal observations aren't worth much. Is there any actual evidence -- sales figures, say -- to suggest how it's gone one way or another?

TrippyHippy · January 01, 2016, 08:20:18 AM

In statements made by the new White Wolf and Onyx Path during the changeover, it's pretty clear that the Classic World of Darkness lines overshadows the nWoD stuff by quite a large margin.

The various Kickstarter campaigns always rack in lots more cash for the cWoD titles, while the decision to rebrand the nWoD to 'Chronicles of Darkness' so that it doesn't interfere with the core brand of the World of Darkness games says it all.

Omega · January 02, 2016, 12:39:54 AM

Quote from: Ravenswing;871491I think our anecdotal observations aren't worth much. Is there any actual evidence -- sales figures, say -- to suggest how it's gone one way or another?

Theres never sales figures. This is one of the most asenine request people make for "evidence".

Companies rarely give out sales numbers. What we have is based on what the designers have said here and there. The original version has a bigger following still even after all this time. The changes to nWoD were too much and alienated apparently too much of the existing fanbase.

Ravenswing · January 02, 2016, 01:47:55 AM

Quote from: Omega;871651Theres never sales figures. This is one of the most asenine request people make for "evidence".

Companies rarely give out sales numbers. What we have is based on what the designers have said here and there. The original version has a bigger following still even after all this time. The changes to nWoD were too much and alienated apparently too much of the existing fanbase.

Of course companies don't give out sales figures; the industry is so tiny they don't have to answer to the usual rules regarding investors wanting CPAs doing audits.

No other "evidence" is anything other than bullshit. I don't give a whole lot more for the designers' anecdotal takes than any other. I agree that at the time, the threads were overwhelmingly "The bastards raped our milieu!!", but then c'mon. You've been around long enough to know full well that the number of people who write into Internet forums to complain outnumber the "Hrm, I like it just fine" posters about ten to one.

TrippyHippy · January 02, 2016, 02:20:53 AM

Quote from: Omega;871651Theres never sales figures. This is one of the most asenine request people make for "evidence".

Companies rarely give out sales numbers. What we have is based on what the designers have said here and there. The original version has a bigger following still even after all this time. The changes to nWoD were too much and alienated apparently too much of the existing fanbase.

The sales numbers via Kickstarter are entirely transparent, and the sales via drivethrurpg are ranked in terms of Platinum/Gold/Electrum/Silver/Copper ratings.

This accounts for all of The Onyx Path's sales currently.

Classic World of Darkness generally outsells New World of Darkness, or now Chronicles of Darkness stuff. It's not surprising either, considering that it's had about 25 years to build brand loyalty. The reason why there was a drive towards creating a Vampire: TM 4th Edition when one was frankly not needed, was that it remains their biggest seller. Exalted is probably second, and going on Kickstarter evidence, Mage The Ascension third.

Kiero · January 02, 2016, 06:52:29 AM

My group wouldn't touch cWoD with a barge pole. The Storyteller system is a steaming pile of crap. I assume most of the people buying it do so to read it, not actually endure playing.

nWoD on the other hand is as close as we have to a default system. With some of the system updates that formed the GMC, it's quite serviceable.

TrippyHippy · January 02, 2016, 03:10:14 PM

Quote from: Kiero;871676My group wouldn't touch cWoD with a barge pole. The Storyteller system is a steaming pile of crap. I assume most of the people buying it do so to read it, not actually endure playing.

nWoD on the other hand is as close as we have to a default system. With some of the system updates that formed the GMC, it's quite serviceable.

I find this view, often expressed, to be an exaggeration. While the system encourages house-ruling, which our group does implement (we don't bother rolling Initiative, for example), we've found the Classic ruleset runs quite smoothly in practice. The nWoD, or Chronicles of Darkness as it now is, is fine but a bit more mechanistic and provides less built in flexibility. May just depend on attitude, I guess.

Anyway, this is all totally besides the point: in terms of world wide reach and sales, (Classic) World of Darkness, is the major WW IP and is the one that the new investors are interested in.