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Author Topic: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs  (Read 4408 times)

mudbanks

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #15 on: October 25, 2021, 11:51:47 PM »
I imagine there are also gamers in Asia, beyond Japan, like South Korea, China, India, the Philippines, Thailand, and other places.

More than you know ;)

Unfortunately, the rot has infiltrated many Asian countries that have more influences from the West. I think it's very unfortunate as many of us, myself included, grew up with more traditional values, but the influence of liberal Western media has eroded a lot of that. Presently in my country, the LGBTQBBQ movement, along with other popular bandwagon ideas, has taken hold and influenced much of the subculture of the younger generation so that they continue to repeat the same rhetoric that is being spread in the US and Europe without questioning its veracity, origin or implication. Furthermore, the narrative is emphasised and repeated in your usual pseudointellectual (and often hateful) manner, as is commonly seen on Twitter. It's really a shame.

SHARK

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2021, 05:42:46 AM »
I imagine there are also gamers in Asia, beyond Japan, like South Korea, China, India, the Philippines, Thailand, and other places.

More than you know ;)

Unfortunately, the rot has infiltrated many Asian countries that have more influences from the West. I think it's very unfortunate as many of us, myself included, grew up with more traditional values, but the influence of liberal Western media has eroded a lot of that. Presently in my country, the LGBTQBBQ movement, along with other popular bandwagon ideas, has taken hold and influenced much of the subculture of the younger generation so that they continue to repeat the same rhetoric that is being spread in the US and Europe without questioning its veracity, origin or implication. Furthermore, the narrative is emphasised and repeated in your usual pseudointellectual (and often hateful) manner, as is commonly seen on Twitter. It's really a shame.

Greetings!

Hi Mudbanks! YES! Very true, and good to know. Of course, gamers, creators, podcasters, companies and so on are more prominent in the United States and the West--but certainly, RPG's and D&D grows everywhere, just about, even in places that we don't hear about as much regarding the hobby.

As for your neck of the woods in Asia, well, my friend, keep up the fight! FIGHT for faith, for traditionalism, for true, genuine culture. You an your family depend on the outcome in very real ways. I know it can get discouraging, and exhausting. Many times it can feel like you are outnumbered and doomed. Resist such feelings, and steel yourself to fight for these greater values. The Communists are like filthy, diseased rats in human form. Their brainwashed brethren, the watered -down Socialists, the Liberals, the Democrats, whatever you know them as in your country, must be resisted, and defeated. Speak out, stand up, and don't back own. Don't retreat. Make them uncomfortable. Make them feel ashamed. Make them retreat to the shadows and gutters and sewers, which is where they truly belong.

Game on, my friend! ;D

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK
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RPGPundit

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2021, 07:56:15 PM »
RPGs as a medium are very enduring.

Let's say you're a gamer, and you've been thrown back in time somehow to prehistoric times. Assuming you run into other people, and you learn the language well enough, you would be all it takes to teach that tribe how to play RPGs. You'd need some kind of randomizer (say, Cowrie shells or something) and that's it.
The concepts of D&D would not even necessarily be foreign: go into the cave to fight monsters and get rewards.

That's why I'm sure that RPGs ("D&D", though not necessarily any current edition) will survive even the fall of the west should that happen.
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GriswaldTerrastone
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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2021, 10:16:18 PM »
No it won't, RPGPundit. You have missed the entire point, and have missed it completely.

Because it is too politically incorrect to talk about what is really happening most people just focus on SJWs and the "woke" crowd at Twitter.

This is where most people miss the point: these things are not the disease- they are merely symptoms.

The idea is to destroy western society as a whole, and contaminating pop culture with toxic ideology is one way of doing it. The SJWs are a mindless mass, merely obeying the orders of an elite that hates western society and wants to bring it down. If they were told tomorrow that AD&D is actually good because even in 1977 it had "strong empowered female characters" then suddenly TSR-era gaming would be "cool" the day after. Look at the SJWs as a religious cult and things make more sense.

The point is, it is NOT about making money and it is NOT about misguided leadership- we are dealing with a deliberate plan to bring down EVERYTHING. And that elite is NOT going to stop, ever.

But Myths survive even the destruction of civilizations. I am definitely not sure if western civilization will survive; but I feel pretty confident that RPGs will, and they won't be the SJW versions of RPGs.


Don't be too sure of that.

People tend to think of Tolkein as having written an epic high fantasy, but believe it or not he wasn't, not really. Unlike Greek mythology ancient English mythology was wiped out, forgotten- King Arthur, Merlin, Excalibur, Robin Hood, are all relatively recent. So Tolkein actually tried to fill in that gap. So the loss of mythology has happened before; cultures have been wiped out before and their legends with them.

This is what the elite behind leftism is trying to do. Superman 2.0 is now bisexual. Jean-Luc Picard is now a wimpy old loser. Luke Skywalker is a pathetic hermit. Thor is now an angry feminist woman. Tony Stark, the list goes on. WotC is declaring old stuff to be racist, sexist, etc.- how long before just owning it is a hate crime? What you speak of is being muddied, confused, soon people won't be sure if Thor was a man or a woman before, what exactly IS AD&D- that old stuff or the new "woke" stuff? If more and more things become a hate crime, then who will dare even play the old stuff since spy technology is vastly superior to anything the former Soviet Union ever had?

Make no mistake about it- Big Brother/Sister (mustn't be sexist) IS watching. Your browsing habits, what books or movies you've ordered...did you buy the horrible hatemonger sexist non-woke RPGPundit's stuff? Well, unless you paid cash somewhere isolated you are on record. A friend had ordered a book about Israel's power over American foreign policy (this person is a rabid Steven Colbert watching leftist) so I told him that he is on record as having ordered such a book, no doubt making him an "anti-semite" according to "anti-hate" groups. He had not thought about this.

The idea is to turn us into hedonistic, weak, stupid people. Easily controlled. Drug boys for ADHD, a phony disease, make us all too scared to do anything. RPGPundit, I am over half a century old, and can tell you that at the rate things are going anything good in pop culture, including heroic fantasy, the original saga of Luke Skywalker, anything good- may not survive at this rate. The SJWs and their overlords, the real problem, are winning time and again. Compare 1981 to 2021. It's frightening. SJWs are weak and kind of stupid, but the people behind them are not and they have WEALTH to keep woke failures going long enough to do the job. Under normal capitalist rules Marvel comics should have collapsed completely by now, with or without Covid-19, but they are still here. Haven't you wondered how?

The idea behind deconstructing is in part about trying to convince people that not only aren't classic heroes and epics and whatever any good, but that THEY NEVER WERE. This is why Luke, Picard, and so many others must be ruined and degraded now. Lowest common denominator. We are being hit from all sides at once. 

« Last Edit: October 26, 2021, 10:20:15 PM by GriswaldTerrastone »
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GriswaldTerrastone
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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2021, 10:56:16 PM »
Note that this is not about surrender, just making it clear what we're all up against.
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Spinachcat

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #20 on: October 27, 2021, 12:34:36 AM »
Segregation is the key to the survival. People who do not want woke shit in their lives need to create parallel economies and spaces where woke shit is not tolerated.

And be prepared to defend those spaces with force as necessary.

The secession of red states would make this much easier for residents of those areas. As Mark Dice and others have discussed, social media (most especially Twitter) is the engine driving the crazy train so dealing with that beast is the only way for nations to survive its onslaught of round the clock stupid.

As for the hobby, I don't know if it will last the end of the West, and frankly, what happens past my lifetime isn't my concern. If the West successfully commits suicide, say sayonara to any humanitarian civilization for a thousand years, or longer if the CCP decides to cleanse the world of non-Chinese.

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #21 on: October 27, 2021, 08:25:54 AM »
No it won't, RPGPundit. You have missed the entire point, and have missed it completely.

Because it is too politically incorrect to talk about what is really happening most people just focus on SJWs and the "woke" crowd at Twitter.

This is where most people miss the point: these things are not the disease- they are merely symptoms.

The idea is to destroy western society as a whole, and contaminating pop culture with toxic ideology is one way of doing it. The SJWs are a mindless mass, merely obeying the orders of an elite that hates western society and wants to bring it down. If they were told tomorrow that AD&D is actually good because even in 1977 it had "strong empowered female characters" then suddenly TSR-era gaming would be "cool" the day after. Look at the SJWs as a religious cult and things make more sense.

The point is, it is NOT about making money and it is NOT about misguided leadership- we are dealing with a deliberate plan to bring down EVERYTHING. And that elite is NOT going to stop, ever.

But Myths survive even the destruction of civilizations. I am definitely not sure if western civilization will survive; but I feel pretty confident that RPGs will, and they won't be the SJW versions of RPGs.


Don't be too sure of that.

People tend to think of Tolkein as having written an epic high fantasy, but believe it or not he wasn't, not really. Unlike Greek mythology ancient English mythology was wiped out, forgotten- King Arthur, Merlin, Excalibur, Robin Hood, are all relatively recent. So Tolkein actually tried to fill in that gap. So the loss of mythology has happened before; cultures have been wiped out before and their legends with them.

This is what the elite behind leftism is trying to do. Superman 2.0 is now bisexual. Jean-Luc Picard is now a wimpy old loser. Luke Skywalker is a pathetic hermit. Thor is now an angry feminist woman. Tony Stark, the list goes on. WotC is declaring old stuff to be racist, sexist, etc.- how long before just owning it is a hate crime? What you speak of is being muddied, confused, soon people won't be sure if Thor was a man or a woman before, what exactly IS AD&D- that old stuff or the new "woke" stuff? If more and more things become a hate crime, then who will dare even play the old stuff since spy technology is vastly superior to anything the former Soviet Union ever had?

Make no mistake about it- Big Brother/Sister (mustn't be sexist) IS watching. Your browsing habits, what books or movies you've ordered...did you buy the horrible hatemonger sexist non-woke RPGPundit's stuff? Well, unless you paid cash somewhere isolated you are on record. A friend had ordered a book about Israel's power over American foreign policy (this person is a rabid Steven Colbert watching leftist) so I told him that he is on record as having ordered such a book, no doubt making him an "anti-semite" according to "anti-hate" groups. He had not thought about this.

The idea is to turn us into hedonistic, weak, stupid people. Easily controlled. Drug boys for ADHD, a phony disease, make us all too scared to do anything. RPGPundit, I am over half a century old, and can tell you that at the rate things are going anything good in pop culture, including heroic fantasy, the original saga of Luke Skywalker, anything good- may not survive at this rate. The SJWs and their overlords, the real problem, are winning time and again. Compare 1981 to 2021. It's frightening. SJWs are weak and kind of stupid, but the people behind them are not and they have WEALTH to keep woke failures going long enough to do the job. Under normal capitalist rules Marvel comics should have collapsed completely by now, with or without Covid-19, but they are still here. Haven't you wondered how?

The idea behind deconstructing is in part about trying to convince people that not only aren't classic heroes and epics and whatever any good, but that THEY NEVER WERE. This is why Luke, Picard, and so many others must be ruined and degraded now. Lowest common denominator. We are being hit from all sides at once.

"English" myth includes the earliest (Welsh) Arthurian stories from the dark ages, which are older than Beowulf, which is also an example of English myth.

But you're right to the extent that for example Briton celtic myth outside of Wales was devastated by the cultural invasion of Rome. However, that was an illiterate people with an oral tradition, in a relatively small area. In the modern world, there's literally almost no place on Earth that hasn't heard of Superman. And if the stories survive, it will be the best most appealing stories that survive.
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Also, now with the CULTS OF CHAOS cult-generation sourcebook

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Wrath of God

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2021, 11:15:34 AM »
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If you run or play D&D V, you're supporting Jeremy Crawford, who hates the OSR

Well that's per se not a sin. I mean his wokism is, but OSR is just like whatever...

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Problem is. Its not going to happen because it didnt happen the last two times and will not happen either when the next iteration rolls around.

With each iteration theres been some lasting damage done to the gaming community. Some of the early stuff like the Satanic Panic witch hunts now only rare spots here and there or weird laws still enforced overseas. But the damage still persists. The 90s iteration was more invasive and closer to what we are seeing now. Just on a much milder tone overall. But the damage from that persists too in various mostly small ways.

That may not be the case with the current 2010 iteration as the damage is near systemic and shows little sign of abating any time soon. If anything they seem to be stepping up the madness. We are also facing long term infiltration and co-opting plans.

The only cold reassurance I get from all this is the fact that the 2030 iteration will near certainly turn on the current and declare THEM the vile nasty ist-ists. Because thats exactly what the 2010 iteration did to the 1990s iteration and what 90s did to 70s.

I'd say for RPGs to be de-wokised generational change has to occur among Western world youth.
Hard to say if it's possible, I'd say not in a short time.

Quote
The point is, it is NOT about making money and it is NOT about misguided leadership- we are dealing with a deliberate plan to bring down EVERYTHING. And that elite is NOT going to stop, ever.

Quite contrary - it's precisely about making money but really big players, cult of Mammon. Destabilisation of Western countries, serve to rise power, influence and income of great players.
Sure there are genuine revolutionists wishing to abolish West, but they would be just some autistic basement screechers without Uncle Dollar.

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The SJWs are a mindless mass, merely obeying the orders of an elite that hates western society

Such claim can be made only by someone who never been on leftist forum or facebook group. SJWs shares some common morale but in terms of practical application and details they are divided in many aspects, and they spend a lot of time quarreling over minutia of their SJWism. Their groups are like regular shitstorms, often ending in schisms and splits (and I'm talking about basic leftbook not even dissidents in lieu of RadFems). Sure they are used by Big Guys in their actions, but they are not footsoldiers - they are too unruly for that. Footsoldiers are your mediocre big city corporate rats.

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I was just using that as an example. They hate Tolkein because they were TOLD to hate Tolkein, because of whatever they were told. If they were told to like Tolkein because OF Galadriel and Eowyn, then they would love Tolkein.

But the point is - SJWs are dividen in subject of Tolkien, and often quarreling about it. Like I said - overall moral divisions are somehow defined, but application... no not really.

Quote
But Myths survive even the destruction of civilizations. I am definitely not sure if western civilization will survive; but I feel pretty confident that RPGs will, and they won't be the SJW versions of RPGs.

But RPG is not Myth (and even in terms of Myths I'm quite sure we lost vast amounts of them in our history. It's a hobby. Quite niche. Weird combination of hazard games, tactical maps from XIX century armies and traditional paleolithic campfire storytelling. It's short lived, lack massive popularity, and in most countries it's even more niche than in USA. And it generally needs nerds to fluorish. Civilisational collapse can very well take it away. Storytelling will survive of course. Other things... not so sure. Depends of scope.

Quote
Let's say you're a gamer, and you've been thrown back in time somehow to prehistoric times. Assuming you run into other people, and you learn the language well enough, you would be all it takes to teach that tribe how to play RPGs. You'd need some kind of randomizer (say, Cowrie shells or something) and that's it.

I'm too busy to survive. And if we're down to paleolithic even with some dices (not good enough probably) - you won't have time, materials and so on to craft proper RPGs so it probably devolves to separate hazard dicing and separate storytelling. And people busy with everyday survival may very well - just don't need RPGs.

Quote
People tend to think of Tolkein as having written an epic high fantasy, but believe it or not he wasn't, not really. Unlike Greek mythology ancient English mythology was wiped out, forgotten- King Arthur, Merlin, Excalibur, Robin Hood, are all relatively recent. So Tolkein actually tried to fill in that gap. So the loss of mythology has happened before; cultures have been wiped out before and their legends with them.

Only not. Ancient English mythology is... West Germanic mythology. Angles were kin to Frisians and Saxons, old English simmilar to modern Frisian and Low Saxon languages.
Their mythology was West Germanic mythology and that's not forgotten. And before them there were Brittons - from whom Welsh and Cornish remains as cultures - and we still have quite good grasp of their mythology. Whole problem for Tolkien was that England lacks ancient mythology - because it's not ancient. It's hybrid nation that came from various Germanic folk and Celts, and remanant of Roman culture, and Normandian French - all merged together. And neither of original mythologies really suited what England become with time. That's why in Middle-Earth we have hobbits, almost contemporary to Tolkien English rustic folk, we have old Anglosaxons in Rohirrim, we have ancient Roman Empire in Gondor, fae/aelfs/sidhe in Elves, and so on.
And English was formed as Christian country - Anglosaxons conquered Christian Celts and were quickly Christians themselves, so there is no real Pagan England.
King Arthur and Merlin are probably remnants of some pre-English Celtic stories, later modified by ages.

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Jean-Luc Picard is now a wimpy old loser. Luke Skywalker is a pathetic hermit.

It's called getting old and crochety.

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If more and more things become a hate crime, then who will dare even play the old stuff since spy technology is vastly superior to anything the former Soviet Union ever had?

I.
And it most likely won't happen in our lifetime, if anywhere. The alliance between Cult of Mammon and SJWs is... quite fragile, and it can turn in various interesting ways.

Quote
Under normal capitalist rules Marvel comics should have collapsed completely by now, with or without Covid-19, but they are still here. Haven't you wondered how?

Marvel Comics survive precisely because of normal capitalist rules - because it's owner is willing to print them, and has enough money to do it. That's as normal capitalism as it's goes, unless they took some grand government dotations.

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S'mon

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2021, 02:18:06 PM »
So 1e AD&D will survive anything, because it is Mythic.

jhkim

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2021, 05:40:53 PM »
The idea behind deconstructing is in part about trying to convince people that not only aren't classic heroes and epics and whatever any good, but that THEY NEVER WERE. This is why Luke, Picard, and so many others must be ruined and degraded now. Lowest common denominator. We are being hit from all sides at once.

"English" myth includes the earliest (Welsh) Arthurian stories from the dark ages, which are older than Beowulf, which is also an example of English myth.

But you're right to the extent that for example Briton celtic myth outside of Wales was devastated by the cultural invasion of Rome. However, that was an illiterate people with an oral tradition, in a relatively small area. In the modern world, there's literally almost no place on Earth that hasn't heard of Superman. And if the stories survive, it will be the best most appealing stories that survive.

I don't know about the fall of civilization, but I agree with Pundit on the broad point that deconstruction is weak and doesn't have the power of myth. Having bad adaptations or other bad works doesn't destroy the myth. For example, there were many stage and film adaptations of The Wizard of Oz long before the 1939 Judy Garland movie, but they have generally been forgotten. Likewise, bad adaptations like the Star Wars Christmas Special just become a footnote in history and the myth gets re-adapted.

Pundit cites Superman and Star Wars (original series only) as myths that will endure. There have been tons of terrible Superman stories, and he's been reinvented countless times. So a few bad Star Wars or Superman adaptations won't destroy the myth.

Still, it can be hard to see at the time what will survive in the longer term. For example, when I was young in the 1970s, Tarzan showed signs of being an enduring myth. With lots of film and television adaptations over 50 years from the first publication in 1912, it stayed huge in the public consciousness for over 50 years. However, I think since then, Tarzan has faded from consciousness and I think now the myth won't stick around.

As far as D&D goes, though, I think Wrath of God has a fair point -

But Myths survive even the destruction of civilizations. I am definitely not sure if western civilization will survive; but I feel pretty confident that RPGs will, and they won't be the SJW versions of RPGs.

But RPG is not Myth (and even in terms of Myths I'm quite sure we lost vast amounts of them in our history. It's a hobby. Quite niche. Weird combination of hazard games, tactical maps from XIX century armies and traditional paleolithic campfire storytelling. It's short lived, lack massive popularity, and in most countries it's even more niche than in USA. And it generally needs nerds to fluorish. Civilisational collapse can very well take it away. Storytelling will survive of course. Other things... not so sure. Depends of scope.

Something may survive from D&D, but I don't think it would be recognizable as the same as the D&D we know.

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #25 on: October 28, 2021, 05:56:36 PM »
I think predicting what shall stay being a Myth in case of 100 years old (at best) popculture devices is like very imprecise form of divination.

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Something may survive from D&D, but I don't think it would be recognizable as the same as the D&D we know.

In the future technobarbaric society, no one will have time for RPGs as whole reality will turn into one big LARP. However legends of beholders and Space Marines will not be forgotten for next 1400 years, till death of He-Droves-On-Chromium-Bicycle last carpenter-shaman of Wis-Con-Sin-Berg nation.

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So 1e AD&D will survive anything, because it is Mythic.

Unfortunately so is "Wrath of Righteousness" AP for Pazuzu's Pathfinder
« Last Edit: October 28, 2021, 05:58:37 PM by Wrath of God »
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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #26 on: October 28, 2021, 06:39:45 PM »
For example, when I was young in the 1970s, Tarzan showed signs of being an enduring myth. With lots of film and television adaptations over 50 years from the first publication in 1912, it stayed huge in the public consciousness for over 50 years. However, I think since then, Tarzan has faded from consciousness and I think now the myth won't stick around.
Aw now, put your faith in what you most believe in...  ;D

The only reason Tarzan is "fading" is because he's anathema to the Woke and very difficult to adapt towards the woke without ending up at "Tarzan in name only." The books are still around and in the public domain, so its just a matter of time until someone resurrects him. Hopefully as a period piece rather than some modern re-imagining.

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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #27 on: October 28, 2021, 07:23:13 PM »
The only reason Tarzan is "fading" is because he's anathema to the Woke and very difficult to adapt towards the woke without ending up at "Tarzan in name only." The books are still around and in the public domain, so its just a matter of time until someone resurrects him. Hopefully as a period piece rather than some modern re-imagining.
I think Tarzan faded long before Woke. But yeah, they would not approve of him today.


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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #28 on: October 28, 2021, 08:19:25 PM »
Quote
The only reason Tarzan is "fading" is because he's anathema to the Woke and very difficult to adapt towards the woke without ending up at "Tarzan in name only." The books are still around and in the public domain, so its just a matter of time until someone resurrects him. Hopefully as a period piece rather than some modern re-imagining.

There was high budget "Tarzan" film few years ago.
Didn't do much AFAIK and I see no real push for it's return or popularity.
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Re: What You Love About RPGs Will Survive SJWs
« Reply #29 on: October 30, 2021, 01:03:30 AM »
God, I'm a newb to this site and I swear it's like that first breath of fresh air to a drowning man.  8)

53 yr old Grog who started with AD&D in '79. Played every edition except 4th. Experienced some weird stuff at the table the past couple years, and have actually drifted back to a 2E campaign with some like-minded, more mature people as a result, and have been enjoying the hell out of it. I just hate like hell to see my favorite hobby infected with this leftist mental illness that seems to have its hooks into EVERYTHING these days.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2021, 01:16:31 AM by jmarso »