What I like about Nobilis!

James McMurray · November 28, 2006, 03:06:09 PM

I've not finished reading it yet, although I plan to. I also have picked up a copy of Amber to read so I can see both sides of the diceless coin. So far I can't really see what Pundit's problem is. It's obvious he's afraid that Nobilis will ruin his Amber, but they're totally different games with totally different systems used across totally different settings for a totally different audience. About the only thing I've seen in common so far is that they're diceless.

Ian Absentia · November 28, 2006, 03:23:04 PM

Quote from: James McMurraySo far I can't really see what Pundit's problem is. It's obvious he's afraid that Nobilis will ruin his Amber, but they're totally different games with totally different systems used across totally different settings for a totally different audience. About the only thing I've seen in common so far is that they're diceless.

No, you see, there are people out there who like both games! And someone somwhere once suggested that the two be mixed. Nothing came of it, of course, but that doesn't matter. It's apparently for the hearts and minds of these people that The War of the Swine has been engaged.

!i!

James McMurray · November 28, 2006, 03:25:48 PM

Quote from: Ian AbsentiaNo, you see, there are people out there who like both games! And someone somwhere once suggested that the two be mixed. Nothing came of it, of course, but that doesn't matter. It's apparently for the hearts and minds of these people that The War of the Swine has been engaged.

!i!

DEAR GODS NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I mean, um... huh? Well... Ok.

RPGPundit · November 28, 2006, 06:28:54 PM

I'm glad you bought a copy of Amber, and trust that you will find the game well worth your time.

RPGPundit

James McMurray · November 28, 2006, 09:02:06 PM

It looks interesting, but I may not be able to convince my group to play it. We likes us some diceseses. Nobilis might be a slightly easier sell, since it actually has some player input into whether or not you win or lose a fight.

We won't know either way for a while, as I've got a few months left with my Babylon 5 campaign at least, and another GM is prepping to run Silhouette (campaign setting based on Necromunda).

RPGPundit · November 28, 2006, 10:26:35 PM

Amber has more player input. Its all in how well you describe what you're doing, and how clever you, the player, are in figuring out what your character can and should do.

No mechanics to get in the way of that. Amber is like chess. You know exactly what your moves are, and the genius is in knowing how to combine them the right way.

RPGPundit

James McMurray · November 28, 2006, 10:55:06 PM

Sorry, we like mechanics. Amber might not fit at all.

The Yann Waters · November 29, 2006, 09:25:27 AM

Quote from: James McMurraySo far I can't really see what Pundit's problem is. It's obvious he's afraid that Nobilis will ruin his Amber, but they're totally different games with totally different systems used across totally different settings for a totally different audience. About the only thing I've seen in common so far is that they're diceless.

For some reason, the best-known diceless games have generally tended to operate on a superhuman power level, which is also one similarity between Nob and Amber: both feature noble families of demigods who rule worlds unknown to common mortals.

James McMurray · November 29, 2006, 10:47:12 AM

True, they have a similar power level, but that's about where the similarities end.

lastspartacus · August 19, 2009, 02:50:31 AM

Id like to chime in here and voice my strong support of Nobilis, which is a beautiful and original game, though quite difficult to grasp even after some playing in its mind bending concept.

To say diceless games are not RPG's, when they take away dice and add more ROLE PLAYING to further the story, is absurd.

The fact that it is a difficult concept game to grasp for most is no reason to shun it, the fact that the critics must shape their characters around strictly defined and small parameters and stare at the rollings of dice to determine their character's actions to suspend themselves in a game world is no reason to abuse the gamers who don't have to.

Nazgul · August 19, 2009, 04:26:49 AM

Random drivel does not good prose make.

The Yann Waters · August 19, 2009, 05:29:02 AM

So strange, seeing someone revive ancient Nob threads around here when it's not me: it feels a little like winding up in a bizarre mirror universe.

The Worid · August 19, 2009, 09:48:56 AM

Quote from: James McMurray;47979That's pretty much every story told in the last 100 years (or more). It's pretty well agreed on by large chunks of the literary circle that there are only 36 real stories to be told

"Well agreed". Except for the ones who think that it's 72 or what not, or the swaths of people who think that theory is a load of crap (like me). There are only that many stories when you create a restrictive, artificial definition of "story" and proceed to gleefully ignore all details that would contradict you as unimportant.
Moreover, I challenge you to fit a good SF short story into one of your little boxes. One of the sort that present an idea and is over; not much for a crackpot theorist to work with.

The Yann Waters · August 20, 2009, 04:51:34 AM

Quote from: lastspartacus;321968To say diceless games are not RPG's, when they take away dice and add more ROLE PLAYING to further the story, is absurd.

Incidentally, it tends to be that "game" part of RPGs which some folks just can't see in diceless play. But personally I doubt that removing randomizers necessarily leads to better RP, since there's no inherent connection between mechanical complexity and whether the system relies on random chance or not. Some diced games are lighter in crunch than Nobilis, after all.

RPGPundit · August 20, 2009, 02:00:02 PM

Quote from: lastspartacus;321968Id like to chime in here and voice my strong support of Nobilis, which is a beautiful and original game, though quite difficult to grasp even after some playing in its mind bending concept.

To say diceless games are not RPG's, when they take away dice and add more ROLE PLAYING to further the story, is absurd.

The fact that it is a difficult concept game to grasp for most is no reason to shun it, the fact that the critics must shape their characters around strictly defined and small parameters and stare at the rollings of dice to determine their character's actions to suspend themselves in a game world is no reason to abuse the gamers who don't have to.

Its not "difficult to grasp", you cunt. Its BADLY WRITTEN.
Its an incredibly simplistic game that's been written in the most godawfully verbally-diuretic way possible to make it sound all twee and clever, so that assholes can make themselves feel like they're intellectual hipsters for playing it.

Its made so that people with no talent can feel smart and special. But it actually sucks both as a book and a game.

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