What do you determine first when creating a character, personality or attributes?

Marleycat · November 27, 2012, 11:21:50 PM

Personality/Concept first because if point build you need a focus if random roll you can't count on "good" numbers, and spreads are a meh middle ground most times. Unless it's whack like 4e.

@Melan, you became a mod? Very cool sir. Or are you doing that fun Ladybird European thing?

mythusmage · November 27, 2012, 11:54:49 PM

I prefer to start for race (and nationality) because they can affect skills, social matters, and the question of how the character got to where he was.

Then social class, since that affects available occupation (Vocation) followed by stats (I think, it's been awhile).

There are 18 stats to roll for, but there are rules as to where rolls can go, with "Capacity" having the highest numbers and "Power" and "Speed" numbers no better than equal to Capacity under each of the six Categories.

There are matters such as wealth and property, skills, and birth rank among other things to consider, but that's the start.

Votan · November 28, 2012, 12:31:25 AM

I like to start with an idea of who this might be and go from there. I guess there might be some exceptions (like when you roll random attributes in order) where I might roll first and then ask what interesting take I can have on the scores. You definitely discover depth during play, but if I don't start with a concept it is a thin line to my wargamer roots taking over (and that never turn out well),

Marleycat · November 28, 2012, 12:47:43 AM

Quote from: Votan;602986I like to start with an idea of who this might be and go from there. I guess there might be some exceptions (like when you roll random attributes in order) where I might roll first and then ask what interesting take I can have on the scores. You definitely discover depth during play, but if I don't start with a concept it is a thin line to my wargamer roots taking over (and that never turn out well),

You aren't alone. I am not a Wargamer but I am double Capricorn so I understand the mindset.

My inner powergaming rules lawyer takes over if I don't have a real concept first. Given "numbers" seduce me with their evil siren call.

Planet Algol · November 28, 2012, 01:17:03 AM

I might come to the table with a silly idea that amuses me for a character, such as like one of those fussy retired British military officers from British media or a corny country music star, but the dice and "formative adventuring" really determine what the character's personality will be.

I may come to the game intending to play Kurt Russel, but the ability score rolls determine whether it's a Snake Pliskin, a Jack Burton or a Captain Ron.

I don't currently play in games where I get to arrange or buy ability scores, when when I did play 4d6 drop lowest and arrange to taste I freely admit to ruthlessly arranging the score for the optimal permutations for the particular game system.

Maybe that's why I prefer random ability scores, I end up playing fat middle-aged texas oil millionaires, goofy inept Kurt Russel, balding disgraced pill-addict doctors, and retarded Russian circus strongmen instead of Batman?

Marleycat · November 28, 2012, 01:36:02 AM

Quote from: Planet Algol;602995I might come to the table with a silly idea that amuses me for a character, such as like one of those fussy retired British military officers from British media or a corny country music star, but the dice and "formative adventuring" really determine what the character's personality will be.

I may come to the game intending to play Kurt Russel, but the ability score rolls determine whether it's a Snake Pliskin, a Jack Burton or a Captain Ron.

I don't currently play in games where I get to arrange or buy ability scores, when when I did play 4d6 drop lowest and arrange to taste I freely admit to ruthlessly arranging the score for the optimal permutations for the particular game system.

Maybe that's why I prefer random ability scores, I end up playing fat middle-aged texas oil millionaires, goofy inept Kurt Russel, balding disgraced pill-addict doctors, and retarded Russian circus strongmen instead of Batman?

Just a request...stop messing with Kurt! That man is sexy.

Planet Algol · November 28, 2012, 01:40:34 AM

Leave Kurt alone you say?

Spoiler

New Magic Item: Scroll of Summoning Aspect of Kurt Russell
These scrolls are similar to protection scroll in that characters of any class are capable of utilizing them. Unlike most scrolls they feature an illustration of a rugged, handsome human male with a beard or stubble and great hair. When read 1d6 rounds later an aspect of Kurt Russel appears. This aspect of Kurt Russel will willingly aid any non-evil user of the scroll as long it does not involve outright villainy and will be present for 24 hours before disappearing back into time and space. Roll on the below table to determine which aspect of Kurt Russell appears; any harm inflicted to an aspect will not affect the real Kurt Russell of our world. All aspects of Kurt Russell have maximum hit dice and a +2 bonus on all saving throw rolls.

d10
1 Dexter Riley (8th-level scientist; 17 intelligence and charisma; 1d6: 1-2 19 intelligence, 3-4 can become invisible at will, 5-6 hill giant strength)
2 Elvis (8th-level bard/monk; 18 charisma; carries 1-3 handguns)
3 Snake Plisskin (8th-level fighting-man/thief; 17 strength, dexterity, constitution and charisma)
4 R.J. McReady (8th level fighting-man & helicopter pilot; 17 strength, wisdom, dexterity, constitution and charisma; carries either a firearm (50%) or a flamethrower (50%))
5 Jack Burton (1st-level fighting-man but believes he is 8th level and actually has the maximum hit points of an 8th-level fighting-man; drops held weapon or pratfalls on any attack roll of 1 or 2 but will kill any supernatural opponents on an attack roll of 20; all allies within view get +1 on all attack rolls and +2 on all saving throws)
6 Captain Ron (8th level thief and sailor; 17 constitution and charisma)
7 Wyatt Earp (8th-level fighting-man; 17 dexterity, constitution and charisma; carries a long-barrel revolver that he can pistol whip with for 1-6 damage)
8 "Jack" O'Neil (8th-level fighting-man; 17 strength, dexterity, constitution and charisma; carries an automatic pistol and a tactical nuke)
9 Todd (8th-level fighting-man; 17 strength, dexterity and constitution; 3 charisma)
10 Actor Kurt Russell (8th-level fighting-man; 17 charisma)

Marleycat · November 28, 2012, 01:40:50 AM

Totally agree about point buy or arrays. I am ruthless and random roll makes it fun. Or it makes me walk out. Either works for the group.

Xavier Onassiss · November 28, 2012, 01:42:15 AM

I can go either way on this, but I get my best results if I start with some idea of the character's background. Personality comes next, then all the mechanical fiddly bits. I've found it's possible to do these steps in any order, but my best characters are the ones that started out as an actual idea for a fictional person, rather than a bunch of statistics, or god forbid, random numbers.

Disclaimer: any discussion of my personal creative process should not be construed as a "one true way" argument. This is what works for me. Whatever works for you, then you do that, okay?

Marleycat · November 28, 2012, 01:45:23 AM

Consider that scroll stolen for EVERY game I run and a possible scroll I create as a player! End of story.

You seriously know how hilarious that would be in a MtAw game? And fitting while actually useful? Damn Thyrsus. You even D10ed for me.!:D

MGuy · November 28, 2012, 01:54:07 AM

I suppose it would technically be personality but background comes at a close second. I say technically because usually the personality I make with my characters is linked to something else (usually the background itself) but I'd have to say that the first thing I come up with would be the personality. Am I going to be a coward? A leader? A genius? Who knows? Usually I make the decision right before I worry about the rest.

StormBringer · November 28, 2012, 02:21:31 AM

I know it's trite, but it really depends. For most Vintage Games, I like to have attributes and a class worked out first. In Justin's PbP game here, I decided ahead of time to use the Cry Havoc counter of Sgt Llewellyn as a template and see what he would look like in 3.x. I think he turned out pretty well, but 3.x has a point-buy option, so I had a good deal of control over that. I might have had to dice up a half dozen or more characters before I got something resembling the Sgt Llewellyn I had in my head, although a grouping of slightly above average scores probably would have done it in a Vintage context. High scores in OD&D were a minor bonus, in AD&D they were more helpful, if not necessarily more important. Ability scores have a fairly larger impact on the assumptions of 3.x, from my understanding, hence low scores are less easily smoothed over.

Melan · November 28, 2012, 02:32:28 AM

Quote from: Marleycat;602974@Melan, you became a mod? Very cool sir. Or are you doing that fun Ladybird European thing?

My status is of no concern to mere users. Do not bring up this issue again.

Marleycat · November 28, 2012, 03:55:38 AM

Quote from: Melan;603040My status is of no concern to mere users. Do not bring up this issue again.

You rock and roll on Melan, why should I ever care that you're a boy/girl /cat?

He said "users" just like Tron. Awesome.

I consider you a spiritual brother. I apologize if my words were insulting. In my family it's a sign of respect and sometimes love.

RPGPundit · November 29, 2012, 01:11:18 AM

Stats rolled first, randomly. The personality is then determined by what makes sense from the rolls. That's by far the best way to do it.

It helps, for starters, to avoid the problem you get from an important percentage of players in non-randomized games, where they basically keep making the same one or two characters over and over again. The randomness fuels everyone's creativity.

RPGPundit