Today I stumbled in my forgotten copy of the "Mage" conversion for GURPS, in a dusty drawer, and I all of sudden rememberd that they *had* converted some WW books for GURPS before things went awry.

This happened during my "I-almost-quit-playing-RPGs" period, so I didn't follow the fracas. I only remember that there was some Jasonbournish (*) exchange between WW and SJ Games, and then the project of converting the other titles stopped.

Well, my curiosity is back. Does anyone know/remembers what actually happened?

(*) Jasonbournish (adj.): an hard to follow controversy that, in form, expression and words resembles an all-out unchoreographed fight seen through incomprehensible shakycam.

This is the first I've heard of any kind of controversy. Something went awry?

I don't have any inside knowledge. I just remember working at a game store when we found out that there wasn't going to be any more SJ conversions. We were selling them like hotcakes and tons of people that didn't play white wolf were getting them.

I remember the guy who ran the shop said that he thought that WW didn't think anyone would buy them, and when they turned out to be so popular they became a direct threat. /shrug

This thread and links off it seem to have the best info you'll get: http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=19401

Quote from: Cranewings;447901I remember the guy who ran the shop said that he thought that WW didn't think anyone would buy them, and when they turned out to be so popular they became a direct threat. /shrug

That's basically how I remember it going.  Imagine the contempt WW would have had for a "roll-playing not role-playing" system like GURPS.  They would have thought SJ was on a fool's errand.

RPGPundit

I suppose it just goes to show how disconnected WW was from gaming, and how right SJG go it.

Quote from: Cranewings;447901I remember the guy who ran the shop said that he thought that WW didn't think anyone would buy them, and when they turned out to be so popular they became a direct threat. /shrug

I heard the same thing at the time. It happened right while I was exiting the industry, so I got only rumors.

It is an old story, but after reading reading the two versions at the link previously given it is worth noticing how SJ is irate but factual, while WW "answer" doesn't explain s*it.

However (for what is worth) I also remember when "Fallout" (the PC RPG) was going to be a direct conversion of GURPS for the PC. When Interplay/Black Isle decided to drop GURPS and create a new system I asked them what happened (at that year's ECTS in London IIRC). All I got (unofficially) from Interplay was that "Working with SJ is like having an ulcer". So between SJ and WW must have been a sort of Clash of Titans

I heard this of all things was the straw that broke the camel's back.

Quote from: The Butcher;447971I heard this of all things was the straw that broke the camel's back.

If it is true it was totally worth it ^^

Quote from: The Butcher;447971I heard this of all things was the straw that broke the camel's back.

Pundit will LOVE that - possibly the very first reference ever to the Pretentious Swine that he loathes.

IF thats true - then that means the disagreement was actually because WW didn't want to admit to having no sense of humor and SJG maybe went for the joke too much.

- Ed C.

(I'd love it if this was truly what caused the rift between the two)

Porkavian :teehee:

Quote from: The Butcher;447971I heard this of all things was the straw that broke the camel's back.

That's just... uncanny.

RPGPundit

Quote from: Reckall;447968However (for what is worth) I also remember when "Fallout" (the PC RPG) was going to be a direct conversion of GURPS for the PC. When Interplay/Black Isle decided to drop GURPS and create a new system I asked them what happened (at that year's ECTS in London IIRC). All I got (unofficially) from Interplay was that "Working with SJ is like having an ulcer". So between SJ and WW must have been a sort of Clash of Titans

I have heard more people live and online who consider Steve Jackson to be an enormous douchenozzle than I have who like him.

He seems to have a personality inverse from his talent at game designing.

(Ogre is a fucking CLASSIC, and one of the finest wargames ever made.)

Any deal that goes south between SJG and any other company is probably Steve's fault from all known evidence.

Shit, I know people who won't buy anything he makes or has made just out of having 1 con interaction with him.

I guess Big Steve is the anti Jolly Blackburn.

Jolly and the company he works for are GOOD PEOPLE but they generally make things I wouldn't play for free.

Big Steve is apparently a massive dickhead but has made some of gaming's best products.

I am gonna feel SO DIRTY preordering Ogre 6th edition.  Not that it will stop me mind you.

Captain Rufus,


.......HOWEVER.......

There was a con in Kentucky in 1997 or so where Steve Jackson was a guest and he was great there - friendly, got along with everybody, did demos of games and generally left a good impression.

It might just all depend on context and which year and which con you meet him at.

On the other hand - "Kromm", Sean Punch - who is the primary line editor for GURPS is a heck of a nice guy in-person.

Still, I beginning to think its a case of White Wolf had no sense of humor and SJ Games did.

- Ed C.


Hell, at one GEN CON I'm pretty sure I got Andrew Hackard to crack a grin - and everybody online seems to diuslike him because he's a moderator.