Actually, I think 4e would have been a GREAT computer game; a computer handling all the bookkeeping would have sped up the game immensely (but please don't ask me to prove that).

Heck, I'd still reach for my walled if a 4e-based fantasy RPG came out on the computer.

Quote from: Doom;888505Actually, I think 4e would have been a GREAT computer game; a computer handling all the bookkeeping would have sped up the game immensely (but please don't ask me to prove that).

Heck, I'd still reach for my walled if a 4e-based fantasy RPG came out on the computer.

Neverwinter online is basically 4E (Without skills), and it's not bad.

Quote from: Doom;888505Actually, I think 4e would have been a GREAT computer game; a computer handling all the bookkeeping would have sped up the game immensely (but please don't ask me to prove that).

Heck, I'd still reach for my walled if a 4e-based fantasy RPG came out on the computer.

Actually, it's a better Board game than RPG.  Seeing as they're still selling them.

Quote from: Doom;888505Actually, I think 4e would have been a GREAT computer game; a computer handling all the bookkeeping would have sped up the game immensely (but please don't ask me to prove that).

Heck, I'd still reach for my walled if a 4e-based fantasy RPG came out on the computer.

I'll never touch the 4E tabletop game again, but I'd throw good money at a 4E CRPG in the vein of ToEE (ideally with fewer major bugs).

Quote from: Doom;888505Actually, I think 4e would have been a GREAT computer game; a computer handling all the bookkeeping would have sped up the game immensely (but please don't ask me to prove that).

Heck, I'd still reach for my walled if a 4e-based fantasy RPG came out on the computer.

For a while there was bounce around the idea of adapting FRUA/DC over to 4e as it was a perfect fit in terms of gameplay on a grid when combat starts. Like alot of UA/DC concepts. As of last check several years ago it had puttered out. Much like the greatly lamented never finished Star Frontiers project which I did all the sprites for based on all the counters from the boxed sets.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;888571Actually, it's a better Board game than RPG.  Seeing as they're still selling them.

Dont think the now four board games use the 4e system. They use some very simplified combat structure. Havent had a chance to really look at it yet though so cant say.

I know some players combined 4e with D&D HeroScape rather than using HeroScapes system which was most definitely not D&D.

And Lords od Waterdeep is even further removed as is Dungeon, which even the original did not use D&D's system.

Quote from: Omega;888602Dont think the now four board games use the 4e system. They use some very simplified combat structure. Havent had a chance to really look at it yet though so cant say.

I know some players combined 4e with D&D HeroScape rather than using HeroScapes system which was most definitely not D&D.

And Lords od Waterdeep is even further removed as is Dungeon, which even the original did not use D&D's system.

They're still selling all the board games, though.  Which is still using the 4e engine as a base.  Personally, I rather like them.

Quote from: Omega;888602Dont think the now four board games use the 4e system. They use some very simplified combat structure. Havent had a chance to really look at it yet though so cant say.

I know some players combined 4e with D&D HeroScape rather than using HeroScapes system which was most definitely not D&D.

And Lords od Waterdeep is even further removed as is Dungeon, which even the original did not use D&D's system.

The board games use a very light version of 4e...you roll a D20 to hit, and past that the resemblance is arguable. I lean towards saying it's "4e light", but I can accept how reasonable people can disagree on that.

They're kind of fun, for a little while, but it's monster whack-a-mole, once you get the hang of it there's no there, there, as far as replay value. I guess you could say the board games use a "fixed" version of 4e, to give some idea of what you'd have to do to 4e to make it run clean.

Lords of Waterdeep and Dungeon! are license properties...there's no way at all to call those 4e systems, you don't even use a D20 anywhere in the game.

Quote from: Christopher Brady;888612They're still selling all the board games, though.  Which is still using the 4e engine as a base.  Personally, I rather like them.

Just looked at the rules PDF WOTC has up on their site. Does look like it uses at least some 4e elements. But its definitely not using the 4e engine aside from some terms, maybe the skills and the baser combat system. The characters arent useing 4es system for HP as one example and monsters are using their own movement system as another at a glance.

Tom Vasel has a very good review of Castle Ravenloft and the other three sets.

As for still using the system. That is because each new set has to be backwards compatible. So they are still using the 4e-like system even now as they can not switch out without losing that compatibility with the rest of the series.

There has been talk of a new 5e based co-op. But so far WOTC seems to be looking to other things.

Rogue

Combat

1. Bloodied. Cheap Shots. (choose one of XYZ status effects to add to your attacks.)
2. Downed Ally. The Art of Vengeance. (unleash the scary venoms and tricks of the trade. define with help of GM.)
3. Last Stand/Sacrifice. Fearless Lunges. (backstabs on charges, target's facing and awareness doesn't matter.)

Explore

1. Evidence/Slip Up. Second Nature Training. (muscle memory catches what escaped your attention.)
2. Exposed. Preternatural Escape. (when all your training sings together.)
3. Cornered. That'll Never Work... (sometimes those old or crazy tricks do work!)

Social

1. Faux Pas. Uncanny Mimic. (ape the savoir faire of the nearest visible suave person. can lead to funny mannerisms.)
2. Gross Breach. Fast Talk & Flattery. (distract and entrance with words. a little goes a long way before your hand is called.)
3. Grave Insult. Precious Bribes. (offer something precious for forgiveness — or plot to take something precious in revenge.)

I'm not sure I would tinker with the mechanics of 4E much. The problem a lot of people seem to have with 4E (including the people who wrote modules for WotC) is using it to run traditional dungeon-crawls. It's a terrible system for adventures with lots and lots of combat encounters. 4E works perfectly fine for more heroic play, featuring role-playing, investigation, and exploration, where you have 2-3 dramatic combats per session.

Quote from: Haffrung;888759I'm not sure I would tinker with the mechanics of 4E much. The problem a lot of people seem to have with 4E (including the people who wrote modules for WotC) is using it to run traditional dungeon-crawls. It's a terrible system for adventures with lots and lots of combat encounters. 4E works perfectly fine for more heroic play, featuring role-playing, investigation, and exploration, where you have 2-3 dramatic combats per session.

I came from this very same perspective just recently. However Daztur's ideas to look at it through an epic saga lens, especially the notable divergence like surges and minion rules, intrigued. I am actually now curious whether a mix of 4e minion rules & 1-2e fighter attacks v. <1HD equal to fighter level, along with a surges hybrid as strat/tactics super moves pool, could pull off that mix of extra combats and attrition.

Checking random chargen (3d6 straight down)
12, 13, 11, 12, 4, 14

Cleric would be odd, but depending on non-AEDU spell equations *could* work.

I'm going to use a middle-aged grandma for these 4 classes, just because. I won't add the triggers for space and redundancy reasons.

First, fighter.

Nan, the Rolling Pin Brava
Human 2nd level Fighter, 1st tier.

Bio
Defended her family homestead with her rolling pin and pet sow after her menfolk were conscripted. Her legend thus spread throughout the county. Now she's teaching other mothers how to form militias for when their menfolk are conscripted. A bit naive thinking this won't upset "the powers that be."

ABILITIES
Human: chose +2 WIS.

STR: 12 (0). CON: 13 (+1). DEX: 11 (0). INT: 12 (0). WIS: 6 (-1). CHA: 14 (+1)

HIT POINTS
34 HP

Hero Points
Hero Points = 3.  Tier Hero Points = 1.

Armor Class
Cloth Armor (Apron) + Small Shield (Wicker Basket)
AC 11, 12 with shield

Saves

Fort = 13.     Refl = 12, 13 with Small Shield.   Will = 11.

Skills

14 Bluff (CHA)
11 Endurance (CON) (cross-class)
6 Heal (WIS)
14 Intimidate (CHA)

Attacks
proficiency: Improvised Household Tools.
STR/DEX/CHA to-hit = 5/4/5 (4/3/4 ranged).

Triggers
Cleverly reskin some to include the pet sow.

Rogue

Mamacita San, of Mamacita San's Traveling Burlesque Circus
Human 2nd level Rogue, 1st tier.

Bio
A sex worker refuge from their legal denial to trade unionism. Mamacita San uses their outsider status to fight against this injustice by scraping a living, and a pension for their aging members. Vive les libertines!

ABILITIES
Human: chose +2 DEX

STR: 12 (0). CON: 13 (+1). DEX: 13 (+1). INT: 12 (0). WIS: 4 (-2). CHA: 14 (+1).

HIT POINTS
12+con score+(5/add lvl) = 30 HP

Hero Points
Hero Points = 3. Tier Hero Points = 1.

Armor Class
Cloth (slinky) + Small Shield (big scarf)
AC 11, 12 with shield

Saves

Fort = 12. Refl = 13, 14 with Small Shield. Will = 11.

Skills

4 Insight (WIS)
4 Perception (WIS)
13 Stealth (DEX)
14 Streetwise (CHA)
13 Thievery (DEX)

Attacks
proficiency: simple, Improvised Boudoir Items.
STR/DEX/CHA to-hit = 5/5/5 (4/4/4 ranged).

Triggers
Cleverly reskin some to include Octopussy circus troupe tricks.