Quote from: RPGPundit;667824I would also like to hear more concrete information about why people will feel one edition is better than the other.

I think they're both pretty poor as Traveller systems go. But, in MGT's defense, it's at least presented as a game, and recognizable as such. T5 looks, and reads, like a dense technical manual with a game buried deep within.

Quote from: flyerfan1991;668033Then what is GT?  GURPS merely using the Third Imperium as a setting?

That's precisely what GT is. When did anyone think differently?

Quote from: Fiasco;667914I'm sorry to derail this thread but where did you find that Ad&D 1.5?

Look for AD&D via Christopher Perkins. It's easy to find. Very nice work, too!

Quote from: Warthur;668047That's precisely what GT is. When did anyone think differently?

Well, that little Traveller logo might imply differently.

Quote from: danbuter;668062Look for AD&D via Christopher Perkins. It's easy to find. Very nice work, too!

Are you talking about this?

http://www.adnd3egame.com/cnc.htm#rulesckmaterials

Quote from: jeff37923;667850I'll tell you right now that they are two different versions of the same game designed for two different audiences of that same game.

All hail Captain Obvious!

Quote from: Warthur;667861when MongTrav first emerged it was said that it and T5 would be mutually complementary versions of each other.

That was weird how one guy posted that myth, about MgT and T5 being developed together, and all the Miller fanboys sucked down hard on it like a bunch of Kissing Gourami.  T5 was just a computer render and book prop in 2007 (see //www.traveller5.com).  T5 wouldn't have actual play rules until mid-2010.  And even some of those rules got scrapped and re-written during the 11th hour of T5's release.

Quote from: Warthur;667898The core book art is terrible, I agree, though I can't think of any time when art has been a strong point of Traveller. And I like the fact that it reflects various types of SF universe from the hard to the ridiculous, which supports the really nice thing MongTrav does of keeping the system recognisably Traveller whilst opening it up just enough to support a range of universes beyond those with the Third Imperium's core assumptions.

Well put.

Quote from: Silverlion;667903Alright, I'm confused. The "Skill Packages" in my version of Mongoose Traveller, unless I'm mistaken, are things you give one skill from your campaign style to each character to make sure each character has a useful skill.

True.  But it offends some people though.

Quote from: Opaopajr;667909And break down a combat in both versus a horde of fleeing Gungan/Ewok/Kender victims? Casualties welcomed.

NPCs cannot be killed by pistol fire in Traveller 5.  No damage is done to NPCs.  Does that mean there was no combat?

Quote from: Fiasco;667914I wish I could contribute to this debate but I'm a heathen who connected with Stars Without Number in a way I never could with Traveller.

Nothing heathen about finding a system that works for your group's RPG and setting.

Quote from: daniel_ream;668022My issue with the MongTrav lifepath system is the same as with FGU's Daredevils - the aging penalties take so long to kick in that character creation tends to produce characters in their forties.  I prefer my Big Damn Heroes to be in their physical prime, and a kid who's crazy good at one specific thing is almost impossible.  It's not a big deal, to some extent that is the point of the lifepath system, to make exceptional characters exceptional.

With my MgT character generator software, I'm gonna change the 4-year term to 2-year terms instead (34+ is still the age where attributes begin to decline), just to see if 30-year-olds are too powerful with skills.

Quote from: flyerfan1991;668033Then what is GT?  GURPS merely using the Third Imperium as a setting?

GURPS tech levels are tweaked slightly to match Traveller tech levels.  And there is no Traveller CharGen mini-game in GURPS.  Most of the game is GURPS characters running around in a Traveller universe though.  There's no draw to get GURPS players to use the Traveller uinverse though.  They already use GURPS Space for their sci-fi fix.  GURPS Traveller 2nd edition for GURPS 3e has excellent source material.

Quote from: Warthur;667861To be honest, it's kind of tragic that this thread has to exist in the first place because when MongTrav first emerged it was said that it and T5 would be mutually complementary versions of each other.

And you BELIEVED them??

jg

Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;668113True.  But it offends some people though.

Strange, especially since its an option..

Quote from: Silverlion;668136Strange, especially since its an option.

This was brought up in a Traveller G+ Hangout recently.  Players joined in with their characters already made, and each person read off their list of enemies, contacts, allies they had that they thought was interesting to their backstory or for the referee to make an NPC for use later.  We then decided which of the other players would make a good match from someone's list.  That was another fun part of CharGen.

But, ya, it's totally optional.  When I first read the rule as written in 2009, I kind of went.. what the hell is this?  Then I read it again (in context)... sounds pretty cool enough.

Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;668113All hail Captain Obvious!

Then if it is so obvious, how did this possibly get by you? It is OK if you say that you have been blinded by your own irrational hate ever since the Kickstarter happened.

So far, for T5 we either have smoke but no fire or all hat and no cattle depending on which side you are on.  Specifics you corksucking iceholes!

NPCs can't get killed by a pistol and there is no ammo?  More info.

A ship-building system with not a single ship?  What about detailed examples?  

Do we have a toolkit that allows us to make anything but doesn't show how you make the world Tatooine, the race of Dralasites, the psionics of Zhodani, a phase plasma rifle in the 40watt range or even the Free Trader Beowulf?

Show us the money or show us the money wasted, or shut the fuck up!

Jeff and Shawn watching you guys spar with facts would be a lot more interesting then watching you bump dickheads.

Quote from: flyerfan1991;668098Well, that little Traveller logo might imply differently.

What, in the same way that the logo on GURPS Vampire made you expect more than GURPS in the World of Darkness or the logo on GURPS Bunnies & Burrows made you expect more than GURPS rules for Bunnies-based campaigns?

GURPS books based on other published RPGs have always been about a) providing setting material from the RPG in question (in Traveller's case, the Third Imperium) and b) providing GURPS rules for running stuff in that setting. GURPS Traveller is no different and I truly, honestly struggle to see what more you could have expected from it.

Quote from: CRKrueger;668168NPCs can't get killed by a pistol...?

Feel free to buy the T5 book and check for yourself.

Quote from: CRKrueger;668168NPCs can't get killed by a pistol and there is no ammo?

That begins to sound story-gamey to me.
Maybe this thread is in the wrong forum...?

Quote from: Shawn Driscoll;668177Feel free to buy the T5 book and check for yourself.

*sigh* I'd rather not. Why not just tell us? The acrimony suffused with allusions to the text is becoming comical now.

Are the makers that blindingly technocratic that mere mortals cannot make killable NPCs? Or did they forget to include hit points or something? Seriously, is the book a functional RPG, or a delightful compendium of algorithms for universe building?