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Author Topic: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld  (Read 2819 times)

GeekyBugle

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The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« on: May 20, 2022, 10:55:05 PM »
Okay, The Torus isn't a Ringworld, it's a tube that forms a ring. Thus no atmosphere is lost unless the part that faces the star is pierced.

Gravitation engines make sure it stays in the correct alignment with it's star.

The days all have the same lenght, so do the nights, the light darkness cycle divides the day in perfect halves. It's created by a ring of screens that float between the star and the torus tied to the structure by electromagnetism.

The floor of the structure is perfectly opaque to all forms of radiation, the roof on the other hand lets light pass in all the spectrum while blocking all the other types of radiation.

Who built it?
Why?
Are they still around?
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David Johansen

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2022, 11:28:08 PM »
1. Engineering students built it.  They weren't human engineering students but the principle is basically the same.  Someone said it couldn't be done and away they went.  The post build bender hasn't ended yet.

2. A low AI nano swarm built it as a result of a coding error.  It was supposed to be a single planet but there was an unexpected recursion loop and insufficient concentrated processing power to correct it. The nano swarm was a self deconstructing one that turned into the topsoil on completion.  A low level concentration of functional nanobots maintains the torus and affects repairs.

3. A god-like alien entity that is the integrated sum of an entire society created it with the intent of creating a utopian society.  Upon completion the structure was judged non-viable for the project and abandoned without creating the intended population.  They left behind a high predation ecology with mega-fauna just to make it interesting.

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GeekyBugle

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2022, 11:40:05 PM »
1. Engineering students built it.  They weren't human engineering students but the principle is basically the same.  Someone said it couldn't be done and away they went.  The post build bender hasn't ended yet.

2. A low AI nano swarm built it as a result of a coding error.  It was supposed to be a single planet but there was an unexpected recursion loop and insufficient concentrated processing power to correct it. The nano swarm was a self deconstructing one that turned into the topsoil on completion.  A low level concentration of functional nanobots maintains the torus and affects repairs.

3. A god-like alien entity that is the integrated sum of an entire society created it with the intent of creating a utopian society.  Upon completion the structure was judged non-viable for the project and abandoned without creating the intended population.  They left behind a high predation ecology with mega-fauna just to make it interesting.

I like number 3.

So there's no intelligent life on it?

If there is where did it come from? Different waves of colonizers from different species?

Part of the mega-fauna are giant nigh immortal worms buried so they eat the dirt from the seas and deposit their refuse on the mountain tops. Thus solving the erosion problem.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2022, 12:14:32 AM by GeekyBugle »
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Shawn Driscoll

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2022, 01:36:52 AM »
Okay, The Torus isn't a Ringworld, it's a tube that forms a ring. Thus no atmosphere is lost unless the part that faces the star is pierced.

Gravitation engines make sure it stays in the correct alignment with it's star.

The days all have the same lenght, so do the nights, the light darkness cycle divides the day in perfect halves. It's created by a ring of screens that float between the star and the torus tied to the structure by electromagnetism.

The floor of the structure is perfectly opaque to all forms of radiation, the roof on the other hand lets light pass in all the spectrum while blocking all the other types of radiation.

Who built it?
Why?
Are they still around?
Reminds me of Startopia. So I will say there are maintenance bots that still work on the thing to keep stuff running.

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2022, 02:04:29 AM »
Small change: The floating thingys for the night/day cyvle? Forget it.

The roof is made of a smart material that simulates both dawn/dusk and night by regulating the amount of light. This same material is able to change the incidence angle of the light thus simulating the seassons.
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Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

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Pat

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2022, 09:14:21 AM »
I would probably make sense if the structure was composed of individual modules, and a thread of some super-strong material that strings them together. Creating a tube with a diameter of 2 AU in one go, after all, seems prohibitively difficult. It would be easier to create independent modules, say the size of a world or a moon, then spin a giant piece of thread around the Sun, and attach them. This allows the tubeworld to grow incrementally over time, starting with just a relative handful of modules attached to a naked string, and then gradually filling out the ring. This allows older generation modules mixed with newer generation modules, and if we assume it's a polysocietal or even multi-species construct, then you can have modules in completely different styles and with different living environments.

Pat

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2022, 09:37:10 AM »
There's also the mass problem. Creating a torus that huge might require stripping several solar systems of material. Which would be easier in the galactic core, where the stars are much closer to each other. But the core isn't friendly to a lot of life. So it might make sense to build the string in the core, and then starting traveling to more hospitable regions. How? Make the string magnetic, and use it to manipulate the Sun, turning it into a giant stellar engine. Then begin the journey toward the outer rim of the galaxy. This would take millions of years, long enough to start to fill in the torus with modules from new galactic civilizations, as the torus passes into regions they find hospitable. And why stop there? Maybe the ultimate purpose of the tour isn't just to tour the galaxy, but to escape the galaxy. This is a giant solar system-sized spaceship that's going on a billion-year journey to explore the Local Group.

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2022, 11:22:39 AM »
I would probably make sense if the structure was composed of individual modules, and a thread of some super-strong material that strings them together. Creating a tube with a diameter of 2 AU in one go, after all, seems prohibitively difficult. It would be easier to create independent modules, say the size of a world or a moon, then spin a giant piece of thread around the Sun, and attach them. This allows the tubeworld to grow incrementally over time, starting with just a relative handful of modules attached to a naked string, and then gradually filling out the ring. This allows older generation modules mixed with newer generation modules, and if we assume it's a polysocietal or even multi-species construct, then you can have modules in completely different styles and with different living environments.

The idea isn't bad, I like it, what do you mean by: "modules in completely different styles and with different living environments"?

There's also the mass problem. Creating a torus that huge might require stripping several solar systems of material. Which would be easier in the galactic core, where the stars are much closer to each other. But the core isn't friendly to a lot of life. So it might make sense to build the string in the core, and then starting traveling to more hospitable regions. How? Make the string magnetic, and use it to manipulate the Sun, turning it into a giant stellar engine. Then begin the journey toward the outer rim of the galaxy. This would take millions of years, long enough to start to fill in the torus with modules from new galactic civilizations, as the torus passes into regions they find hospitable. And why stop there? Maybe the ultimate purpose of the tour isn't just to tour the galaxy, but to escape the galaxy. This is a giant solar system-sized spaceship that's going on a billion-year journey to explore the Local Group.

Yes! I had thought about turning it's star into an engine this morning while walking the dog. And if it's an engine it also is a weapon.

The mass problem is an interesting one, especially since the material needs to be nigh indestructible, maybe they were in a pit stop to find more resources when something happened and the construct remained parked there. It's a solar system with no inner planets but it has the giant exterior planets.

Maybe they used to stop and strip mine solar systems including their stars?

But the tripulation died for some unknown cause and the construct is still parked there.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

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Pat

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2022, 01:14:05 PM »
I would probably make sense if the structure was composed of individual modules, and a thread of some super-strong material that strings them together. Creating a tube with a diameter of 2 AU in one go, after all, seems prohibitively difficult. It would be easier to create independent modules, say the size of a world or a moon, then spin a giant piece of thread around the Sun, and attach them. This allows the tubeworld to grow incrementally over time, starting with just a relative handful of modules attached to a naked string, and then gradually filling out the ring. This allows older generation modules mixed with newer generation modules, and if we assume it's a polysocietal or even multi-species construct, then you can have modules in completely different styles and with different living environments.

The idea isn't bad, I like it, what do you mean by: "modules in completely different styles and with different living environments"?
One way to think of it as a train with no end. The modules would be the cars, though of course the cars might be the size of worlds. There could be ancient modules, and newer ones in newer styles and based on newer technologies. The disparity could be immense, since we're potentially talking about deep time, not just a few years, centuries, or even millennia. Then consider modules added by different civilizations. They might have very different needs and styles. Or species -- there could be water modules, or near-vacuums, and so on. Some modules might have shared environments with their neighbors, with the "doors" between the modules open.

Others might be closed, because of incompatible environments, or worries of ecological contamination. It would still make sense to have a standard common ground, so travelers could pass down the torus, but the common ground is most likely a contained vacuum. Say a torus within a torus, an internal tube with no impeding air. That would allow transit using mono-ships, that are propelled magnetically or gravitically, and which could use gravity differentials or centrifugal force to reach ridiculous speeds, like particles in a collider.

Incidentally, you don't have to "park" it anywhere. Since a stellar engine is based on sublight travel, perhaps very slow sublight travel with transit times in the millions of years, it could be on its way to its next stop and still approachable or visitable. Not dissimilar to the Puppeteer's Fleet of Worlds, except much grander in scope.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2022, 01:17:01 PM by Pat »

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2022, 01:33:55 PM »
I would probably make sense if the structure was composed of individual modules, and a thread of some super-strong material that strings them together. Creating a tube with a diameter of 2 AU in one go, after all, seems prohibitively difficult. It would be easier to create independent modules, say the size of a world or a moon, then spin a giant piece of thread around the Sun, and attach them. This allows the tubeworld to grow incrementally over time, starting with just a relative handful of modules attached to a naked string, and then gradually filling out the ring. This allows older generation modules mixed with newer generation modules, and if we assume it's a polysocietal or even multi-species construct, then you can have modules in completely different styles and with different living environments.

The idea isn't bad, I like it, what do you mean by: "modules in completely different styles and with different living environments"?
One way to think of it as a train with no end. The modules would be the cars, though of course the cars might be the size of worlds. There could be ancient modules, and newer ones in newer styles and based on newer technologies. The disparity could be immense, since we're potentially talking about deep time, not just a few years, centuries, or even millennia. Then consider modules added by different civilizations. They might have very different needs and styles. Or species -- there could be water modules, or near-vacuums, and so on. Some modules might have shared environments with their neighbors, with the "doors" between the modules open.

Others might be closed, because of incompatible environments, or worries of ecological contamination. It would still make sense to have a standard common ground, so travelers could pass down the torus, but the common ground is most likely a contained vacuum. Say a torus within a torus, an internal tube with no impeding air. That would allow transit using mono-ships, that are propelled magnetically or gravitically, and which could use gravity differentials or centrifugal force to reach ridiculous speeds, like particles in a collider.

Incidentally, you don't have to "park" it anywhere. Since a stellar engine is based on sublight travel, perhaps very slow sublight travel with transit times in the millions of years, it could be on its way to its next stop and still approachable or visitable. Not dissimilar to the Puppeteer's Fleet of Worlds, except much grander in scope.

Okay, now I grok it.

You're thinking more of a ship/space station than an artificial world, what would the collector build if he was into preserving whole worlds? something like you postulate with closed modules. I was thinking more of a unique world. So the "Natives" (in the case of the tripulation all dying out) have forgotten they live in an artificial construct. But since it's so big you could have both at the same time, just imagine 13 million earths unfolded and sewn together, I reccon there's more than enough room for both being true.

Maybe it's a space ark? The builders are escaping the galaxy and saving/kidnapping whole worlds (the living things) into their ship.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

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Pat

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2022, 01:39:59 PM »

You're thinking more of a ship/space station than an artificial world, what would the collector build if he was into preserving whole worlds? something like you postulate with closed modules.
I think it's both, and there's no escaping that. But if you're referencing Ringworld, remember the inset world maps? The modules themselves could be titanic, with many times the surface area and volume of Earth. That's one of the biggest things to struggle with when thinking about a construct like this: The sheer scale. The Ringworld alone has more space than 3 million Earths. There can be more livable space in a single torus than in the entire rest of the galaxy.

And if you want to think even bigger, what if the first torus is filled? What's stopping them from adding more toruses, in different orbits? One of the views of a Dyson sphere is overlapping spaghetti circling the Sun. You could have many toruses, a partial step towards a Dyson sphere.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2022, 01:42:54 PM by Pat »

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2022, 01:51:39 PM »

You're thinking more of a ship/space station than an artificial world, what would the collector build if he was into preserving whole worlds? something like you postulate with closed modules.
I think it's both, and there's no escaping that. But if you're referencing Ringworld, remember the inset world maps? The modules themselves could be titanic, with many times the surface area and volume of Earth. That's one of the biggest things to struggle with when thinking about a construct like this: The sheer scale. The Ringworld alone has more space than 3 million Earths. There can be more livable space in a single torus than in the entire rest of the galaxy.

And if you want to think even bigger, what if the first torus is filled? What's stopping them from adding more toruses, in different orbits? One of the views of a Dyson sphere is overlapping spaghetti circling the Sun. You could have many toruses, a partial step towards a Dyson sphere.

Yeah, but the maps all shared the same atmosphere, if I got it right you want even different atmospheres.

As for other Torus, who's to say they don't exist? build one (or start building it in your version) an use the star from another system and send it in a slightly different direction, you divy up the population in half and now it's harder they ever go extinct.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell

Pat

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2022, 04:06:26 PM »
Yeah, but the maps all shared the same atmosphere, if I got it right you want even different atmospheres.
My point is the torus is so huge, that all those maps could be contained in the same module. From the perspective of a space traveler approaching the torus, they might see it as a string of modules, some independent, others with the doors open so they share atmospheres/ecologies/water systems. But from the perspective of someone living in the torus, a single module might be a whole world greater than the one we live on. Someone could walk for their entire life, and never even reach one end of their module, much less a series of open modules. The trick from a setting standpoint would be to figure out ways to help the players grasp that sense of scale, and to shift between different perspectives.

hedgehobbit

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2022, 09:59:13 PM »
The days all have the same lenght, so do the nights, the light darkness cycle divides the day in perfect halves.

Is there any reason you actually need a day/night cycle? Also, how does gravity work?

GeekyBugle

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Re: The Torus, a serial numbers filed Ringworld
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2022, 09:27:05 AM »
The days all have the same lenght, so do the nights, the light darkness cycle divides the day in perfect halves.

Is there any reason you actually need a day/night cycle? Also, how does gravity work?

I mean, this is an open content collaborative effort, if YOU want your totally not Ringworld not to have a day/night cycle by all means.

Gravity, well, for starters the mass of the construct, but also if you noticed I wrote something about gravity drives/engines to keep the construct in a concentric orbit with it's star. So, the presumption is that if the construc doesn't have enough mass and the centrifugal force isn't enough well the builders had the tech to create artifical gravity.
Quote from: Rhedyn

Here is why this forum tends to be so stupid. Many people here think Joe Biden is "The Left", when he is actually Far Right and every US republican is just an idiot.

“During times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act.”

― George Orwell