Or if one is using Discord one creates a channel names it monster pictures. Then find one on the internet and copies and pasted it.

Quote from: SquidLord on August 30, 2022, 10:31:33 AM
Just like on my physical tabletop, I can throw together a quick sketch, cut it out, and throw it on a standy. The good-enough-proxy lives!

And make a note that I need to find something appropriate to that for the next time it comes up.

Just like at any other table. Except that I can probably Google an image and cut that out to make a much higher quality proxy than I could with my bagful of markers and a 3 x 5 card.

Yes, you can do work-arounds with anything. Pity the DM that does a Lamentation style game with only a few very unique monsters.

Quote from: Ruprecht on August 30, 2022, 12:38:58 PM
Yes, you can do work-arounds with anything. Pity the DM that does a Lamentation style game with only a few very unique monsters.

If he can't be bothered to do a modicum of prep the exact same he'd need to for an analog tabletop game, maybe that's a DM you shouldn't be spending your time with, yeah?

Quote from: SHARK on August 21, 2022, 09:21:59 PM
Greetings!

You know, if by circumstance or preference, you like playing D&D online with VTT and whatever--good for you. Go for it.

As for myself, I like getting together with my friends, in person, face-to-face. I enjoy ordering up food at a restaurant with them, or serving up food personally. I enjoy drinking together, and lighting up fine cigars. I enjoy making coffee for everyone. I enjoy hearing them laugh, and seeing their faces, their expressions, their antics. Hearing them scream in hatred or triumph.

I enjoy rolling dice and moving painted miniatures across the table.

I enjoy gaming together, with them. Face-to-face.

Fuck the digital BS. All that online digital BS will always and forever be a sad, poor substitute for what I described experiencing above.

In-person gaming is in my view, the absolute best. Simple as that. In-person gaming is what we as a community, as a hobby, should prioritize, emphasize, celebrate and promote.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Quoted FTW.

Quote from: SquidLord on August 30, 2022, 12:43:03 PM
If he can't be bothered to do a modicum of prep the exact same he'd need to for an analog tabletop game, maybe that's a DM you shouldn't be spending your time with, yeah?

You are throwing your money away if you are paying to do the exact same thing.

Quote from: Ruprecht on August 30, 2022, 07:18:52 PM
You are throwing your money away if you are paying to do the exact same thing.

I can sleep equally well on the ground or on a cot – but I prefer a cot. I can sleep on the ground if I have to, but I'd prefer sleeping bag. I'd really prefer a king size bed in a five star hotel – but if I can't have what I'd prefer, I'll take what I can get rather than do without.

Only a fool gives up tools to make their given experience better. Only the truly foolish consider it noble.

Quote from: Ruprecht on August 30, 2022, 09:07:16 AM

Quote from: Omega on August 30, 2022, 06:25:42 AM
Your understanding of what the good VTTs can do then is massively lacking.

Can they display a beast not in the software library?

Thats the same fake bitching as used against minis.

Try again please.

But to answer your fake question. All the ones I've seen allowd for creation of the tokens.

Now if we are talking about 3d VTTs. Those are still getting traction and support. I know TableTopSimulator allows for porting in models. But it is not a function I have tried. Apparently theres a fairly broad range now of models. But as said. Its an area I have not delved into other than the superficial.

Similar to the Neverwinter PC game. Out of the box it had a fairly ok selection. But of course there is going to be ones not covered. Bitching about that is well past pedantic. And people have been making new models for it even now. For me NW just lacked other elements that I wanted from a VTT.

I think as 3d VTTs advance the short-comings will become fewer and fewer just as they did got the 2d versions.

Will WOTC ever put out a good one? Odds are no. Or of they do. They will promptly start trying to ruin it. Failure is the only option.

Quote from: Ruprecht on August 30, 2022, 07:18:52 PM

Quote from: SquidLord on August 30, 2022, 12:43:03 PM
If he can't be bothered to do a modicum of prep the exact same he'd need to for an analog tabletop game, maybe that's a DM you shouldn't be spending your time with, yeah?

You are throwing your money away if you are paying to do the exact same thing.

See MapTools and TokenTools.  Free and open source so it's yours to modify.
I was using it to run the mega-dungeon BarrowMaze.  We play face-to-face but we've got a large monitor in the game room which haven't used until now.
I have copied in the map and the handouts as well as all the dungeon specific critter pictures.
Learning curve is a little steep.
Getting fog of war working correctly requires one to basically trace the outlines of the walls in you dungeon map image.
If I have time in the next couple of days/weeks I'll post some screen shots.

Quote from: DocJones on August 30, 2022, 11:00:17 PM

Quote from: Ruprecht on August 30, 2022, 07:18:52 PM

Quote from: SquidLord on August 30, 2022, 12:43:03 PM
If he can't be bothered to do a modicum of prep the exact same he'd need to for an analog tabletop game, maybe that's a DM you shouldn't be spending your time with, yeah?

You are throwing your money away if you are paying to do the exact same thing.

See MapTools and TokenTools.  Free and open source so it's yours to modify.
I was using it to run the mega-dungeon BarrowMaze.  We play face-to-face but we've got a large monitor in the game room which haven't used until now.
I have copied in the map and the handouts as well as all the dungeon specific critter pictures.
Learning curve is a little steep.
Getting fog of war working correctly requires one to basically trace the outlines of the walls in you dungeon map image.
If I have time in the next couple of days/weeks I'll post some screen shots.

As a poor man's solution, for in person gaming inside of a dungeon; I have created a deck of index cards, with different simple images drawn on each card.  Laying down one or two cards at a time, allows me to maintain the mystery of what the players shouldn't be able to see yet.  Cheap, quick, and easy to create and use.

I'm not referring to ICRPG.  I'm just drawing out generic hallways, intersections, rooms, dead ends, etc. that I can use over and over again.

I'm of a very mixed mind on One D&D which is a truly awful name BTW and I hope at least they change that if nothing else.

I'm not a grognard so I very much DO like having a fully indexed online wiki style set of rulebooks. My games of the past few years have all been on Roll20 and I've DM'd 100s of hours of games there. The fact that everything is in the SRD, hyperlinked, indexed, searchable has been a godsend for the simple reason that a Roll20 game by its very nature is harder to setup and manage then a tabletop game. I can't just easily "redraw" a tactical map for instance. Everything has to be pre-staged including monster tokens.

Any shortcut that helps keep my overhead down I welcome. I use a combination of multiple monitors and hardcover books to keep my game flow very fast & smooth even during complex combat sections. If the VTT can do this at least as well as R20 or even better, that part I welcome with open arms.

I saw one video with a guy concerned about the 'gamification' of using a VTT so that people approach it as a videogame instead of a tabletop RPG. There is -some- merit in that statement and I say that as someone that ran an actual Neverwinter Nights campaign for a few years. It is important as a DM to 'set the tone' for your table so I would just remind people not to get too hung up on the visuals (which were amazing at the time) and remember you have full license & freedom. After a few sessions this wasn't an issue anymore.

I'd love to see a VTT that is isometric like NWN but easy to use. I saw a couple posts on this thread talking about NWN but the truth of the matter is this. Even with that powerful toolset crafting modules and running games in NWN was hard. A real time combat and movement system did not help. It was a weird animal a hybrid of CRPG and TT. Module creation? Forget it, if you did not have some basic programming or scripting knowledge you were incredibly limited.

My 'vision' for an ideal VTT would be something like Talespire (check it out on Steam) with a very intuitive fast UI for creating simple encounter maps.

Now the not so great stuff- They seem to be going all in on the wokey shit what with all races are now just basically window dressing and a halfling can breed with an orc because... reasons. There are many changes that appear to be simply political in nature with no true mechanical benefit, I will never get behind that sort of madness.

Codifying critical effects (Nat 1/ Nat 20) seems to be a very mixed and controversial change. I'm somewhat more ambivalent about that. There just appears to an overall homogenization to everything tracks very well with the culture at large and the left leaning agenda that there be absolutely no deviation from a standard homogenized uniformity of everything. While at the very same time and in maximum Orwellian fashion calling this complete uniformity, lockstep, and homogenization something as absurd as "Diversity" when it is the polar opposite.

There are also the legit concerns about the walled garden / gatekeeping but the truth of the matter is, they are appealing to the younger audience that grew up in a world where this is quite common. Interacting with a book, pen and paper, is a totally alien concept. Opening your phone to do something is as natural as breathing so of course WOTC will capitalize on that.

My go to VTT is Tabletop Simulator.  It has the features I want now and a pay system that I prefer (buy once, no subscription, most resources are free, but premium DLC is available for specific games.)

Quote from: zircher on August 31, 2022, 11:09:12 AM
My go to VTT is Tabletop Simulator.  It has the features I want now and a pay system that I prefer (buy once, no subscription, most resources are free, but premium DLC is available for specific games.)

And it has the advantage of not necessarily being game specific, so you can play a variety of tabletop experiences with whatever level of support you really want.

Most of the time I am perfectly happy to have a hand-drawn contour map and some half decent looking chits to push around in a lot of games. Or the equivalent of cardboard standys for individual infantry.

And sometimes I want to go the extra mile, put in actual terrain, go get some nice models, and make everything look cool. As well as have character sheets which do their own calculations, etc.

But that's just like my table at home. Sometimes it's just a convenient shorthand representation for what's happening, sometimes it's a critical part of the interface for the wargame that we're playing.

I think a lot of people get too hung up on the idea of "tech" at the table and forget that a book is a piece of technology. As is the pencil. As it is a piece of paper. You use the right tool for the right job for the problem at hand.

Quote from: zircher on August 31, 2022, 11:09:12 AM
My go to VTT is Tabletop Simulator.  It has the features I want now and a pay system that I prefer (buy once, no subscription, most resources are free, but premium DLC is available for specific games.)

My go-to was Fantasy Grounds after Roll20 started pushing woke nonsense.
It had a steep entry price for a GM licence (but getting it means none of my friends have to buy it so we can all 'share' my account) and had some quirks to adjust to.  But we made the change and never went back, currently if we can't use Fantasy grounds for whatever reason we just tend to play by post since roll20 only leaves a bad taste in our mouths.

I can also agree with the thread sentiment that "IRL is better", but I've also been in the situation of "online TRPG or no TRPG" with all my friends going away to university, military, or Germany.

Arguing over VTTs is all well and good, but I think it misses the important issues raised by OneDnD and their effect on the industry, especially for RPGs other than DnD. 

Quote from: rkhigdon on August 31, 2022, 12:30:11 PM
Arguing over VTTs is all well and good, but I think it misses the important issues raised by OneDnD and their effect on the industry, especially for RPGs other than DnD.

I'm not sure there's that much to debate, really. One D&D doesn't really seem to offer anything particularly new or desirable to the current player base while providing a lot of potential threat from Hasbro, and as a result it's just likely to be a net gain for every other RPG on the planet as there will be people – some people, anyway – who will be looking for new things to play.

Outside of D&D, the "industry" is largely a vanity press and is pretty hobby-centric. That's not a slur or a slam, that's just an honest assessment of the economic impact.

There's not really much in the way of debate on the issue. The facts seem pretty cut and dry. Which is why conversation has wandered so widely.