Quote from: Jaeger on September 03, 2022, 04:57:30 PM
There is a "salvery element" in the Nu-Spelljammer lore on the Hadozee that has caused many to point it out as a racist caricature of black people.

WotC "apologized" and claimed this:

Statement on the Hadozee:
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/statement-hadozee

Quote"We wanted to acknowledge and own the inclusion of offensive material within our recent Spelljammer: Adventures in Space content. We failed you, our players and our fans, and we are truly sorry.

The campaign includes a people called Hadozee which first appeared in 1982. Regrettably, not all portions of the content relating to the Hadozee were properly vetted before appearing in our most recent release. As we continue to learn and grow through every situation, we recognize that to live our values, we have to do better.

Throughout the 50-year history of Dungeons & Dragons, some of the characters in the game have been monstrous and evil, using descriptions that are painfully reminiscent of how real-world groups have been and continue to be denigrated.

And the key concept is that everything is remincient because our imaginations are informed by the real world. Nothing can escape the woke concepts of racism, everything is fair game for being twisted to suit their racist, manipulative worldview.

It sounds like the new Spelljammer setting is not worth my money. I've got access to the original, and that's all I need.

It's time to move on from outrage over WOTC's perpetual attempts to destroy creativity, dynamism, and authenticity in the hobby.

These people will never change. Who is making something cool & doesn't care about the outrage mob?

Quote from: Darkwind on September 03, 2022, 12:59:03 PM
The good news is, my hard copy of the Spelljammer box set just doubled in value because it basically just became a "Limited Run First Edition Print" filled with 2 paragraphs of "Dat Evil Rayciss Errata" thereby making it automatically valuable as a collector's item. So there is that at least... 

I considered buying one for just that reason, but I got better.

Quote from: Jaeger on September 03, 2022, 04:57:30 PM
There is a "salvery element" in the Nu-Spelljammer lore on the Hadozee that has caused many to point it out as a racist caricature of black people.

WotC "apologized" and claimed this:

Statement on the Hadozee:
https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/statement-hadozee

Quote"We wanted to acknowledge and own the inclusion of offensive material within our recent Spelljammer: Adventures in Space content. We failed you, our players and our fans, and we are truly sorry.

The campaign includes a people called Hadozee which first appeared in 1982. Regrettably, not all portions of the content relating to the Hadozee were properly vetted before appearing in our most recent release. As we continue to learn and grow through every situation, we recognize that to live our values, we have to do better.

Throughout the 50-year history of Dungeons & Dragons, some of the characters in the game have been monstrous and evil, using descriptions that are painfully reminiscent of how real-world groups have been and continue to be denigrated. We understand the urgency of changing how we work to better ensure a more inclusive game.

Effective immediately, we will remove the offensive content about Hadozee in our digital versions – and these will no longer be included in future reprints of the book. Our priority is to make things right when we make mistakes. In addition, we've initiated a thorough internal review of the situation and will take the necessary actions as a result of that review.

We are eternally grateful for the ongoing dialog with the D&D community, and we look forward to introducing new, engaging and inclusive content to D&D for generations to come. D&D teaches that diversity is strength, for only a diverse group of adventurers can overcome the many challenges a D&D story presents. In that spirit, we are committed to making D&D as welcome and inclusive as possible. This part of our work will never end."

Note that the parts in bold imply that the lore on the Hadozee was a result of using unvetted write-ups from past editions of the game...

This is a false implication however.

Well, these are people who can never actually do anything wrong in their view. Implying someone else was racist and they failed to censor it is their version of "the Devil made me do it".

Quote from: Zelen on September 03, 2022, 09:52:59 PM
It's time to move on from outrage over WOTC's perpetual attempts to destroy creativity, dynamism, and authenticity in the hobby.

These people will never change. Who is making something cool & doesn't care about the outrage mob?

You can find it in the OSR.  Either faithful renditions, or fresh takes on old rulesets; or gonzo, wacko, different approaches.  It's all there, in the OSR.

Quote from: THE_Leopold on September 03, 2022, 08:58:45 AM
Busy Body soul sucking shit heels think that any race that has a  skin color darker than Beige=Representing a Black Person.  Furthermore, if the race has any Simian traits it therefore must be mocking a Black Person.  Finally,  if the Race has any type of savage behavior it therefore must be respresenting a Black Person.


TLDR: SJW's are the biggest racists on the planet and are projecting.

This pretty much sums it up.

Remember what I keep saying here.

There is NO limit to what these sociopaths can hallucinate. And there is NO limit to what they can induce the gullible into equally hallucinating.

The only controversy is in their own insane heads.

This controversy really bothers me... really gets to me.  In my view, it's the perfect example of "soft racism": if you see a real world analogue in a species of flying, alien monkeys, YOU are the racist.

On August 24, I had made up my mind to grab some 5th edition D&D books before they became rarer and harder to find at reasonable prices - and by reasonable, I'm talking the deep, discounted prices on Amazon.  I did a little research and had an idea of what titles were "tolerable" and ones to avoid.  I *just* got the Spelljammer set delivered last Sunday, August 28 and found out all this crap a couple of days ago.  At least now I know that future WotC products are off the table.

Quote from: FASAfan on September 05, 2022, 08:31:59 PM
This controversy really bothers me... really gets to me.  In my view, it's the perfect example of "soft racism": if you see a real world analogue in a species of flying, alien monkeys, YOU are the racist.

On August 24, I had made up my mind to grab some 5th edition D&D books before they became rarer and harder to find at reasonable prices - and by reasonable, I'm talking the deep, discounted prices on Amazon.  I did a little research and had an idea of what titles were "tolerable" and ones to avoid.  I *just* got the Spelljammer set delivered last Sunday, August 28 and found out all this crap a couple of days ago.  At least now I know that future WotC products are off the table.

More importantly, you now have a copy of the 5e Spelljammer set that just became more valuable since they're going to edit the content to be more woke in future print runs.

I'm just a little amused at how they tried to continue the lore which includes the crossover between Star Frontiers (the Hadosee were originally recalled Yazirians) and D&D and the SJW horde is unhappy. Their sense of outrage (are they "...literally shaking..." over it?) doesn't erase 20+ years of lore of the origins of the Hadosee/Yazirians, none of it racist.

I got a huge laugh out of this line from the WOTC statement:

"Throughout the 50-year history of Dungeons & Dragons, some of the characters in the game have been monstrous and evil, using descriptions that are painfully reminiscent of how real-world groups have been and continue to be denigrated. We understand the urgency of changing how we work to better ensure a more inclusive game."

So, they've set themselves the task of never again having any lore that is even reminiscent of any unpleasant thing that's been done to any group of people at any point in history.

If that's not creative suicide, I don't know what is.

Much like Orcs. Monkeys = Black people. And WotC  are the bigots for making people think of that. It's as simple as that. SJWs expose their racism yet again. And expose their childlike lack of accountability for their own faults.

Good thing that in my setting I've reflavored the yaizirians/hadozee as space bat people so that their clothes can actually fit across their bodies. Just that, all the racism vanishes! (/sarcasm)

Quote from: 3catcircus on September 06, 2022, 08:40:05 AM

Quote from: FASAfan on September 05, 2022, 08:31:59 PM
This controversy really bothers me... really gets to me.  In my view, it's the perfect example of "soft racism": if you see a real world analogue in a species of flying, alien monkeys, YOU are the racist.

On August 24, I had made up my mind to grab some 5th edition D&D books before they became rarer and harder to find at reasonable prices - and by reasonable, I'm talking the deep, discounted prices on Amazon.  I did a little research and had an idea of what titles were "tolerable" and ones to avoid.  I *just* got the Spelljammer set delivered last Sunday, August 28 and found out all this crap a couple of days ago.  At least now I know that future WotC products are off the table.

More importantly, you now have a copy of the 5e Spelljammer set that just became more valuable since they're going to edit the content to be more woke in future print runs.

I'm just a little amused at how they tried to continue the lore which includes the crossover between Star Frontiers (the Hadosee were originally recalled Yazirians) and D&D and the SJW horde is unhappy. Their sense of outrage (are they "...literally shaking..." over it?) doesn't erase 20+ years of lore of the origins of the Hadosee/Yazirians, none of it racist.

If nobody cared about buying it before, I doubt too many will care about grabbing it up for a bit of unedited hadozee lore. Speaking for myself, my interest has risen from 0 to...well 0, so not risen at all.

"Throughout the 50-year history of Dungeons & Dragons, some of the characters in the game have been monstrous and evil, using descriptions that are painfully reminiscent of how real-world groups have been and continue to be denigrated. We understand the urgency of changing how we work to better ensure a more inclusive game."

This bugs me. Just because the Saxons called Vikings savages doesn't mean that calling orcs savages means Orcs = Vikings. To make it worse most cultures were called barbarians or savages by their neighbors at some point in time, but that's ignored because savages was a term applied to Africans during the Victorian era and that's all that counts. The real problem is these fools were not laughed out of the room when they started this nonsense and now some don't have the brainpower to see the sham for what it is.

Quote from: HappyDaze on September 06, 2022, 01:20:01 PM

Quote from: 3catcircus on September 06, 2022, 08:40:05 AM

Quote from: FASAfan on September 05, 2022, 08:31:59 PM
This controversy really bothers me... really gets to me.  In my view, it's the perfect example of "soft racism": if you see a real world analogue in a species of flying, alien monkeys, YOU are the racist.

On August 24, I had made up my mind to grab some 5th edition D&D books before they became rarer and harder to find at reasonable prices - and by reasonable, I'm talking the deep, discounted prices on Amazon.  I did a little research and had an idea of what titles were "tolerable" and ones to avoid.  I *just* got the Spelljammer set delivered last Sunday, August 28 and found out all this crap a couple of days ago.  At least now I know that future WotC products are off the table.

More importantly, you now have a copy of the 5e Spelljammer set that just became more valuable since they're going to edit the content to be more woke in future print runs.

I'm just a little amused at how they tried to continue the lore which includes the crossover between Star Frontiers (the Hadosee were originally recalled Yazirians) and D&D and the SJW horde is unhappy. Their sense of outrage (are they "...literally shaking..." over it?) doesn't erase 20+ years of lore of the origins of the Hadosee/Yazirians, none of it racist.

If nobody cared about buying it before, I doubt too many will care about grabbing it up for a bit of unedited hadozee lore. Speaking for myself, my interest has risen from 0 to...well 0, so not risen at all.

Oh, absolutely. If you have 1e/2e spelljammer, you've got 90% of what you need for gameplay in any edition of D&D, whether 5e, PF, OSR. The "they're black people" SJW racism is new and is a mash-up of 2e, 3.5e, and new lore.

Yazirians have been a PC race since the early 1980s when they first appeared in Star Frontiers. It wasn't until 3e that they changed from a rocky the flying squirrel/chewbacca look (wookiees likely being the inspiration but changed so that TSR wouldn't get sued) to an actual great ape look. Now, they've returned to their Star Frontiers roots but the mashup of the lore is what has created the problem. That along with claims of minstrel shows because of art showing one in a bad ren faire costume.

I love the idea of yazirians being descendants of the hadozee (who are the dralasites descended from - gelatinous cubes?) But had they stuck with the original yazirian descriptions in Star Frontiers (...the smartest of the four core races...), would some still be offended by the "they were enslaved by an evil wizard" origin story?

Quote from: 3catcircus on September 06, 2022, 02:17:08 PM
But had they stuck with the original yazirian descriptions in Star Frontiers (...the smartest of the four core races...), would some still be offended by the "they were enslaved by an evil wizard" origin story?

Maybe not specifically, but they'd find something to complain about. When you're a professional victim that gets paid in social credits, you need to find a job wherever you can get it.