Quote from: Squidi on September 08, 2021, 12:35:51 AM

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:59:05 PM
  I think religion does describe a lot of the behavior I see, and like many religions, there are the TRUE BELIEVERS, the FUNDAMENTALISTS, the CASUALS, and so on.   I guess it may be true humans tend to have a "god sized hole" in their hearts and they end up putting something in there.   No arguing with religious fanatics.

I don't buy that. I'm increasingly a believer in the "midwits theory" - basically people who are above average intelligence, but not actually smart enough to develop true understanding.

There are plenty of smart and dumb-as-doornails SJWs out there though. To me they look mostly like a mix of smart holier-than-thou bullies and useful idiots.

Quote from: oggsmash on September 07, 2021, 11:59:05 PM
  I think religion does describe a lot of the behavior I see, and like many religions, there are the TRUE BELIEVERS, the FUNDAMENTALISTS, the CASUALS, and so on.   I guess it may be true humans tend to have a "god sized hole" in their hearts and they end up putting something in there.   No arguing with religious fanatics.

I think you're framing it wrong. It's not a religion. It does share some similarities, but religions are specific things, and in many ways it doesn't qualify. It's a part of a broader category that includes religions, but also social and political movements that attract the true believers you mentioned. Though I'm using the term in the technical sense used by Hoffer, whose eponymous monograph defined the subject. A few of his distinctions:

"Mass movements can rise and spread without belief in a God, but never without belief in the devil."
"We do not usually look for allies when we love. Indeed, we often look on those who love with us as rivals and trespassers. But we always look for allies when we hate."
"When we lose our individual independence in the corporateness of a mass movement, we find a new freedom — freedom to hate, bully, lie, torture, murder and betray without shame and remorse."
"Passionate hatred can give meaning and purpose to an empty life. Thus people haunted by the purposelessness of their lives try to find a new content not only by dedicating themselves to a holy cause but also by nursing a fanatical grievance. A mass movement offers them unlimited opportunities for both."

Very interesting posts in some cases, but this is not the subforum to make them in. Please stick to topics exclusively within what's happening in the RPG hobby.

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 08, 2021, 08:41:51 AM
Very interesting posts in some cases, but this is not the subforum to make them in. Please stick to topics exclusively within what's happening in the RPG hobby.

Hah - you won't censor me. I am sick, SICK I say, of the bodyshaming of your cat, Big Chungus. CANCELLED.

Quote from: GriswaldTerrastone on September 07, 2021, 09:08:14 PM
There is, of course, one BIG problem. One big question.

Read the above comments about SJWs. Listen to what The Critical Drinker and Nerdrotic have to say about them. Read my own posts here about them.

So- how is it that they keep winning? How is it that they have won with schools, movies, comics, workplaces, laws, etc. etc. etc?

Now look at them as a whole and consider what I've said here before: SJWs would seem to be an impossible phenomenon because they consist of too many groups with conflicting complaints, the trouble between transsexuals and feminists being a perfect example.

It cannot be happening- yet instead of falling apart as it should have by now they only gain more ground.

Obviously they are cannon fodder, shock troops, for an intelligent group of elites controlling them, a group that knows EXACTLY what it is doing.

They are winning because of the Paradox of Tolerance.

The Paradox of Tolerance is an idea that.was originally coined back in the 1940s. It states that if a society is tolerant without limit, its ability to be tolerant is eventually seized or destroyed by the intolerant.

We as gamers are the Tolerant. The SJW's are the Intolerant. For decades we were just playing games, ya know. The SJW infiltration into society, and then into gaming, was very subtle and happened over many years. Because we are Tolerant, all about Free Speech, Having Integrity, and just want to get along... We didn't stand up to the SJW's when they were still small in the rpg sphere. It wasn't until the last couple years when a greater number of gamers started to really see and witness just how far gone and Intolerant the SJW's really are.

This has been happening in all aspects of our society.

In order for us to stop them, we have to step up and stop being tolerant of them.

Quote from: RebelSky on September 09, 2021, 01:25:19 AM

Quote from: GriswaldTerrastone on September 07, 2021, 09:08:14 PM
There is, of course, one BIG problem. One big question.

Read the above comments about SJWs. Listen to what The Critical Drinker and Nerdrotic have to say about them. Read my own posts here about them.

So- how is it that they keep winning? How is it that they have won with schools, movies, comics, workplaces, laws, etc. etc. etc?

Now look at them as a whole and consider what I've said here before: SJWs would seem to be an impossible phenomenon because they consist of too many groups with conflicting complaints, the trouble between transsexuals and feminists being a perfect example.

It cannot be happening- yet instead of falling apart as it should have by now they only gain more ground.

Obviously they are cannon fodder, shock troops, for an intelligent group of elites controlling them, a group that knows EXACTLY what it is doing.

They are winning because of the Paradox of Tolerance.

The Paradox of Tolerance is an idea that.was originally coined back in the 1940s. It states that if a society is tolerant without limit, its ability to be tolerant is eventually seized or destroyed by the intolerant.

We as gamers are the Tolerant. The SJW's are the Intolerant. For decades we were just playing games, ya know. The SJW infiltration into society, and then into gaming, was very subtle and happened over many years. Because we are Tolerant, all about Free Speech, Having Integrity, and just want to get along... We didn't stand up to the SJW's when they were still small in the rpg sphere. It wasn't until the last couple years when a greater number of gamers started to really see and witness just how far gone and Intolerant the SJW's really are.

This has been happening in all aspects of our society.

In order for us to stop them, we have to step up and stop being tolerant of them.

That's part of it, and there have been those at the now-dead site Return of Kings who have pointed this out- and as a white straight male I'm beginning to agree.

I no longer care about "everyone's rights," only mine and those of my own group or tribe- you know, what everyone else does but I'm not allowed to. It has been shown all too clearly that those who hate you WILL turn around and stab you in the back. Again, I'm just old enough to remember the fight for pornography, how the people behind this claimed it was a freedom of speech/expression/tolerance/etc. issue. etc. Obviously they got their way, and this was decades before the Internet in any modern sense of the word.

So what happened?

The very people I've just mentioned turned around and created various hate speech laws, now to the point that in more and more places you can be ruined or even end up in jail for saying the wrong things- this done in a way to serve the group behind it.

So- for RPGPundit this is how it relates to the thread's topic.

There was always a bit of political correctness in AD&D- Morgan Ironwolf being an example- but that was to be expected back then. Overall it was heroic fantasy, with clear lines between good and evil.

But the elites trying to ruin everything pushed Critical Theory, which is why now you can't say drow or orcs- fantasy creatures- are evil. It's not just about political correctness in this game, it's to create a society where literally anything goes, except for certain absolutes the elites want kept in place. This dumbs down the population, otherwise more people would ask that if it's just movies or games that don't matter why are the leftists so determined to push sex and race quotas in these things?

That list warns people. They might have bought Wizards of the Coast products based on "well it's just another name for TSR" but now they might at least take a second look, and NOT buy such products. Remember- nothing makes the elitists laugh harder than the very people they want to ruin spending money on "entertainment" meant to push propaganda that will do just that. This is why Nerdrotic and The Critical Drinker have also come under fire- opposing voices must be silenced.

Quote from: GriswaldTerrastone on September 09, 2021, 03:46:43 PM
There was always a bit of political correctness in AD&D- Morgan Ironwolf being an example- but that was to be expected back then. Overall it was heroic fantasy, with clear lines between good and evil.

Morgan Ironwolf struck me as more horny teen male bait than any kind of political correctness.

Quote from: Ratman_tf on September 09, 2021, 04:04:45 PM

Quote from: GriswaldTerrastone on September 09, 2021, 03:46:43 PM
There was always a bit of political correctness in AD&D- Morgan Ironwolf being an example- but that was to be expected back then. Overall it was heroic fantasy, with clear lines between good and evil.

Morgan Ironwolf struck me as more horny teen male bait than any kind of political correctness.

Eh, no worse than most other 80's art.

That was part of it in retrospect- fierce better-than-men women warriors were also sexy so males would watch. Now you get those like the one from "Mad Max" 2010's. It was bait.

That's absolute nonsense. If you and your players want to play a gritty game with realistic physical disparities between the sexes, that's fine. It works for stuff like the Black Company, gritty WW2 dramas, and so on. But D&D is inspired by media like Burrough's Barsoom series, which included the competent adventurer Dejah Thoris. And Howard's Conan, which featured the deadly pirate queen, Bêlit, and Valeria, whose skill rivaled Conan. If you think Morgan Ironwolf is some kind of icon of political correctness, you must be completely unfamiliar with Appendix N. Yes, there were damsels in distress aplenty; but more than a few tough, capable female fighters as well.

Quote from: GriswaldTerrastone on September 07, 2021, 09:08:14 PM
There is, of course, one BIG problem. One big question.

Read the above comments about SJWs. Listen to what The Critical Drinker and Nerdrotic have to say about them. Read my own posts here about them.

So- how is it that they keep winning? How is it that they have won with schools, movies, comics, workplaces, laws, etc. etc. etc?

Now look at them as a whole and consider what I've said here before: SJWs would seem to be an impossible phenomenon because they consist of too many groups with conflicting complaints, the trouble between transsexuals and feminists being a perfect example.

It cannot be happening- yet instead of falling apart as it should have by now they only gain more ground.

Obviously they are cannon fodder, shock troops, for an intelligent group of elites controlling them, a group that knows EXACTLY what it is doing.

Evil flourishes when good people do nothing.  That's why they are winning.  A measly 15% or so of the population make all the noise, and the rest of the population remains mostly silent, ignorant and oblivious to the danger.

We've lost, I think, and we'll preside over our fall.

Quote from: pdboddy on September 10, 2021, 08:27:13 AM

Quote from: GriswaldTerrastone on September 07, 2021, 09:08:14 PM
There is, of course, one BIG problem. One big question.

Read the above comments about SJWs. Listen to what The Critical Drinker and Nerdrotic have to say about them. Read my own posts here about them.

So- how is it that they keep winning? How is it that they have won with schools, movies, comics, workplaces, laws, etc. etc. etc?

Now look at them as a whole and consider what I've said here before: SJWs would seem to be an impossible phenomenon because they consist of too many groups with conflicting complaints, the trouble between transsexuals and feminists being a perfect example.

It cannot be happening- yet instead of falling apart as it should have by now they only gain more ground.

Obviously they are cannon fodder, shock troops, for an intelligent group of elites controlling them, a group that knows EXACTLY what it is doing.

Evil flourishes when good people do nothing.  That's why they are winning.  A measly 15% or so of the population make all the noise, and the rest of the population remains mostly silent, ignorant and oblivious to the danger.

We've lost, I think, and we'll preside over our fall.

It's 8%.  A pretty massive study confirmed it's 8% of the population who actually believe in SJW values.


On the other hand, I can say from personal experience that there's way more pushback happening now than there was a few years ago. Or even just a couple of years ago.

There's also hopeful signs: a recent study shoed that Gen Z people are consistently growing more opposed to Cancel Culture, and the younger they are the more opposed they are to it. There's a rift growing between the Gen Z and the Millennials that presently rule over them.

Well, conservatism and libertarianism are now counter-culture, so...

Part of the backlash, I suspect, has to do with the will-to-power that is related to relativism linked with "toleration!" as it seems a theme so often encountered.. (quotes, because it's so easy to call bullshit on that). Right and Left are on the road to totalitarianism, IMO. I hope that I am wrong, but getting the "wrongthink" finger-wag at a thing like this utterly neutral and helpful list is so boring and disgusting, I am enjoying the folks losing their minds.

Quote from: RPGPundit on September 10, 2021, 11:34:28 AM
It's 8%.  A pretty massive study confirmed it's 8% of the population who actually believe in SJW values.

Only 10% of the US population was directly involved in the Civil War, on both sides. The vast majority of people are happy to watch from the sidelines. 8% is actually pretty huge in light of this. And I think that 8% is more likely to act on it than whatever percentage the shitposters on the other side represent.

The real question is whether that number is increasing or shrinking. If it is increasing, that means the mind virus is spreading - which I don't think is the case. The pendulum is definitely swinging the other way. But we haven't crossed the line yet, and there's still so much more damage they can do before then.

QuoteThere's also hopeful signs: a recent study shoed that Gen Z people are consistently growing more opposed to Cancel Culture, and the younger they are the more opposed they are to it. There's a rift growing between the Gen Z and the Millennials that presently rule over them.

I think when kids become teenagers, they just naturally rebel against the status quo. I mean, after all, I went to Catholic school and nobody is going to confuse me for a Catholic any time soon. My kids went to a super cringey SJW private school (in my defense, it didn't start that way), and they certainly aren't leaning that direction.