Quote from: Crüesader;940237This is what I'd like to do.  I would rather the team be versatile and capable, rather than just go from shooting lasers from their eyes and blowing wood paneling apart, to shooting lasers from their eyes and destroying Australia (not really a downside to that otherwise).

Can you bump up their power level just a little, though?  I'd like to see their abilities get more potent.  This campaign is going to start at the street level, and develop into more as time goes on.

You can totally do that when merited. The thing is that advancement is not dependent on it. If you award Power Points it doesn't mean an increase in power level. The Power Level increase could be treated like some sort of milestone. You decide that after a major plot is resolved that the characters are indeed getting better at what they do. Just remember that advancement doesn't parallel level based d20. Your PL 13 character is going to be powerful. Like take out groups of normals and lesser supers powerful. Start out lower than you want by a PL or two, and then it's easier to fix if you find yourself underpowered than trying to fix an overpowered game.

Your desired style & power-level sounds like a good match for GURPS, to me, though I'm a GURPS-o-phile and probably wouldn't actually recommend starting GM'ing GURPS with a supers game. Also GURPS has the "oh looks like one of those bullets from a random thug actually hit you in the throat..." factor or just the "um that teenager raked a knife through your unarmored arm, and you have no superpowers that keep that from crippling it.." factor.

Quote from: Skarg;940428Your desired style & power-level sounds like a good match for GURPS, to me, though I'm a GURPS-o-phile and probably wouldn't actually recommend starting GM'ing GURPS with a supers game. Also GURPS has the "oh looks like one of those bullets from a random thug actually hit you in the throat..." factor or just the "um that teenager raked a knife through your unarmored arm, and you have no superpowers that keep that from crippling it.." factor.

That's why it worked for Wild Cards.

jg

Quote from: Crüesader;939948A group of players and I started running D&D 5e... and honestly, no one is feeling it.  I pitched the idea for a superhero RPG, and everyone seems to be down for that.  With this comes a couple of concerns.

I'll be using my own 'setting'- which is hardly a 'setting', but more or less the real world with a few twists here and there- 'Enhanced Persons' are a relatively new development that became public knowledge in 1999.  'Physics' is still a thing in this setting, so nothing too absurd.  It's a few bits gritty, a few bits deconstructive, but I'm not going to have people Roleplaying a Frank Miller setting with everyone in plain clothes.  There are heroes, there are villains- however, some Enhanced Persons are 'heroes' because it simply gives them what they want, not really because they are genuinely good people.  Villains are generally empowered people who feel like they might be actually doing the right thing (and some may be convincing the public of this as well).  

And yes, I will be doing that cheesy thing where I have a 'GM player character' (although, he takes mostly a backseat and acts as a plot device off-screen, as his motives are not completely clear at this time).  Of course, we will be rotating GM's- this is to sort of simulate different writers' story arcs, as seen in comics.

I'll share some of my ideas here, and I'd like for you guys to offer critique and guidance.  Mostly, what I'll be doing is sharing some of the characters I've made- NPC's of various sorts.

However, right now what I'm looking for is the best system to use.  I hear 'Champions' is a bit heavy on the math- but I don't remember playing Dark Champions and having that much difficulty.  I still actually own Aberrant, even though I see its setting as seriously as I would a clown cock-slapping a tambourine (although, I distinctly will say that 'Champions' is just the same, except there's another clown farting on a bass drum).  I have used the D20 system as well, and it's okay.

So, here are the caveats to the campaign(s):

-Heroes are not 'epic' in power level.  Mostly, they should be 'enhanced'- but should not have extreme superhuman abilities or assets (think "X-Men" or "WildCATS").  
-'Supernatural' abilities are not public knowledge, and anything of the sort should be easily dismissed as a form of 'Enhanced Ability'.
-Much of the initial campaign will be 'street level' and is lacking things like alien invasions, cosmic god-like threats, and things of this nature.

Any guidance you guys have would be great.

What you've described is basically a 100% match for Dark Champions (Hero 5e/6e + the 5e Dark Champions sourcebook).

Quote from: The_Shadow;940509What you've described is basically a 100% match for Dark Champions (Hero 5e/6e + the 5e Dark Champions sourcebook).

Dark Champions was a headache, as I recall.  I'd be willing to try it again, but I'd have to re-learn it.  I was hand-held through the last one.  

Also, Champions has a SHITLOAD of books- any recommendations on it?

I recently picked up AMP Year One from Third Eye Games and it seems perfect fit for this. It's about normal people developing super powers. Its street level, but it assumes that there are groups that could be identified as heroes and villains, depending on perspective, much like in X-Men. The game includes a broad range of powers and also includes technology designed to combat super powered individuals.

The system is simple using a single d20, with a mechanics for powers that feels like Aberrant's but fixed. Unlike many Super RPGs that start PCs as powerful and advanxement minimal, it sees them progress in power more rapidly from ordinary people much like other RPGs. The setting sounds like it may also provide you with the ability to pick and choose as you want.

Quote from: Crüesader;940523Dark Champions was a headache, as I recall.  I'd be willing to try it again, but I'd have to re-learn it.  I was hand-held through the last one.  

Also, Champions has a SHITLOAD of books- any recommendations on it?

All you need is Champions Complete. Pretty sure it's still readily available in print as well as pdf. Then you can pick up the Dark Champions pdf as a resource, not really necessary.
Champions Complete is a bit dense, but if you've played Hero before it should be fine. If you or your group are a bit wary about complexity, consider Hero Basic as an entry point. It's 95% of Hero 6e in 128 pages, and what's more is  presented and explained better than Champions Complete. There should be no issues with getting a game going just with Basic.

Quote from: The_Shadow;940526All you need is Champions Complete. Pretty sure it's still readily available in print as well as pdf. Then you can pick up the Dark Champions pdf as a resource, not really necessary.
Champions Complete is a bit dense, but if you've played Hero before it should be fine. If you or your group are a bit wary about complexity, consider Hero Basic as an entry point. It's 95% of Hero 6e in 128 pages, and what's more is  presented and explained better than Champions Complete. There should be no issues with getting a game going just with Basic.

My advice in regard to Dark Champions is that while the original (pre-5th Edition) version was designed around the sort of low-level supers cruising with human vigilantes thing you see in Marvel Netflix productions, 5th Edition Dark Champions was less superhero and more "action hero."  Mercenaries, cops, espionage, that sort of thing.  In my opinion it should have been called Action Hero, or they should have revived the name of Danger International (which I understand they are going to do in the near future).

JG

I really, really wish I had the time and inclination to get into Hero/Champions or even its close cousin Fuzion.

M&M3 is better than its predecessors but the Feat system is still a mess.

ICONS is nice and simple but perhaps too simple.

Wild Talents is interesting but mostly for street-level games, and has a strong Iron Age bias.

If I ever get around to giving supers another shot, I'll probably go with Savage Worlds with the Super Powers Companion, because I'm a lazy bum. And also because SW does a good job of emulating Golden, Silver and Bronze Age comics (and, I suspect, Iron with minimal adaptation)

Quote from: The Butcher;940641I really, really wish I had the time and inclination to get into Hero/Champions or even its close cousin Fuzion.

M&M3 is better than its predecessors but the Feat system is still a mess.

ICONS is nice and simple but perhaps too simple.

Wild Talents is interesting but mostly for street-level games, and has a strong Iron Age bias.

If I ever get around to giving supers another shot, I'll probably go with Savage Worlds with the Super Powers Companion, because I'm a lazy bum. And also because SW does a good job of emulating Golden, Silver and Bronze Age comics (and, I suspect, Iron with minimal adaptation)

M&M and Icons seem too simple, Savage Worlds seems a bit underpowered, and while I have always preferred Hero I'm starting to agree with those who find it too much work.  I'm trying to create a happy medium.

JG

Quote from: James Gillen;940669M&M and Icons seem too simple, Savage Worlds seems a bit underpowered, and while I have always preferred Hero I'm starting to agree with those who find it too much work.  I'm trying to create a happy medium.

M&M3 is "too simple"

I find the Feat system a GURPS-like drag. But please elaborate; you may end up selling me on it!

Quote from: Skywalker;940525I recently picked up AMP Year One from Third Eye Games and it seems perfect fit for this. It's about normal people developing super powers. Its street level, but it assumes that there are groups that could be identified as heroes and villains, depending on perspective, much like in X-Men. The game includes a broad range of powers and also includes technology designed to combat super powered individuals.

The system is simple using a single d20, with a mechanics for powers that feels like Aberrant's but fixed. Unlike many Super RPGs that start PCs as powerful and advanxement minimal, it sees them progress in power more rapidly from ordinary people much like other RPGs. The setting sounds like it may also provide you with the ability to pick and choose as you want.

Just had a little hunt for this. Looks quite interesting for a one-off campaign.

Quote from: The Butcher;940641I really, really wish I had the time and inclination to get into Hero/Champions

The 4th edition of Champions isn't as bad as 5th and 6th, at least from an eye bleed standpoint.  Makes me think that the earlier editions were probably even easier.

You might find Two-Fisted Tales a viable option. Not a supers game but a pulp one, which can be set to four different power levels (Gritty, Escapist, Fantastic, and Amazing), the highest of which corresponds to proto-supers.

Link: Precis Intermedia :: Two-Fisted Tales

Quote from: urbwar;939996Going by the power level you're aiming for, I suggest checking out AMP: Year One and it's supplements, Year Two & Three. Power level is on par with early X-Men (before Wolverine, etc joined). I had the chance to play this at GenCon last year, and I enjoyed it.

AMP would be my suggestion as well.

Quote from: Skywalker;940525I recently picked up AMP Year One from Third Eye Games and it seems perfect fit for this. It's about normal people developing super powers. Its street level, but it assumes that there are groups that could be identified as heroes and villains, depending on perspective, much like in X-Men. The game includes a broad range of powers and also includes technology designed to combat super powered individuals.

The system is simple using a single d20, with a mechanics for powers that feels like Aberrant's but fixed. Unlike many Super RPGs that start PCs as powerful and advanxement minimal, it sees them progress in power more rapidly from ordinary people much like other RPGs. The setting sounds like it may also provide you with the ability to pick and choose as you want.

I think one of the best things about AMP is that, except for some corner cases, guns are still king! in the game.

Granted some of the powers feel a bit too "magical" instead of 'genetic' Like the Mirror power set.

Quote from: One Horse Town;940674Just had a little hunt for this. Looks quite interesting for a one-off campaign.

The main game books are pretty good, still some flaws in it, but that's normal if you ask me.  It's the 'guide books' that imo are pretty bad.  I bought 4 of the guide book PDFs and the quality is definitely not there.