Quote from: Omega;1016373So kinda like what Kwanchai did? Updated it with new art? Im not fond of his style. But he put alot of effort into covering all the counters and map. Dont know if he ever did Wizard as well. Heres an example.

I really like the colors and clean design of this. It "Pops".

Quote from: RunningLaser;1016345... For those in the know, was making adventures easier for TFT than GURPS?  Just wondering if there's any chance that they would make something like DM's Guild for it.

It's generally easier than GURPS because making characters (i.e. NPCs and opponent) is much simpler. Thought GURPS Dungeon Fantasy tries to cheat a bit by suggesting all goblins be the same simple stat line, while in TFT usually each opponent is more or less varied in stats and equipment (though still just something like "ST 11 DX 11 IQ 9 shortsword, dagger, 21 silver" is enough for one, and sometimes an encounter will be lazy and use a few identical opponents).

The whole TFTs/GURPS dichotomy is complicated. The short version is that DM'ing and playing TFT feels about as complex as an early edition or retroclone of D+D or Tunnels and Trolls, whereas GURPS introduces a level of complexity in everyone's stat blocks that elevates the complexity to something like 3.5 or 4E D+D or one of the BRP games.

Yeah, although if you start with Man To Man, Orcslayer and detail characters about that much, or to the level of the original pre-4e sample characters, GURPS characters can be not all that complex.

Melee/Wizard was to GURPS what Chainmail was to D&D.

Quote from: Larsdangly;1016661The short version is that DM'ing and playing TFT feels about as complex as an early edition or retroclone of D+D or Tunnels and Trolls, whereas GURPS introduces a level of complexity in everyone's stat blocks that elevates the complexity to something like 3.5 or 4E D+D or one of the BRP games.

Since when does BRP get lumped in for crunch with 3.5/4e D&D? Call of Cthulhu is probably the best known/most popular flavor and it's pretty lite in comparison.
GURPS is also pretty lightweight unless you can't resist adding ALL the options to your plate.

GURPS 4e Character Creation can be as simple as:

The Characters will be built on n points.

The attributes: Strength (ST), Dexterity (DX), Intelligence (IQ), and Health (HT) start at 10.  Strength and Health can be increased or decreased for ten character points per attribute point.  Dexterity and Health can be increased or by one attribute point for twenty character points.

Crossbow (DX), Guns (DX), Shield (DX), Knife (DX), any one type of weapon Throwing (DX), Fast Draw any one type of weapon (DX), and Swimming(HT) cost 1 point at their controlling attribute level.
Axe/Mace (DX) Broadsword (DX), Bow (DX), Climbing (DX), Two Handed Sword (DX), Two Handed Axe/Mace (DX), Stealth (DX), Spear (DX), Boxing (DX), and Wrestling (DX) cost two points at their controlling attribute level.
Karate (DX), Judo (DX), and each spell (IQ) cost four points at their controlling attribute level.

You have $1000 to spend on equipment and $4000 in personal possessions.

For many NPCs it probably doesn't need to go beyond that.

Once you're familiar with what the levels mean and have made some characters so you have a rough feel for what's reasonable, a GM can make NPCs by just assigning what makes sense and feels right. In a realistic game, 8-9 is below-average attribute, 10 is average, and most NPCs are probably at most 11-12, maybe 13, unless they're outstanding, in all four attributes, but mostly probably in the 9-11 range, with ST based largely on their size, gender, and whether they're muscular or not. Weapon skills might be about DX -1 to DX +1 for most people, or a bit more for competent people. Professional skills at IQ or DX level or a bit more if they are experienced or good, and just list the relevant skills or rule what they have when/if it comes up. Points don't matter as long as you have a good sense of proportion.

Though, it helps to pre-calc the numbers you'll need for combat, if that's liable to happen to the NPC. That became pretty automatic for me soon after I got familiar with making characters. It is still even easier to do for TFT, and would be easier for newer people to learn faster.

Encumbrance is one thing that can still make me do a bit of math, if they have enough gear to matter (especially armor).

Good for him! I look forward to seeing what he does with it.

Quote from: David Johansen;1016711GURPS 4e Character Creation can be as simple as:

The Characters will be built on n points.

The attributes: Strength (ST), Dexterity (DX), Intelligence (IQ), and Health (HT) start at 10.  Strength and Health can be increased or decreased for ten character points per attribute point.  Dexterity and Health can be increased or by one attribute point for twenty character points.

Crossbow (DX), Guns (DX), Shield (DX), Knife (DX), any one type of weapon Throwing (DX), Fast Draw any one type of weapon (DX), and Swimming(HT) cost 1 point at their controlling attribute level.
Axe/Mace (DX) Broadsword (DX), Bow (DX), Climbing (DX), Two Handed Sword (DX), Two Handed Axe/Mace (DX), Stealth (DX), Spear (DX), Boxing (DX), and Wrestling (DX) cost two points at their controlling attribute level.
Karate (DX), Judo (DX), and each spell (IQ) cost four points at their controlling attribute level.

You have $1000 to spend on equipment and $4000 in personal possessions.

For many NPCs it probably doesn't need to go beyond that.

In principle, GURPS can be as simple as 'I have a ST of 17' (or whatever), full stop. But that isn't the reality. The reality is that you have a large number of options, falling into a half dozen categories, to play off one another and typical stat blocks have at least a couple dozen separate pieces of information in them. It's a complicated game in this respect.

One important feature of TFT is that it is a 'point buy' system, but operates under different and ultimately much stricter rules. You have a pretty narrow range of possible starting stats and there is no way to trade other things for more stat points. And your talents and spells can't be exchanged for stats, or status and jobs, or gear, etc. Each category of character capability is independent, and therefore the choices you are presented are always quite constrained. GURPS opens this up by putting all possible qualities a character can have under the same point-total calculus, so everything trades off of everything. This has theoretical benefits but in my experience makes character creation too complicated of a decision tree, and allows almost infinite scope for 'gaming' the character creation process to min/max in some way you like. If you are playing the game of 'build-a-bear-PCs', it is wonderful. If you are playing a roleplaying game, it is all a bit too meta for my tastes.

Quote from: Simlasa;1016695Since when does BRP get lumped in for crunch with 3.5/4e D&D? Call of Cthulhu is probably the best known/most popular flavor and it's pretty lite in comparison.
GURPS is also pretty lightweight unless you can't resist adding ALL the options to your plate.

It's a fair comparison. A character in Runequest or any of a number of other BRP games has a couple dozen skill percentages to track separately, in some versions hit locations and hit location specific armor, etc. You need quite a few independent bits of information to define what a character is and what he or she can do. To first order, its the same amount of information you need to define a 3.5E character, with all their feats, etc.

Quote from: Larsdangly;1016572And once your character has more than 50 attribute points things start to get wobbly.

This was my biggest problem with the system: that "roll 3 against IQ" is vastly different when dealing with a 35-pt character than a 50-pt character.  I was working out how I'd do an "original stat" system, and then I had GURPS 0.5 in my hands, and that put paid to my musings.

That, and I never cared for the wizard vs hero dichotomy, and was likewise musing over something akin to GURPS Magery: a lump sum point cost at startup for the right to pick spells.

Quote from: Larsdangly;1016721It's a fair comparison. A character in Runequest or any of a number of other BRP games has a couple dozen skill percentages to track separately, in some versions hit locations and hit location specific armor, etc. You need quite a few independent bits of information to define what a character is and what he or she can do. To first order, its the same amount of information you need to define a 3.5E character, with all their feats, etc.

I found 3.5 far more complicated than AD&D or RQ, granted at the time I had 20+ years with BRP systems so ymmv.

Quote from: CRKrueger;1016500Translation, if you want their stuff, get it now.

I know nothing of Steve Jackson other than what he wrote and what his company published (so, like the Wikipedia version of the man). Does he have a reputation for something something that means people that work with him... something that precludes them selling their old stuff?

Quote from: Willie the Duck;1016754I know nothing of Steve Jackson other than what he wrote and what his company published (so, like the Wikipedia version of the man). Does he have a reputation for something something that means people that work with him... something that precludes them selling their old stuff?

Its been weird. Even back in the late 90s there were sporatic reports of odd behavior at SJG. Then there was the C&D sent to a fan site for a game they didnt even own. Then takedown of one set of fan material and threats. Rumours of more. And so it goes. None of which makes one bit of sense. And if I didnt know some of the people involved or was present when it happened I would have thought such things just wild tales.

But after decades of watching game companies do underhanded things at this point I just shrug and chalk it up to whatever disease eats away at some publishers.

So sadly yeah. Its best to assume the worst at this point and grab what you can while you can. If SJG and DCG work out a deal then great. I sure hope they do.