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Author Topic: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?  (Read 3302 times)

weirdguy564

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So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« on: January 23, 2023, 09:05:52 AM »
This predates the OGL.  Lots of people don’t like D&D 5E.  In my case I just don’t like the rules for AC, hit dice, hit points that go up (AC should go up), and Vancian magic are all reasons to avoid D&D. 

Is it still Old School Essentials?  Is that the standard response to, “What else is there?”

I would steer people to Palladium Books Fantasy, especially 1E.  Sure, it’s got quirks like the stats for shields are not in the equipment section, but written in the proficiency skill description.  2E continues that oddity too, because it’s tradition?!?

Or lots of OSR games that are free.  Dragon Warriors is another I’m starting to warm up to, and currently pay-what-you-want on DT-RPG. 

I don’t think this question has changed.  Avoiding a game with the old 1.0a OGL in it seems petty, as that still isn’t a thing.  In fact, I say get your alternate games now before they go away. 
Saying D&D is the best RPG is like saying Bud Lite is the best beer.  Maybe we shouldn't equate "popular" with "good"?

3catcircus

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2023, 09:33:33 AM »
I think that, unfortunately, there hasn't been a ton of competition that the current generation is players is aware of beyond Pathfinder if they only hang out on the WotC farm.

Even those who venture off the plantation to Paizo or ENW are only exposed to PF or Level Up A5E, for the most part.

My choices would be Rules Cyclopedia or 1e AD&D. For those without access to that, one of the OSR retroclones is more readily available.

That having been said, I'm all for exposure to non-d20 rules sets  also - HARP (Role master may be too overwhelming going to it directly), Runequest, Harn, and WFRP. For more d20-esque but definitely differently flavored, DCC or LotFP may be good choices.

For those willing to put in the work to parse the poorly edited content, I loves me some Mythus/Dangerous Journeys - there is a beautiful system hidden inside, and the campaign setting is easily accessible to people who understand a little of real Earth geography.

Or you could choose to open the aperture and play something other than medieval fantasy type stuff.

Steven Mitchell

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2023, 10:13:37 AM »
Do you actually read anything here?  Or do you just post your latest slant on your favorites over and over, as some slightly different way to say it springs to mind?  Because most of the posts you are starting have been well covered, and often recently.

Or more to the point, why do you ask questions if you don't listen to the answers?

Bruwulf

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2023, 10:20:30 AM »
This predates the OGL.  Lots of people don’t like D&D 5E.  In my case I just don’t like the rules for AC, hit dice, hit points that go up (AC should go up), and Vancian magic are all reasons to avoid D&D. 

We get it. You don't like D&D. You play other games. Is that your entire personality?

Ghostmaker

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2023, 10:27:26 AM »
I need to make a song along the lines of Lehrer's 'Element Song' but with all the RPGs in it.

Chris24601

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2023, 10:33:31 AM »
I’m going to pretend you’re serious and answer with something equally as serious as I think you’re actually being;

If you want something 5e-ish that is not OGL, then you should switch to MY game; Ruins & Realms; once it’s released (art scheduled for completion in mid-March… so release should still be ahead of the OGL1.666).

All the d20 rolls and options for non-Tolkein expy races you enjoyed from 5e, but with better mechanics and easier GM-side tools for encounter-building and with a lower price point.

weirdguy564

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2023, 10:35:37 AM »
This predates the OGL.  Lots of people don’t like D&D 5E.  In my case I just don’t like the rules for AC, hit dice, hit points that go up (AC should go up), and Vancian magic are all reasons to avoid D&D. 

We get it. You don't like D&D. You play other games. Is that your entire personality?

I don’t hate it.  Hell, until this OGL nonsense I had a good opinion of WotC.  It just wasn’t for me. 

Now it seems even being tangentially associated with them is poison.  But OSR games shouldn’t be punished for what WotC does. 

Like I said, the one OSR that “seemed” above the others was Old School Essentials.  Is that still the case? 

Just curious what everyone is up to now.  My guess is everyone will actually keep playing 5E.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2023, 10:38:52 AM by weirdguy564 »
Saying D&D is the best RPG is like saying Bud Lite is the best beer.  Maybe we shouldn't equate "popular" with "good"?

weirdguy564

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2023, 10:49:11 AM »
This predates the OGL.  Lots of people don’t like D&D 5E.  In my case I just don’t like the rules for AC, hit dice, hit points that go up (AC should go up), and Vancian magic are all reasons to avoid D&D. 

We get it. You don't like D&D. You play other games. Is that your entire personality?

Sort of, yes?   Maybe?

To put it into context I’ve been spending time digging around the OSR scene looking for the least D&D styled game out there that still is advertised as OSR.  Sometimes they’re so far out there I want know what the author thinks is OSR about their game. 

Hell, I’m not even a fantasy player at heart.  My main games used to be sci-fi.  Rifts.  RoboTech, and D6 Star Wars. 

This OGL blowup does make me think I’m a bit harsh on the OSR and D&D 3rd party products.  But, yes.  I’m an outsider to that scene. 
Saying D&D is the best RPG is like saying Bud Lite is the best beer.  Maybe we shouldn't equate "popular" with "good"?

GhostNinja

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2023, 10:51:42 AM »

Just curious what everyone is up to now.  My guess is everyone will actually keep playing 5E.

I considered switching to something different due to the whole OGL mess.  I have deciced I am too far into the game I am running to do so.   I had seriously considered Pathfinder second edition (I am going to read it and may up the way switch to it) but for right now I am going to use the 5e books I have.

WOTC already has my money.  I wont given them any more money and continue to get my money's worth out of the books I have.
Ghostninja

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2023, 11:07:28 AM »

To put it into context I’ve been spending time digging around the OSR scene looking for the least D&D styled game out there that still is advertised as OSR.  Sometimes they’re so far out there I want know what the author thinks is OSR about their game. 

  Try Sarah Newton's Monsters & Magic--FATE flesh on an OSR skeleton.

tenbones

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2023, 11:18:21 AM »
Unless you're dead-set on running d20 in some other form, I continue to the bang the drum of Savage Worlds.

With the advent of Savage Worlds Pathfinder as an official brand and flavor of d20 fully translated to Savage Worlds, everyone has a *very* easy template to play D&D on the Savage Worlds chassis.

With the Savage Worlds Fantasy Companion out now - you can *fully* customize your Savage Worlds fantasy games to effectively run any kind of Fantasy game you want. The natural scalability and flexibility of the system will let you create just about anything you need. Translating any d20 content, regardless of flavor, is pretty easy. You can (and I have) picked up 1e/2e content, 5e AP's, Pathfinder material and used it all on the fly without any problem in Savage Worlds.

It's completely non-OGL, it gives no money to WotC, it introduces you to an extremely cool system that handles *far* more than just D&D fantasy. It plays faster, scales *way* higher in playability (high level D&D play is a breeze), and it has none of the issues that d20 traditionally has.

It is *not* perfect. There are quibbles that Savage Worlds enthusiasts will debate, but it's *nothing* like the knock-down drag outs that d20 Tribalists do. And literally all of the "issues" are easily tweakable to be rendered irrelevant.

hedgehobbit

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2023, 11:43:20 AM »
This predates the OGL.  Lots of people don’t like D&D 5E.  In my case I just don’t like the rules for AC, hit dice, hit points that go up (AC should go up), and Vancian magic are all reasons to avoid D&D. 

If you are that particular about what you like then why not just create your own game? My OD&D game doesn't have armor class, vancian magic, or the six normal ability scores.

weirdguy564

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2023, 12:22:13 PM »
This predates the OGL.  Lots of people don’t like D&D 5E.  In my case I just don’t like the rules for AC, hit dice, hit points that go up (AC should go up), and Vancian magic are all reasons to avoid D&D. 

If you are that particular about what you like then why not just create your own game? My OD&D game doesn't have armor class, vancian magic, or the six normal ability scores.

I’m tempted.  But free time is not a thing I have.  Still, David Guyll, writer of Dungeons and Delvers said the same to me in private emails. 

But do we need another not-Star Wars, but it’s Star Wars RPG using his dice pool system?
Saying D&D is the best RPG is like saying Bud Lite is the best beer.  Maybe we shouldn't equate "popular" with "good"?

hedgehobbit

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2023, 01:03:07 PM »
I’m tempted.  But free time is not a thing I have.  Still, David Guyll, writer of Dungeons and Delvers said the same to me in private emails.

I didn't start out trying to write an RPG, I just made tweak after tweak until the whole thing was different. But the thing about writing an RPG for yourself is that you don't need to write it to the standards of a published RPG. You only need to flesh out the first three levels or so of each class and write only first level spells, etc. Your magic item and monster list will grow naturally as you write adventures, etc.

Just write enough to get you by the next session or two and rely heavily on player input for what parts of the game to expand.

Quote
But do we need another not-Star Wars, but it’s Star Wars RPG using his dice pool system?

D6 Space is the SW RPG without the SW IP. But you are correct that we don't NEED any more RPGs. However, science fiction is a bit different from most other genres in that it varies so much. A Star Wars game, a Star Trek game, and an Alien game will all be radically different in tone. And new sub-genre's about being created all the time; like the Expanse.

Greentongue

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Re: So if you don’t want to use WotC 5E, what do you play?
« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2023, 01:30:13 PM »
Well, there is still MAZES & MINOTAURS
http://mazesandminotaurs.free.fr/revised.html