It occurs to me upon reflection that I actually found it a terrible shape for a gaming book; the text is small and starts to vanish in the binding if you try to lay it flat for reference, the pages are small at the best of times and occasionally half of one is taken up by a chart, table, or list - save in the case of "Death magic" (technology), where there's one long chart over three or more pages.

But a game that didn't so much rely on charts and the like would be ok.  I mean, look at the Minds Eye theatre stuff.  All of those after Masquerade and Apocalypse were normal paper back sized.  I probably got more gaming out of those books than any of the regular sized game books I own.  And it wasn't just larp.  I used the same sytem for tabletop for years, worked like a dream.  Didn't even need to score dice.

IIRC the Darksword books were mass market paperbacks.  A lot of vanity publishers don't handle that size, so the price for the book is going to be about $12 to $20 depending on the page count which is a lot to pay for an unknown author.  People are willing to buy RPGs at those prices, but a novel with a mini RPG tacked on, I don't know.  It's an interesting thought in theory.  Of course, what you'd have in practice is a double whammy of horribly written novels crammed with poorly designed and/or incomplete settings.  Everyone has at least one great idea for a book, but the truth is it takes a lot more skill to write a good novel than it does to design a good RPG setting.  Not to discourage anyone from anyone from trying---I'm all for new things that help expand awareness of the hobby.  

And yeah, Darksword wasn't a terribly good book or setting.  But I wish like hell they would make a Deathgate Cycle RPG.

Pete

Quote from: StumpydavePut it this way, a typical, non gamer, sci-fi/fantasy/horror (genres chosen for their ubiquity) fan is more likely to come across a game if it's in their usual section than us hoping that said fan will chance upon a game set in their genre in the game section.

I'd like to see more games in a paperback/trade paperback format.  Cheaper to produce/buy.  Easier to carry.  The only downside I can see is a lack of interest by existing gamers through sheer snobbery.

That's the way I see it as well but I'm curious from people in the know why it's not done anymore.  There have been many adaptations of popular fiction to RPGs of late but they're sold seperately and for exorbant prices.  Personally, I don't need hard covered books with color pictures on gloss paper that badly.  RPGs have spawned fiction and fiction has spawned RPGs, why not sell RPGs in a form where they're most accessible?  

Quote from: Christmas ApeAlso, umm...Darksword Adventures was a pretty bad game, as I recall.

I just pulled/unburied it off of the shelves.  I plan on re-reading it with a more critical eye on system.

Quote from: Christmas ApeIt occurs to me upon reflection that I actually found it a terrible shape for a gaming book; the text is small and starts to vanish in the binding if you try to lay it flat for reference, the pages are small at the best of times and occasionally half of one is taken up by a chart, table, or list - save in the case of "Death magic" (technology), where there's one long chart over three or more pages.

I think the advent of RPG internet sites would be the answer to that hurdle.  With OGLs and such, I'd think this would be a great idea for authors to put out their own works as RPGs in a format that could be sold along with their writing.  I could also imagine a RPG written in the format of a graphic novel with supplements coming in the form of comic books for superhero games.  I somehow feel that tradition has become the standard for releasing RPG related material.

IIRC, it wasn't Weiss & Hickman - I think it was just Weiss (may have been just Hickman).  

I also think that each's work was vastly enhanced by the other (I seem to remember reading at least one book by each of them alone).  Darksword wasn't particularly good.

Deathgate Cycle, however, I really liked.

V.

Quote from: VolkazzIIRC, it wasn't Weiss & Hickman - I think it was just Weiss (may have been just Hickman).

Yep, just Weiss.

- Q

Umm...I have the Darksword Adventures right here and it is both Hickman and Weis.

I remember reading the darksword trilogy (I enjoyed it, by I was quite young. I don't think I would find any good now ...) and buying the darksword adventures.

For one thing, the game was terrible, but, overall, I didn't like the format. Looking thru it was very difficult as accessing any kind of charts.

Given that, two general comments :
- Why should a good writer not want to write for the rpg and should write a novel instead ? I mean, sure, given the current format of setting and prewritten plots, everything (almost) written that way is dull to read, but there should be other alternatives (concerning those formats) that could be fun to write and read. Beside the mere money aspect, I could see something more fun to write than a novel ...

- I think getting outside the typical format of rpg as a way to sell those elsewhere is a good idea. I guess the final product would need to feel differently than the current ones, but why not !! Most people I know don't like to go to games store and I can understand why. So, why not try to produce games that could be sold elsewhere, given their format ?