Quote from: BoxCrayonTales;1142600I'm really surprised WotC hasn't made a module where the vistani are victims of ethnic cleansing and need to be rescued by the party, with a portion of profits being donated to charities that help Romani people.

That would be ACTUAL social activism and ACTUALLY caring about a minority that isn't important in the USA, so we can't have that.

Quote from: Slipshot762;1142594the deck of cards was always ham, i just gave her a crystal ball instead.

Hell yes, it was ham.  And I laid that shit on six inches thick with a trowel.

Dark room lit with some flickering candles.  Violin music playing in the background.  Dramatically whip out a cloth and put it on the table.  Put on a thick-ass fortuneteller voice, stack the deck so it gave the reading I wanted, gasp and swoon as the cards were revealed.

They fucking loved it, I loved doing it.  Cheesy.  Corny.  Probably offensive.  But damn was that fun!

Quote from: Taggie;1142584pretty much, the Roma are being purged and killed in parts of Eastern Europe right now, lets not have a game spreading the propaganda used to justify it.

Yeah.  It's a real shame how the US government has failed to put any pressure on Eastern European governments to treat their Roma populations better despite the ongoing protests by woke activitists in nearly every major US city calling for action and standing in solidarity with the Roma.

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1142542No way a bunch of social justice nitwits are going to buy tons of copies of a whitewashed Ravenloft at hundreds of dollars a pop.
They'll play their old modules (if they play at all) and moan about the stereotypes on twitter.

Can't wait to see this flop and get blamed on the neo-nazi OSR grognards somehow.

Want to bet?

Serious question.

I can't wait to see you squirm, spin, distract, and attempt to ignore it when it's a success. I bet it ranks higher on Amazon than any Pathfinder 2 product has ever done.

[Edit - Well, that was fast. #49. And it's only in preorder!]

Quote from: Taggie;1142584pretty much, the Roma are being purged and killed in parts of Eastern Europe right now, lets not have a game spreading the propaganda used to justify it.

Having romani relatives who fled the the old world to the US. I can tell you that even they used the term Gypsy. As a derogatory to refer to Romani thieves. Not often. But it happened. And I've lived in no less than two areas where "Gypsies" regularly came through the area and robbed people. These sorts also used to hole up on the land in back of us and I can tell you from experience those steryotypes... arent.

The depiction in Ravenloft is not too far off from actuality. Just like every other group of people you have your good ones. And then you have the nuts who seem hellbent on self perpetuating the negative image. Or are the source of the negative image. And that grinds anyone normal's gears because it makes life potentially harder for those who want to live a normal life.

"Fixing" Ravenloft isnt going to fix anything.

Quote from: Mistwell;1142608Want to bet?

Serious question.

I can't wait to see you squirm, spin, distract, and attempt to ignore it when it's a success. I bet it ranks higher on Amazon than any Pathfinder 2 product has ever done.

[Edit - Well, that was fast. #49. And it's only in preorder!]

#1. We'd have to get a lot more specific about "tons of copies" or "success" before actually making a wager. #49 on Amazon preorder doesn't mean anything to me. I have no idea how Pathfinder 2 performed, so that also means nothing to me.

#2. I don't plan to squirm for your amusement. The best you'll get is, "Well I was wrong about that." But that's a mighty big "If".

Quote from: Ratman_tf;1142613#1. We'd have to get a lot more specific about "tons of copies" or "success" before actually making a wager. #49 on Amazon preorder doesn't mean anything to me. I have no idea how Pathfinder 2 performed, so that also means nothing to me.

#2. I don't plan to squirm for your amusement. The best you'll get is, "Well I was wrong about that." But that's a mighty big "If".

You'd also need some way of verifying that the people doing the purchasing are social justice types. I think it far more likely the people doing the purchasing are hardcore D&D fans who are completely oblivious to "controversy" surrounding WotC and its products at the moment.

Quote from: SavageSchemer;1142615You'd also need some way of verifying that the people doing the purchasing are social justice types. I think it far more likely the people doing the purchasing are hardcore D&D fans who are completely oblivious to "controversy" surrounding WotC and its products at the moment.

That too.

I can't see myself buying this, not because of the content change (which matters not at all to me), but because the price seems silly high.

99$ for a boxed non-hardcover set seems stupidly high? I cant see the contents costing that much. And well over 200$ for a special? Is this some sort of early or late April Fools joke? Makes no sense.

The Vistani in the original Ravenloft setting were a very game-able representation of the Romani (mostly as presented by Bram Stoker and Hollywood), but in 2020, there can't be any honesty about why the gypsies were known for being thieves, entertainers and con men. They've always had a complicated relationship wherever they have roamed.

As for casting curses, one has to understand that Eastern European culture is saturated deep in superstition. Far more than England or France, much more akin to Italy where stuff like wards on your home against the Evil Eye is normal life. The comedian Sebastian Maniscalco even did a bit about the malocchio.

I have no doubt the SJW edition will sell just fine. Plenty of D&D collectors and completeists out there. Also, the SJW soy kids are the WotC audience now so its no surprise they'd be catered to...for a price. They can buy it with their next $1200 CoronaChan check!

Quote from: Premier;1142601That would be ACTUAL social activism and ACTUALLY caring about a minority that isn't important in the USA, so we can't have that.

That'd be White Saviour Complex, and WoTC would be attacked for it. SJWs always attack.

Quote from: Mistwell;1142608[Edit - Well, that was fast. #49. And it's only in preorder!]

#11 on your preferred list now. Still well behind Monster Girl Islands #6!

Quote from: SavageSchemer;1142615You'd also need some way of verifying that the people doing the purchasing are social justice types. I think it far more likely the people doing the purchasing are hardcore D&D fans who are completely oblivious to "controversy" surrounding WotC and its products at the moment.

Exactly. The book will sell well because all WOTC D&D products sell well. I don't personally care about the edits to Vistani other than I thought the Vistani were kinda bland in the original and I am happy if they make them into a more interesting group of people who are plane-hoppers. And I am interested in all the additional material included with this product.

Almost nobody is buying or not buying it because of the inclusion issue - it's going to be about the new stuff in it, like always!

The truth of the matter is most gamers are not buying or protesting products due to any of these issues. Most are not even aware they ARE issues.

But, they might have some extra cash in their pocket right now if they are stuck at home on super-unemployment with a stimulus check to boot. And if they see a new version of the best reviewed adventure for their favorite (and only) RPG with tons of new doo-dads, they may buy it. That's really what most of this comes down to. It's a cash grab, and it will likely work.

Quote from: S'mon;1142651#11 on your preferred list now. Still well behind Monster Girl Islands #6!

That cover really catches the eye...