Did anyone either run or play in the Castle Forlorn boxed set? How was it? I have it but never got a chance to run it.

Quote from: Lynn;594724Did anyone either run or play in the Castle Forlorn boxed set? How was it? I have it but never got a chance to run it.

I ran it ages ago and really liked it. But it has been a while and I no longer have a copy.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;594725I ran it ages ago and really liked it. But it has been a while and I no longer have a copy.

Same here, all the way around. The PCs made it through intact, but scarred...specifically, one was aged about 30 years by a ghost (and he was human).

The castle map in I6 is the best thing.

Quote from: misterguignol;592591What's bad in Ravenloft: it's not that influenced by Gothic literature per se; it's more like Hammer Horror meets D&D.

That's a bad thing?

QuoteAlso, the Dark Lords are fairly lame and obvious pastiches.  They have the 2e issue of having pages and pages of backstory that has no effect in play--this is the work of frustrated would-be novelists.

Well, you get paid by the word, and some editors actually want that stuff.  Or maybe they did at the time.

JG

Quote from: Piestrio;592551What is the best introduction to Ravenloft?

What's cool about it?

What's lame?

What's the one must have Ravenloft product?

The best introduction? Ravenloft is a game that requires the storyteller to set a mood, and give intense details to make the hearts of his players pound in genuine terror. It is a story of Gothic Horror, the dark arcanum, and Mythos-inspired entities.

The Overlords, each a sort of dark power, each have a slice of the realm of Ravenloft, and each mandate whether it is possible to pass either in or out of their respective realm, and if they permit you to simply walk across a field into the realm of another Overlord. They also limit the use of spells--especially divine spells--in their domains, and the casting of any inherently good spell essentially always requires an opposed powers check against that Overlord.

While it is possible to play any 'alignment', the traditional stories require you to start as 'good', and will slowly corrupt you. The game, as I recall, has both a corruption system and a madness system. Some storytellers do not make use of these, however, they are int he system for a good reason.

I believe one of the outlines in 'Ravenloft' reads like this:

In a normal AD&D setting, when characters are walking across a bridge approaching a troll, you may say 'You approach the bridge, and see a large troll standing on it.',
but in Ravenloft, you would state:

'The mists surround you, and the wind howls in your ears like the chill voices of lost souls. You hear a trickling stream, probably of icy water in the near distance. As you gaze abroad, you can see a dilapidated wooden bridge that spans the rippling currents, and through the veil that shades the land in grey shadows, you can barely make out a gruesome figure, twice the height of a man, with glowing blue eyes and a bloodied axe standing aloft on the crumbling crossing.'

That is the difference between Ravenloft (run properly) and AD&D.

I haven't run a Ravenloft game since it converted to d20, so I couldn't say what products sold today are worth owning. I suggest buying the core book and going from there to decide if you like it, and if you feel able to run it appropriately. You might even pick up an old copy of the original system, and try running that first.

I don't know if the new materials stand up to the old, or if they became more video-game-ish in nature: I hope that it has withstood the test of time, and the core book has always had one pre-designed scenario for you to run, until you get the swing of things.

if you enjoy this sort of thing, I also advise Mythos games. They are also designed for the detailed, horror-based and 'good vs. the questionable' motif. Ravenloft is not necessarily evil, but the purpose and ideals of the Overlords are not understood well by anyone by them.

Ravenloft is rumoured to be a prison for them, and they may be fallen gods, or otherworldly horrors, or men who became so powerful and corrupt that they were cursed and banished to the realm. Escape is impossible, or so all legends state. (I believe there is an artefact in 2e that escaped from Ravenloft though, and I would guess that if you can pass a powers check, a Spelljammer might be able to break away. All of that is up to the storyteller.

One of the goals is often for the PCs to find a way out, much like the D&D animated series, which was somewhat influenced by Ravenloft in concept.

The fun pat is that you can send anyone, from any setting, or any universe, or any level of technology, science, magic or psychic ability tot he realm. Their ray guns may start shooting out streams of bats, and their psy-powers trigger contact with Entities from Beyond. Heck, you could run a Ghostbusters RPG and send the players there just as easily. The goal of the players: To escape.

Killing the Overlords may not even ever be mentioned. (X|S)

Quote from: MagesGuild;594891Ravenloft is not necessarily evil, but the purpose and ideals of the Overlords are not understood well by anyone by them

Hmm... You seem to be conflating darklords (such as Strahd etc.) with the Dark Powers, the ultimate and unknown authority in the realm. The former can be killed, even if it's tricky, while the latter don't even have names or stats.

Quote from: GrimGent;594900Hmm... You seem to be conflating darklords (such as Strahd etc.) with the Dark Powers, the ultimate and unknown authority in the realm. The former can be killed, even if it's tricky, while the latter don't even have names or stats.

Aye, I probably am. I recall Overlord-eque entities that controlled the domains and required powers checks, however I don't recall the standing of every other powerful being in the realm. I do remember that the Overlords, or whatever you have them, are more like wardens of a prison for the other powerful characters (e.g. Strahd), but I don't remember which of the two sets can control the boundaries between regions, or if both can do this, with the 'Dark powers' having the primary control, and the 'Dark Lords' to a lesser-extent.

I would call it ill-advised to try to kill a Dark lord as well, but try it at your own peril. (X|S)

Quote from: MagesGuild;594956Aye, I probably am. I recall Overlord-eque entities that controlled the domains and required powers checks, however I don't recall the standing of every other powerful being in the realm. I do remember that the Overlords, or whatever you have them, are more like wardens of a prison for the other powerful characters (e.g. Strahd), but I don't remember which of the two sets can control the boundaries between regions, or if both can do this, with the 'Dark powers' having the primary control, and the 'Dark Lords' to a lesser-extent.

I would call it ill-advised to try to kill a Dark lord as well, but try it at your own peril. (X|S)

Overlords, demilords, etc are distinctions created later on (pretty sure they appeared in Domains of Dread. Basically that just refers to the kind of domain they rule but all are domain lords. A demilord rules over a pocket domain, a lord rules over an island of terror, an overlord rules pver a cluster of isdlands, and a dark lord rules over a domain that is part of the core (so strahd would be a darklord and anton misroi is a lord. Dark lords are considered the most powerful. All have the same basic powers (though I am little fuzzy on how domain border closing works when an overlord comes into conflict with a lord inside his cluster) and the distinction is more about what is an appropriate challenge for different level PCs (as well as having more convenient titles to discuss domains and their rulers).

The dark powers are the wardens. These are the unamed and unknown mastes of the demiplane of dread. They supposedly created ravenloft and are the ones who control the mists, bring in new inhabitants, and respond to acts of evil in the form of powers checks. So a domain lord is imprisoned and cursed (or blessed) by the dark powers. What the dark powers are (and even if they exist) was deliberately left unanswered. Best not to leave them blank in my opinion. The worst ravenloft campaigns I played in were ones where the Gm tried to explain what the dark powers were.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;594966Overlords, demilords, etc are distinctions created later on (pretty sure they appeared in Domains of Dread. Basically that just refers to the kind of domain they rule but all are domain lords. A demilord rules over a pocket domain, a lord rules over an island of terror, an overlord rules pver a cluster of isdlands, and a dark lord rules over a domain that is part of the core (so strahd would be a darklord and anton misroi is a lord.

The 3e version apparently took a somewhat simpler approach to the terminology: "Every aspect of a domain, from the climate to the creatures that call it home, is a subtle reflection of its darklord, offering painful reminders of the transgressions that forged the darklord's doom. The size of a domain may range from a single room, to a lonesome manor and its grounds, to an expansive dominion containing numerous towns and a thriving culture."

Quote from: James Gillen;594782That's a bad thing?

It is if you wanted something more akin to Gothic lit than D&D Hammer Horror, yes.

QuoteWell, you get paid by the word, and some editors actually want that stuff.  Or maybe they did at the time.

JG

Maybe.  But I think the stuff in game materials should be oriented toward playable content.  Those long backstories (which, if we're honest, were the product of frustrated would-be novelists) were not gameable content.  

My preference is for stuff I can actually use at the table.  What is more useful: a backstory that won't come up in play or what a Dark Lord is up to RIGHT NOW that the characters can get involved in?

Quote from: misterguignol;594975It is if you wanted something more akin to Gothic lit than D&D Hammer Horror, yes.
 in?

In your opionion, what would have made Ravenloft more in line with Gothic literature?

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;594977In your opionion, what would have made Ravenloft more in line with Gothic literature?

A random event chart with entries like "Giant helmets fall, everyone dies"?

(Actually, I did something along those lines for Maid at one point.)

The Domain of Giant Falling Helmets.
That sounds scary enough.

JG

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;594977In your opionion, what would have made Ravenloft more in line with Gothic literature?

The same sort of stuff I've done in my Tales of the Grotesque and Dungeonesque books, I suppose.  My rules for terror and horror are more in-genre than Ravenloft's fear and horror saves; my gothic character archetypes give more indications on what types of characters fit the themes; my dark secrets tables and former professions tables give more genre emulation; etc.

And now I sound like a shill.