Quote from: AsenRG;939514I understand modesty might be an issue:). No, honestly, I do...
But the idea that any Referee, not to mention one who has been running games for Gygax and Arneson, would have trouble finding players still almost boggles the mind. How many players are looking for anyone willing to run a game;)?

Oh yes, productivity would be a huge advantage. With the kind of effort you boat people have been putting in, had you focused all of those into editing things Phil had written and layout, you could have had the second biggest shop at Drivethru/RPGNow after WotC:D!

Understood, but he's running a game that nobody's really heard of or that has a tie-in with one of the big-name brand games that people see on the shelves. One has to be a 'name brand' these days, with a commercial tie-in to something that's on the shelf, in order to get people to stop by and take a look. No product, no sales, no interest. I've seen some really excellent miniatures lines fade away into oblivion because of this; great figures that are good for all sorts of games, but the Official, Authorized rules sets that they were created for got very little marketing support or exposure and so the lines dropped out of sight.

Dave's Braunsteins are heaps of fun to play, but they don't have the 'name recognition' that attracts casual players.

Agreed; if we'd had all of the stuff that dribbled out over the past thirty years all at once, we'd have had it made. See also 'no product... etc.'

Quote from: chirine ba kal;939516Understood, but he's running a game that nobody's really heard of or that has a tie-in with one of the big-name brand games that people see on the shelves. One has to be a 'name brand' these days, with a commercial tie-in to something that's on the shelf, in order to get people to stop by and take a look. No product, no sales, no interest. I've seen some really excellent miniatures lines fade away into oblivion because of this; great figures that are good for all sorts of games, but the Official, Authorized rules sets that they were created for got very little marketing support or exposure and so the lines dropped out of sight.

Dave's Braunsteins are heaps of fun to play, but they don't have the 'name recognition' that attracts casual players.

Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson should be good enough for name recognition, in his case. I mean, they did create a game a few RPG players might have heard about, so he may easily use that as part of his line...

QuoteAgreed; if we'd had all of the stuff that dribbled out over the past thirty years all at once, we'd have had it made. See also 'no product... etc.'

Well, it would have been nice, but one's gotta play with the cards one was dealt;)!

Quote from: AsenRG;939519Gary Gygax and Dave Arneson should be good enough for name recognition, in his case. I mean, they did create a game a few RPG players might have heard about, so he may easily use that as part of his line...

Well, it would have been nice, but one's gotta play with the cards one was dealt;)!

Who?

Seriously; neither of them has a lot of name recognition anymore, outside of the specialists. I was in the FLGS closest to my house, when I mentioned the two of them, and the denizens had no idea who had written D&D; all they knew was that the game had been done by WotC, and they didn't know anything about TSR either.

Agreed. What we had was what we had, and what we had to deal with was what we had to deal with.

How close to what you remember is My Private Jakalla?

Looks like an easy way to transition into an EPT game to me.
With those maps and the original EPT rule book, anyone should be able to hit the ground running in my opinion.

It may be that the "Kool Kids" don't play "Dungeon Crawls" any more ...
They need a three page character sheet showing how great they are and opportunities to posture not some dangerous crawlspace to risk their character in.
=

Quote from: Greentongue;939529How close to what you remember is My Private Jakalla?

Looks like an easy way to transition into an EPT game to me.
With those maps and the original EPT rule book, anyone should be able to hit the ground running in my opinion.

It may be that the "Kool Kids" don't play "Dungeon Crawls" any more ...
They need a three page character sheet showing how great they are and opportunities to posture not some dangerous crawlspace to risk their character in.
=

Yes, I'd agree with that. His maps are more spread out then Phil's, but I think that's because of the different media - back in Ye Olden Dayes, the usual style was to cram as much onto a sheet of graph paper as possible, which is why you get thin walls all over the place. It's a good Underworld map set, and if you took and populated it the way Phil did - as a busy place full of ancient hazards and modern occupants - I think you could have a great game in that same style.

I have no idea what the 'kool kids' want. What I see both online and at the local gaming spots is very different from what we used to do, and from each other as well. What we used to do here in the Twin Cities seems to be both obsolete and unpopular - "too hand-wavy", "too loosey-goosey", as I've been told quite a number of times. Quite a few people have been utterly baffled by the notion of a 'miniatures wargame' that is run that way, and they have been a little freaked out by the sample game on my YouTube channel. It's like the use of the word 'wargame' for what we used to call 'board games', and the accompanying assumptions that we played SPI and Avalon Hill games like we played with Tractics and Chainmail. Gronan's mantra, "Anything Not Specifically Forbidden By The Rules Is Permitted", vs. the assumption that "Anything Not Specifically Permitted By The Rules Is Forbidden". I play the former, even in my historical settings.

'Dungeon crawls' can be fun, and I've run a few myself in the various settings that I support. Ancient Egypt is a good example of what's possible; the setting has some pretty interesting 'monsters' that - in my opinion, anyway - give even experienced RPG players a run for their money. Take two sedja, and call me in the morning...

I can never quite decide if creativity has always been uncommon and the smaller, grass-roots gaming community in the old days simply drew more creative people or if creativity has been eroded and stigmatized by a world with access to professionally produced media.

Quote from: chirine ba kal;939456Interesting thought, there, and in line with the question we were asked at Gary Con two years ago about running The Great Mos Eisley Spaceport Raid once again. Certainly, we could amass the stuff to do it with, and book the space at a game convention; it would not be all that hard to run.

However, I think it would be a flop. First, RPG players who subscribe to the 'I hate miniatures!' school would flee from the sight; very few RPG players would understand the Braunstein nature of the beast and not get into the spirit of the thing; and I suspect that what's left of the miniatures hobby would freak out over the setting. So, I think we'd get very few players, which does cripple the game pretty badly. (Look how hard it is for Maj. Wesely to get players.)

If you did want to do this, I'd suggest doing it at FFG in their Event Center as a Big Special Event, tied in with their game. That way, you'd get the players needed to make the game a success, and who are used to the idea of little (plastic, in this case) people on the table. You'd largely avoid the fanatic OSR types and the edition warriors, too; different segment of the market.

Well, I'd make sure I had at least four reliable people I knew would show up; as you taught me lo the decades ago, "the best spontaneous demonstrations are carefully planned."  GaryCon might work, but in any case I'd have some plants.

More likely I'd find some eager, young, healthy, and not too bright young lad and convince him that HE wants to do this.  To quote Obi-Wan Kenobi, "I'm getting too old for this sort of thing."

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;939380More later...

Reading the posts about travel made me think on the subject of "gifts" on Tekumel.  Traveling for the Temple, I might present the local guard squad with some fresher or more varied supplies than standard army chow, and/or make provisions for religious observances; traveling as a private citizen, I might invite the hereksa of that tower to dine with me that night; traveling as the Glorious General I might let the hereksa know that she will be favorably mentioned in my dispatches; etc.

Rewards can take many forms other than crude specie.

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;939552Reading the posts about travel made me think on the subject of "gifts" on Tekumel.  Traveling for the Temple, I might present the local guard squad with some fresher or more varied supplies than standard army chow, and/or make provisions for religious observances; traveling as a private citizen, I might invite the hereksa of that tower to dine with me that night; traveling as the Glorious General I might let the hereksa know that she will be favorably mentioned in my dispatches; etc.

Rewards can take many forms other than crude specie.

This is interesting. So, what would you say the "correct" non-pecuniary inducement would be for the guard at the gate to the city who decides that the PC's are perfect for a shakedown, or the merchant that simply has nothing that the PC's are in need of, but might know someone who has what they are looking for (if only he could remember...), or the bureaucrat that is just too busy to deal with the party right now and tells them to come back tomorrow or next week, but is the only one that can sign off on a document the PC's absolutely need?

Shemek

Quote from: Shemek hiTankolel;939560This is interesting. So, what would you say the "correct" non-pecuniary inducement would be for the guard at the gate to the city who decides that the PC's are perfect for a shakedown, or the merchant that simply has nothing that the PC's are in need of, but might know someone who has what they are looking for (if only he could remember...), or the bureaucrat that is just too busy to deal with the party right now and tells them to come back tomorrow or next week, but is the only one that can sign off on a document the PC's absolutely need?

Shemek

Depends... who am I?  Who are the PCs?

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;939565Depends... who am I?  Who are the PCs?

Ok, you are one of the above mentioned individuals, and the PC's are "nobodies", perhaps foreigners, or low clan.

Shemek

A bit late to the discussion but here in the UK various groups run what are known as Megagames but which are really Braunstein-a-likes. The organisers arrange a location, a scenario and a team of referees then gather players for a day's gaming. I played in quite a few over the years a Battle of Britain game at Sandhurst, a Morgan's Raid on Panama, a sci-fi invasion, a World War One game. All involve about 50-80 people and for a modest cost provide a day full of entertainment. They don't seem to have a problem in getting enough players together.

Megagame Makers
Megagame Society

Quote from: chirine ba kal;939527Who?

Seriously; neither of them has a lot of name recognition anymore, outside of the specialists. I was in the FLGS closest to my house, when I mentioned the two of them, and the denizens had no idea who had written D&D; all they knew was that the game had been done by WotC, and they didn't know anything about TSR either.

All too true.  It was probably three years ago now, after running a session of ACKS I was waiting for the bus and talking to one of my players, who was in his mid-to-late 20s and mostly experienced with 3eD&D/Pathfinder, about differences between early editions of D&D and what he was used to.  In the course of the conversation, I made passing references to TSR and Gygax, then, in both cases, had to double back and explain to him who they were.

I suppose that shouldn't surprise me.  After all, for most people, "history" is this vague miasma with cavemen, George Washington, Romans, knights in armor, World War 2, pyramids, and Abraham Lincoln all floating around in it and occasionally some figure comes into focus.

I discovered about 10 years ago that C.S. Lewis had made the same observation in slightly different words back in the 1940s.

Quote from: chirine ba kal;939527Who?

Seriously; neither of them has a lot of name recognition anymore, outside of the specialists. I was in the FLGS closest to my house, when I mentioned the two of them, and the denizens had no idea who had written D&D; all they knew was that the game had been done by WotC, and they didn't know anything about TSR either.

Agreed. What we had was what we had, and what we had to deal with was what we had to deal with.

Well, surely they have heard about the game those two designed, so you can replace the names with "the guys who designed D&D back before D&D existed"?
Of course, I'd understand the Major if he didn't want to play with people who lack interest in history...

Quote from: Gronan of Simmerya;939662I suppose that shouldn't surprise me.  After all, for most people, "history" is this vague miasma with cavemen, George Washington, Romans, knights in armor, World War 2, pyramids, and Abraham Lincoln all floating around in it and occasionally some figure comes into focus.

I discovered about 10 years ago that C.S. Lewis had made the same observation in slightly different words back in the 1940s.

And the best part is when people don't listen, but then they wonder about repeating the same mistakes over and over;).