Finally, after years of agitation and discontent, our ongoing MERP/roleplayer group has decided to switch systems (hooray), Unfortunately, there is no true consent about what shiny new game should replace the current mess of a game we use (basically a mesh up of MERP, Rolemaster and a large houserule bloat nobody seems to completely understand anymore). I had a few ideas (as do the others) and I am the "guy who knows many different roleplaying games", and I am not completely sure if there isn't a better option than my first gut feeling (that would be BRP or another member of the Runequest family, probably Legend, because it's cheap). So, I'm asking you for recommendations for good systems. Perhaps there is a hidden gem out there which we haven't seen yet which would be a nigh perfect fit.

The criteria so far for a new game are:

• The base is classic fantasy. With Elves, Dwarves, Orcs and so on. Strongly inspired by Tolkien, but expanded to a massive kitchen sink (think forgotten realms, but without any consistency).
• The system should be generic enough to be adjusted to the setting.
• The rule mechanics should be "sensible", meaning mostly "realistic" and strongly associated with the events in the game represented in the game; highly abstract games are not to this group's tastes.
• Task resolution should be decently quick and simple.
• the game should require little bookkeeping or nitty-gritty resource management.
• Many options for characters are good; classes, levels or other purely metagame concepts are not.
• Random character creation should at least be an option.
• Realism is more important than balance, balance is more important than cinematic spectacle, spectacle is more important than individual drama or other introspective elements.
• D&D in any form is for some reason or other unacceptable. No, the reasons aren't entirely rational.

So, if you have any recommendations for a game system that would fit those criteria, let me know.

Runequest 6e would be my first recommendation for non-D&D fantasy, and it seems to jive just fine with most of your criteria.

RQ6 is essentially a revision and/or expansion of Legend, which makes both games very similar. While Legend does indeed offer great value at $1 for the full game in PDF, RQ6 Essentials is PWYW. You can nudge the rest of your group over there and let them check it out for themselves.

I am definitely more of a RQ6 fan, but both should do the trick.

Harnmaster, Harn is a bog standard, (although high detailed) medieval setting with elves, and dwarves. It easily adaptable to D&Dish or Tokienesque settings.

I also second Butcher recommendation for Legends/Runequest.

I dearly love HarnMaster, but a lot of that love is linked to the setting and that is way too detailed for this group. Besides, I already play HarnMaster (even though not frequent enough) so for entirely egoistic reasons, I wouldn't recommend that one.

RQ6 without a doubt.  If your players aren't rules lawyers, then they can get Legend which is close to get the basics down.

Why RQ6 instead of any other BRP derived game? Well formed and different magic systems that can do subtle as well as overt and have different magical sources.  If your players are used to running from an Olog Hai instead of cueing up Highway to the Danger Zone and charging, then RQ 6 is what you want, period.

Age of Shadow, based on OpenQuest may be of interest. It is First Age Middle Earth with the serial numbers filed off. Core rules are free in pdf; supplements are cheap.

Or there's Magic World for BRP.

I'd probably have to say RuneQuest 6th as well would be at least a good candidate for what they're after. It does a really good job of explaining core concepts in the book, too.

Even before the OP mentioned BRP/RQ family, that's what I was thinking based on where they're coming from.

The only other option I can think of would be a version of Talislanta/Omni, maybe High Medieval from Morrigan. I understand it uses levels in some way but my impression from Tal 4e, the basis of Omni, is that they're vestigial. (I.e. no escalating hit points.)

Except for no option for random character creation, HERO System 6e 1 & 2 and Fantasy Hero might be worth a look.  A new all-in-one rules & sourcebook, Fantasy Hero Complete, was recently funded via Kickstarter and should be released in early 2015. It will be similar to Champions Complete.

Admittedly, if you are heavily invested in Runequest/BRP that would probably be a more seamless transition.  However, since the house rules your group currently use already incorporate some of those rules it might be better in the long run to switch to something completely different.

D&D sounds perfect, but I guess it's too popular for your group. So edgy.

RQ6 is great but a bit at the crunchy end for my preferences.
Openquest or Magic World are lighter fare which bring most of the same advantages (and seeing as how closely they're all related it's a doddle to interbreed between them)... and pull in additional powers/magics from the BRP toolbox.

Quote from: Beagle;781546The criteria so far for a new game are:

• The base is classic fantasy. With Elves, Dwarves, Orcs and so on. Strongly inspired by Tolkien, but expanded to a massive kitchen sink (think forgotten realms, but without any consistency).
• The system should be generic enough to be adjusted to the setting.
• The rule mechanics should be "sensible", meaning mostly "realistic" and strongly associated with the events in the game represented in the game; highly abstract games are not to this group's tastes.
• Task resolution should be decently quick and simple.
• the game should require little bookkeeping or nitty-gritty resource management.
• Many options for characters are good; classes, levels or other purely metagame concepts are not.
• Random character creation should at least be an option.
• Realism is more important than balance, balance is more important than cinematic spectacle, spectacle is more important than individual drama or other introspective elements.
• D&D in any form is for some reason or other unacceptable. No, the reasons aren't entirely rational.

So, if you have any recommendations for a game system that would fit those criteria, let me know.

WFRP hits everything on that list.
1st ed rather than second, as 2nd ed is a lot more tied to the setting.

I'd go with Legend. As already pointed out, it's really cheap and if you want to go further, then it's a very easy step to RQ6 .

There's a thread here about RQ and ME
http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?666743-Runequest-Middle-Earth

Warning that it's a thread on TBP though.

Quote from: danbuter;781659D&D sounds perfect, but I guess it's too popular for your group. So edgy.

Not really. Two of our groups have a history with one of the most awful campaigns I have ever heard of, based on Pathfinder. They have developed a strong dislike against the system on principle.  Me, I just think the 5th edition seems to be an okay choice, but many key elements of D&D - like alignments, the rather abstract HP system, and classes and levels - just doesn't mesh particularly well with the preferences and ideas of this group. The existance of levels is one of the reason why we are going to abandon MERP, for example. We are looking for a different set of aesthetics than those provided by D&D. Things like "normal" humans being effectively tougher than, let's say elephants (let alone dragons) just doesn't feel right.
Besides, we're German. If we are going to shun a game for its popularity, it's DSA (even though mocking DSA is probably as mainstream among German gamers as the game itself ever was, so for the sake of being edgy, we should probably become its staunch defenders).

You've been using a big incoherent mashup of MERP/RM/houserules? For a moment I thought it must still be 1988...

Long before it got to that point, I would have suggested going to a clearly defined flavor of Rolemaster, such as RM2 with only a few options from the companions, or RMSS.

Or if you are not totally burned on ICE systems, and just want to simplify, you could check out HARP (High Adventure Roleplaying). RQ6 or another BRP game does also seem like it would suit the group.