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Not getting the vibe.

Started by Stumpydave, August 02, 2007, 09:31:05 AM

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Stumpydave

August 02, 2007, 09:31:05 AM
Right, where did this idea that games that emphasise the story are lesser than those that take a more (for want of a better word) Gygaxian approach spring from?  Because this site has just left me cold for the past couple of months.  

It started when there seemed to be a groupthink that unless a game was based upon a twenty+ year old system then it was a swine game designed to emulate chick flicks and rom coms and worthy only of the inverted snobbery one finds in working class politics.

So what happened?
 

James J Skach

#1
August 02, 2007, 09:33:45 AM
Quote from: StumpydaveRight, where did this idea that games that emphasise the story are lesser than those that take a more (for want of a better word) Gygaxian approach spring from?  Because this site has just left me cold for the past couple of months.  

It started when there seemed to be a groupthink that unless a game was based upon a twenty+ year old system then it was a swine game designed to emulate chick flicks and rom coms and worthy only of the inverted snobbery one finds in working class politics.

So what happened?
It's a reaction to the vibe that games that emphasize the story are greater than those that take a more (for want of a better word) Gygaxian approach.

It's simple, really.
The rules are my slave, not my master. - Old Geezer

The RPG Haven - Talking About RPGs

jrients

#2
August 02, 2007, 09:37:07 AM
What happened is that a lot of people who feel completely satisfied with the Old Ways discovered a place where they aren't considered fossils.  People being people, it became easier for some folks to vent their spleen about the Young Whippersnapper approach when surrounded by the likeminded.
Jeff Rients
My gameblog

JamesV

#3
August 02, 2007, 09:37:35 AM
Quote from: James J SkachIt's a reaction to the vibe that games that emphasize the story are greater than those that take a more (for want of a better word) Gygaxian approach.

It's simple, really.

Pretty much gotta blame the misguided jerks on this one. You gotta admit it's not far to get from a simple and understandable "I'm having so much more fun playing my game!" to an arrogant and offensive "You're having so much less fun playing yours!"
Running: Dogs of WAR - Beer & Pretzels & Bullets
Planning to Run: Godbound or Stars Without Number
Playing: Star Wars D20 Rev.

A lack of moderation doesn\'t mean saying every asshole thing that pops into your head.

Settembrini

#4
August 02, 2007, 09:43:25 AM
Although Jeff is basically right, I think there´s somthing he´s missing:

The whippersnapper approach really is not an approach.
Because a new approach is a new way to reach the same goal.

Whereas I´d postulate that the "whippersnapper" contribution is a fundamental change of goals.

When people do not share goals, they can hardly communicate.

Sharing goals makes it possible to praise certain games, modules and adventures here, that get no love at other places. Anyone coming to such discussions with different goals means loss of the basic ability to communicate.
Especially when they assume there goal is everyone elses too.

PS: My goal is to fly a starship
If there can\'t be a TPK against the will of the players it\'s not an RPG.- Pierce Inverarity

Stumpydave

#5
August 02, 2007, 09:45:21 AM
Quote from: JamesVPretty much gotta blame the misguided jerks on this one. You gotta admit it's not far to get from a simple and understandable "I'm having so much more fun playing my game!" to an arrogant and offensive "You're having so much less fun playing yours!"

Bit like Ron Edwards infamous "Brain damage" moment then.
 

James J Skach

#6
August 02, 2007, 09:48:19 AM
Quote from: StumpydaveBit like Ron Edwards infamous "Brain damage" moment then.
Except that Brain Damage, when you read it, requires no inference.  It's not an implied "your game is so much less fun." It's an assertion that certain games literally caused Brain Damage to people who wanted to find collaborative storytelling.  I just read it again to see if I was missing something or such..and...well..unfotunately...no...
The rules are my slave, not my master. - Old Geezer

The RPG Haven - Talking About RPGs

Dr Rotwang!

#7
August 02, 2007, 10:50:59 AM
Right now I'm running Castles & Crusades.  I'd totally play sm Dread, though.

So the whole 'storygames > old-school' and vice-versa, to me, is so much wankery.

WANKERY!
Dr Rotwang!
...never blogs faster than he can see.
FONZITUDE RATING: 1985[/font]

Brantai

#8
August 02, 2007, 11:02:15 AM
Once again, Rotwang!'s fonzitude cuts through the bullshit, as a light through darkness.

flyingmice

#9
August 02, 2007, 11:12:48 AM
Quote from: BrantaiOnce again, Rotwang!'s fonzitude cuts through the bullshit, as a light through darkness.

More like "as a vibro-katana through the hull metal of a light star cruiser."

-clash
clash bowley * Flying Mice Games - an Imprint of Better Mousetrap Games
Flying Mice home page: http://jalan.flyingmice.com/flyingmice.html
Currently Designing: StarCluster 4 - Wavefront Empire
Last Releases: SC4 - Dark Orbital, SC4 - Out of the Ruins,  SC4 - Sabre & World
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Brantai

#10
August 02, 2007, 11:15:47 AM
Yes, I agree.  Yours is much more accurate.  :D

joewolz

#11
August 02, 2007, 11:35:10 AM
Quote from: Dr Rotwang!Right now I'm running Castles & Crusades.  I'd totally play sm Dread, though.

So the whole 'storygames > old-school' and vice-versa, to me, is so much wankery.

WANKERY!

Sounds like you and I have very similar taste.  Have you seen The Shadow of Yesterday?  Awesome game.
-JFC Wolz
Co-host of 2 Gms, 1 Mic

Stumpydave

#12
August 02, 2007, 01:13:56 PM
Quote from: Dr Rotwang!Right now I'm running Castles & Crusades.  I'd totally play sm Dread, though.

So the whole 'storygames > old-school' and vice-versa, to me, is so much wankery.

WANKERY!

Clearly I am not alone. This makes me happy.
 

J Arcane

#13
August 02, 2007, 01:16:43 PM
It's funny to me, that despite all the caterwauling certain indivuduals do about "mainstream play", the one thing no one seems to get is that all this arbitrary box drawing is about as un-"mainstream" as you can get.

The vast majority of players are far more fluid and fickle in their tastes and methods than the typical Internet partisan type.
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David R

#14
August 02, 2007, 01:28:09 PM
Quote from: J ArcaneThe vast majority of players are far more fluid and fickle in their tastes and methods than the typical Internet partisan type.

I've been saying this like forever....even though I'm probably viewed as one of those partisan types.

Regards,
David R
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