Quote from: Brad on May 27, 2021, 05:57:55 PM
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/17041/D12-Descent-into-the-Depths-of-the-Earth-1e
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/17043/D3-Vault-of-the-Drow-1e
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/17054/Q1-Queen-of-the-Demonweb-Pits-1e

Imagine claiming stuff is so "problematic" but having no issue making money off that stuff.

You'd think they'd either give it away for free or give all proceeds to charity or something.

Time is the greatest critic, so caring about changing the optics with bullshit ''problems'' is a waste of time. I hope to be around in the next 40 years to witness what that generation has to say about the people of today in hindsight. While people like to be judgemental, everybody forms an opinion one way or the other. Each new generation likes to think they have the ''real deal'' on the topic because they have seen one facet of the issue and then ''bam!'', seen it all! Those old fuckers knew nothing about their own lives! Its why i laugh my ass off seeing whitewashing in tv series like ''Bridgerton''(yes, its a soap opera, sue me:)) or similar, making make believe history that deflects from the actual issues...

Its late and i feel i have to stop myself from getting a bit too preachy for my own taste, ill end for now by this; "There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true."
― Soren Kierkegaard

Gamers of the past weren't student. It's actually modern gamers, and modern people in fact, who are foolishly obsessed with race, racism, and the supposed evils of whitey. In most other places and times, people wouldn't care about the skin color or morality of fictional creatures in books or games, but in the modern Western world we care tremendously about such things. It's one of the new religions of our time, this constant witch hunt for even the slightest hint of so called racism.

Quote from: Renegade_Productions on May 27, 2021, 05:45:32 PM

Quote from: Zelen on May 27, 2021, 03:35:22 PM

Quote from: HappyDaze on May 27, 2021, 03:12:52 PM
Friend of mine asked:
Do you read FR fiction?
Do you run/play FR?
Do you allow Drow PCs in D&D games outside of FR?
Why does this change matter to you?

Me:
No
No
Maybe (but not in Eberron).
It really doesn't.

Unfortunately this isn't the type of scenario where you can just bow out of it. Unreasonable power-hungry people won't stop being unreasonable & power-hungry by acquiescing, even on trivial issues.

Yep. You either tell them to stuff it and keep their stupidity to themselves, or you lose more ground to them as the hobby capitulates to them.

What ground am I losing? I already mentioned how it doesn't impact me at all. If the current ground I've lost is 0, then at what multiple of that is it going to be a problem for me?

Quote from: Habitual Gamer on May 27, 2021, 02:30:18 PMSplit the difference: drow have been canonically depicted with blue and dark purple skin, so just go with that.  Pow!  They're no long "problematic".

You underestimate what insane leaps of ill-logic these lunatics well go through to declare something racist, problematic, whatever.
Drow are lead by evil women? That is problematic because it is misrepresenting women!
Drow have some sort of vaugly dark skin? That is problematic because it is misrepresenting minorities!
Drow live underground and dislike the light? That is problematic because it is condoning the oppression of minorities by forcing them into ghettos!
Drow have this whole spider theme going? That is problematic spiders are often dark colours and thus this is obviously a thinly veiled attack on minorities!
Drow have white hair? This is problematic because it is obviously a symbol of white supremacy over oppressed minorities!

Now change drow to say white skinned? This is problematic because it is whitewashing a minority AND erasure!
Yes. Doing as these loons demand is also problematic.

No matter what you do these sociopaths can and will and probably already have declared it problematic.
So your drow are now transparent cubes? Thats problematic because cubes are mathematical shapes and math was invented by white people (because the woke say so) and that is RACIST!

Quote from: HappyDaze on May 27, 2021, 03:12:52 PM
Friend of mine asked:
Do you allow Drow PCs in D&D games outside of FR?

Me:
Maybe (but not in Eberron).

Was it because of the scorpions or something else?

It all seems very adolescent.  Many people go through this stage.  They know more than the adults, because the adults have never had experiences like the teenagers.  Their love is amazing and unlike anything that has happened before.  They know how to solve all of the worlds problems, and obviously those who came before were just to dumb to see it.  And anyone who disagrees with them is, dumb, wrong, evil, or some combination of the three.

Thankfully, most of us eventually grow out of it and realize that practical matters make carrying out ideals harder, those who came before did a pretty good though not perfect job of trying to carry out ideal within the limitations of reality, and the current state of affairs is a balance of idealism and practicality, and a compromise among the values of many different parts of society.  A few don't and become extremists like SJWs or right wing militias.

Quote from: Omega on May 27, 2021, 11:33:00 PM
Drow have this whole spider theme going? That is problematic spiders are often dark colours and thus this is obviously a thinly veiled attack on minorities!

Aargh! You wrote Spider without putting a trigger warning first! 
Don't you have any consideration for people with arachnophobia? 

Quote from: BoxCrayonTales on May 27, 2021, 06:00:57 PM

Quote from: Brad on May 27, 2021, 05:57:55 PM
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/17041/D12-Descent-into-the-Depths-of-the-Earth-1e
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/17043/D3-Vault-of-the-Drow-1e
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/17054/Q1-Queen-of-the-Demonweb-Pits-1e

Imagine claiming stuff is so "problematic" but having no issue making money off that stuff.

You'd think they'd either give it away for free or give all proceeds to charity or something.

Ideally to a charity set up to help those harmed or traumatised by deptictions of imaginary beings in rpgs.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on May 27, 2021, 03:29:19 PM
Expand Chult, for God's sake. It's right fucking there in the Forgotten Realms. It's got a badass lawful good god (Ubtao). Why aren't they doing anything with it?

Because they are lazy and unimaginative.  Seriously that's the whole reason for everything that's happening.  You can't spend all day yelling at imaginary nazis on twitter if you have actual deadlines and work to do.

Don't tell these idjits that complain about the evil drow that in Neverwinter/DDO the drow (other than the 'renegade drow' player option) take slaves and are EVIL. There is an entire area with this theme.

Quote from: Ghostmaker on May 27, 2021, 08:09:38 AM
These endless attempts to redefine gamers of the past (and their games) as somehow 'wrong' really, really pisses me off.

You can just replace "gamers" with an open field _________ and leave it that way.

The attitude seems to be 'the past is all evil because racism.'

Leaving this here as I found it fitting with the discussion in this thread.

https://www.convergemedia.org/wokeism-the-new-religion-of-the-west/

Quote from: Godfather Punk on May 28, 2021, 03:19:19 AM

Quote from: Omega on May 27, 2021, 11:33:00 PM
Drow have this whole spider theme going? That is problematic spiders are often dark colours and thus this is obviously a thinly veiled attack on minorities!

Aargh! You wrote Spider without putting a trigger warning first! 
Don't you have any consideration for people with arachnophobia? 

Im pretty sure the drow book will not have any spiders in it because it might scare someone. Happy now?
(Actually Im pretty sure the drow book WILL have spiders in it because the woke only demand you kowtow to their current pet minoritys and who cares about those damn redskins. (until the blacks are used up and discarded for the next target.) Oh you cripples can have a bone too because we might sucker a few bucks from it.)

Quote from: soundchaser on May 28, 2021, 11:15:13 PM
Leaving this here as I found it fitting with the discussion in this thread.

https://www.convergemedia.org/wokeism-the-new-religion-of-the-west/

That article can be summed up as "OMG! We're losing our Christian Values! Christianity is the only Cure!"
That's as much a dark path risk as Wokeism in my experience.